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  1. #21
    Community Member DYWYPI's Avatar
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    A Character wearing a 'Proof Against Poison' item is supposed to be able to take the HP damage portion from (natural) Poison jet Trap in Sunken Sewer. Albeit they are not supposed to take other types of additional ability/skills "debuff" from the poison such as CON/STR/DEX damage from the - Spider - poison. Thus a 'Proof Against Poison' item should fully protect against Troglodyte Stench, which it currently doesn't unless they've reclassified Troglodytes. :-/

    Team DDO still haven't fixed the text descriptions for: Dispel Magic, Greater Dispel Magic and Mordenkainen's Disjunction: https://ddowiki.com/page/Update_47_Release_Notes#Spells. (Seriously, I don't have a clue how came up with those ridiculously overpowered "[U47] Spells" DCs. Whomever changed them probably doesn't fully understand or appreciate how Trap CRs function.) Therefore it's also unlikely the various 'Proof Against Poison' descriptions will be getting - clarified - updated in-game before Christmas. Possibly the Poison system is - mostly - working as intended but some of the 'Proof Against Poison' Item text Descriptions appear; misleading or inaccurate, and could do with updating or clarifying for the benefit of everyone.

  2. #22
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    On a related note Fear Immunity is not working against Undead Fear effects, whatever those are. My EK/PM was regularly getting feared in Epics despite having two different sources of Fear Immunity, one an enhancement based immunity and the other an augment based one. Chill Touch from mobs caused me to lose control of my character for 10-30 seconds. There were other cases also but that was the one that stood out since it happened every time I fought a rakshasa caster.

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by DYWYPI View Post
    A Character wearing a 'Proof Against Poison' item is supposed to be able to take the HP damage portion from (natural) Poison jet Trap in Sunken Sewer. Albeit they are not supposed to take other types of additional ability/skills "debuff" from the poison such as CON/STR/DEX damage from the - Spider - poison. Thus a 'Proof Against Poison' item should fully protect against Troglodyte Stench, which it currently doesn't unless they've reclassified Troglodytes. :-/

    Team DDO still haven't fixed the text descriptions for: Dispel Magic, Greater Dispel Magic and Mordenkainen's Disjunction: https://ddowiki.com/page/Update_47_Release_Notes#Spells. (Seriously, I don't have a clue how came up with those ridiculously overpowered "[U47] Spells" DCs. Whomever changed them probably doesn't fully understand or appreciate how Trap CRs function.) Therefore it's also unlikely the various 'Proof Against Poison' descriptions will be getting - clarified - updated in-game before Christmas. Possibly the Poison system is - mostly - working as intended but some of the 'Proof Against Poison' Item text Descriptions appear; misleading or inaccurate, and could do with updating or clarifying for the benefit of everyone.
    This is not correct - the natural poison immunity from proof against poison should render the wearer immune exactly as Warforged are immune to natural poisons, that trap is natural poison; The items used to grant natural immunity correctly - I have a collection of items I've used since 2006.

    At some point over the last few years it stopped working - I'm not sure which update broke Proof against poison, proof against disease, protection from evil - and now some are posting fear immunity is not always working - clearly these magical bonuses need to be looked at and corrected to whatever the present rules are.

    Since Turbine did the home brew breaking Proof Against items into 3 separate categories for natural poison/disease, supernatural poison/disease, and magical poison/disease, and the items and augments were to grant a natural immunity (Warforged get this as a racial) - and when SSG purchased Turbine and continued the homebrew rules - it seems because they are not working to either fix it so they do, or redesign the items to a bonus that makes sense in the present game. Keep in mind, until MotU proof against items granted total immunity to all forms of poison or disease, as per the 3.5 rules. Its our homebrew that complicated things.

    I favor the items granting total immunities - if this is perceived as too strong, just make the items super rare.

    Potions and spells for neutralize poison and remove disease need to be fixed too - as well as protection from evil and fear immunity, which should grant complete immunity from all fear effects

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by KoobTheProud View Post
    On a related note Fear Immunity is not working against Undead Fear effects, whatever those are. My EK/PM was regularly getting feared in Epics despite having two different sources of Fear Immunity, one an enhancement based immunity and the other an augment based one. Chill Touch from mobs caused me to lose control of my character for 10-30 seconds. There were other cases also but that was the one that stood out since it happened every time I fought a rakshasa caster.
    Thank you very much for posting this! I hadn't noticed - clearly 'Immunity' items all need a look

    Items/augments
    Proof Against Poison
    Proof Against Disease
    Protection from Evil
    Fear Immunity

    Potions/spells
    Neutralize Poison
    Remove Disease
    Protection from Evil

    - Theres a paladin spell that grants fear immunity yes? Lion something

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by KoobTheProud View Post
    On a related note Fear Immunity is not working against Undead Fear effects, whatever those are. My EK/PM was regularly getting feared in Epics despite having two different sources of Fear Immunity, one an enhancement based immunity and the other an augment based one. Chill Touch from mobs caused me to lose control of my character for 10-30 seconds. There were other cases also but that was the one that stood out since it happened every time I fought a rakshasa caster.
    I noticed this too, while running with GH spell on. Chill touch does fear undead, but GH should block it. Totally broken.

    Also, my Bladeforged gets poisoned (and diseased--is there any source of "natural" disease in the game??) all the time, including by regular spiders, to which he should be immune. At least he can still play around in poison traps without taking damage. I posted here years ago about how irritated I was that my druid got paralyzed by drow poison: if it's a natural poison, I should be immune as a druid. If it's magical, then FOM should block a magical paralysis effect. Stop having your cake and eating it too, Drow.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by JOTMON View Post
    Poison protection is all kinds of flawed.


    Quick test, Marketplace Sunken Sewer on level 30 toon with Suulomades and a randomgen poison resist item equipped.. should be a basic level 2 quest with poison jets..
    ...my level 2 Warforged was fully immune taking no damage...

    Supernatural poisons and diseases are specifically excluded. These being supernatural poison is a dumb choice, but doesn't look like a bug.

  7. #27
    Community Member J1NG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bluenoser View Post
    I noticed this too, while running with GH spell on. Chill touch does fear undead, but GH should block it. Totally broken.
    It's not broken, it's simply WAI by Wizards rules.

    In undead form, you can't get feared anyway. So why would Wizards have put in a rule specifically about Chill Touch causing a Fear(panic) in undead if the natural Fear immunity would already protect against such an effect? Or why would undead being Turned go panic and run around if immune to the Fear effect by another source? Essentially, if the Fear Immunity (from another source, not just the Racial one) protects you against Chill Touch, by extension it should by the same logic protect the undead from being Turned too. But being Turned has always been accepted as working even through extra protections like GH (unless if you made the save, or), unless if you're just not powerful enough to channel your Deitiys divinity to Turn the undead there.

    It's just one of those things unfortunately.

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  8. #28
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    In general, I'm not persuaded by appeals to Wizards of the Coast pen and paper rules when we're talking about DDO. They have very little to do with each other anymore. Fear immunity is fear immunity. You could argue that the fact that as undead you're immune to regular fear effects just means you'd better not forget to still carry some form of fear protection because of Chill Touch.

    The analogy to turn undead doesn't really work, and suggests instead that cast/item fear immunities on undead should work. Look at it this way: Undead are immune to (most) instadeath effects. "Mighty" turn undead can still instakill them. However, if they have deathward, it DOES block destruction from turning. I see fear operating the same way.

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    Very interesting the data coming in, thank you everyone - clearly there are many issues with immunities -

    Bladeforged being warforged should be immune to natural poisons and diseases, paralysis

    fear immunity should cover all fear effects unless something specified, or relevant to undead; I did not think turn was a fear effect, but more of a supernatural blast of energy that either forced them to flee or destroyed them. Chill touch however, if it produces fear, should not if the player has fear immunity, say, an undead tiefling.

    for events such as hardcore league and for new players with few past lives, having the immunity items fixed and working properly seems of utmost importance.
    If we are all collecting the new feywild gear sets only to have bonuses not work, what is the point? If all of a sudden shield stopped granting magic missile immunity,
    and only granted the protection bonus to AC, that would be a huge deal - poison, disease, paralysis, compulsions, charms, fear effects are all just as serious - and the immunities
    need to be corrected to function as intended.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artos_Fabril View Post

    Supernatural poisons and diseases are specifically excluded. These being supernatural poison is a dumb choice, but doesn't look like a bug.
    That particular screen capture was in VOD where I contracted the Pit Fiend poison and disease while wearing the Heart of Suulomades.
    I had intentionally red circled the Devils blood of the Heart of Suulomades to show the description.

    Updated my thread pic to focus only on the Heart of Suulomades to remove any confusion.
    Somehow you honed in on a part of the screen capture that had nothing to do with this thread.


    Last edited by JOTMON; 01-04-2021 at 08:10 PM.
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  11. #31
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    it should be pointed out that undead shrouds from the wizard pale master tree also make you immune to all poisons, just straight up immune

  12. #32
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    My guess, is that any "forms" itself, pulls from the same immunities from the original racial type for all things in DDO. So Undead and Warforged get the immunity that enemy versions also get because the base type has those immunities. But all versions of immunity otherwise on the player side (items, feats, enhancements, etc) that have been altered, remains altered. So it might be Palemaster Undead aren't even supposed to be completely immune to Poison, but the base Form provides it to them.

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  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by merlinfire1 View Post
    it should be pointed out that undead shrouds from the wizard pale master tree also make you immune to all poisons, just straight up immune
    Hey thank you - that's a good point; Makes me wonder if they are supposed to be immune to all or just 1 or 2 of the 3. Clearly the code is in and works, poison items just need to be fixed to provide what they are enchanted to provide.

  14. #34
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    The immunity items are not working correctly in Sharn, RL, Feywild, or the older content. It seems to be specific to the items/augments/potions/spells and not to content itself -

  15. #35
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    The Night revels shield that provides protection from evil seems to be suffering from the same issues as other immunity items.

    Please Devs, can we have an immunity item/augment/potion/spell check up and get them functioning before we have any new major events?

  16. #36
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    Testing of Proof Against Poison items on the live servers,
    a new Video Series on my Adventure.AI YouTube channel: HARDCORE LEAGUE EVENT PREP

    https://youtu.be/91v4x0ITAwI

    Time Code 36:17 - Item of Proof Against Poison testing - its broken

    I put on a proof against poison item and test it vs various natural poisons. The item fails to work at all in any way.

    The IMUNITY is broken
    The 'NO FAIL SAVE ON A 1' is broken
    The + BONUS RENDERING IMMUNITY TO POISON OF ITEM + + TOON SAVE FORT BONUS is broken

    All of these are malfunctioning or not functioning at all in the present live game:
    Proof Against Poison Items/augments
    Proof Against Disease Items/augments
    Protection from Evil Immunity to charm, dominate, compulsion, command
    Neutralize Poison/Cure Disease Potions/Spell granted Immunity
    NOTE: It has also been reported by other players certain Fear Immunity items are not working to protect against fear effects. Would love further reporting.
    Last edited by Dark_Lord_Mary; 01-10-2021 at 05:29 PM.

  17. #37
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    Latest Snowpeaks patch did not fix Proof Against Poison items/augments
    Last edited by Dark_Lord_Mary; 01-13-2021 at 09:48 PM.

  18. #38
    Community Member DYWYPI's Avatar
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    They altered how Poison Traps functioned around 2014 about six years ago; so that they now do HP damage and also Poison effect damage instead of just poison damage, i.e. two separate portions.


    So possibly that's one factor with regards to traps.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dark_Lord_Mary View Post
    [...] This is not correct - the natural poison immunity from proof against poison should render the wearer immune exactly as Warforged are immune to natural poisons, that trap is natural poison; The items used to grant natural immunity correctly - I have a collection of items I've used since 2006. ...
    Yes, the old 'Proof against Poison' Description did suggest it prevented HP damage against Natural Poison (and I believe they did work that way once and did stop HP damage). Albeit they stopped functioning that way in 2017, after: U36.2 hit the road.


    The above image is from about a week after U36.2, with a 'Proof against Poison' item equipped. Evidently it was erroneously doing Constitution Damage even by that date! Since then; there's probably been too many SSG Cooks in the kitchen fiddling with poisons and changing the damage behaviours. So that now due to poor documentation and lack of a clear 'Item: Description' the player is completely confused about the unexplained changes.

    Good luck with getting the bugs addressed; I've been waiting about three years for them to fix the bug regarding 'Proof against Poison' and it not preventing ability damage from Natural poison. :-/

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    it appears after testing that Proof Against Disease is working to convey natural disease immunity,
    i am going to test to see if the other bonuses are working

    proof against poison is not working at all, the items only provide a + to saves presently

    i am also testing protection from evil immunities to charms controls compulsions

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    Quote Originally Posted by DYWYPI View Post
    They altered how Poison Traps functioned around 2014 about six years ago; so that they now do HP damage and also Poison effect damage instead of just poison damage, i.e. two separate portions.


    So possibly that's one factor with regards to traps.



    Yes, the old 'Proof against Poison' Description did suggest it prevented HP damage against Natural Poison (and I believe they did work that way once and did stop HP damage). Albeit they stopped functioning that way in 2017, after: U36.2 hit the road.


    The above image is from about a week after U36.2, with a 'Proof against Poison' item equipped. Evidently it was erroneously doing Constitution Damage even by that date! Since then; there's probably been too many SSG Cooks in the kitchen fiddling with poisons and changing the damage behaviours. So that now due to poor documentation and lack of a clear 'Item: Description' the player is completely confused about the unexplained changes.

    Good luck with getting the bugs addressed; I've been waiting about three years for them to fix the bug regarding 'Proof against Poison' and it not preventing ability damage from Natural poison. :-/
    thanks for testing this - i just released a video where i test proof against poison - the items are failing to confer the 3 benefits they should:

    immunity to natural poisons
    no fail on a roll of 1
    immunity to magical/supernatural poison for (Item bonus#) + (player for save#)

    I tested Proof against disease
    Immunity to natural disease is working correctly
    will test no fail on a roll of 1
    immunity to magical/supernatural poison for (Item bonus#) + (player for save#)

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