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  1. #1
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    Default Epic Leather Gloves of the Snake bug

    Got these just last week, and they were +18 to Search, Spot, Open Lock, and Disable Device (as on wiki). Threw them into my shared bank. Pulled them out a few minutes ago (noticed they were still +18), and saw all the bonuses drop to +17 once in my inventory. Not a display bug, that's all they're giving. Tried moving them back and forth to shared bank a few times, no change.

  2. #2
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    Anyone else seeing this on theirs? I bug reported it, but would like to know if it's just me.

  3. #3
    Community Member TitusOvid's Avatar
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    Is it possible to upload a screenshot?

    Cheers,
    Titus.
    Beste, Titus. | playing since 2009 | Don't do the fun wrong | New to Orien? Join the ingame Titan Channel | Soko Irrlicht freut sich immer über neue Mitglieder | Deutscher Discord | Orien Raiding Discord Toons: Titusovid , Bruder, Upload, Zzed, (Rubbel)

  4. #4
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    I can never get the attachment manager to upload--is there some trick I'm missing?

    I click "manage attachments", then "add files", browse to and select the .jpg, click upload, it looks like it's processing, but never adds it to the list. Using Firefox on Win 10.
    Last edited by Bluenoser; 08-17-2019 at 01:06 PM.

  5. #5
    Community Member Josielynn's Avatar
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    I could never get that to work either, and was told to use an image storage/sharing site like imgur. I used photobucket a long time ago, but imgur more recently. Somewhere in the forums are instructions, so you might want to do a search.
    Tequira Sunrise ~ Josielynne ~ Dawnalynn ~ Litzy so Ditzy

  6. #6
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    Checked with my regular raid party the other night, and some of them have this item as well. They all displayed as +17 now. Bug report prompted the usual automated "thank-you for letting us know" but I have no idea if anyone is even checking those reports anymore. Hoping a dev will see this thread and confirm that this is a bug that'll get fixed. Random, unannounced changes to named loot are...unsettling.

  7. #7
    Community Member Bunker's Avatar
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    Don't put them back in your shared bank or the next time you pull them out they might be + 16
    Mothergoose - Kardinal - Bunks

  8. #8
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    So, let's go down a fun wormhole into a fun chunk of legacy DDO code known as Progressions

    To answer your questions ahead of time, yes, we're aware that these have changed, and yes, we can fix it. No ETA but in the meantime I can at least explain what actually happened here.

    Some of our spells and abilities in DDO scale off caster level. Some scale off character level, some scale off ability scores, etc etc. If you'd like to get an ability to do 1d6 per caster level, easy peasy - just use Caster Level as your scaling modifier.

    But what if you want to do something that's not 1:1? What if you wanted to do something like... this ability can hit a maximum of two targets until 10, then it hits 3, and then at 14 hits 4? That's not 1:1 - nor is it a multiplier of 1:1. It's irregular. You'd need some sort of progression... and that's what a progression is.

    Think of it like a set of numbers in a row, and you can pick the numbers in that row. In the above example, the progression would be: [ 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 3 3 3 3 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 (... and then a lot of 4s onwards and so forth) ].

    So, how does this relate to the gloves?

    Well, our internal scaling item effects use a progression for certain stats - such as bonuses to specific skills. And, for this update, I stumbled upon a pretty funny bug: the internal scalar for several scaling effects was missing number 40 in the progression. It skipped from 39 to 41. So, everything is off by 1. Weird, right? I fixed the templating, which retroactively added entry 40 to all of our scaling progressions, which bumped everything using our scaling templates down 1 ilevel. We can fix this with some light hackery, but it'd need a lot of testing and we really don't want to rush something like this. We managed to get out from under this bug without just deleting everything accidentally, which is a great step forward, and the worst case scenario would just blink the gloves off of your hands, so we really don't want to take a risk
    100% radical, enthusiasm enthusiast.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    snip
    Fun! I was wondering how is it possible that some item enchantments display one number and actually grant something else, for example named items with enchantments like Insightful PRR +5 usually grant one less, in this case +4. Could it be that you accidentally used one progression for the displayed effect and another, similar progression for the actual effect?

    Or the insightful UMD +0 random loot that iirc actually grants +1.

    Or it's something completely different Perhaps rounding...


    Also kinda related, when you redesigned cannith crafting, you had the opportunity to clean up some progressions; have fewer of them. For example, I never understood why Protection and Natural Armor don't progress at the same pace. Oh well.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by cru121 View Post
    Fun! I was wondering how is it possible that some item enchantments display one number and actually grant something else, for example named items with enchantments like Insightful PRR +5 usually grant one less, in this case +4. Could it be that you accidentally used one progression for the displayed effect and another, similar progression for the actual effect?

    Or the insightful UMD +0 random loot that iirc actually grants +1.

    Or it's something completely different :) Perhaps rounding...
    It's something completely different. No progressions involved, actually.

    Quote Originally Posted by cru121 View Post
    Also kinda related, when you redesigned cannith crafting, you had the opportunity to clean up some progressions; have fewer of them. For example, I never understood why Protection and Natural Armor don't progress at the same pace. Oh well.
    This is even more completely different.
    100% radical, enthusiasm enthusiast.

  11. #11
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    Thanks for that Lynnabel!

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    This is even more completely different.
    Bummer!

  13. #13
    Community Member Requiro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    It's something completely different. No progressions involved, actually.

    This is even more completely different.
    That explain a lot
    -------------------------------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by stoerm View Post
    Player remembers. Player never forgets.
    I'm not native speaker

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    So, let's go down a fun wormhole into a fun chunk of legacy DDO code known as Progressions

    To answer your questions ahead of time, yes, we're aware that these have changed, and yes, we can fix it. No ETA but in the meantime I can at least explain what actually happened here.

    Some of our spells and abilities in DDO scale off caster level. Some scale off character level, some scale off ability scores, etc etc. If you'd like to get an ability to do 1d6 per caster level, easy peasy - just use Caster Level as your scaling modifier.

    But what if you want to do something that's not 1:1? What if you wanted to do something like... this ability can hit a maximum of two targets until 10, then it hits 3, and then at 14 hits 4? That's not 1:1 - nor is it a multiplier of 1:1. It's irregular. You'd need some sort of progression... and that's what a progression is.

    Think of it like a set of numbers in a row, and you can pick the numbers in that row. In the above example, the progression would be: [ 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 2 3 3 3 3 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 4 (... and then a lot of 4s onwards and so forth) ].

    So, how does this relate to the gloves?

    Well, our internal scaling item effects use a progression for certain stats - such as bonuses to specific skills. And, for this update, I stumbled upon a pretty funny bug: the internal scalar for several scaling effects was missing number 40 in the progression. It skipped from 39 to 41. So, everything is off by 1. Weird, right? I fixed the templating, which retroactively added entry 40 to all of our scaling progressions, which bumped everything using our scaling templates down 1 ilevel. We can fix this with some light hackery, but it'd need a lot of testing and we really don't want to rush something like this. We managed to get out from under this bug without just deleting everything accidentally, which is a great step forward, and the worst case scenario would just blink the gloves off of your hands, so we really don't want to take a risk
    Does this explain why my Cannith Crafted melee alacrity level 20 item is now 14% instead of 15%?

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by GramercyRiff View Post
    Does this explain why my Cannith Crafted melee alacrity level 20 item is now 14% instead of 15%?
    Sure does. It's on my list.
    100% radical, enthusiasm enthusiast.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    Sure does. It's on my list.
    You rock. Also Fatesinger is pretty fantastic and fun. Well done there.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by GramercyRiff View Post
    You rock. Also Fatesinger is pretty fantastic and fun. Well done there.
    Hell yeah.
    100% radical, enthusiasm enthusiast.

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