Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 51
  1. #1
    Squirrel Enthusiast Lokeal_The_Flame's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Kordamye
    Posts
    1,706

    Default When SSG Says "No" to a Malicia Sentient Jewel, they are only making excuses!

    In the Sharn arc we learned that a soul can be consumed to be used in place of spell points!

    In the soul splitter arc we learned that souls can be stored and transfered into new vessels!

    If a soul can be stored, the technology/magic to analyze said soul's composition is by extension also possible!

    If a soul can replace the necessity for Spellpoints, then spellpoints should be by extension in theory capable of mimicking a soul likely through something discovered via the transmutation school of magic, possibly with some additional help from the necromancy school of magic.

    When people ask for a Malicia sentient jewel (Or in my case a Yaulthoon sentient jewel), or any other sentient jewel of an NPC whose voice and personality they enjoyed and SSG says no on the basis of "It would break with what is Canonical with DDO", they are only making excuses. The technology that the Sharn content is working up to makes the possibility of making a Malicia sentient jewel a no-brainer through minimal creative writing.

    The reality is, if SSG cares enough to make whatever sentient jewel you desire the most based on an in game NPC...... they can do it, and all they have to do is to extent the technology of the vaunt device to make a device that does the following:

    1-Extract a soul

    2-Copy the extracted soul

    3-Store the synthetic copy into a sentient jewel

    4-Return the extracted soul to the original host with a permanent amnesia as to how they got there or what they were doing there (Convenient side effect).

    The current cannon to game capabilities of the modified vaunt devices are capable of a little less than half of this list already, therefore let it be known that when a Dev says no on the basis mentioned to a sentient jewel, they are only making excuses! The plot progression towards this is such a no brainer!

    On the other hand some valid excuses are:

    1-For some reason we are not allowed to make an further content featuring said character

    2-We can not afford to hire that voice actor/actress again

    3-That voice actress/actor is no longer available

    The reality is, the potential progression of the vaunt technology reads like a predictable plot line in a mystery novel, if the potential for further modified vaunt devices to create synthetic copies of souls for sentient jewel creation is not utilized for some reason then it would simply be a waste of potential that there is no way the Devs aren't aware of being there! In fact there is a chance the Devs came up with this story line to create new sentient jewels themselves.

    Next time you ask for a sentient jewel of a particular NPC in the game, don't let the Devs make the excuse that such would break with the cannon as if it is actually required to kill said NPC in order to make a sentient jewel of them, let them know that you know better and can see that they are simply making excuses!

    Important: Let them know you see this in a way that is playful, do not be forceful or rude to them!

  2. #2
    Hero Noir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Nevada
    Posts
    590

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokeal_The_Flame View Post
    *Snip*

    On the other hand some valid excuses are:

    1-For some reason we are not allowed to make an further content featuring said character

    2-We can not afford to hire that voice actor/actress again

    3-That voice actress/actor is no longer available.
    *Snip*
    4- We can not get approval from the IP holder (WOTC) to implement that.
    Last edited by Noir; 01-19-2020 at 05:19 PM.
    Originally Posted by grodon9999
    "I'm beginning to think a lot of people play this game because it's cheaper than paying for a Dominatrix."
    Disciplines Disciples - 54 Alts on Khyber and counting

  3. #3
    Community Member Lonnbeimnech's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    4,692

    Default

    5- adding the soul gem for a STILL LIVING NPC is just, ahem, not well thought out.

  4. #4
    Hero Noir's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Nevada
    Posts
    590

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lonnbeimnech View Post
    5- adding the soul gem for a STILL LIVING NPC is just, ahem, not well thought out.
    ALSO- I don't think Malicia is willing to have her soul sucked out in the first place. Capturing a powerful demon last I checked was not that easy. For magic to work. You have to know her TRUE name, And just like we don't know her home plane. I'm relatively certain "Malicia" is not her TRUE name.
    Originally Posted by grodon9999
    "I'm beginning to think a lot of people play this game because it's cheaper than paying for a Dominatrix."
    Disciplines Disciples - 54 Alts on Khyber and counting

  5. #5
    Squirrel Enthusiast Lokeal_The_Flame's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Kordamye
    Posts
    1,706

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lonnbeimnech View Post
    5- adding the soul gem for a STILL LIVING NPC is just, ahem, not well thought out.
    Read the post, if a copy of a soul is made synthetically then yes it is well thought out!

    If you do not have access to the Sharn story line, your comment makes some sense in terms of where you are coming from as the storyline does make room for leading to the scenario I speak of. Please reread my post, read up on DDO's sharn and soulsplitter storyline and get back to me on that as after you do those things you can contribute to the discussion.

  6. #6
    Squirrel Enthusiast Lokeal_The_Flame's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Kordamye
    Posts
    1,706

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post
    ALSO- I don't think Malicia is willing to have her soul sucked out in the first place. Capturing a powerful demon last I checked was not that easy. For magic to work. You have to know her TRUE name, And just like we don't know her home plane. I'm relatively certain "Malicia" is not her TRUE name.
    The sentient Jewel Of BlackRazor contains the soul of a being of far greater power than Malicia, and as far as we know of, the modified Vaunt devices might not factor in the will of the being whose soul is consumed by it.

    This means that regardless, it is definitely possible that such a device could temporarily contain the soul of Malicia (At least long enough to make a synthetic copy of her soul).

    Malicia was able to be summoned and contained in the quest Good Intentions, it was there that we learned her home plane to be Mabar, it was also there that we learned that she does indeed have vulnerabilities that can be surpassed by those belonging to what we call "Player races".

    Further more, there is a very practical application for such technology in the exploration of dangerous realms that would indeed encourage the development of such technology such as the copying of a researcher's soul to implant it into an automaton so that a portal to another plane of existence can be safely traversed. Of course, logically speaking such an automaton would need to have an emergency protocol that if the automaton is damaged significantly would lead to the sentient jewel being ejected via a teleport spell to return to some relatively easy to access location for the owner of such. The owner of that sentient jewel could then access the memory data bank of the sentient jewel as to learn what it learned,


    There is so much potential in storyline for this as this kind of technology does leave room for abuse and motivations for corruption..... hence, potential plot sourcing gold!
    Last edited by Lokeal_The_Flame; 01-19-2020 at 05:47 PM.

  7. #7
    Community Member dennisck2's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    328

    Default

    What the heck did I stumble into?
    Proud guild gimp of Synergia! Adults only. Bring beer. Pants optional.
    Banginurz/Gimpinurz/Shagginurz/Spankinurz. Stay classy Argo.

  8. #8
    Founder & Super Hero Arkat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Wyoming
    Posts
    8,361

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dennisck2 View Post
    What the heck did I stumble into?
    A classic DDO Forum trap - The Pit of Stupidity™.
    "A wise person chooses the right road; a fool takes the wrong one." - Author unknown

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    Hi Welcome

  9. #9
    Forum witchdoctor Hobgoblin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    hell.
    Posts
    6,559

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkat View Post
    A classic DDO Forum trap - The Pit of Stupidity™.
    it comes with free infractions and warnings!
    main toons: Cerrsi(silly caster/xbow) Sttomper (silly barbarian)-jammiee (Silly melee)
    Quote Originally Posted by Eladrin View Post
    You are still completely free to run around like a jackrabbit on caffeine.
    quem deus vult perdere, dementat prius

  10. #10
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    uk
    Posts
    1,163

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dennisck2 View Post
    What the heck did I stumble into?
    a gem i think.

    your friend sil

  11. #11
    Community Member Oghma_Infinium's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Beer, Chocolate & Speculaas FairyLand
    Posts
    80

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokeal_The_Flame View Post
    In the Sharn arc we learned that a soul can be consumed to be used in place of spell points!

    In the soul splitter arc we learned that souls can be stored and transfered into new vessels!

    If a soul can be stored, the technology/magic to analyze said soul's composition is by extension also possible!

    If a soul can replace the necessity for Spellpoints, then spellpoints should be by extension in theory capable of mimicking a soul likely through something discovered via the transmutation school of magic, possibly with some additional help from the necromancy school of magic.

    ....
    Do you know what Entropy is ?
    There is no genius without a touch of madness. Doubt is the key to knowledge. No child has sinner heart.
    Mastering a weapon is knowing how & when to not use it. No law forbid you to be stupid.

  12. #12
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    715

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by dennisck2 View Post
    What the heck did I stumble into?
    Oh nothing to see here.

    BTW, what is your true name? Just uhm... curious. And would you mind standing inside this pentagram?

  13. #13
    Squirrel Enthusiast Lokeal_The_Flame's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Kordamye
    Posts
    1,706

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Fenrisulven7 View Post
    Oh nothing to see here.

    BTW, what is your true name? Just uhm... curious. And would you mind standing inside this pentagram?
    The soul splitter technology from Sharn in DDO can in theory circumvent the rituals normally used in pen and paper D&D if only further modified..... please read the post next time?

  14. #14
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    932

    Default

    Souls can't be used to cast spells.

    I count Vaunt's technology as devilish in nature instead to keep original D&D cannon.

    You can sell only part of your soul through a Faustian Pact, progressively corrupting yourself more and more until you're a finely tuned future Hellspawn.

    Those Pacts can also turn out to give you nice amount of magical power - for a time.

    'Vaunt Arcanotech: sell your soul at the touch of a button!'

    Souls are the price, magic is the result, the only possible intermediary is a demon or devil, and the plan is too crafty to be demonic.

  15. #15
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Posts
    715

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokeal_The_Flame View Post
    The soul splitter technology from Sharn in DDO can in theory circumvent the rituals normally used in pen and paper D&D if only further modified..... please read the post next time?
    LOL.

    No.

    It was just a joke.

  16. #16
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    127

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Noir View Post
    we don't know her home plane.
    I thought it was Mabar.

  17. #17
    Community Member Dragavon's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    3,079

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Sorcerio View Post
    I thought it was Mabar.
    It is.

    If people pay attention to the NPC's at the start of Good Intentions then the wizard that has summoned Malicia will tell you she is "a creature from Mabar".

    Cordovan has been asked about new sentient jewels several times on the wednesday livestream and he always evades saying anything about it. I get the impression SSG have very little interest in making new jewels at the moment. No idea why though.
    Last edited by Dragavon; 01-20-2020 at 04:29 AM.

  18. #18
    Squirrel Enthusiast Lokeal_The_Flame's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Location
    Kordamye
    Posts
    1,706

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Xgya View Post
    Souls can't be used to cast spells.

    I count Vaunt's technology as devilish in nature instead to keep original D&D cannon.

    You can sell only part of your soul through a Faustian Pact, progressively corrupting yourself more and more until you're a finely tuned future Hellspawn.

    Those Pacts can also turn out to give you nice amount of magical power - for a time.

    'Vaunt Arcanotech: sell your soul at the touch of a button!'

    Souls are the price, magic is the result, the only possible intermediary is a demon or devil, and the plan is too crafty to be demonic.
    If you read through all of the dialog, the vaunt devices use necromancy to accomplish the task.

    The trap the soul spell uses conjuration.....

    "Trap the soul forces a creature’s life force (and its material body) into a gem. The gem holds the trapped entity indefinitely or until the gem is broken and the life force is released, which allows the material body to reform. If the trapped creature is a powerful creature from another plane it can be required to perform a service immediately upon being freed. Otherwise, the creature can go free once the gem imprisoning it is broken."

    https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/trapTheSoul.htm

    While trap the soul won't create a sentient jewel, it does encase the soul into a jewel known as a soul gem and it does not in fact require the name of an enemy to be spoken, though speaking their name can increase the chances of successfully trapping said soul. Curses and energy drain effects can be sufficient for making an enemy weak enough to have their soul trapped (Both necromancy school spells). In the quest Good intentions, Malicia herself was summoned and temporarily imprisoned as an exhibit, and she was not powerful enough to resist having had been summoned in such a way, in fact she seemed kind of startled.

    Raise dead, another spell that moves souls (In this case back into their physical body) is also conjuration!

    The soul trapping function of the modified vaunt devices seem to work on an entirely different system than "Trap the soul", in fact likely still utilizing necromancy.

    Pretty sure it would use Evocation if the device in fact utilized a connection to devilish entities, could be wrong there but seems a much better fit (Think Warlock for this).

    Everything seems to point to a further modification of the vaunt devices possibly being capable of copying souls for soul gem creation!

  19. #19
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Posts
    652

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragavon View Post
    It is.

    If people pay attention to the NPC's at the start of Good Intentions then the wizard that has summoned Malicia will tell you she is "a creature from Mabar".

    Cordovan has been asked about new sentient jewels several times on the wednesday livestream and he always evades saying anything about it. I get the impression SSG have very little interest in making new jewels at the moment. No idea why though.
    Prolly cause it costs a lot. Put the malicia jewel in store only. Problem solved.
    Toon on cannith

  20. #20
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    932

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lokeal_The_Flame View Post
    If you read through all of the dialog, the vaunt devices use necromancy to accomplish the task.

    The trap the soul spell uses conjuration.....

    "Trap the soul forces a creature’s life force (and its material body) into a gem. The gem holds the trapped entity indefinitely or until the gem is broken and the life force is released, which allows the material body to reform. If the trapped creature is a powerful creature from another plane it can be required to perform a service immediately upon being freed. Otherwise, the creature can go free once the gem imprisoning it is broken."

    https://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/trapTheSoul.htm

    While trap the soul won't create a sentient jewel, it does encase the soul into a jewel known as a soul gem and it does not in fact require the name of an enemy to be spoken, though speaking their name can increase the chances of successfully trapping said soul. Curses and energy drain effects can be sufficient for making an enemy weak enough to have their soul trapped (Both necromancy school spells). In the quest Good intentions, Malicia herself was summoned and temporarily imprisoned as an exhibit, and she was not powerful enough to resist having had been summoned in such a way, in fact she seemed kind of startled.

    Raise dead, another spell that moves souls (In this case back into their physical body) is also conjuration!

    The soul trapping function of the modified vaunt devices seem to work on an entirely different system than "Trap the soul", in fact likely still utilizing necromancy.

    Pretty sure it would use Evocation if the device in fact utilized a connection to devilish entities, could be wrong there but seems a much better fit (Think Warlock for this).

    Everything seems to point to a further modification of the vaunt devices possibly being capable of copying souls for soul gem creation!
    Trap the Soul, the conjuration spell, works on soulless beings (you can use Trap the Soul on a perfectly normal human zombie, and could do it on any of the golems that isn't immune to magic - shield guardians come to mind).
    What this means is the spell doesn't trap a soul by itself, but a whole creature, no matter what that creature was. It's a bit of a misnamed spell.

    The spell encases a whole creature inside a gem. It's also why the creature can't be brought back to life - it didn't die that day.
    Suffice to say we couldn't force Malicia herself into a weapon slot. (though I'd love her voice as a sentient gem, really)

    Now, what the Vaunt machine does would go under various schools. The soul sucking part is definitely Necromancy.
    Undead can't use it, neither can mindless machines, because both of them are natively immune to Necromantic effects.

    We couldn't force a Clone of Malicia either, since those only become sentient when their original dies.
    We could do it on a Simulacrum of Malicia. That would require us to be able to keep a piece of her the next time we meet, which would also entail not killing her, because her dying means her body parts vanish alongside her.
    Then, we build a nice Malicia-shaped snowwoman, cast the spell and we have our own obedient Malicia, fully operational.
    Take our snowperson and do the magical stuff that lets us turn it into a sentient weapon. But that would require us losing an actual Malicia clone, which would demand a Will save I'm almost certain I'd fail.
    Last edited by Xgya; 01-20-2020 at 02:59 PM.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload