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  1. #1
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    Default The problem with Magister ED

    +5 DCs to magister in latest ED upgrade, but all new content is being designed around those +5 DCs!!!

    All the devs have done is make it so you must be in magister if you want your spells to ever land. Before the +5 DCs I could be in any ED and be an effective DC caster.

    Now I have no choice I must be in Magister or I might as well be in nothing at all.

    So in effect the buff that was done to Magister was actually a nerf because all the DCs were raised along with it.
    Toon on cannith

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by capsela View Post
    So in effect the buff that was done to Magister was actually a nerf because all the DCs were raised along with it.
    To clarify: We have not raised monster saving throws (or changed anything else that would be impacted in this way) alongside or in response to Magister changes.
    We don't only build for the builds that exist.
    We don't only build for the builds that are good right now.

    The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.


    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    To be very clear, the change to IPS does not specifically have to do with Inquisitive overperforming. It is the result of evaluating the way that Ranged Weapon Users interact with the overall build meta and (especially) melees.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    To clarify: We have not raised monster saving throws (or changed anything else that would be impacted in this way) alongside or in response to Magister changes.
    Well, it seemed like that to me. I stand corrected. Apologies and thanks for the quick response.
    Toon on cannith

  4. #4
    Community Member mr420247's Avatar
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    Also add in the fact that Wizies are like 8 dcs over all other casters and ya along with legendary levels

    Other casters might be sol when they raise the bar again since most spells still being hard capped back in cap 20 days

    And we'll be going to 35 arg and if those levels dont do anything for max caster levels ya i see problems coming
    Damonz Cannith

  5. #5
    Community Member Inanout's Avatar
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    Who do I believe?

    It is sad the player knows more about the game then the developer.
    Protect the Silver Flame at all costs!

  6. #6
    Community Member ChadB123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inanout View Post
    Who do I believe?

    It is sad the player knows more about the game then the developer.
    Monster saves were not buffed outside of reaper. They were inside of reaper, but magister is still a net gain.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChadB123 View Post
    Monster saves were not buffed outside of reaper. They were inside of reaper, but magister is still a net gain.
    Wow, that misses the point of the OP completely. Yes, Magister is still a net gain, but every other ED is a net loss. That was the point. And Sharn may not have intentionally been balanced with ED changes in mind, but Sharn most certainly did see pretty significant fortitude save increases for many mob types, especially in the earlier quests in the saga. Necro DCs that were fine in RL were not in A Sharn Welcome or Red Rain. That's also what may be triggering the original post.

  8. #8
    Community Member ChadB123's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zretch View Post
    Wow, that misses the point of the OP completely. Yes, Magister is still a net gain, but every other ED is a net loss. That was the point. And Sharn may not have intentionally been balanced with ED changes in mind, but Sharn most certainly did see pretty significant fortitude save increases for many mob types, especially in the earlier quests in the saga. Necro DCs that were fine in RL were not in A Sharn Welcome or Red Rain. That's also what may be triggering the original post.
    I did misread the OP, which is my bad.

    However, although fort saves are high in Sharn, other saves aren't to compensate.

  9. #9
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    I also have a DC caster. Everything said in the original post is 100% accurate based on my experience and in my opinion.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zretch View Post
    Necro DCs that were fine in RL were not in A Sharn Welcome or Red Rain. That's also what may be triggering the original post.
    Sharn is intentionally more difficult content than Ravenloft, not just in DCs - Across the board.
    We don't only build for the builds that exist.
    We don't only build for the builds that are good right now.

    The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.


    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    To be very clear, the change to IPS does not specifically have to do with Inquisitive overperforming. It is the result of evaluating the way that Ranged Weapon Users interact with the overall build meta and (especially) melees.

  11. #11
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zretch View Post
    Wow, that misses the point of the OP completely. Yes, Magister is still a net gain, but every other ED is a net loss. That was the point. And Sharn may not have intentionally been balanced with ED changes in mind, but Sharn most certainly did see pretty significant fortitude save increases for many mob types, especially in the earlier quests in the saga. Necro DCs that were fine in RL were not in A Sharn Welcome or Red Rain. That's also what may be triggering the original post.
    After you get the better Sharn gear (and the sentient sets from Artifacts), your Necro DCs increased and were good enough again. And enchant DCs were good enough even with RL gear. This was a more martial pack with mobs that had high fort saves.

    My wizard did just fine in Sharn once I got all the gear, and that was BEFORE the magister changes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  12. #12
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Inanout View Post
    Who do I believe?

    It is sad the player knows more about the game then the developer.
    The player doesn't know more in this case. It's sad that you think they do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  13. #13
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Sharn is intentionally more difficult content than Ravenloft, not just in DCs - Across the board.
    Exactly. Did you guys really think you'd walk into the latest end-game pack, and it would be as easy as the last end-game pack?

    Gianthold and Amrath were also packs where the mobs had high fort saves, and for good reasons. Some players complained, the good players adjusted.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  14. #14
    Community Member SpartanKiller13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zretch View Post
    Necro DCs that were fine in RL were not in A Sharn Welcome or Red Rain. That's also what may be triggering the original post.
    Are your Necro DC's still fine in RL though?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    My wizard did just fine in Sharn once I got all the gear, and that was BEFORE the magister changes.
    Sharn gear + filigree did more for me than Magister did. If I was planning on a bunch of RL runs etc I'd probably swap out of Magister for more DPS lol.
    -Khysiria of Cannith
    Quote Originally Posted by zehnvhex View Post
    Warlock is basically a ghetto Shiradi Sorc. You gives up some of the damage and self sustain for the ability to just hold down left click and yolo blast your way to victory.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    It's DDO. There are probably 6 different types of Evil damage.

  15. #15
    Community Member HuneyMunster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    To clarify: We have not raised monster saving throws (or changed anything else that would be impacted in this way) alongside or in response to Magister changes.
    Though Exalted Angel and Draconic Incarnation were impacted indirectly through Reaper difficulty.

    Update 42 Patch 4 "Creatures in Reaper will have an additional +4 to their Saving Throws versus Spells."

    After the destiny changes and in Reaper mode Magister gained +1 to all spells and an additional +3 to the school they focused in. Draconic Incarnation got a -1 DC Evocation and Conjuration and -4 to all other schools. Exalted Angel got a -4 penalty to all spell DC's in Reaper.

  16. #16
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    Exactly. Did you guys really think you'd walk into the latest end-game pack, and it would be as easy as the last end-game pack?

    Gianthold and Amrath were also packs where the mobs had high fort saves, and for good reasons. Some players complained, the good players adjusted.
    That highlights a specific but different issue. Content the same level is made intentionally more difficult due to the specific need to constantly creep the character power past the previous ceiling.

    Now the grind is not only longer, but it has a specific order of operations.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013 (when concurrency was ~4x what it is today)

  17. #17
    Community Member AlmGhandi's Avatar
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    There was me thinking that the problem with the Magister is that the area affect deathward etc do not work.
    kruemeli of Orien - Leader of the "Merry" Hobbits https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...20#post5002220
    It is okay to be "merry": http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjOOKb-DFZs
    I just Keep quiet and think.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYP8M06A8W0

  18. #18
    2014 DDO Players Council
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChadB123 View Post
    Monster saves were not buffed outside of reaper. They were inside of reaper, but magister is still a net gain.
    A net gain either way, but relatively more of a net gain for Int/Cha casters than Wis casters, though.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    As a general rule we don't intend for a single spawn area to cause any dungeon alert, and certainly not red dungeon alert. This basically isn't ever a goal in our designs

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thrudh View Post
    After you get the better Sharn gear (and the sentient sets from Artifacts), your Necro DCs increased and were good enough again. And enchant DCs were good enough even with RL gear. This was a more martial pack with mobs that had high fort saves.

    My wizard did just fine in Sharn once I got all the gear, and that was BEFORE the magister changes.
    I am 100% sure capsela has the relevant sharn gear and maxed out DCs. Am sure the OP came from the fact that DCs in sharn are much higher than other content - which is fine I guess. Just means you need to prepare for it, especially if running in reaper!!!

  20. #20
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whaldorf View Post
    I am 100% sure capsela has the relevant sharn gear and maxed out DCs.
    I'm 100% sure he didn't. Because he wouldn't be complaining if he did.

    Again, the Magister changes were made a good time AFTER Sharn came out... After I got all my Sharn gear, and my Artifact built out, and I was still running in Exalted Angel, I did just fine in Sharn.

    After the Magister changes, it's even easier.

    Maybe the next pack will take Magister changes into account (I hope not), but Sharn was not built with Magister changes in mind... The Magister changes happened AFTER Sharn.
    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    We are no more d000m'd then we were a week ago. Note - This was posted in 10/2013
    Quote Originally Posted by Eth View Post
    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

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