Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 31

Thread: new to bards

  1. #1
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    14

    Default new to bards

    what am i looking for a build i would say SWF fighting with healing to self-heal and or full on healing others to heal
    Last edited by tom200087; 08-25-2019 at 07:32 PM.

  2. #2
    Community Member Thunder-Monkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    242

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tom200087 View Post
    what am i looking for a build i would say SWF fighting with healing to self-heal and or full on healing others to heal
    Lots of options here. Have a look at bard trees and decide which tree you want to take your T5 in. Swashbuckler is straight damage with an easy insta-kill, Warchanter has freezing procs and some party buffs, Spellsinger is support and DCs.

    Bard is a viable healer but avoid splashing too heavily, recommend minimum 16 bard for cure moderate mass.

    Let us know which trees you want to specialize in. And are you planning to TR at 20 or run up to 30?

    TM

  3. #3
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    14

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Thunder-Monkey View Post
    Lots of options here. Have a look at bard trees and decide which tree you want to take your T5 in. Swashbuckler is straight damage with an easy insta-kill, Warchanter has freezing procs and some party buffs, Spellsinger is support and DCs.

    Bard is a viable healer but avoid splashing too heavily, recommend minimum 16 bard for cure moderate mass.

    Let us know which trees you want to specialize in. And are you planning to TR at 20 or run up to 30?

    TM
    plan on going to lvl 30 as i look at the trees looking at a wanting t5 for warchanter due to i have gear for stuns and using SWF tree mixed with it

  4. #4
    Forum witchdoctor Hobgoblin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    hell.
    Posts
    6,399

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tom200087 View Post
    plan on going to lvl 30 as i look at the trees looking at a wanting t5 for warchanter due to i have gear for stuns and using SWF tree mixed with it
    would take a hard look at swash t5

    u can stun with and i sigh to say it soundburst
    main toons: Cerrsi(silly caster/xbow) Sttomper (silly barbarian)-jammiee (Silly melee)
    Quote Originally Posted by Eladrin View Post
    You are still completely free to run around like a jackrabbit on caffeine.
    quem deus vult perdere, dementat prius

  5. #5
    Community Member Thunder-Monkey's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    242

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by tom200087 View Post
    plan on going to lvl 30 as i look at the trees looking at a wanting t5 for warchanter due to i have gear for stuns and using SWF tree mixed with it
    Have a look at these builds, the first needs a +1 lesser heart to remove the fighter level from PDK, but can workaround that if you don't have the heart:

    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...d-Swashbuckler
    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...archanter-Bard

    That should give you all the basic info you need to build a Warchanter with SWF Swashbuckling. If you need any more help, or a step by step build just ask. My favourite bard at the moment is my pure warchanter swashy.

    Three key points:

    1. You must wear light armor (or outfits/robes)
    2. You must use shortswords (for CHA to-hit/dmg with PDK)
    3. You must put 7 points into Balance (for GSWF)

    TM

  6. #6
    Community Member Ralmeth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    2,331

    Default

    IMHO, the two best kind of Bard builds are a Freezing Warchanter, or a Vistani Swashbuckler. I haven't officially built a Warchanter version and played it to level 30, so I don't have a build at the ready but generally you'll want to take 1 level of Favored Soul for the tier 1 easy access to an enhancement that increases your freezing DCs. You could probably add in some Fighter levels for more feats, or Barbarian for run speed, and other Barbarian goodies.

    As for a Vistani Swashbuckler, that's what I prefer. Generally speaking you want to go for tier 5 in Swashbuckler, and tier 4 in Vistani, and then splash in whatever else you want to round out the build how you see fit (ex. Barbarian, Fighter, and/or Rogue all mix well). A lot of people go Charisma based. That has the advantage of having a better DC on your Coup de Grace and enchantment spells, but that's typicaly at the expense of needing a second stat pretty high for your 'to hit'. Another option is to go Dexterity based for a higher chance to hit, and this also gives the option of getting evasion to work well, but at the expense of not having as high of a DCs. There is a trade-off there.
    The best part of the 10th Anniversary of DDO...the description on the Oatmeal Raisin Kookie,
    "From a distance you thought this was a chocolate chip kookie. Now you're sad."

  7. #7
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    734

    Default

    PDK 18bard/1fvs/1ftr is the only way to go. Tier5 and core 5 in Warchanter, 22ap into spellsinger for the heal dot, 3ap into PDK for charisma to atk/dmg with short swords, 11ap into swash to pick up Skirmisher, 2-4ap into Warsoul for Divine Presence. Take all of the SWF feats, Shield Mastery feats, Improved Shield Bashing, Quicken Spell.

    If well geared you can touch 900 positive spellpower to make your heals and heal dot straight up legit while still maintaining good DPS and great CC. All of the passive AOE benefits of Warchanter (Dmg%, 15% full time run speed, all of it) are great for parties.

    Or you can make a Swash based build and have a hair better DPS while losing all party utility.

  8. #8
    Community Member ifumoveudie's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Banging my head against a wall, cause the named item didn'the drop.
    Posts
    149

    Default Bard Advice

    I have been playing a Bard on my main for about a year and a half now. After several different incarnations and racial past lives, I have come to acknowledge a few things.

    1. A Str based Aasimar using handaxes is a very strong option, better than short swords and PDK even. With the proper gear, and my new favorite weapon, Tornado, I can self heal in reapers effectively, have a crit profile of 12-20 and have enough self buffs and utility to be a positive addition to any group.

    lam vid: https://youtu.be/BfSBc1dEngs

    2. I have recently been trying out a 17 Bard/ 3 Sorc Inquisitive build. Solo up to about R4, and provide amazing dps and cure crit will hit for over 1200 on party and about 400 to 600 on self in R5. Standing RP is 231, and when in reaper mode, under full boost is 316. Good damage mitigation and 73% chance to defend at level.

    3. Always keep a pair of healing items for when you need to swap to get a full heal on yourself.

    4. T5 swashbuckler is the way to go if youre looking for melee dps, with warchanter following up.

    5. A swash Vistani is a good idea, but you lose a bit of survivability if you go for more than the melee power boost in the low branch.
    Proud member of the ArchAngels guild, Thelanis.
    Policegirl Killz, Porklord Meatfield, Pilfering Pirate.

  9. #9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Hobgoblin View Post
    would take a hard look at swash t5

    u can stun with and i sigh to say it soundburst
    The key to almost any bard is utilizing your LOWER level spells.

    TYRS PALADIUM - A Premier Dungeons & Dragons Online Guild
    No Drama. Cameraderie. TEAM Focus. That's the TYRS way. If that's your style, come join us!

    Research our Guild here: Read our official Recruitment thread | Sign up here: Tyrs Guild Website! | GHALLANDA GUILD LEADERS: Join the Fellowship!


  10. #10
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    2,429

    Default

    Bard 16, Fighter 3, FVS 1 works well

    ~35AP Swash - get you some dps, Coup, and other goodies
    ~24AP Warchanter - single target freeze, bit of buffing, temp hp proc
    ~13AP Stalwart - PRR, HP, while maintaining casting range
    4AP Warpriest - Divine Presence
    4AP for Rapid Slash until cap, then Haste Boost from Kensai when using non-daggers

    Running in Fatesinger.


    This build will give:
    DPS: Solid
    Instakill: Great for individual targets
    Buffing: Solid
    CC: Freeze, Dire Charge, Siren's song, Fascinate
    Heals: Solid

    Gives a nice well-rounded build.
    Server: Thelanis
    Guild: Fallen Immortals
    Toons: Soza, Sozz, Sozza, Sossa (bards)

  11. #11
    Community Member BigErkyKid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    6,800

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Emerge2012 View Post
    PDK 18bard/1fvs/1ftr is the only way to go. Tier5 and core 5 in Warchanter, 22ap into spellsinger for the heal dot, 3ap into PDK for charisma to atk/dmg with short swords, 11ap into swash to pick up Skirmisher, 2-4ap into Warsoul for Divine Presence. Take all of the SWF feats, Shield Mastery feats, Improved Shield Bashing, Quicken Spell.

    If well geared you can touch 900 positive spellpower to make your heals and heal dot straight up legit while still maintaining good DPS and great CC. All of the passive AOE benefits of Warchanter (Dmg%, 15% full time run speed, all of it) are great for parties.

    Or you can make a Swash based build and have a hair better DPS while losing all party utility.
    What happened to the man who said he would never play PDK because they look awful?

    That said, it really depends on how you play. From a DPS perspective, swash + vistani > war chanter + swash. There is no discussion about it, it is what it is. The reason is that, all in all, vistani probably is a higher damage PRE than swash due to power creep and the devs not keeping the PREs up to date.

    The question is whether it is worth it to bring a DPS bard, or it would simply be better to bring a real DPS character at that point.

    No evasion, light armor, suboptimal weapons (swash weapons are worse than other weapons in other classes), with some party buffing and some party healing is what 18/1/1 is; the DPS is OK.

    Let's give you some numbers on sustaining song:

    BASE 2d3 modified by spellpower and heal amp. Assume SP: 900, hamp: 125 (85 armor, 30 paladin PLs, 20 guild)

    BASE*Spell power multiplier*Hamp multiplier=total healing

    3*((100+900)/100)*((100+125)/100)=67.5 per tick

    Is it worth 22 AP?

    Personally, I am leaning towards a different build.

    Pure tiefling scoundrel (this is already a plus, not a big fat PDK), STR to hit and CHA to damage.
    Assuming 82 AP
    41 swash (evasion, t5s)
    14 war chanter (single target freeze and song of heroism)
    8 harper for KTA
    8 vistas (arrows, quick draw, haste boost)
    11 tiefling: ash emprisonment and some more DPS

    Still a bard (not some gimped assassin that half arses daggers in vista), some utility, but obviously worse that what emerge said.

    If I am absolutely honest, the biggest draws (for me) of the build suggested by Emerge are the run speed for the group and the possibility to fascinate most enemies. Used correctly it can trivialize some most fights with nasty spawns in suboptimal parties.

    Also, don't get overly seduced by some guy soloing r10s on a freeze bard. He compensates bard weaknesses with grind (massive HPS, for example), picks specific quests, and has uber gear.

    That said, have your fun, just trying to give you some perspective.

    A final note: if you want to be party utility and freeze, I suggest you go wolf druid instead. Better DPS, better freezes, much better healing and even the potential of better CC (quake). I did it for a while and it is very solid, I just got tired of looking like a dog, honestly.

  12. #12
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    2,429

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BigErkyKid View Post

    That said, it really depends on how you play. From a DPS perspective, swash + vistani > war chanter + swash. There is no discussion about it, it is what it is. The reason is that, all in all, vistani probably is a higher damage PRE than swash due to power creep and the devs not keeping the PREs up to date.
    I think the dps is higher in Swashbuckler vs vistani, at geared gap. Off memory, I tested it. Perhaps simply due to weapon choices, then SB gets gets coup, which is awesome, on top of that.

    Certainly a gear capped SB is more of a killing machine than a vistani, and has a few more AP (no 13AP skirmisher tax).
    Server: Thelanis
    Guild: Fallen Immortals
    Toons: Soza, Sozz, Sozza, Sossa (bards)

  13. #13
    Community Member BigErkyKid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    6,800

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BoBoDaClown View Post
    I think the dps is higher in Swashbuckler vs vistani, at geared gap. Off memory, I tested it. Perhaps simply due to weapon choices, then SB gets gets coup, which is awesome, on top of that.

    Certainly a gear capped SB is more of a killing machine than a vistani, and has a few more AP (no 13AP skirmisher tax).
    Really? It beats 30% DBs + 20 MP?

    With a good dagger, and the +W and +mods from vistani, I'd be extremely surprised. Dagger vs 1d6 weapon is just 1 damage per dice, which is compensated by +1w from vistani (5w weapons nowadays, 5 damage, 1d4+3 extra is already that).

    Could you give more details on the test?

  14. #14
    Community Member Alrik_Fassbauer's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    2,918

    Default

    For completeness' sake I point towards the "Haggle Bard" : https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...sissippi-Queen
    "Archbishop Dryden wants to talk to you to tapper this dale."
    "Archbishop Dryden wants to talk to you to tap on this dale."
    "Archbishop Dryden wants to talk to you to tap on this tale."
    English is not my first language - misinterpretations galore !

  15. #15
    Community Member Ralmeth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    2,331

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BigErkyKid View Post
    Really? It beats 30% DBs + 20 MP?

    With a good dagger, and the +W and +mods from vistani, I'd be extremely surprised. Dagger vs 1d6 weapon is just 1 damage per dice, which is compensated by +1w from vistani (5w weapons nowadays, 5 damage, 1d4+3 extra is already that).

    Could you give more details on the test?
    What I like doing is going to tier 5 in SB, and tier 4 in Vistani to get the best of both! I'm actually not a big fan of tier 5 in Vistani because there are too many short duration buffs, and not enough abilities that are always on.
    The best part of the 10th Anniversary of DDO...the description on the Oatmeal Raisin Kookie,
    "From a distance you thought this was a chocolate chip kookie. Now you're sad."

  16. #16
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    2,429

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BigErkyKid View Post
    Really? It beats 30% DBs + 20 MP?

    With a good dagger, and the +W and +mods from vistani, I'd be extremely surprised. Dagger vs 1d6 weapon is just 1 damage per dice, which is compensated by +1w from vistani (5w weapons nowadays, 5 damage, 1d4+3 extra is already that).

    Could you give more details on the test?
    Bruntsmash, R1, I think. Did maybe 10 times each in both SB vs Vistani. Blitzing and non-blitzing (before the ED changes). SB won every time.

    I can't remember exact builds, but be something like:
    16 Bard, 3 Fighter, 1 FVS
    Swashbuckler: 35SB, 24WC, 13SD, 4FVS, +4
    Vistani: 41 Vist, 13 WC, 14 SB, 6SD, 4FVS


    The doublestrike is close to a wash, since I was almost capped in Swashbuckler - I think (currently not capped) I was sitting at 94%, and I am not fully tweaked (no scourge past lives for a start).

    I don't think I used these weapons for the test, but this is the difference now:

    Moonbeam: 7.5(1d6+2)+15
    vs
    Pain: 5.50[1d4+3] + 15


    Note, this is all off hazy memory. I didn't record the details and to me the 'real' world performance of the Swashbuckler feels much higher, due to coup being a lot of 'trash' dps.

    I will be able to test again in a couple of levels I guess. It's a pretty easy switch out (just some AP). I can run whatever tests you want that just require AP switches within that level split, if you want them.
    Last edited by BoBoDaClown; 10-02-2019 at 03:24 PM.
    Server: Thelanis
    Guild: Fallen Immortals
    Toons: Soza, Sozz, Sozza, Sossa (bards)

  17. #17
    Community Member BigErkyKid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    6,800

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralmeth View Post
    What I like doing is going to tier 5 in SB, and tier 4 in Vistani to get the best of both! I'm actually not a big fan of tier 5 in Vistani because there are too many short duration buffs, and not enough abilities that are always on.
    Of course...I was just comparing one against the other.

    Problem is that SB and vistani eat up most of your AP. I like having either warchanter or SS to feel like a real bard.

  18. #18
    Community Member BigErkyKid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    6,800

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BoBoDaClown View Post
    Bruntsmash, R1, I think. Did maybe 10 times each in both SB vs Vistani. Blitzing and non-blitzing (before the ED changes). SB won every time.

    I can't remember exact builds, but be something like:
    16 Bard, 3 Fighter, 1 FVS
    Swashbuckler: 35SB, 24WC, 13SD, 4FVS, +4
    Vistani: 41 Vist, 13 WC, 14 SB, 6SD, 4FVS


    The doublestrike is close to a wash, since I was almost capped in Swashbuckler - I think (currently not capped) I was sitting at 94%, and I am not fully tweaked (no scourge past lives for a start).

    I don't think I used these weapons for the test, but this is the difference now:

    Moonbeam: 7.5(1d6+2)+15
    vs
    Pain: 5.50[1d4+3] + 15


    Note, this is all off hazy memory. I didn't record the details and to me the 'real' world performance of the Swashbuckler feels much higher, due to coup being a lot of 'trash' dps.

    I will be able to test again in a couple of levels I guess. It's a pretty easy switch out (just some AP). I can run whatever tests you want that just require AP switches within that level split, if you want them.
    Interesting! I agree that vistani bard is just not worth it, at that point be a rogue. I am very surprised, though.

    94 DBs with boosts, right?

  19. #19
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    2,429

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BigErkyKid View Post

    94 DBs with boosts, right?
    No, standing.

    I don't really use boosts due to that. I use the reaper's strike +6% (+10% for 1st tier) every now and then, but tend to use reaper PRR ones instead, due to the double-strike cap.
    Server: Thelanis
    Guild: Fallen Immortals
    Toons: Soza, Sozz, Sozza, Sossa (bards)

  20. #20
    Community Member BigErkyKid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2014
    Posts
    6,800

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by BoBoDaClown View Post
    No, standing.

    I don't really use boosts due to that. I use the reaper's strike +6% (+10% for 1st tier) every now and then, but tend to use reaper PRR ones instead, due to the double-strike cap.
    Breakdown needed!:P

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload