Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 1234567 LastLast
Results 41 to 60 of 139
  1. #41
    Systems Designer
    Lynnabel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    game/cdb/effect/effects-property-2.cdb
    Posts
    2,562

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DRoark View Post
    It used to work, whether or not it was intended there was a noticible difference.
    The actual code does not show any history of the Quicken metamagic flag being usable on these spells, from now to the day of their creation on 5/27/2011 at 4:55PM. The property Spell_MetamagicFlags controls which Metamagic is available, and the only changes in that field since release have been the adding of Intensify and Accelerate.

    If you have more information on this I'd love to hear it I'm always happy to poke into fun corner cases on this project.
    Last edited by Lynnabel; 02-20-2020 at 05:29 PM.
    100% radical, enthusiasm enthusiast.

  2. #42
    Community Member DRoark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    269

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mr420247 View Post
    Ok but heroics on a dg with wand scroll mastery my heal scrolls heal for more quicker
    Exactly, when a scroll or a wand is superior to a class core ability, there's zero reason to use it.
    NO MORE MONEY UNTIL IPS NERF RETRACTED... Ranged of the World Unite!

  3. #43
    Community Member DRoark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    269

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    The actual code does not show any history of the Quicken metamagic flag being usable on these spells, from now to the day of their creation on 5/27/2011 at 4:55PM. The property Spell_MetamagicFlags controls which Metamagic is available, and the only changes in that field since release have been the adding of Intensify and Accelerate.

    If you have more information on this I'd love to hear it I'm always happy to poke into fun corner cases on this project.
    Oh, I completely believe there's no flag for it if you say that, but having played Artificer as my main since it came out, I can flat-out say I could see a difference when I toggled it on to cast other spells,
    as did the people I routinely threw the vials at.

    It's like the FvS/cleric thing I dare not type here, lest it be "fixed". I'm pretty sure that's a bug too.

    ... and the other thing, I'll just send you a PM on that one.
    Last edited by DRoark; 02-20-2020 at 06:18 PM.
    NO MORE MONEY UNTIL IPS NERF RETRACTED... Ranged of the World Unite!

  4. #44
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    70

    Default

    Eh, give it a week and you'll be calling for nerfs. You people are mad, clearly not played the class or played it badly.

    I can get off 3 or 4 mass heal potions before you've finished casting your mass heal, I didn't need to heal my damage was just so **** high, but when I did heal I could healed a lot, and I also used it a lot to keep my reactions switching.

    Alchemist is incredibly powerful, they aren't punished by healing, often by healing you put yourself into Green stance, giving you a huge boost to healing and +20% run speed, making you a far better healer. Unless you guys are talking about R7+ Which shouldn't be considered in a discussion of balance.

  5. #45
    Community Member Oliphant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    1,349

    Default

    Have to agree after playing it more that its not true to say Alch heals are slow. In fact, the mass heal pot is quite a bit faster. But then I play some more and start seeing the behavior that upset me in the first place. Just a few possible hypotheses: 1. lacking quicken, sometimes you get a slow debuff that reeeally slows down the casting, so it's a bit less reliable; and 2. maybe the Alch spell state switching is affecting speed more than just a little bit. Overall, I find the heal pot to be quite fast. The mechanic is a little less reliable but basically ok and I can throw off multiple attempts so overall it works pretty good. I suspect that the finnicky mechanic is sensitive to your IP and lag issues. I am in a city and have decent internet connection and I'm ok with the pot throwing mechanic at this point. However, when it gets laggier, I have more trouble and I wonder if this is part of the issue for some folks.
    Please consider the environment before printing this post

  6. #46
    Community Member DRoark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    269

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by crackas View Post
    Eh, give it a week and you'll be calling for nerfs. You people are mad, clearly not played the class or played it badly.

    I can get off 3 or 4 mass heal potions before you've finished casting your mass heal
    You're amazing then, being able to cast multiple 12-second-cooldown potions, before we cast one 3-second quickened spell. )
    NO MORE MONEY UNTIL IPS NERF RETRACTED... Ranged of the World Unite!

  7. #47
    Community Member Oliphant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    1,349

    Default

    Is mass heal 3 seconds?
    Please consider the environment before printing this post

  8. #48
    Community Member mr420247's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    1,767

    Default

    No but mass cure mods crits serious and div wrath fully mtables are cheaper

    I throw a pot peep runs off done fizzle welcome to the zerg

    For r1 zergs sure but epic r10s a joke mate play wiz or sorc
    Last edited by mr420247; 02-20-2020 at 08:11 PM.
    Damonz Cannith

  9. #49
    Community Member Oliphant's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    1,349

    Default

    Agree mass cures are awesome but getting the restorative effects of mass heal faster is nice. It's not as simple as slower, less functional. At this point I'm leaning toward seeing it as just a legit flavor distinction and happy to have a faster mass heal on the team. I also think buffing Alch is likely reasonable, generally. It's ok - maybe good - not great. However, my opinion after a week is I really like the play style if the diff is easy enough (e.g. heroic r1). I'm doing a no IPS thrower and it feels the most like a traditional arcade game with genuinely functional single and aoe dps options in a pew pew bomb bomb play style. Good job on flavor devs. I hope you hone this one and smooth out the rougher edges.
    Please consider the environment before printing this post

  10. #50
    Community Member DRoark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    269

    Default

    I was laughing at that other post. By the time you actually cast two of the Heal potions, I can cast my entire line of spells.

    That 12-second cooldown is a bear, plus the overland shipping. It's like your spell has to catch an Uber to go find the tank.
    NO MORE MONEY UNTIL IPS NERF RETRACTED... Ranged of the World Unite!

  11. #51
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    70

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DRoark View Post
    You're amazing then, being able to cast multiple 12-second-cooldown potions, before we cast one 3-second quickened spell. )

    I'm pretty sure mass heal is longer than 3 seconds, and I have two mass heal potions. Still having two mass heals to throw so rapidly and one being an SLA is a good trade off.

    Obviously R10 is completely different, and doesn't really have a place in a conversation about balance. Last I seriously looked into R10 there was like 6 builds to play or you may as well not play at all.

  12. #52
    Community Member Oxarhamar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    5,859

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by HastyPudding View Post
    So it's okay for a FVS to have lightning fast healing that they can spam near infinitely, awesome buffing potential, a powerful aoe heal that can be kept up indefinitely, a heal and true resurrection sla, and yet still have great instakills, innate wings, double alchemist's spell points, great single target buffs, higher HP and defenses, and viable damage? Alchemist has two instakills: one is single target with a bottle travel time and the other is touch range, requires a condition to be met, and is locked in apothecary tier 5 (where the vast majority of alchemists aren't going to go). Please tell me how this is balanced between the two.



    Again, the 'slow but strong' shtick works for damage, but not for healing. It's detrimental to have a slow healer. Period. I went from 1-20 as an alchemist (ready to TR when I login this afternoon) and I had several people die in my parties because I could not heal fast enough, or because another player stepped in front of the curative bottle as it was traveling. No other class has that penalty.

    Even quickened, the bottle still has to have travel time, so there's still more than enough room for the healing to fail due to a variety of reasons I've already mentioned in this thread. The mechanics of the class work in theory, but fail in practice. I could easily see the SP cost of the curatives increased by 30%~50% and able to be quickened, and that would be acceptable.
    Meh I've not tried running one yet but, I've been playing Arti at all levels since it came out.

    Groups are always happy to have my healing if Alchemist is better than Arti it's healing is fine even if it is slow.

  13. #53
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    909

    Default

    Alchemist healing is decent for people who don't need a lot of really quick heals. It is ideal for topping up the people who can survive 4-5 hits at your level of difficulty. It is awful for the 2 hit squad. It's also awful for the squad who has no idea how your heals work (ie the ones that make you and the bottle chase them rather than prudently trying to be inside the ae of it when it goes off on you).

  14. #54
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Wisconsin, birthplace of D&D
    Posts
    27,309

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by crackas View Post
    Eh, give it a week and you'll be calling for nerfs. You people are mad, clearly not played the class or played it badly.
    They wont have played it by then either. It will be OTHER people playing it, ruining my fun.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013 (when concurrency was ~4x what it is today)

  15. #55
    Community Member DRoark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    269

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxarhamar View Post
    Meh I've not tried running one yet but, I've been playing Arti at all levels since it came out.

    Groups are always happy to have my healing if Alchemist is better than Arti it's healing is fine even if it is slow.
    Arti's still more efficient, using the Converter to just repair the tank, and using the potions if you really have to, on anyone else.
    Unfortunately, Alchemist is a half-a-trick pony. If they officially add Quicken back, and fix Accelerate, it might be tolerable.

    right now, it's about 4x slower to throw a potion, than toss an actual heal. (Quicken + no travel time).
    NO MORE MONEY UNTIL IPS NERF RETRACTED... Ranged of the World Unite!

  16. #56
    Community Member Oxarhamar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    5,859

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DRoark View Post
    Arti's still more efficient, using the Converter to just repair the tank, and using the potions if you really have to, on anyone else.
    Unfortunately, Alchemist is a half-a-trick pony. If they officially add Quicken back, and fix Accelerate, it might be tolerable.

    right now, it's about 4x slower to throw a potion, than toss an actual heal. (Quicken + no travel time).
    I am speaking of potion healing not repairing robots or converting

    of course it's slower & yet it if still fine if it's better than Arti

    context matters

  17. #57
    Community Member DRoark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    269

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Oxarhamar View Post
    I am speaking of potion healing not repairing robots or converting

    of course it's slower & yet it if still fine if it's better than Arti

    context matters
    If it was only the potion, and no other sources of healing, yeah the Alch will be better, but in terms of overall healing, they're not.
    You can quicken all the other stuff, and there's zero travel time. You can't really say Class A is better than HALF of Class B.

    Not saying some people don't find Alchemist tolerable, they're OK if I need a random top-off, and I'm not in a hurry.
    NO MORE MONEY UNTIL IPS NERF RETRACTED... Ranged of the World Unite!

  18. #58
    Community Member Oxarhamar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    5,859

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DRoark View Post
    If it was only the potion, and no other sources of healing, yeah the Alch will be better, but in terms of overall healing, they're not.
    You can quicken all the other stuff, and there's zero travel time. You can't really say Class A is better than HALF of Class B.

    Not saying some people don't find Alchemist tolerable, they're OK if I need a random top-off, and I'm not in a hurry.
    Yes I can say & I have for the 3rd time now

    Class A Alchemist is better than Class B Artificer speaking about potion healing

    Multiple others have in the thread as well

    It's the speed that's been a complaint and that's the same as on Artificer so there really ain't an issue

    You one talking about other stuff maybe try stay on topic.


    Attempt to move the goal post & take it out of context some more now ??
    Last edited by Oxarhamar; 02-21-2020 at 10:46 PM.

  19. #59
    Community Member DRoark's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2018
    Posts
    269

    Default

    I literally agreed with him, that on potions, Alch is better... and he still complains, lol.

    You have our permission to throw a potion at the tank, if he needs a heal eventually.
    NO MORE MONEY UNTIL IPS NERF RETRACTED... Ranged of the World Unite!

  20. #60
    Community Member Oxarhamar's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    5,859

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by DRoark View Post
    I literally agreed with him, that on potions, Alch is better... and he still complains, lol.

    You have our permission to throw a potion at the tank, if he needs a heal eventually.
    Your reply is quoted the complaint is all yourn

    You don't agree with someone at the same time that disagree and take it out of context.
    Last edited by Oxarhamar; 02-22-2020 at 12:07 AM.

Page 3 of 7 FirstFirst 1234567 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload