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  1. #1
    2016 DDO Council Member Strimtom's Avatar
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    Default A Sneak Peak at Alchemist, with Steelstar!

    Hello everyone. My name is Strimtom. You may remember from such build guides as Archers, an introduction to mechanics and Motors and springsockets, how to move your experience meter.

    I sat down with Steelstar to go through all the alchemist details we could talk about, and then put it into a video format for all you wonderful souls to enjoy!



    A big, BIG shout out to SSG for taking the time to record this with me. It was good fun and I enjoyed mucking around with the alchemist while I could.

    I hope you are all as excited for U45 as I am!
    All my builds in one place!
    Personal stream http://www.twitch.tv/strimtom and I stream my show on the official DDOStream 6PM-9PM EDT on Mon.

  2. #2
    Community Member Mofus's Avatar
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    Saw the interview on youtube, looks like it will be an interesting class. Thanks for the upload.
    Darkwinn, Milkus, Terismina, Gothmawg, Dreylock, Drunarah, Bigbhamboo, etc on Sarlona / Brixlynn, Mofus, Curgoth, Deidlit, etc on Ghalanda.

  3. #3
    Founder & Super Hero Arkat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mofus View Post
    Saw the interview on youtube, looks like it will be an interesting class.
    Saw the video, just not seeing how this new class will be in any way interesting.
    "A wise person chooses the right road; a fool takes the wrong one." - Author unknown

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    Hi Welcome

  4. #4
    Bwest Fwiends Memnir's Avatar
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    Not watching the video or reading too much about them until release notes... but cautiously hopeful; even if I can't be overly optimistic.
    “Too much of anything is bad, but too much good whiskey is barely enough.” ~ Mark Twain

    .57460.

  5. #5
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    So I added some quick notes to the wiki:
    https://ddowiki.com/page/Alchemist_(speculation)

  6. #6
    Community Member Oliphant's Avatar
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    I feel like I just lost at three card molly to the wizard of oz...
    Please consider the environment before printing this post

  7. #7
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    Tldw: vile chemist is a poison ek with bonuses to simple weapons including xbow, it'll be the new inqui meta. Evasion, int to reflex and int to will, ranged bonus feats, cc and self heals mmm

    Interesting to see how it'll play with 11 alch 7 wiz 2 arti - all int class, pm and poison both scale on neg power.

    Or if the whole thing is doa with so many poison immune mobs ie undead...

  8. #8
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    Tldw: vile chemist is a poison ek with bonuses to simple weapons including xbow, it'll be the new inqui meta. Evasion, int to reflex and int to will, ranged bonus feats, cc and self heals mmm

    Lol, kinda predicted this, but im still interested in the other 2 trees .

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strimtom View Post
    I sat down with Steelstar to go through all the alchemist details we could talk about, and then put it into a video format for all you wonderful souls to enjoy!
    A big, BIG shout out to SSG for taking the time to record this with me. It was good fun and I enjoyed mucking around with the alchemist while I could.
    I hope you are all as excited for U45 as I am!
    I watched through it and extract as much info as I could for my character planner. Thank you for that.

    Hopefully have a release supporting Alchemist end of this week, as long as I get time to generate those enhancement trees and effects.
    Will be on Lamannia Tuesday (14th)/Wednesday (15th) collecting data on my HC character "Ord-1" if you want to say Hi.
    Cannith Server: Maetrim - Once again complete
    Maetrim's DDO Character Planner: https://github.com/Maetrim/DDOBuilder/releases

  10. #10
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    It concerns me that the class gets evasion.

    First, it doesn't really make any sense that a lab rat would be trained in the dodge and weave antics that rogues, rangers and monks specialize in.

    Second, it suggests that SSG don't know how to make builds survivable without either heavy armour or evasion (or being distance casters).

  11. #11
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    Any news on the past life bonuses?

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaeveTuohy View Post
    It concerns me that the class gets evasion.

    First, it doesn't really make any sense that a lab rat would be trained in the dodge and weave antics that rogues, rangers and monks specialize in.

    Second, it suggests that SSG don't know how to make builds survivable without either heavy armour or evasion (or being distance casters).
    They're not trained, they quaff a potion that makes them magically dodgy

    And that's a little unfair - those ARE the two main ways to passively defend against magic right now, either Evasion or MRR. How else would you suggest they boost survivability outside those two mechanics?

  13. #13
    Community Member SpartanKiller13's Avatar
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    So who's looking at Nightforge Spike?

    Assuming hits on 2+ which isn't exactly reasonable:

    16-20/x3 Base
    15-20/x3 Improved Critical
    11-20/x4 Swashbuckler (+4/1 via ICrit)
    10-20/x4 Vile Chemist T5
    9-20/x4 Celestial Champion

    +1 on 19-20 Overwhelming Critical

    (1x0 + 7x1 + 10x4 + 2x5)/20 = 2.85 average crit multiplier, and now you have 30+ AP in a useful tree (compared to FB T5).

    With another bonus with the simple weapons mastery feat; I'm assuming it's +1 to crit multiplier probably, given the new tree's T5 is threat range.

    (1x0 + 7x1 + 10x5 + 2x6)/20 = 3.35 average crit multiplier.

    I think that could make it better at 30 than even Twisted Missile.

    It's weird to consider that any random +1 range bonus is better than SB's T5 in this narrow case...

    Quote Originally Posted by MaeveTuohy View Post
    It concerns me that the class gets evasion.
    Insightful Reflexes + Evasion for free sounds pretty strong. Also Int to Fort or Will as a bonus? Hmmm.
    -Khysiria of Cannith
    Quote Originally Posted by zehnvhex View Post
    Warlock is basically a ghetto Shiradi Sorc. You gives up some of the damage and self sustain for the ability to just hold down left click and yolo blast your way to victory.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    It's DDO. There are probably 6 different types of Evil damage.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpartanKiller13 View Post
    With another bonus with the simple weapons mastery feat; I'm assuming it's +1 to crit multiplier probably, given the new tree's T5 is threat range.
    No I expect Simple Thrower Expertise to be a copy of Shuriken Expertise - chance to throw additional Simple Throwing Weapons based on ?INT

    Also what makes you think VC crit boosts will stack with Swash?

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by MaeveTuohy View Post
    It concerns me that the class gets evasion.

    First, it doesn't really make any sense that a lab rat would be trained in the dodge and weave antics that rogues, rangers and monks specialize in.

    Second, it suggests that SSG don't know how to make builds survivable without either heavy armour or evasion (or being distance casters).
    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    They're not trained, they quaff a potion that makes them magically dodgy

    And that's a little unfair - those ARE the two main ways to passively defend against magic right now, either Evasion or MRR. How else would you suggest they boost survivability outside those two mechanics?
    They also get it much later than most classes, and don't get it automatically; it takes a class feat slot.
    We don't only build for the builds that exist.
    We don't only build for the builds that are good right now.

    The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.


    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    To be very clear, the change to IPS does not specifically have to do with Inquisitive overperforming. It is the result of evaluating the way that Ranged Weapon Users interact with the overall build meta and (especially) melees.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    They also get it much later than most classes, and don't get it automatically; it takes a class feat slot.
    Well...that's only an opportunity cost if there's a meaningful tradeoff...which I guess we'll see later what the other class feats are at that level, but if Evasion is the only obvious first one to take once it becomes available, then it might as well just be an auto-grant. Sounds like Alch wont be feat-starved though, especially since it naturally pairs with other INT classes like Wiz and Arti that *also* get bonus feats and/or autogrants.

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    They're not trained, they quaff a potion that makes them magically dodgy

    And that's a little unfair - those ARE the two main ways to passively defend against magic right now, either Evasion or MRR. How else would you suggest they boost survivability outside those two mechanics?
    maybe quaff a potion that temporarily increases MRR cap or something instead of evasion?

    I haven’t studied this in depth enough though to fully offer my oft-ignored depths of wisdom
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  18. #18
    Community Member HungarianRhapsody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    They're not trained, they quaff a potion that makes them magically dodgy

    And that's a little unfair - those ARE the two main ways to passively defend against magic right now, either Evasion or MRR. How else would you suggest they boost survivability outside those two mechanics?
    They could be like the rest of us and NOT have enormous survivability.

    Like Wizards, Sorcerers, non-bear Druids, etc.
    No one in the world ever gets what they want
    And that is beautiful
    Everybody dies frustrated and sad
    And that is beautiful

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by HungarianRhapsody View Post
    They could be like the rest of us and NOT have enormous survivability.

    Like Wizards, Sorcerers, non-bear Druids, etc.
    Wiz, Sorc, and Druid all have options for Medium armor, which gives them access to uncapped MRR, and the corresponding ASF reduction.

    Alchemist, it sounds, was designed to be a totally unarmored caster, so it has zero options/support for armor. You need to give them something, even if its something most pure-caster builds might not end up taking. The only other option would be like Saekee says, to give them arbitrarily increased MRR cap in Robes. But then you run into a balance issue with taking an Evasion class splash AND having a higher MRR cap, unless the MRR cap somehow made you Encumbered or something - but it gets trickier than just aligning Alch with the existing unarmored archetype.
    Last edited by droid327; 01-14-2020 at 10:16 AM.

  20. #20
    Community Member SpartanKiller13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    No I expect Simple Thrower Expertise to be a copy of Shuriken Expertise - chance to throw additional Simple Throwing Weapons based on ?INT

    Also what makes you think VC crit boosts will stack with Swash?
    In the video it was called out as being a stacking bonus. I could be misinterpreting that, but frankly aside from NFSpike it wouldn't be very unbalanced for it to fully stack. It's just that NFSpike has +4/+1 crit profile compared to a standard dart lol.
    -Khysiria of Cannith
    Quote Originally Posted by zehnvhex View Post
    Warlock is basically a ghetto Shiradi Sorc. You gives up some of the damage and self sustain for the ability to just hold down left click and yolo blast your way to victory.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    It's DDO. There are probably 6 different types of Evil damage.

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