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  1. #1
    Community Member Virgonian's Avatar
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    Default Wine client - How does it work?

    Since the old client somehow stopped working after an update and steam doesn't offer anything newer, i tried the wine client from ddo direct.

    It installed ok, managed to place the game files on an external drive so it doesn't clutter my small main drive.
    It even runs, at about the same speed as the old one.

    But i run into 2 problems i can't find a solution for.

    1. How do you start it up?
    The only way i see so far is to run the installer and wait till it verifies the install and then ask to play now.
    Surely there is a better way to directly acces the game launcher.

    2. It only runs full screen, even if i select windowed. When windowed it black out my screen and i only see a window with the game in the middle.
    But, i have multiple screens and it blacks out ALL my screens even in windowed mode.
    How can i play in a window, or just on one screen and leave the others with my normal desktop?

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virgonian View Post
    Since the old client somehow stopped working after an update and steam doesn't offer anything newer, i tried the wine client from ddo direct.

    It installed ok, managed to place the game files on an external drive so it doesn't clutter my small main drive.
    It even runs, at about the same speed as the old one.

    But i run into 2 problems i can't find a solution for.

    1. How do you start it up?
    The only way i see so far is to run the installer and wait till it verifies the install and then ask to play now.
    Surely there is a better way to directly acces the game launcher.

    2. It only runs full screen, even if i select windowed. When windowed it black out my screen and i only see a window with the game in the middle.
    But, i have multiple screens and it blacks out ALL my screens even in windowed mode.
    How can i play in a window, or just on one screen and leave the others with my normal desktop?
    The installer should have placed an application "DDO" in the /Applications folder. Double-click that to start it.
    The application itself is very small. The actual game, including the Launcher is placed in your home folder in "Library/Application Support/com.standingstonegames.ddo". Apple hides the Library folder. To see it, hold down the option key, and select "Library" from the Go menu in the Finder. If you get info on the "common" folder inside the "com.standingstonegames.ddo" you will see it occupies about 14 GB of disk space. Because your home folder is pretty much always on the startup volume, I am afraid that DDO will be consuming 14 GB from that volume whether you like it or not. At least that is my understanding of it. If you actually did get that "common" folder on to an external drive, that would be interesting, and I wouldn't mind knowing how you did that. One of the betas of the Mac wine client did install entirely to the Applications folder so maybe there is something I am missing and I might need to tweak my Launcher script in another thread.

    As to how Wine works, I have been reading a bit about it recently. They don't like for it to be called an emulator, but it kind of is. They provide a Windows C drive, but rewrote all the dlls so that when an exe makes a call out to the Windows APIs, the rewritten dlls are called and emulate the behavior that Windows would have provided. It's pretty clever. It must have been a monumental undertaking. The problem in Catalina is that executing 32-bit apps is not supported. In theory. The part that confuses me is that 32-bit support is supposedly disabled at the kernel level, but the Wine folks apparently are running 32-bit code. Someone is not telling the truth. I assume since Wine is saying they have it at least partially working, they must be on to something. Unfortunately, there are still some *very* major hurdles with address space conversions in and out of those dlls.

    I couldn't tell you why Wine needs to take over every and all screens when playing the game. It is probably some limitation related to DirectX in Wine that they couldn't work around. I know when I Tab switch to another application the whole client genies into the dock. I can't look at the game and any other macOS window at the same time. At least I haven't found a way yet.

  3. #3
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    Aside from these things (windowed mode etc.) It works decently for me, the only issue is that it freezes from time to time and you have to restart it. It happens, however, only when changing public areas. It never happened during a quest.

    The biggest issue is that it doesn't run on Catalina. I had to make a Mojave partition in order to play.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Optalidon View Post
    Aside from these things (windowed mode etc.) It works decently for me, the only issue is that it freezes from time to time and you have to restart it. It happens, however, only when changing public areas. It never happened during a quest.

    The biggest issue is that it doesn't run on Catalina. I had to make a Mojave partition in order to play.
    Wine was designed to emulate, yes it's an emulator, the Windows execution environment to run Win32 programs inside Linux. Later they added support for some Win64 stuff but largely it's used to run older Windows programs / games on a Linux box. To do this they need several 32-bit libraries made available to them to there is an API to transact the Win32 calls against, without those it fails. Now BSD is similar enough to Linux that most code can be compiled and made to work with minimal tweaking, so getting the code to run inside MacOS isn't that big a deal, Apple being a huge **** about library support is. What Apple did was remove the 32-bit libraries from Catalina and not provide an easy way to get them back inside. Last I heard Wine was working on a way to package the required libraries with them, not sure how far along that path they are.

    Now realize that it's not possible to "disable 32 bit code" inside an x86 environment because x86 IS 32-bit naturally. 64-bit execution is done via a set of extensions developed by AMD known as x86-64. When the CPU is put in a 64-bit mode by the OS, it can still execute 32-bit code just fine. So if someone wrote a Hello World program in C and then compiled it to contain all library calls as static along with distributing all libraries with it, then it should work. Of course "all libraries" is a pretty big list for anything other then stdin and stdout.

  5. #5
    Community Member Virgonian's Avatar
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    Thanks for the help, it gave me a few ideas where to loop.

    For problem 1. i didn't get any app or icon in the applications folder or anywhere else that can be used to start up DDO.
    The only thing it left is 2 useless windows files on my desktop.

    For problem 2. I remembered i made a whole thread about installing and using wine with DDO a while go, before there was a mac client.
    So my own thread helped me there, go figure ;-)

    In case you want to try it

    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...O-on-a-mac-OSX

    Item 10 in the second post explains how to set it to windowed mode and that still works. You only need to find winecfg which is now hidden in the applications support folder for standingstonegames.

    As for installing it all on an external drive, that's very possible, well almost.

    The wine libraries are installing on the main drive in the application support folder, but that's less than 2 Gb.
    The game itself, which is nearly 14 Gb can be on an external drive.
    Just navigate to the desired drive when the DDO installer asks for a destination drive.

    I'll figure out how to create a startup icon to, i did it before, but i need to find where the startup file is hidden and how it's named.
    (If anyone can tell what the name is of the windows startup or loader exe that would be helpful.)

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virgonian View Post
    I'll figure out how to create a startup icon to, i did it before, but i need to find where the startup file is hidden and how it's named.
    (If anyone can tell what the name is of the windows startup or loader exe that would be helpful.)
    If you can find /Applications/DDO.app/Contents/MacOS/ddo, you can open that in Xcode. It is a bash script. It has all the secrets -namely it will point to the python script that is run to launch the game.

    But I gather from your posts that you don't have this file which is at the heart of the problem.

    It sounds like you aren't a stranger to Terminal. Launch the game, then quickly tab out to the Terminal and do a "ps ax > ~/ps.txt". You can open up ps.txt and catch the location of the launcher script. It takes quite a few seconds to spin wine up so you should have plenty of time to get the info you need. I am not sure if the "ax" flags are needed. It's just reflexive for me to add them. Also, you don't really need to cat to a file if you remember to open the Terminal wide enough to see the beginning of the command line before typing ps.

    The python script is buried in the same bundle that the ddo script is. Once you have it, you can navigate back up in the tree and find the ddo script. The ddo script is the thing you will probably want to launch, as the python script needs some arguments provided by the ddo script.
    Last edited by Kaytis; 10-28-2019 at 11:25 PM.

  7. #7
    Community Member Virgonian's Avatar
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    I finally managed to fix my problem, and now DDO is up and running again.

    The path for wine is:

    /Users/your user name/Library/Application Support/com.standingstonegames.ddo/common/usr/bin/wine

    Then you need to add the path for the ddo launcher, which is now called DNDLauncher.exe and can be found where you installed the game.

    On my system the full path and command to start ddo from terminal is:

    /Users/your user name/Library/Application\ Support/com.standingstonegames.ddo/common/usr/bin/wine Z:\\\\Volumes\\\\LaCie\\\\Applications\\\\DDO-wine\\\\DNDLauncher.exe"

    Lacie is the name of the external drive where i installed ddo, into the folder Applications/DDO-wine. (notice the \ before the space in the path which is needed to make it work.)

    To make it easier, let's make an icon to start DDO.

    Start up the applescript editor, you will find it in applications - utilities, same as terminal.

    Place the following into the top window:

    tell application "Terminal"

    do script "/Users/your user name/Library/Application\\ Support/com.standingstonegames.ddo/common/usr/bin/wine Z:\\\\Volumes\\\\LaCie\\\\Applications\\\\DDO-wine\\\\DNDLauncher.exe"

    end tell

    (notice the double \\ before the space in the path!)
    Hit compile and the text should change format.
    Now save as, name it DDO and choose Application in the file format box.
    Save it to your applications folder, and or drag it onto your dock.
    You can now start DDO from this icon.
    Last edited by Virgonian; 12-10-2019 at 05:02 PM.

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