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  1. #81
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    I think several people already mentioned this:

    Hirelings needed!

    If the level cap is increasing past level 30, we really need clerics at level 26, 28, 29, 30, and 31 along with improved high skill rogues at 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, and 31.
    Would also like Rangers and Wizards at level 25, 27, 29, and 31.
    Would also like Fighters at level 28 and 30.
    Would also like another level ?/30 gold seal with the expansion.

    If you are going to do this, you need to step back and work on things like hires that are not anywhere near current level cap, much less an increased level cap.

    Thanks for reading.
    Last edited by Silverleafeon; 10-02-2020 at 11:10 PM.

  2. #82
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kinerd View Post
    this is one of the most striking things about coming back to DDO after playing other games - every one has some form of on-ramping making it easier for new players to catch up, and there's just nothing like that here. someone starting DDO today gets the same Ember Rapier and Battleworn Chainshirt i got 10 years ago.

    although i certainly wouldn't mind the reduced xp per life version (shorten the distance), the more common thing i've seen is items and boosts (increase the speed). what if all new accounts got...
    -double XP (only for their first month)
    -a permanent 3/day flask of mnemonic enhancement for casters and a permanent 3/day flask of cure critical wounds for melees
    -50k plat
    -an ML 10 box of a +4 Holy 3 of Bludgeoning 3 or 77 spellpower of 11 lore weapon, a +6 Con item and a +6 primary stat item by class, and 30 Striding boots

    every new system puts new players further behind and at a worse relative speed. these would be very easy to generate, make a huge difference, and new players still wouldn't have a prayer of catching up even with an old player rolling a new character, so it seems to me like everyone would be happy with them

    .

    and just briefly: this is assuming we want new players to be able to catch up faster to old players. i would say yes because groups are fun and adding players to a game is indispensable to its ability to survive long term.
    There's no 'catching up' in DDO because there's no point that everybody resets. A month of 10x XP wouldn't catch any new player up to anything meaningful. It would likely give them a 3rd life character and maybe a few Epic past lives. The meta is so far beyond that at this point that all the extra XP would do for them is to give them a glimpse of what the methuselahs, no-life grinders and dupers have.

    At this stage of it's life Advanced DDO is like that cool backroom party at the local pub that only a few people can get in the door on. It's sad but it's true.

  3. #83
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    If the developers limit future level cap increases to +1 per expansion and do not implement a Legendary Reincarnation system, then I would conclude that there is no upper limit for level cap increases. (Of course, if we do limit thus, it will be another 10 to 15 years before we hit level 40 anyway).


    The population will be bundled into three categories:

    Reincarnations thru heroic levels due to new racial past lives.

    Reincarnations thru epic levels due to new iconic past lives and players catching up with epic past lives.

    End game players working on the latest high level content and raids.

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by KoobTheProud View Post
    There's no 'catching up' in DDO because there's no point that everybody resets.
    +1 good point


    Every old game will face the "what is your catch up plan?"

    Having talked to Game Developers in the past, I found most to be very sincere in their passion for their game.
    Most of them also have a strong interest in the overall history and tends in other games.

    In the coming years, especially with the possible introduction of raising the level cap, there needs to be a lot of thought addressing this subject.

    Raising the level cap does have one real benefit for new players: equipment and character power creep tends to erode past life power.
    This is a good thing.

    Many heroic past lives no longer have such as strong impact at level cap as they did before MotU.


    However, if we add a new Legendary Reincarnation systems, the widening gap between alts and main toons will continue to increase.


    The proper approach could be to create an easier path for new players, such as double past lives or reduced experience costs or making a new Legendary Reincarnations system grant three heroic or racial past lives: 40 back to 1 grants all Barbarians Past Lives or all Shifter Past Lives in one swoop.

    (Although as you can see in the post right above this one, there is great benefit to not creating any sort of Legendary Reincarnation.)
    Last edited by Silverleafeon; 10-08-2020 at 05:18 AM.

  5. #85
    Community Member HungarianRhapsody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverleafeon View Post
    If the developers limit future level cap increases to +1 per expansion and do not implement a Legendary Reincarnation system, then I would conclude that there is no upper limit for level cap increases. (Of course, if we do limit thus, it will be another 10 to 15 years before we hit level 40 anyway).
    If they actually did that, I wouldn't be so opposed to a level increase. But I don't think that SSG will be able to keep themselves from adding a Legendary Past Lives grind. And I don't think that SSG will be able to keep themselves from selling a way to bypass that grind in the DDO store. At this point, the only thing I'm *actually* hoping for is that SSG manages to find a way to make a Legendary Otto's Box that can't be duped.

    (Hint for SSG - make it traceable and DON'T MAKE IT STACKABLE)
    No one in the world ever gets what they want
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    Everybody dies frustrated and sad
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  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by HungarianRhapsody View Post
    If they actually did that, I wouldn't be so opposed to a level increase. But I don't think that SSG will be able to keep themselves from adding a Legendary Past Lives grind. And I don't think that SSG will be able to keep themselves from selling a way to bypass that grind in the DDO store. At this point, the only thing I'm *actually* hoping for is that SSG manages to find a way to make a Legendary Otto's Box that can't be duped.

    (Hint for SSG - make it traceable and DON'T MAKE IT STACKABLE)
    +1 well said


    You have great points.

    The rush to 40 to enable a legendary reincarnation system that adds more power to the game is a temptation that Devs need to avoid.
    Its a trap!

  7. #87
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  8. #88
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverleafeon View Post
    +1 well said


    You have great points.

    The rush to 40 to enable a legendary reincarnation system that adds more power to the game is a temptation that Devs need to avoid.
    Its a trap!
    I'm all for raising the cap and NOT adding a Legendary Reincarnation or even hinting at one. The rule should be: FIX all WAI and revisit previous bad nerfs and "FIX" other issues and then, THEN when that is straightened out(maybe 5-7 years later) Producer Letter a throw-out saying how the climate is for a Legendary Reincarnation probability.
    When I see a Shadar-kai whip out as much chain damage as his NPC counterpart, then maybe then the serfs are ready to eat their rez-cake.

  9. #89
    Community Member kanordog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverleafeon View Post
    Hirelings needed!
    First they gotto fix the AI, it doesnt really matter what level of the cleric hire has standing in the trap or charging ahead to die or forget to heal even themselves...


  10. #90
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    The top tier of the Feywild expansion adds:

    Satyr Bard Hireling (Epic)*
    Razorclaw Shifter Iconic
    Winter Eladrin Cosmetics
    (helm, armor, cloak)
    Displacer Beast Cosmetic Pet
    Black Unicorn Mount
    Instant Teleport item to Feywild*
    Tome of Destiny +1 for all characters


    The Tome of Destiny is typed (Feywild) and therefore stacks with any other future or existing Tome of Destiny.

    I feel this is a huge step forward for the Developers.
    While it does not commit to any particular direction, it leave many possibilities open.

    For example, if the devs decide to follow a variation of my examples of working on current epic destiny system, this alllow my suggested conversion of Tomes of Fate.
    EI: your +3 Tome of Fate is transformed into a +3 Tome of Destiny (typed Fate) which would stack with the +1 Tome of Destiny (typed Feywild).

    This allows the Devs to continue forward along a variation of (20 instant +3 per level with no barriers on spending) or another path if they choose to do so.

    This also allows the Devs to continue selling these same tome of destiny (typed ____ expansion) in the future.

    The above items listed were enough for me to choose the Complete Expansion Pack, and would likely continue such a purchase for future expansions.



    Of importance, there was no code for this expansion, you were logged into one of your accounts.
    This should prevent people from trying to hack DDO for expansion codes in today's turbulent environment.


    Personally, if we never saw another Otto's Box and this more secure purchase is the new "deluxe purchase option", I would be very acceptive of that route.



    Supposing, that the next expansion raised the level cap up 1 from 30 to 31 while providing an additional +1 Tome of Destiny typed Expansion X, while changing the epic destiny system to the (20+3 with unlimited spending model I showed earlier), how would the numbers look like:



    Gaining Epic Levels:

    Level 20
    20 auto granted + 3 (fate typed) +1 (fey typed) + 1 (expansion X typed) = 25 points spendable on two epic destiny trees without any restrictions other than points spent on tree unlocks higher tiers as existing system

    Level 21
    28 points spendable on two trees

    Level 22
    31 points spendable on two trees

    Level 23
    34 points spendable on two trees

    Level 24
    37 points spendable on two trees

    Level 25
    40 points spendable on two trees

    Level 26
    43 points spendable on two trees

    Level 27
    46 points spendable on two trees

    Level 28
    49 points spendable on two trees

    Level 28
    52 points spendable on two trees

    Level 29
    55 points spendable on two trees

    Level 30
    58 points spendable on two trees

    Level 31
    61 points spendable on two trees


    Please note that these points would not have any spending requirements other than:

    Tier Two
    After 4 points are spent, abilities in this tier can be purchased.

    Tier Three
    After 8 points are spent, abilities in this tier can be purchased.

    Tier Four
    After 12 points are spent, abilities in this tier can be purchased.

    Tier Five
    After 16 points are spent, abilities in this tier can be purchased.

    Tier Six
    After 20 points are spent, abilities in this tier can be purchased.



    Please also note that such a system would remove all Twists of Fate but allow spending into two (or three if the Devs desired) trees instead of one.
    This removes up to five slots with up to three points spent in each slot = loss of between 3 and 15 epic destiny points.
    I do feel that the flexibility of choices within a second tree and the increase of points will more than make up for this loss.



    Technically this would mean with every +1 level cap there would be an extra +1 epic destiny point to spend upon reaching epic levels.
    Last edited by Silverleafeon; 10-17-2020 at 10:59 AM.

  11. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by VinoeWhines View Post
    I'm all for raising the cap and NOT adding a Legendary Reincarnation or even hinting at one. The rule should be: FIX all WAI and revisit previous bad nerfs and "FIX" other issues and then, THEN when that is straightened out(maybe 5-7 years later) Producer Letter a throw-out saying how the climate is for a Legendary Reincarnation probability.
    When I see a Shadar-kai whip out as much chain damage as his NPC counterpart, then maybe then the serfs are ready to eat their rez-cake.
    +1s

    Agreed.
    The more I think about it, the more I don't want to hear anything about a legendary reincarnation system during this decade.


    Quote Originally Posted by kanordog View Post
    First they gotto fix the AI, it doesnt really matter what level of the cleric hire has standing in the trap or charging ahead to die or forget to heal even themselves...
    +1s

    Aye, even more reason to slow the upward pace of level cap as much as possible.

  12. #92
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    Or they could.... (wait for it) ........ leave Epic Destinies alone. They are fine how they are. Just my opinion.
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  13. #93
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    Quote Originally Posted by dennisck2 View Post
    Or they could.... (wait for it) ........ leave Epic Destinies alone. They are fine how they are. Just my opinion.
    +1 well said
    I can understand your position, this game is complicated already.


    You have a very valid point.
    Putting aside my personal reasons listed above which I will not repeat here, this is an option that the Devs could take.



    There are likely a whole lot of players who might support leaving everything alone, including level cap, epic destinies and more.
    That would be the ultimate leave everything alone.



    The Developers opened this portal, and I have to look at the flutter.
    Since the Developers so far seem to want to move the level cap, well, what happens next?



    Considering raising level cap, but leaving epic destinies alone (not my favorite option but exploring possible paths):



    Solution 1) Leaving the Current Epic Destiny System alone & Continue Supplementing the fact that the Epic Destinies stop at level 6 minus 1 xp with more Epic Destiny Feats. This option has held the system together so far, and the Devs could try to continue using it. Perhaps one new Epic Destiny Feat every two levels and one new Legendary Scion Feat every three levels?

    Problem with Solution 1) More powerful and creative Epic Destiny Feats will be required as the level cap progresses. Can the Developers creativity match this challenge? I would have to judge on a Feat by Feat basis. This would allow slow movement forward from level 30 to 31 to 32 to 33 to 34 to 35...

    Advantages of Solution 1) This follows closest to the leave everything alone path. It does not address old problems, but does not introduce new problems.

    Additional Problems with Solution 1) Some players feel Spellcaster options for Epic Destiny feats are inferior to Melee options for Epic Destiny Feats. Also, the best Melee Epic Destiny Feats might already exist.






    Solution 2) Leaving the Current Epic Destiny System alone & Creating a new Legendary Destiny System The level cap would jump to 35 with the next expansion to allow sufficient levels to create a new Destiny System.

    Problem with Solution 2) This jumps the level cap dramatically, quickly obsoleting current gear and meta. Creating a new Destiny System with the whole problems associated with the current system seems very unwise to me. Why create a new broken system without fixing and adapting the current system? The power creep at level 30 would be much larger than fixing the current system. Players are familiar with the current system and would adapt better to having more points to spend in the current system than learning a new system.

    Additional Problem with Solution 2) It also points towards Legendary Reincarnation by the third expansion. This is something I highly oppose.

    More Additional Problems with Solution 2) There are going to be more and more balance issues with each and every tree system that you add to the game. Eventually the Devs will have to do a Legendary Destiny System pass, because the trees are unbalanced and every melee/spellcaster only uses the most powerful tree for melee/spellcaster.
    Last edited by Silverleafeon; 10-17-2020 at 10:56 PM.

  14. #94
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silverleafeon View Post
    There are likely a whole lot of players who might support leaving everything alone, including level cap, epic destinies and more.

    Yep.

    There are a lot of things to do in this game. Lot of things to grind for. You can skip quests while levelling. There is no reason for any major change.

    And those who already got everything and tried every build (OP builds more likely) and bored will just smash the new content in a matter of weeks and get bored again.


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    Quote Originally Posted by kanordog View Post
    Yep.

    There are a lot of things to do in this game. Lot of things to grind for. You can skip quests while levelling. There is no reason for any major change.

    And those who already got everything and tried every build (OP builds more likely) and bored will just smash the new content in a matter of weeks and get bored again.
    Just pointing out that it took a year for most of the power gamers to get their reaper wings. Reaper did exactly what SSG tried to do, which was to give the addicted methuselahs something to grind on. It damaged the game significantly for everybody else with the meta shift to reaper difficulty but it handled the methuselahs just fine.

    A good pusher knows the junkies they sell too.

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