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Thread: Monkcher in U46

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    Default Monkcher in U46

    Hello,
    I always wanted to play a monkcher one day, but unfortunately i postponed this decision. Now I am not even sure if this is still possible/playable because i didnt see any monkcher for at least one year. I would be grateful for some feedback on monkchers in current update for both heroics and epics. Thanks in advance.

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    Founder & Super Hero Arkat's Avatar
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    It's still possible, they're just not all that great anymore.

    The nerf to IPS is one reason. There are other reasons.
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    How would you create that build? Should it be pure monk with elven AA, or some split with fighter or ranger for feats?

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    I am thinking about 6rgr for manyshot and early access to AA, then either 14mnk and WIS to hit and dmg from falconer or 12mnk and 2fvs silver flame for WIS to hit and dmg. Elf so i can use AA cores at epics...

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    Founder & Super Hero Arkat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilgeforts View Post
    How would you create that build? Should it be pure monk with elven AA, or some split with fighter or ranger for feats?
    I'd go pure Elven AA Monk (DEX).

    If you don't want to go Elf, go Aasimar Monk14/Ranger6 (WIS).

    Regardless, jack up your AA DCs and banish/smite/phantasmal/paralyze everything.
    Last edited by Arkat; 07-10-2020 at 11:39 AM.
    "A wise person chooses the right road; a fool takes the wrong one." - Author unknown

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    Quote Originally Posted by Arkat View Post
    I'd go pure Elven AA Monk (DEX).

    If you don't want to go Elf, go Aasimar Monk14/Ranger6 (WIS).

    Regardless, jack up your AA DCs and banish/smite/phantasmal/paralyze everything.
    It would be hard to take all important feats with monk and play AA early though

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    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilgeforts View Post
    Now I am not even sure if this is still possible/playable because i didnt see any monkcher for at least one year.
    What happened to monkchers is Inquisitive came out. Now Inquisitives are old-hat post-nerfs and it's all...I dunno, Vile Chemist dagger throwers or whatever the cool kids run at endgame for ranged DPS.

    If you still want to play a monkcher, you have the same options you always did, with the same pros & cons. A few options:

    • monk 20: maxed-out Doubleshot bonus from Ten Thousand Stars and full access to Ninja tree. Probably your best option for a bow+shuriken build (Manyshot then switch to shurikens): something like 41 Ninja / 14 elf / 25 AA (or reverse the AA / Ninja AP split). Might work well in Shiradi now?
    • monk 6 / ranger 6: lowers your TTS bonus to add Sniper Shot to your combat rotation; plus three free ranged feats. Remaining 8 levels can be more monk or more ranger or a third class for an HTR.
    • monk 6+ / FvS 10+: natively supports WIS to damage from Knowledge of Battle and access to Warsoul bonuses. Lower DPS than the first two options but more self-sufficient due to FvS buffs & heals.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vilgeforts View Post
    12mnk and 2fvs silver flame for WIS to hit and dmg
    Knowledge of Battle only applies if at least half of your class levels are FvS; i.e., you need to be at least FvS 10. Divine Will should work with just a FvS splash though.
    Retired Build Engineer. Everything was better back in our day. Get off my lawn.

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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    What happened to monkchers is Inquisitive came out. Now Inquisitives are old-hat post-nerfs and it's all...I dunno, Vile Chemist dagger throwers or whatever the cool kids run at endgame for ranged DPS.

    If you still want to play a monkcher, you have the same options you always did, with the same pros & cons. A few options:

    • monk 20: maxed-out Doubleshot bonus from Ten Thousand Stars and full access to Ninja tree. Probably your best option for a bow+shuriken build (Manyshot then switch to shurikens): something like 41 Ninja / 14 elf / 25 AA (or reverse the AA / Ninja AP split). Might work well in Shiradi now?
    • monk 6 / ranger 6: lowers your TTS bonus to add Sniper Shot to your combat rotation; plus three free ranged feats. Remaining 8 levels can be more monk or more ranger or a third class for an HTR.
    • monk 6+ / FvS 10+: natively supports WIS to damage from Knowledge of Battle and access to Warsoul bonuses. Lower DPS than the first two options but more self-sufficient due to FvS buffs & heals.


    Knowledge of Battle only applies if at least half of your class levels are FvS; i.e., you need to be at least FvS 10. Divine Will should work with just a FvS splash though.
    I didnt realise that KoB requirement, thanks for enlightening me. I think i am convinced more by 6monk/6rgr due to easier access to all good stuff at heroics. Now i need to choose between DEX and WIS to hit and DMG, WIS would require 12enhancements for Falconer, but Grandmaster of Wind wouldnt give me anything but 4 dex, where ocean gives dodge and saves

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    A pure monk, Falconry-wisdom build should be very effective. Not having played a monkcher before, I can't speak to whether ninja or shintao is better.

    But I have played a divine Falconry ranged build, and loved it. I went t5/41 pts in Falc and focused on assassinating. The downside is so-so dps, but excellent CC and very effective assassinate. With monk evasion, speed and overall defensive strength, it should be a really easy build to solo with.

    Go with Shadowdancer for Executioner's Shot in epic. I twisted Unusual Tactics from Dreadnought for a couple more points to my assassination DCs. My assassinates were reliably hitting into R5 or 6. Being able to assassinate the totems in Old Baba's Hut really sped things up.

    Hmm, now that I'm thinking about this, I may want to try it.

    *Sigh* So many builds. So little time.
    Last edited by SocratesBastardSon; 07-10-2020 at 03:10 PM.
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    What is dead may never die.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SocratesBastardSon View Post
    A pure monk, Falconry-wisdom build should be very effective. Not having played a monkcher before, I can't speak to whether ninja or shintao is better.

    But I have played a divine Falconry ranged build, and loved it. I went t5/41 pts in Falc and focused on assassinating. The downside is so-so dps, but excellent CC and very effective assassinate. With monk evasion, speed and overall defensive strength, it should be a really easy build to solo with.

    Go with Shadowdancer for Executioner's Shot in epic. I twisted Unusual Tactics from Dreadnought for a couple more points to my assassination DCs. My assassinates were reliably hitting into R5 or 6. Being able to assassinate the totems in Old Baba's Hut really sped things up.

    Hmm, now that I'm thinking about this, I may want to try it.

    *Sigh* So many builds. So little time.
    Yea I think I might be using wisdom to dmg from falconer and go full wisdom, with enough dex for IPS and Combat archery. Ocean stance seems better and I think will saves are the ones that will be crucial not reflex ones... I will propably post a build tommorow considering all that you guys told me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Komradkillingmachine View Post
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    I hate what they did to that show...

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    Ive had a lot of fun with my rogue monkcher, you can have a look here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5G3NgfQuDCQ

    Maybe it could give some inspiration, good luck!

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    Ok, following your advices I created an example of build. It looks like this:

    Character name:
    Classes: 14 Monk, 10 Epic, 6 Ranger
    Race: Elf · · · · · · · · ·Alignment: Lawful Good

    · · ·Start Tome Final
    Str:· · ·8· · 2 · · 8 · · ·HP:· · · · 415 · · ·AC:· · 39
    Dex:· · 16· · 5 · ·25 · · ·PRR: · · · · 3
    Con:· · 14· · 2 · ·16 · · ·MRR: · · · · 3 · · ·+Healing Amp:· · 10
    Int:· · 12· · 2 · ·14 · · ·Dodge: · 24/33 · · ·-Healing Amp:· · ·0
    Wis:· · 18· · 3 · ·34 · · ·Fort:· · · ·0% · · ·Repair Amp:· · · ·0
    Cha:· · ·8· · 2 · ·10 · · ·SR:· · · · ·24 · · ·BAB: · · · · · · 16

    Class and Feat Selection
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Level Class · · · · · ·Feats
    1 · · Monk(1) · · · · ·Standard: Point Blank Shot
    · · · · · · · · · · · ·Monk Bonus: Dodge
    2 · · Ranger(1) · · · ·Favored Enemy: Favored enemy: Undead
    3 · · Ranger(2) · · · ·Standard: Zen Archery
    4 · · Ranger(3) · · · ·Wisdom: +1 Level up
    5 · · Ranger(4) · · · ·
    6 · · Ranger(5) · · · ·Standard: Precision
    · · · · · · · · · · · ·Favored Enemy: Favored enemy: Evil Outsider
    7 · · Ranger(6) · · · ·
    8 · · Monk(2) · · · · ·Monk Bonus: Mobility
    · · · · · · · · · · · ·Wisdom: +1 Level up
    9 · · Monk(3) · · · · ·Standard: Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons
    · · · · · · · · · · · ·Monk Philosophy: Path of Harmonious Balance: Fists of Light
    10· · Monk(4) · · · · ·
    11· · Monk(5) · · · · ·
    12· · Monk(6) · · · · ·Standard: Shot on the Run
    · · · · · · · · · · · ·Monk Bonus: Ten Thousand Stars
    · · · · · · · · · · · ·Wisdom: +1 Level up
    13· · Monk(7) · · · · ·
    14· · Monk(8) · · · · ·
    15· · Monk(9) · · · · ·Standard: Improved Precise Shot
    16· · Monk(10)· · · · ·Wisdom: +1 Level up
    17· · Monk(11)· · · · ·
    18· · Monk(12)· · · · ·Standard: Grandmaster of Forms
    19· · Monk(13)· · · · ·
    20· · Monk(14)· · · · ·Wisdom: +1 Level up
    21· · Epic(1) · · · · ·Epic Feat: Overwhelming Critical
    22· · Epic(2) · · · · ·
    23· · Epic(3) · · · · ·
    24· · Epic(4) · · · · ·Epic Feat: Combat Archery
    · · · · · · · · · · · ·Wisdom: +1 Level up
    25· · Epic(5) · · · · ·
    26· · Epic(6) · · · · ·Epic Destiny Feat: Holy Strike
    27· · Epic(7) · · · · ·Epic Feat: Blinding Speed
    28· · Epic(8) · · · · ·Epic Destiny Feat: Doubleshot
    · · · · · · · · · · · ·Wisdom: +1 Level up
    29· · Epic(9) · · · · ·Epic Destiny Feat: Embodiment of Law
    30· · Epic(10)· · · · ·Epic Feat: Improved Martial Arts
    · · · · · · · · · · · ·Legendary: Scion of Arborea

    Enhancements: 80 APs
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Elf - Points spent: 14
    1 Core ·(1) Accuracy I
    2 Tier1 (2) Weapon Training I: Aerenal Weapon Training
    3 Tier1 (1) Keen Senses
    4 Tier1 (1) Keen Senses
    5 Tier2 (2) Arcanum
    6 Tier2 (2) Arcanum
    7 Tier1 (1) Keen Senses
    8 Tier3 (4) Arcane Archer
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Falconry - Points spent: 24
    1 Core ·(1) Summon Falcon: Summon Raven
    2 Tier1 (1) Practiced Accuracy
    3 Tier1 (1) Practiced Accuracy
    4 Tier1 (1) Out in Nature
    5 Tier1 (1) Out in Nature
    6 Core ·(2) Ability I: Wisdom
    7 Tier2 (1) Diving Attack: Diving Shot
    8 Tier2 (1) Watch the Center
    9 Tier2 (1) Watch the Center
    10 Tier3 (2) Killer Instinct II
    11 Tier3 (2) Conditioning
    12 Tier3 (1) Strike for the Eyes: Shoot for the Eyes
    13 Tier3 (1) Strike for the Eyes: Shoot for the Eyes
    14 Tier3 (1) Strike for the Eyes: Shoot for the Eyes
    15 Tier2 (1) Watch the Center
    16 Core ·(1) Well Rounded I
    17 Tier2 (1) Diving Attack: Diving Shot
    18 Tier4 (1) Deadly Instinct
    19 Tier4 (1) Deadly Instinct
    20 Tier4 (1) Deadly Instinct
    21 Tier4 (1) Coordinated Strikes: Shoot and Destroy
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Arcane Archer (Elf) - Points spent: 42
    1 Core ·(1) rcane Archer (Elf)
    2 Tier1 (2) Conjure Arrows
    3 Tier1 (2) Elemental Arrows I: Shock Arrows
    4 Core ·(1) Morphic Arrows
    5 Tier2 (2) Elemental Arrows II: Elemental Damage
    6 Tier2 (2) Force Arrows
    7 Tier2 (2) Force Arrows
    8 Core ·(1) Metalline Arrows
    9 Tier3 (2) Elemental Arrows III: Elemental Damage
    10 Tier3 (2) Terror Arrows
    11 Tier1 (1) Energy of the Wild
    12 Tier1 (1) Energy of the Wild
    13 Tier1 (1) Energy of the Wild
    14 Core ·(1) Aligned Arrows
    15 Tier4 (2) Elemental Arrows IV: Elemental Damage
    16 Tier4 (2) Paralyzing Arrows
    17 Tier3 (2) Ability I: +1 Wisdom
    18 Tier2 (1) Inferno Shot
    19 Tier2 (1) Inferno Shot
    20 Tier2 (1) Inferno Shot
    21 Core ·(1) Shadow Arrows
    22 Tier5 (2) Final Strike
    23 Tier5 (2) Improved Elemental Arrows: Elemental Damage
    24 Tier5 (2) Runebow
    25 Tier5 (2) Arrow of Slaying
    26 Tier5 (2) Moonbow
    27 Core ·(1) Master of Imbuement
    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


    I start as a monk for skills purpose, then take 6lvls of ranger for feats, some spells, and most importantly for me: early access to arcane archer goodies. I realize this is not endgame optimized build, but i am not gonna stay for long at 30 lvl. Moreover i prefer to have fun as an arcane archer at low lvls and one shot with elemental arrows. I hesitate about taking 1ftr for additional feat(weapon focus) at cost of two skill points and -1mnk lvl for 10k stars. Might switch AA for Falconer sometimes for fun with assassinate abilities. I guess this build should be an ok way to level. Feel free to criticise.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vilgeforts View Post
    I start as a monk for skills purpose, then take 6lvls of ranger for feats, some spells, and most importantly for me: early access to arcane archer goodies. I realize this is not endgame optimized build, but i am not gonna stay for long at 30 lvl. Moreover i prefer to have fun as an arcane archer at low lvls and one shot with elemental arrows. I hesitate about taking 1ftr for additional feat(weapon focus) at cost of two skill points and -1mnk lvl for 10k stars. Might switch AA for Falconer sometimes for fun with assassinate abilities. I guess this build should be an ok way to level. Feel free to criticise.
    Good plan for leveling with Ranger AA. DWS has a lot to offer for DPS with Killer and Strikes like Lightning for 40 Doubleshot as well as +1 crit multi.

    Edit: Tier 5 Elven AA Final Strike DOES give 20% Doubleshot but you have to wait until level 25 to get 20% DS from the capstone.

    Feat wise you can get SOTR early for the 10% Bow Alacrity and the 3 Ranged Power because you have high enough dexterity early on so you dont need Precision, Zen Archery or Monk stance untill level 12.

    Just a few ideas i had
    Last edited by Coffey; 07-20-2020 at 04:55 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffey View Post
    Good plan for leveling with Ranger AA. DWS has a lot to offer for DPS with Killer and Strikes like Lightning for 40 Doubleshot as well as +1 crit multi.

    Tier 5 Elven AA Final Strike doesnt give 20% Doubleshot any more and you have to wait until level 25 to get 20% DS from the capstone.

    Feat wise you can get SOTR early for the 10% Bow Alacrity and the 3 Ranged Power because you have high enough dexterity early on so you dont need Precision, Zen Archery or Monk stance untill level 12.

    Just a few ideas i had
    Thats a good point with SOTR! I will resign from precision and take dodge->mobility->SOTR instead. I also have an upgrade to the build. At lvl 6 instead of 5th ranger i will take 1mnk and then at 7 instead ranger i will take fighter with manyshot as additional feet. This will grant me 15 monk and the end for AC and movement bonus at cost of some skill points. I counted with builder and veteran status II and it adds up. I think that in this build it is important to use max BAB classes so you wont lose ranged attack speed and manyshot bonus. I think i now have the build in my head and i am happy about it. Thanks to all for help. Cya in game

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    Hi Folks,

    For those who are still interested in monkcher builds, let me assure you, this is not only viable option, but with falconry tree and gear from Sharn/Feywild it is now better than ever.

    Here's what I play right now and I absolutely love it!!

    Aasimar Scourge, Wisdom based. 14 monk / 6 ranger.
    AA and falconry tree plus some points in racial for extra wisdom, heals and healing amp.


    Here are few pros:
    - great defences, (high AC (190+), Saves (100+ all), Dodge (35%), HP pool (2k+ on reaper), some feats that boost your immunes like poison etc and don't forget this is ranged class, so you dont take much beating anyway.
    - Amazing self heal and heal amp (healing hands that restores 3.2k hp instantly)
    - fast movement / wings
    - great ranged DPS, both sustained and burst (Manyshot / 10k stars) and fury shot from Shiradi.
    ranged power 200+ not buffed, and with manyshot, action boost and AF stance, it can easily go up to 400+, not to mention deadly instinct from Falconry.
    - cc: paralyze arrows, trip and blind (falconry), Slow/Paralyze (Shiradi - Stay Frosty / Nerve venom), knockdown from Water Stance.
    - UMD for scroll usage (buffs / res etc)

    Overall this is fantastic balance between survivability and DPS, while in groups you deal extra sneak attack damage that scales with ranged power.
    It's an absolute delight to play.

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    Quote Originally Posted by iMike8one View Post
    Hi Folks,

    For those who are still interested in monkcher builds, let me assure you, this is not only viable option, but with falconry tree and gear from Sharn/Feywild it is now better than ever.
    It's an absolute delight to play.
    Great to know, I need to reroll my archer to this. If you take 6 ranger, definitely get sniper shot. It's a huge amount of dmg when combined with slayer arrows from Shiradi.
    Kodraith / Xanxibar / Xinibar / Lensgrinder :: Lava Divers of Khyber :: I'm a monk. I hit things; it's what I do.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kodwraith View Post
    Great to know, I need to reroll my archer to this. If you take 6 ranger, definitely get sniper shot. It's a huge amount of dmg when combined with slayer arrows from Shiradi.

    Yes, I'll try that for sure. Still trying to sort out best point distribution between AA, Falconry and Deepwood stalker.

    For now I am using AA tree with Arrow of Slaying which I believe deals even more damage with Shiradi fury shot. And also, I switch between acid arrow when I need armor destruction and paralyze arrows for cc. It works pretty well even on R7.

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    Community Member Kodwraith's Avatar
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    I just rerolled Xanxibar into this last night. I went woodelf with 1 ranger -> 2 monk -> 5 ranger -> rest monk which gets you evasion, a stance, feats early. Then PBS, dodge, zen archery, mobility, SotR. It's a very front loaded build which is super nice. Remember that you have to take Grandmaster as your 18 feat. Also need IC, IPS and I like 10k stars which I think is now selectable as a regular feat.

    Enhancements, I usually do 3-5 into AA for summon arrows since it's really annoying running out of arrows. Then Falconry for WIS hit/dmg. Then DWS for sniper shot, Then all into AA for Acid/paralyzers. I've never figured out an optimal T5 spread, since there's good things in all of them. Elf gives me AA optional capstone at 23, but it's a bit of. stretch with the T4 investment into falconry. 25% incorp in Ninja used to be awesome, but now?

    The absolute minimum investment is AA: 22AP for Paralyzers, Falconry 12AP for wisdom/dmg, DWS 11AP for Snipershot.

    The main downside to the build is you don't have the right level split for +1 competence to crit range even with Elf AA in epic.
    One option is Elf: 14, 41 AA, 11 DWS, Falconry the rest. Should be viable and gets you the capstone.
    The other split would be DWS 38 (T5), AA 24(T4), Falconry (the rest). Which gives +crit mult but misses all the capstones.
    Kodraith / Xanxibar / Xinibar / Lensgrinder :: Lava Divers of Khyber :: I'm a monk. I hit things; it's what I do.

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