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  1. #21
    Founder & Hero cdbd3rd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Knight View Post
    .... Back when the game first launched it lagged so badly in public areas that you could spend a half hour or more just going from the Leaky Dingy to the Information is Key quest entrance. Once it took me an hour to go from the Wayward Lobster tavern to a quest entrance door for Kobolds' New Ringleader.
    Uphill - both ways.

    Right?
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  2. #22
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    Sadly, I have the same sentiments. Only 9 years of a great game for me, and 9 years of VIP. Cancelled last week as it just isn't fun anymore. I want to carry on playing (and paying) - but it seems that SSG just do not care that their infrastructure is a complete and utter joke.

    The company is direly in need of someone who understands server virtualisation properly, and what you should and (more importantly) shouldn't virtualise.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    We are fixing this bug by deleting this ability from the game

  3. #23
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    gotta admit i've found myself playing less the last couple weeks, the lag is just getting to be too much. hoping they fix it. i don't understand how it isn't the #1 priority

  4. #24
    Community Member Retired_Old_Gamer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikarddo View Post
    /signed

    The very first thing on my mind on raid night isn't "I wonder how many and who will show up today" but rather "I hope we dont get too much lag so we call it quits early". Note, its not even "I hope we dont get lag" as thats a given but ".. not too much".

    The state of the game is well beyond not worth recommending it to anyone.

    /sadness
    This is legit. And, unfortunately, very true.

    Cetus, memnir, arkat, and other long time players are sending a message SSG, it would behoove you to take heed and maybe post a reply.?

    When I took the screenshot of Thorimir last week, G-Land, running harbor quests solo, the lag was bad but not a game breaker. If I was a new player and that happened as often as it does, I might not return. Think about that for a while.

  5. #25
    Community Member Red_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdbd3rd View Post
    Uphill - both ways.

    Right?
    Certainly felt like it sometimes. That first month the game was horribly optimized, and was down quite often for hotfixes as they tried to get the game stable. Once you could get into a dungeon it was fine. But reaching said dungeon was a HUGE pain. I remember a few early content update patches also broke things to the point the game would crash after ten minutes or your character taking ten steps... whichever occurred first. To be honest, the lag I've been seeing on and off again for the last couple years isn't too bad. It mostly affects public areas, which makes sense since it's having to handle all those players (many of whom have various particle effects going at once). And they are probably more worried about fixing game breaking bugs and balance issues then worrying about lag. And most of those lag issues vanished entirely for me when I got a better internet connection last year so I could do cable streaming.

    EDIT: I wonder if people who mock the "uphill both ways" thing realize that this is entirely possible. Where I live, unless you live in one of the valley areas and your destination is also in the same valley area, you literally are going uphill both going to your destination and coming back. Of course, you also are going downhill both ways too. Which never really gets mentioned.
    Last edited by Red_Knight; 01-05-2021 at 08:21 AM.
    Finding ones past, present, and future in the threads of destiny.

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Retired_Old_Gamer View Post
    If I was a new player and that happened as often as it does, I might not return. Think about that for a while.
    You mean like this? Returning player, but the same sentiment.
    DPS solves all problems. R10 or bust. Khyber: Ying-1, Kobeyashi

  7. #27
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    I've worked in places where lag much less severe than this in an application caused the IT equivalent of a four-alarm-fire in terms of response. We need to hear a response. And that response needs to be "this is our top priority".

  8. #28
    Community Member Red_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by merlinfire1 View Post
    I've worked in places where lag much less severe than this in an application caused the IT equivalent of a four-alarm-fire in terms of response. We need to hear a response. And that response needs to be "this is our top priority".
    It might not be something that can be fixed. Or at least not something easy to fix. The game's engine is old. In fact it's going on 15 years old. Remember that DDO came out in 2006 during the height of Windows XP. For all the graphical overhauls, system overhauls, new classes, and what not you need to keep in mind the game's core engine and netcode is 15 years old and designed for an entirely different OS architecture. The game engine got updated to the point where Windows Vista was the minimum OS requirement, but that is still an old OS. It may be well that this is why lag has crept back into the game over time. If that's the case, then to "fix it" might require completely rewriting the game and it's netcode from the ground up specifically for Windows 10.

    Kind of like how I can run Knights of the Old Republic or Spore PC on my windows 10 machine, but there's graphical glitches and issues that just plain don't exist if I run those same games on an XP machine.
    Finding ones past, present, and future in the threads of destiny.

  9. #29
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    I've been getting allot of lag on the course in Eveningstar this year during the winter games. I missed a few 1000+ runs, mostly on Sarlona.

    I typically don't get this kind of lag during the winter events and didn't see any issues on my end.

  10. #30
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    The silence on their part is deafening. Do they even give a ****? That's a rhetorical question by the way. I would be embarrassed if I was them. It's obvious it's a problem with the culture over at SSG and it starts at the top and **** rolls down hills.

    It's almost like they want people to leave. You got tons of issues with lag, ancient bugs , ancient U.I and rather than fix them they just release a half-assed expansion. This game already has trouble keeping new players in the game because of how far behind a new player is behind vets with a ton of PL's. Also, the amount of money a new player must spend on expansions and everything is a lot to ask especially when you look at all the issues I mentioned above. Why would a new player want to even stay? Now even vets are starting to have enough as seen in this topic.

    I still love the game , it's just a shame how badly it is run.

    Edit: Love how it censored my post when I even didn't use the "S" word , but the "nicer" version.
    Last edited by glassesjr; 01-05-2021 at 09:37 AM.

  11. #31
    Community Member TitusOvid's Avatar
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    /signed
    Beste, Titus. | playing since 2009 | Don't do the fun wrong | New to Orien? Join the ingame Titan Channel | Soko Irrlicht freut sich immer über neue Mitglieder | Deutscher Discord | Orien Raiding Discord Toons: Titus Ovid , Bruder, Upload, Zzed, (Rubbel)

  12. #32
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    Had a guild mate who was long time player quit. Upsetting that it is coming to this.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Knight View Post
    It might not be something that can be fixed. Or at least not something easy to fix. The game's engine is old. In fact it's going on 15 years old. Remember that DDO came out in 2006 during the height of Windows XP. For all the graphical overhauls, system overhauls, new classes, and what not you need to keep in mind the game's core engine and netcode is 15 years old and designed for an entirely different OS architecture. The game engine got updated to the point where Windows Vista was the minimum OS requirement, but that is still an old OS. It may be well that this is why lag has crept back into the game over time. If that's the case, then to "fix it" might require completely rewriting the game and it's netcode from the ground up specifically for Windows 10.

    Kind of like how I can run Knights of the Old Republic or Spore PC on my windows 10 machine, but there's graphical glitches and issues that just plain don't exist if I run those same games on an XP machine.
    The lag can definitely be fixed.

    Whether it's new, faster, higher-capacity servers or something else (probably something many players will not appreciate like removing all static reaper buffs), lag can be fixed.

    It all depends on things like expense and pain the playerbase is willing to put up with in order to do so.
    "A wise person chooses the right road; a fool takes the wrong one." - Author unknown

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  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arkat View Post
    The lag can definitely be fixed.

    Whether it's new, faster, higher-capacity servers or something else (probably something many players will not appreciate like removing all static reaper buffs), lag can be fixed.

    It all depends on things like expense and pain the playerbase is willing to put up with in order to do so.
    It's clear it can be fixed because it WAS fixed.

    Lag was as bad now or in fact even worse during the summer free thing, it got much better in the fall, and then shortly after feywild it spiked back up to the current levels.

  15. #35
    Community Member fabhpk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cetus View Post
    I don't care about the new raid. I don't care about the new classic pack. I don't care about the destiny revamp. I don't care about the level cap raise. I don't care about any other piece of news you have for future production if it does not provide a smoother gaming experience than we have now.
    That's it.

  16. #36
    Community Member Hawkwier's Avatar
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    Personally I haven't seen recent lag much worse than it's been.

    That doesn't invalidate much of the criticism here though. It appears to me to be honest feedback from serious players. Losing players and revenue to this issue is highly concerning. Or certainly should be!

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arkat View Post
    The lag can definitely be fixed.

    Whether it's new, faster, higher-capacity servers or something else (probably something many players will not appreciate like removing all static reaper buffs), lag can be fixed.

    It all depends on things like expense and pain the playerbase is willing to put up with in order to do so.
    I got in a long debate with a bunch of laymen on the discord who were convinced there was no way to fix it.

    Having worked with a wide variety of different products, in different architectures and environments, and different industries, I can tell you without qualification, that increasing system resources will ALWAYS help performance issues that are server-bound. Period. End of story. There's no debate to be had. It's like asking whether pouring water into a cup makes it fuller. Only someone disconnected from reality would argue the point.

    Does that cost money? Yes. But the developer salary necessary to fix the underlying issues is BY FAR more expensive than hardware. You can buy a lot of serious hardware for $50,000. A developer with total cost-of-employment of $100k MIGHT be able to fix the issues by addressing code refactoring over the course of a year. Or perhaps not. If they are virtualizing several servers one a single large physical server, they need to build a second physical server of equal or greater resources, and migrate half the servers off to the new box. Rate the servers by average peak playerbase, and make sure the peak playerbase is balanced across both physical boxes after the migration. Building the server would take no more than a week. Migrating the VM's of the servers would take a while, you would need a longer downtime, clearly telegraphed to users weeks in advance, but no longer than 8 hours.

    Total cost between hardware and IT work, probably less than $75k.

    Don't get me wrong, $75k is $75k. But this is a problem that is costing them money already. Why not spend the money to make money?

  18. #38
    Community Member GODDEATH's Avatar
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    OP
    I don't know why this has become so bad, but the reaper enhancement points constantly applying and stripping is the easiest thing to reach for, since we feel it every.single.time.we.run.a.quest. What's the detriment to just leaving these on? Is it that we will ROFLSTOMP normal or hard raids even more than we do now? If that's true, is that a more severe offense than the unplayable lag it is otherwise causing, maybe?

    I appreciate you adding this to your main post its the only post in thread with anything related to the issue as you see it and something specifically to address it. and seems there is validity with what your describing, but cannot confirm test myself yet.
    (i do not have any reaper tree points , is this why i do not expectance the lag others report?) just questions i know its the sum of lag point issues, hence i am curious)
    .
    Memnir? what is your thoughts on the actual things in game causing lag? I am sure you have some insight here.
    I would also ask other long time players and council members if they also have a list of known items they believe are part of the lag? we are listening and want to hear that perspective.

    If we are not listing and talking about those issues specifically the posts are pointless. You may think some random post of a user describing there thoughts or points where they get lag are not worth it, i guarantee if we all posted such things a dev has a good read and may discover something they find interesting and can expand the possibilities they have not considered. and Start a dialogue.

    If u ask 20 employees how to market there product you will get a handful of amazing ideas.
    if you only ask the marketing guy u get one which in comparison will be less then the 20 + ideas generated by the group
    as a marketing person on some days i ask everyone, even strangers. You would be surprised with the creativity when you do.

    Added to list seeing last post after submitting:
    Faster better servers, ok makes sense yes indeed. but only puts off the underlying code causing it i would think? , but darn happy to hear it as part of a solution matrix.
    Last edited by GODDEATH; 01-05-2021 at 12:20 PM.

  19. #39
    Community Member Bunker's Avatar
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    At some point you have to ask yourself if it is worth rebuilding an engine on a 15 year old car. Sure, rebuilding the engine will probably allow the car to run longer, but if it is at 15 years, the trans is probably shot, the axel might be on its way out and frankly the cars frame is probably more than half way rusted through. Not to mention the continued maintenance of tires, shocks, brakes, oil changes, ect ect ect......

    So you have to ask yourself, is it worth rebuilding that engine, or just running on it till it dies?

    Bunk

    P.S. bear with the analogy
    Mothergoose - Kardinal - Bunks

  20. #40
    Community Member TDarkchylde's Avatar
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    Raids literally grinding to a halt last night... gods, yes, the lag is getting bad. I get that a lot of it is out of the devs' control (like the ddos attacks), but everything that can be fixed needs to be.
    .: Sarlona - High Lords of Malkier : Reaper Life 1, 2 , 3, and 4 alumnus : My Twitch : Trans and Proud : (she/they please) :.
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