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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShifterThePirate View Post
    I never understand topics like these... IT"S A FREE GAME! If you want to know if it's worth it just install the game and try it yourself. Others can't tell you what is worth it for you If you like it keep playing... if you don't like it uninstall it again
    He's trying to do a bit of research before starting down a path that could take up alot of his time energy and money.

    Kinda like: if I spend 4 years on this Intersectional Studies degree, will I be able to get a job once I graduate?

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by ShifterThePirate View Post
    I never understand topics like these... IT"S A FREE GAME! If you want to know if it's worth it just install the game and try it yourself. Others can't tell you what is worth it for you If you like it keep playing... if you don't like it uninstall it again

    You not understanding does not make it a topic not worth bringing up. Some of us don't have endless free time I guess? and maybe you just don't know but a lot of Older mmorpgs (you know, the ones you play because other people are around) Are rather dead in the beginner & older areas. Im not really into spending tens-hundreds of hours figuring out if its too late in that respect "Free game" or not.

    Here's the thing. If i wanted to play a Single player game? I would. this is an MMORPG. Having just spent 20+ Years on ONE mmo clearly if i were to start playing it would be the MMO I would be putting my time into.
    I do NOT however want to spend hundreds of hours "Making my own fun" Alone only to get to a point when I need to interact with other players (again...its an MMO) and be told to go to hell because i'm not part of the cool club or whatever the case may be. If the game had become a tight-knit community of only people who do certain things Why waste my time? Better to hear it from the horse's mouth directly than spend a bunch of hours alone bumbling through a game only to find out "I Did it wrong". I have plenty of SP RPG's i can slog through and I did not want this to become one of them.

    I also never asked someone to tell me the games "Worth to me" in any way shape or form. I merely asked a question relating to whether or not the game had a specific "meta" in a sense that if one did not meet, would they be excluded?.

    Thank's for the reply though I guess.

  3. #23
    Community Member ShifterThePirate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brachra15 View Post
    You not understanding does not make it a topic not worth bringing up. Some of us don't have endless free time I guess? and maybe you just don't know but a lot of Older mmorpgs (you know, the ones you play because other people are around) Are rather dead in the beginner & older areas. Im not really into spending tens-hundreds of hours figuring out if its too late in that respect "Free game" or not.

    Here's the thing. If i wanted to play a Single player game? I would. this is an MMORPG. Having just spent 20+ Years on ONE mmo clearly if i were to start playing it would be the MMO I would be putting my time into.
    I do NOT however want to spend hundreds of hours "Making my own fun" Alone only to get to a point when I need to interact with other players (again...its an MMO) and be told to go to hell because i'm not part of the cool club or whatever the case may be. If the game had become a tight-knit community of only people who do certain things Why waste my time? Better to hear it from the horse's mouth directly than spend a bunch of hours alone bumbling through a game only to find out "I Did it wrong". I have plenty of SP RPG's i can slog through and I did not want this to become one of them.

    I also never asked someone to tell me the games "Worth to me" in any way shape or form. I merely asked a question relating to whether or not the game had a specific "meta" in a sense that if one did not meet, would they be excluded?.

    Thank's for the reply though I guess.
    You're making things way too complicated for yourself. There is no better way to get answers then just go play and have fun. Even if you don't have much time you can put in a few hours and find out if the game is still alive and if the community is toxic or meta builds only... Besides this forums does not always speak the truth, it's just opinions. And most DDO players aren't even here on the forums. One will say it's not about a specific meta and another will say it is. The experience is different for a lot of players because it's an MMO and you play it with a lot of different people. When you go group for raids of course there will be groups that only want the best builds/equipment but does that mean the whole game is a specific meta only? No. There will always be more casual groups that you can join also. You just have to find the right people to play with like any other MMO. So go install the game, try it, meet with other people, have fun or not, if it sticks you keep playing it. If not, you try something else until you find something worth putting over 100 hours into it.
    Last edited by ShifterThePirate; 11-11-2019 at 02:09 PM.

  4. #24
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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  5. #25

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    I just wanted to add that I'm about to run through DDO without maximzing anything. At all. In fact I'll be at a huge disadvantage with my characters and I'm enjoying the adventure so far. I say you just play however you want and have fun.

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by brachra15 View Post
    I have been eyeing DDO for a while and have been wanting to come back after like a 6 year break.

    Is it worth it?
    So far the few people I do know who play have told me the game is basically Making new characters or rebirthing (not sure what its called) And builds. rinse and repeat. I have always been a 1 (maybe 2 rarely) character kind of guy and want to see and do everything from solo content to endgame group content. I don't tend to care about things like making the newest coolest build or tweaking with things constantly to change how this or that works.
    Ohhhh do I love threads like this... so first things first:

    Well met Brachra!

    And welcome home. DDO still has a vibrant community, and some very dedicated guilds that can help you feel the old vibe again.

    You sound like a TRUE adventurer. I am as well. DDO shines in several ways. VARIETY is the big one for me. You can build 12 bards that play TOTALLY different. All feel unique and dripping in D&D lore. In today's DDO you can make one of your old builds GLOW. Regardless how imperfect he/she may be. And if you join a GOOD GUILD, your friends can help you play that custom character the way you WANT TO PLAY HIM/HER.

    THAT is the single greatest thing going in DDO to this day. And I am in a guild that has let me play my lousy bard and my lousy fighter and I FEEL LIKE a hero. This is what D&D is all about my friend! Camaraderie is a playstyle in DDO. And its an important choice you should give consideration to.

    Quote Originally Posted by brachra15 View Post
    I already dislike how the MMO community has become basically "Google it and then come back" with everything. Builds, bossfights, everything has become cookie cutting
    I never experienced that. But Im spoiled I guess. I started in the Old Timers Guild which has a HUGE website with a great community of helpers. Then in 2008 I co-created Tyrs Paladium with the greatest female guild leader I ever saw in this game or any other in my experience, Paks, and we crafted a guild we could be proud of. To this very day we focus on teamwork and camaraderie and adventure. Help is EVERYWHERE, in game, on our guild forum. We are an OLD SCHOOL guild and we are proud of that fact. I think you would fit in GREAT based on what your goals and concerns are!

    Quote Originally Posted by brachra15 View Post
    Min-maxing and building stuff straight out of a guide otherwise be shunned by the current playerbase for not "Getting gud" so to speak I just want to know in advance before I jump in.

    That being said I'm not even fully sure how the mid-late and endgame of DDO plays out but i imagine there is group content & Raids and such. I would of course want to eventually do these things but if only the people who min/max are welcome then i'll pass.

    So! my question.
    Do my "friends" just suck at bringing someone back into the game? OR is this how it actually is?

    Thank you.
    Min-maxing requirements? Not in Tyrs. We could CARE LESS what your gear or raid completions are. All we care about is that you are having A BLAST!!! Period.

    Mid/end game can be solod or grouped but its almost ALWAYS MORE FUN in good company! The difficulty settings go a long way to letting you play the DDO YOU want to play on any particular day. Feel like soloing one night, go get it! Looking for a group or want to sign up for a scheduled guild run in the "Tyrs War Room" on our forum!? BRING IT!!!
    Last edited by LeslieWest_GuitarGod; 11-11-2019 at 04:43 PM.

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  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeslieWest_GuitarGod View Post
    Ohhhh do I love threads like this... so first things first:

    Well met Brachra!

    And welcome home. DDO still has a vibrant community, and some very dedicated guilds that can help you feel the old vibe again.

    You sound like a TRUE adventurer. I am as well. DDO shines in several ways. VARIETY is the big one for me. You can build 12 bards that play TOTALLY different. All feel unique and dripping in D&D lore. In today's DDO you can make one of your old builds GLOW. Regardless how imperfect he/she may be. And if you join a GOOD GUILD, your friends can help you play that custom character the way you WANT TO PLAY HIM/HER.

    THAT is the single greatest thing going in DDO to this day. And I am in a guild that has let me play my lousy bard and my lousy fighter and I FEEL LIKE a hero. This is what D&D is all about my friend! Camaraderie is a playstyle in DDO. And its an important choice you should give consideration to.



    I never experienced that. But Im spoiled I guess. I started in the Old Timers Guild which has a HUGE website with a great community of helpers. Then in 2008 I co-created Tyrs Paladium with the greatest female guild leader I ever saw in this game or any other in my experience, Paks, and we crafted a guild we could be proud of. To this very day we focus on teamwork and camaraderie and adventure. Help is EVERYWHERE, in game, on our guild forum. We are an OLD SCHOOL guild and we are proud of that fact. I think you would fit in GREAT based on what your goals and concerns are!



    Min-maxing requirements? Not in Tyrs. We could CARE LESS what your gear or raid completions are. All we care about is that you are having A BLAST!!! Period.

    Mid/end game can be solod or grouped but its almost ALWAYS MORE FUN in good company! The difficulty settings go a long way to letting you play the DDO YOU want to play on any particular day. Feel like soloing one night, go get it! Looking for a group or want to sign up for a scheduled guild run in the "Tyrs War Room" on our forum!? BRING IT!!!

    This kind of answer makes it all the more worth the effort i put into checking before i dove in. I think i am gonna give it a chance. Thank you!
    It seemed like maybe there was an invitation to your guild/group of friends or circle in general in there somewhere. If this is the case Where can i go to look into this further?

    Thank you again. And I'm glad you seem to understand the position i'm coming from at least the reasoning behind my asking in the first place!

  8. #28
    Community Member Kutalp's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Wellcome back

    Hi.Wellcome back friend.


    Yes you can have alot of fun at a guild aswell as soloing.

    You do not have to be the elitist roller and can still do good at majority of the content.


    If you wish to solo as much, two levels of rogue is allways good to have. lvl 12-16 Bard is an allaround build with physical and arcane tricks. Multiclassing both opens amazing opportunities. Both of these support eachother. If you wish to add a third class, Barbarian, Fighter, Ranger and Wizard can add nice feats to keep the build versatile (you can swap feats in the game which means you can play around with the build)


    Precision, Choice of Improved critical (Your favorite weapon type here), Force of Personality should work well. Other feats are all up to you.

    I hope you enjoy the stay.



    Last edited by Kutalp; 11-12-2019 at 12:18 AM.

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  9. #29

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    Quote Originally Posted by brachra15 View Post
    This kind of answer makes it all the more worth the effort i put into checking before i dove in. I think i am gonna give it a chance. Thank you!
    It seemed like maybe there was an invitation to your guild/group of friends or circle in general in there somewhere. If this is the case Where can i go to look into this further?

    Thank you again. And I'm glad you seem to understand the position i'm coming from at least the reasoning behind my asking in the first place!
    Most definitely both a response to your concerns AND an invitation!

    Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website!

    TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Dungeons & Dragons Online Guild
    No Drama. Cameraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!

    Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | GHALLANDA GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!


  10. #30
    Community Member shores11's Avatar
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    I play this game and any game for my own personal enjoyment and fun. Everyone has their own opinion as to what state DDO is in or not. I know that I like the game very much and have been playing (without any breaks) since Feb. 2006. Things I enjoy are:

    - Content
    - Character builds - many of these
    - Social interaction
    - Three different worlds to play in
    - Multiple difficulty levels

    I could care less about the overly negative input some seem to only dwell on. These type of people have a very distorted view of everything not just DDO. Would I like to see additional things in the game I like, yes. But for me what we have now makes it the best MMO out there in my opinion and therefore I still play DDO.
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  11. #31
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    If you mostly solo, you can play DDO any way you want. It will be good, albeit occasionally a bit laggy. If you enjoy the story, it's good to run a new quest solo the first time, or find a guild that goes slow.

    If want to play with random groups, you will have to live with occasional zergers and a power-gap to grinders. In groups on higher difficulties you may be more successful in a support role, but many zergers will probably be too busy zerging to care much :-). The gap is smaller at cap though, you can do end-game content on a first-lifer. Just make sure you pick a server that has groups up on the times you usually play.

    Another option if you want to play in groups and not zerg is to play on the hardcore server with some durable class like FvS nuker. It's a different mindset, but the HC server is easily the most vibrant. At some point soonish(?) it will close down and you get transferred off it though.
    Last edited by LurkingVeteran; 11-12-2019 at 11:43 AM.

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by LurkingVeteran View Post
    If you mostly solo, you can play DDO any way you want. It will be good, albeit occasionally a bit laggy. If you enjoy the story, it's good to run a new quest solo the first time, or find a guild that goes slow.

    If want to play with random groups, you will have to live with occasional zergers and a power-gap to grinders. In groups on higher difficulties you may be more successful in a support role, but many zergers will probably be too busy zerging to care much :-). The gap is smaller at cap though, you can do end-game content on a first-lifer. Just make sure you pick a server that has groups up on the times you usually play.

    Another option if you want to play in groups and not zerg is to play on the hardcore server with some durable class like FvS nuker. It's a different mindset, but the HC server is easily the most vibrant. At some point soonish(?) it will close down and you get transferred off it though.
    This is exactly the kind of things i was asking.

    You basically told me "if you want to do X, you will have to probably do Y"
    I realize they were provided in a "You have a choice" kind of way and i know you weren't speaking in absolutes but its very similar to the kind of answers i was getting from my friends.

    An example is You said I may be more successful in a support role. Well obviously not everybody is in a support role right? What if i don't wish to play a support role? is the reality that i will probably be most unsuccessful?
    Or my choice is hardcore server with an FVS nuker if i wanna basically be viable. Again. Provided as an option but it seems like you provided some sort of Easy/Meta option.

    Don't take my response as me saying anything you said isn't true or even that I'm disagreeing with you. But these are the kinds of answers I have been getting from people.
    I do get that nobody wants to group with someone who cant pull their weight or is absolutely broken and useless. But I feel there is a line of balance somewhere. Luckily from all the answers i have received It seems there is one if you look in the right places. Its not like "Black desert online" which i did look into. SURE you can play for thousands of hours and make your own fun but the general consensus of 90% of the community is that if you wish to COMPETE (i didnt so whatever) you MUST spend either tons of money or grind for 18hrs a day and pray to the RNG gods to catch up to even a reasonable state. I digress. This has nothing to do with anything but i wanted to point it out anyway.

    The other note is There are 2 kinds of players In my opinion. Those who start a game on day 1 and say "Whats the best class in the game?" a very meta question. They want to play only the best thing in that moment. If it changes? They change with the meta. Then there is the kind in which i feel i fall into category wise. I want to play what I want to play. I Do not care about Flavor of the month builds, meta, etc. I want to HAVE FUN. MY WAY. and find other players who are doing the same and explore ALL content together. not just what some group/guild/person thinks i am good enough for.

    And at last. Not all of this was directed at you but i didn't want to reply to each person separately merely to make my point

  13. #33
    Community Member Gabrion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brachra15 View Post

    The other note is There are 2 kinds of players In my opinion. Those who start a game on day 1 and say "Whats the best class in the game?" a very meta question. They want to play only the best thing in that moment. If it changes? They change with the meta. Then there is the kind in which i feel i fall into category wise. I want to play what I want to play. I Do not care about Flavor of the month builds, meta, etc. I want to HAVE FUN. MY WAY. and find other players who are doing the same and explore ALL content together. not just what some group/guild/person thinks i am good enough for.
    But how much is your ability to have fun tied to feeling like you are effective (subjective term I know) when playing as part of a team? If it's a matter of not needing to be "bleeding edge" top performance, but expecting that there is general parity (maybe 10-20% difference in effectiveness for instance) between classes/playstyles/builds, so choosing to play what you enjoy will never be that huge of a penalty, then probably best to keep looking. This is a game where you can get your heart set on what looks like a totally valid play style, invest in it heavily, and find that it performs much more poorly than the meta options.

    To make matters worse, "balance passes" are handled in a very strange way here. Instead of toning down the top performers and slightly buffing the low performers on any given pass (trying to achieve a general across the board balance from patch to patch), this game tends to focus on updating one thing at a time. It takes them several years to cycle through "balancing" classes and trees in those classes, so if you are a player who prioritizes playing what seems fun to you and what seems fun to you happens to be a neglected style, you may go literally years as a severely under performing option before being looked at by the devs.

  14. #34
    Community Member Thrudh's Avatar
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    People in the game are far nicer than people on the forums.

    The game is fairly easy... Especially the older quests, because the random gear is far stronger than it used to be.

    Play whatever character you want.

    Solo most quests if possible, the first time you run them, on normal or hard, to enjoy the atmosphere and the story.

    If you see a group up that is running a quest you have already run, try joining them and see how that goes.

    Don't worry about end-game raids or groups yet. Just enjoy the game at first, you'll learn what works and what doesn't, and you can always do a True Reincarnation once you hit 20+ and rebuild your character with any changes you've learned (with some TR bonuses).

    All classes can be solid. There are meta builds, but all builds can be good enough to contribute strongly at end-game.
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    When you stop caring about xp/min this game becomes really fun. Trust me.
    Quote Originally Posted by TedSandyman View Post
    Some people brag about how fast they finished the game. I cant think of a stupider thing to brag about. Or in this game, going from level 1 to level 30 in two days, or however long it takes. I can't even begin to imagine what drives a person to think that is fun. You are ignoring all of the content and options and going for sheer speed. It is like going to a museum and bragging about how fast you made it through. Or bragging about how fast you finished a good steak.

  15. #35
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    Player knowledge of quests > Player skill > Equipment > Build


    DDO wiki is full of useful information.


    There is no need to play a certain build, as there are many builds that work quite well.
    Most pure builds will get the job done.

    I stayed at level cap on a tank build that became non optimal over time, but was still very appreciated by players in the party.

  16. #36
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    This game has something for everyone. Some people that say they dislike something are actually drawn to it like a moth to flame. What they dislike is that the environment fails them when they cannot achieve what they hoped for. Grab your spreadsheet and graph paper and dive right in, I doubt you'll be disappointed - and if you will be, it won't take long to realize it.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gabrion View Post
    But how much is your ability to have fun tied to feeling like you are effective (subjective term I know) when playing as part of a team? If it's a matter of not needing to be "bleeding edge" top performance, but expecting that there is general parity (maybe 10-20% difference in effectiveness for instance) between classes/playstyles/builds, so choosing to play what you enjoy will never be that huge of a penalty, then probably best to keep looking. This is a game where you can get your heart set on what looks like a totally valid play style, invest in it heavily, and find that it performs much more poorly than the meta options.

    To make matters worse, "balance passes" are handled in a very strange way here. Instead of toning down the top performers and slightly buffing the low performers on any given pass (trying to achieve a general across the board balance from patch to patch), this game tends to focus on updating one thing at a time. It takes them several years to cycle through "balancing" classes and trees in those classes, so if you are a player who prioritizes playing what seems fun to you and what seems fun to you happens to be a neglected style, you may go literally years as a severely under performing option before being looked at by the devs.
    It's not so much that any of it at all is tied to feeling like i am effective. Its if the whole of the community has deemed certain playstyles, classes, builds etc. NON effective and effectively exclude them. Then it wont matter what you feel because you will have spent all that time only to be told hey..if you wanna play with us you gotta be more like us. or something to that extent. its a very wide subject and there are so man variables. but I've been given a pretty clear explanation of how it is in DDO through this thread alone.

    If i am less effective but enjoying myself? I don't care what other players think (as long as i can play too)
    If im going to spend 100+ Hours searching the ends of the earth for a single person to play with because i didnt play CLASS Whatever with Build #1 that everyone else is using? yeah i'll pass.

    Thank you for your response by the way!

  18. #38
    Community Member Rob_65270's Avatar
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    My responses are in bold.

    Quote Originally Posted by brachra15 View Post
    I have been eyeing DDO for a while and have been wanting to come back after like a 6 year break.

    Is it worth it?
    So far the few people I do know who play have told me the game is basically Making new characters or rebirthing (not sure what its called) And builds. rinse and repeat. I have always been a 1 (maybe 2 rarely) character kind of guy and want to see and do everything from solo content to endgame group content. I don't tend to care about things like making the newest coolest build or tweaking with things constantly to change how this or that works. That is just one of several ways that one can play DDO, even now.
    I already dislike how the MMO community has become basically "Google it and then come back" with everything. Builds, bossfights, everything has become cookie cutting.
    Well, if one doesn't know the content and stuff, makes a lot of sense to me.

    I was heavily into EQ1 from 1999-2018 and recently gave it up due to a ton of reasons.
    I'm not trying to Insult anyone with this but so far I've basically been told things like "You'll be relevant if you build this way *Here's a ton of links and internet guides* Only X/Y is good. Builds builds builds and Min-maxing etc...


    If the only way i'm going to be able to enjoy this game is by Min-maxing and building stuff straight out of a guide otherwise be shunned by the current playerbase for not "Getting gud" so to speak I just want to know in advance before I jump in. Like I said before, that is just one of several ways that one can play DDO. In my view there's no right way or wrong way to play DDO, or shoot many MMOrpgs in my book.

    That being said I'm not even fully sure how the mid-late and endgame of DDO plays out but i imagine there is group content & Raids and such. I would of course want to eventually do these things but if only the people who min/max are welcome then i'll pass.

    So! my question.
    Do my "friends" just suck at bringing someone back into the game? lol, I can't say that, only I can honestly answer that yourself lmao.

    OR is this how it actually is? In my experience no. That's not to say there ain't min/maxxers, there are I'm sure, but for me just play how you yourself wants to, not what others say. Cause 1. This is just a game. & 2. There's other ways to play it as well.

    Thank you.
    Hopefully I answered ya lol.
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  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by brachra15 View Post
    If i am less effective but enjoying myself? I don't care what other players think (as long as i can play too)
    If im going to spend 100+ Hours searching the ends of the earth for a single person to play with because i didnt play CLASS Whatever with Build #1 that everyone else is using? yeah i'll pass.

    Thank you for your response by the way!
    That's not what I said though.

    Class balance is mostly OK if you stick to pure regular trees, no class is automatically excluded. While leveling up you might not have the gear, past lives and reaper points to survive well if you are going to PuG reaper difficulty on a glass cannon melee though. This can be compensated by gear later on. I wouldn't worry too much. It's always possible to lesser reincarnate to re-level your character.

  20. #40
    Community Member Gabrion's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brachra15 View Post
    It's not so much that any of it at all is tied to feeling like i am effective. Its if the whole of the community has deemed certain playstyles, classes, builds etc. NON effective and effectively exclude them. Then it wont matter what you feel because you will have spent all that time only to be told hey..if you wanna play with us you gotta be more like us. or something to that extent. its a very wide subject and there are so man variables. but I've been given a pretty clear explanation of how it is in DDO through this thread alone.

    If i am less effective but enjoying myself? I don't care what other players think (as long as i can play too)
    If im going to spend 100+ Hours searching the ends of the earth for a single person to play with because i didnt play CLASS Whatever with Build #1 that everyone else is using? yeah i'll pass.

    Thank you for your response by the way!
    In that case I don't think you will have a big issue with this game. Put some time into finding the right guild (some folks already popped up in this thread that seem like good fits). I've played on and off for over a decade and very rarely ran into people being ultra hardcore about only allowing specific builds into groups. It happens, but at least in my experience, can be entirely avoided.

    I do think though - and no hard data to back this up mind you - that it has gotten harder to build a group of friends in game over time. I think fewer people are online, but that's pretty normal for an aging game. Just something to keep in mind as it may relate to what you're asking.
    Last edited by Gabrion; 11-12-2019 at 08:32 PM.

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