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  1. #1
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    Default Arcane Archer pass?

    Is there any plans to do a Arcane Archer pass anytime soon? they are shown a lot of love to crossbow and dagger users but the AA tree has not seen any love since the introduced the current enhancement tree couple years ago. AA is now weaker then the other ranged tree's... So Please Dev's show some love too the AA tree.. I love playing AA's..

    Thanks

  2. #2
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    AA doesn't need an overhaul. Bow archery does. If you fix the inherent shortcomings of bow combat, then you'll make AA more viable as well as monkcher and bow ranger and silver flame fvs etc.

    Low rate of fire, no offhand option - it's got many of the same problems as THF. Poor base crit profile too. They're still too afraid of recreating the old system where 10ks and manyshot synergized too well with other skills and enhancements...even though they basically just recreated it with inqui...

  3. #3
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    Never happen. DDO will never make bows viable again. They'll add insanely stupid stuff like dual-crossbows and make a shuriken, a complete garbage weapon in reality, into a mini-gun but the Longbow must remain garbage.

    THFing will be fixed before this.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alled78 View Post
    Why should i use all my neural cells when i can go inqui and go pew pew pew ???

  4. #4

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    Poor bow rangers. Ask where 18ranger/1monk/1rogue in FOTW with a Pinion go a few years ago... It was a popular build back then...

    With Great Power Comes Great Responsibility

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaboom2112 View Post
    Never happen. DDO will never make bows viable again. They'll add insanely stupid stuff like dual-crossbows and make a shuriken, a complete garbage weapon in reality, into a mini-gun but the Longbow must remain garbage.

    THFing will be fixed before this.
    I feel this way too. I love bow play, but I don't think they will ever bring the DPS up.

    When ravenloft came out I was like wow the handwraps get twohanded dice increase and the bow doesn't... it just shows the design goal with bows which truly get no offhand attack or equip.

    AA is fine, bows are bad. AA actually might be so good, that it's part of why bows are not getting a bump. Every thread about how bows are bad someone comes in and says "but you can do no fail paralyzing." (with wet noodle dps)

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    AA doesn't need an overhaul. Bow archery does. If you fix the inherent shortcomings of bow combat, then you'll make AA more viable as well as monkcher and bow ranger and silver flame fvs etc.
    Essentially, this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cantor View Post
    bows are bad. AA actually might be so good, that it's part of why bows are not getting a bump. Every thread about how bows are bad someone comes in and says "but you can do no fail paralyzing." (with wet noodle dps)
    Mmmhm. AA's a solid tree in a style that has some serious shortcomings. The style overall needs work. We've got a lot on our plate at the moment (so it's not very likely in the immediate future), but reworking bow style is something we'd like to do when we can.
    We don't only build for the builds that exist.
    We don't only build for the builds that are good right now.

    The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.

  7. #7
    Hero apocaladle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Essentially, this.


    Mmmhm. AA's a solid tree in a style that has some serious shortcomings. The style overall needs work. We've got a lot on our plate at the moment (so it's not very likely in the immediate future), but reworking bow style is something we'd like to do when we can.
    Thanks for the info, it is nice to see how dev's feel about certian balance issues rather than just player speculation.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    The style overall needs work. We've got a lot on our plate at the moment (so it's not very likely in the immediate future), but reworking bow style is something we'd like to do when we can.
    Good to hear. Thank you!
    The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left. - Ecclesiastes 10:2 (NIV)

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    Hi Welcome

  9. #9
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    AA is action points expensive, with non stacking, low to no scaling enhancements. It has one good thing every 20 seconds if paired with one specific ED, I say that with current mob AC/Fort scores, even this every 20s shot is kinda meh.

  10. #10
    Community Member Buddha5440's Avatar
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    Could you at least change it so the core Enchantment bonus DOES stack? As it is right now the bonus you get is equal to or, at some levels (required to get the additional cores to increase the bonus), below the enchantment bonus of random gen/CC stuff from the same level. Other than that, I rather like the tree. In fact, I have a toon with 5, almost 6, past lives who has never used a melee weapon (elf-AA build of whatever class).
    Dennis the Peasant: Listen. Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government. Supreme executive power derives from a mandate from the masses, not from some farcical aquatic ceremony.

  11. #11
    Community Member Lagin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Essentially, this.


    Mmmhm. AA's a solid tree in a style that has some serious shortcomings. The style overall needs work. We've got a lot on our plate at the moment (so it's not very likely in the immediate future), but reworking bow style is something we'd like to do when we can.
    One of the reasons Ive stopped playing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaxtan View Post
    I have only been playing a little over a year, I have learned a lot more about how to really play DDO in a few days vs. grind DDO in a year, and it is much more entertaining. I hope HC never ends.

  12. #12
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lagin View Post
    One of the reasons Ive stopped playing.
    I mean it* was a sinking ship for the last two years, then DXBs, it* hit the last reef

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Mmmhm. AA's a solid tree in a style that has some serious shortcomings. The style overall needs work. We've got a lot on our plate at the moment (so it's not very likely in the immediate future), but reworking bow style is something we'd like to do when we can.
    Steel, I realize that a true overhaul is not in the cards any time soon but I have a question... is it possible to add a feat (autogranted to Rangers at say level 12) or a core enhancement (I'd say the AA or DWS at level 12) that basically replicates the Advanced Ninja Training enhancement but for Wisdom? As in "You also gain a chance based on your Wisdom score to fire an extra arrow per attack"? The MAJOR deficiency of bows vs. shuriken is the ridiculously low rate of fire. Perhaps add this feat/enhancement to Silver Flame at level 12 as well for those Cleric/FvS builds as well?
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  14. #14
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maelphistez View Post
    Steel, I realize that a true overhaul is not in the cards any time soon but I have a question... is it possible to add a feat (autogranted to Rangers at say level 12) or a core enhancement (I'd say the AA or DWS at level 12) that basically replicates the Advanced Ninja Training enhancement but for Wisdom? As in "You also gain a chance based on your Wisdom score to fire an extra arrow per attack"? The MAJOR deficiency of bows vs. shuriken is the ridiculously low rate of fire. Perhaps add this feat/enhancement to Silver Flame at level 12 as well for those Cleric/FvS builds as well?
    As little as i know about this, I kinda think the problem with always 4 arrow was that each projectile is "real", as in "does calcs", unlike the other ranged weapons where projectile is mostly a well synced up display effect.

    So that means each arrow would need collision-tracing, to hit, on hit effect -calcs PER target, add in manyshot and IPS and the backend is torn.

    But yeah id too love back the 4 arrow burst from level6 and up. THAT might persuade me to one day play another archer.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Maelphistez View Post
    Steel, I realize that a true overhaul is not in the cards any time soon but I have a question... is it possible to add a feat (autogranted to Rangers at say level 12) or a core enhancement (I'd say the AA or DWS at level 12) that basically replicates the Advanced Ninja Training enhancement but for Wisdom? As in "You also gain a chance based on your Wisdom score to fire an extra arrow per attack"? The MAJOR deficiency of bows vs. shuriken is the ridiculously low rate of fire. Perhaps add this feat/enhancement to Silver Flame at level 12 as well for those Cleric/FvS builds as well?
    Quote Originally Posted by janave View Post
    As little as i know about this, I kinda think the problem with always 4 arrow was that each projectile is "real", as in "does calcs", unlike the other ranged weapons where projectile is mostly a well synced up display effect.

    So that means each arrow would need collision-tracing, to hit, on hit effect -calcs PER target, add in manyshot and IPS and the backend is torn.

    But yeah id too love back the 4 arrow burst from level6 and up. THAT might persuade me to one day play another archer.
    I think the answer lies in Doubleshot. Maybe a KT-like feat for Bows that gives you +1 Crit Range with bows and doubles your Doubleshot while wielding a bow. I think that would make Bow crits competitive with other martial styles, and bring the ROF up in a more backend-friendly way that scales with your gear and investments.

    I dont like tying it to WIS, since that's pigeonholing bow builds, and requiring a handcuff to a premium tree as well. Rangers and elves can build DEX for bows, and ostensibly Bow Strength lets you build STR as well, FvS might prefer going CHA with Silver Flame, and there might be viable INT builds possible with Harper (ie EK) once archery itself is updated. Thats why I think Doubleshot is the stat to boost, it works for all Bow Archers.

  16. #16
    Community Member Eddexp's Avatar
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    Default yep

    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Essentially, this.
    Mmmhm. AA's a solid tree in a style that has some serious shortcomings.

    That's a joke?
    besides the bugs on attack speed, we post every 3 months on the forum, and the loot balance who looks like make by RNG and don't show any synergy.
    All game playstyle is carried for bugs and exploits. Even shurikens give more base damage then bows(and its not counting the multirow advantage), you have more loot for repeater then any other weapon (and looks like every one carry one or one hundred of that) and all repeaters looks like have vorpal and keen as default powers(just because its 3 times more effective), Shields now give more damage then two-handed swords(bug spoiler), Greater Xbows are the faster weapon to do actions(bug spoiler).


    Quote Originally Posted by Lagin View Post
    One of the reasons Ive stopped playing.

    Same... They killed one of the most iconic weapons and play style of the game.


    For anyone who likes bows, advises:
    -They don't scale well, you pay too much AP for same enhancement powers and some of them are mutually exclusive.
    -the trajectory of the arrow looks kinda bug and looks like it can miss some times for lag compensation or some kind of weird lost mechanic lost by time. For that avoid use slayer arrow adrenaline combo on the first shot.
    -They are the most feat dependent weapon style of the game and the feats are heavy unbalanced with cooldowns of more less 120s witch a damage increase of more less 30%.


    Enjoy the game trying every combat style, and have in mind this game is not balanced for PvP or any other weird logic.
    [<O>] Orien: Set(-TCompletionist-)

  17. #17
    Community Member Lagin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eddexp View Post
    That's a joke?
    besides the bugs on attack speed, we post every 3 months on the forum, and the loot balance who looks like make by RNG and don't show any synergy.
    All game playstyle is carried for bugs and exploits. Even shurikens give more base damage then bows(and its not counting the multirow advantage), you have more loot for repeater then any other weapon (and looks like every one carry one or one hundred of that) and all repeaters looks like have vorpal and keen as default powers(just because its 3 times more effective), Shields now give more damage then two-handed swords(bug spoiler), Greater Xbows are the faster weapon to do actions(bug spoiler).





    Same... They killed one of the most iconic weapons and play style of the game.


    For anyone who likes bows, advises:
    -They don't scale well, you pay too much AP for same enhancement powers and some of them are mutually exclusive.
    -the trajectory of the arrow looks kinda bug and looks like it can miss some times for lag compensation or some kind of weird lost mechanic lost by time. For that avoid use slayer arrow adrenaline combo on the first shot.
    -They are the most feat dependent weapon style of the game and the feats are heavy unbalanced with cooldowns of more less 120s witch a damage increase of more less 30%.


    Enjoy the game trying every combat style, and have in mind this game is not balanced for PvP or any other weird logic.

    I can't stress enough how absurd the whole x-bow debacle is. Dual x-bows? Is this pathfinder, where anything goes?

    X-bows have the same range as a long bow/ Really?

    Let's face it SSG refuses to address this issue, Ive heard everything from animation issues to the BS single pull change. When SSG starts to makes worthwhile changes to BASIC game play mechanics, I'll reconsider my stance. but right now. they've taken the fun out of bow users, AA etc....

    Don't like my reply? "Hate it for ya"

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaxtan View Post
    I have only been playing a little over a year, I have learned a lot more about how to really play DDO in a few days vs. grind DDO in a year, and it is much more entertaining. I hope HC never ends.

  18. #18
    Community Member lyrecono's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sirelder View Post
    Is there any plans to do a Arcane Archer pass anytime soon? they are shown a lot of love to crossbow and dagger users but the AA tree has not seen any love since the introduced the current enhancement tree couple years ago. AA is now weaker then the other ranged tree's... So Please Dev's show some love too the AA tree.. I love playing AA's..

    Thanks
    Bows in general, need an update.
    But crossbow support is far larger in the dev team, so don't hold your breath.

    At least you're dps-ing from a safe distance, you could be strugling in close combat with an underpowered 2hf style.
    At least you have a favorable risk reward when it comes to doing damage.
    Last edited by lyrecono; 07-11-2019 at 01:25 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by FlimsyFirewood View Post
    I play a guy with a two-hander not just in this game, but in every game that has 'em.
    Quote Originally Posted by J-mann View Post
    Not to derail the thread, but then can you make 2hf NOT suck so much compared to 2wf or swf?
    Quote Originally Posted by FlimsyFirewood View Post
    8 pages in, that train has already sailed. The dead horse is canned into cat food by now.

  19. #19
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    Effective bow/AA is already tied to monkcher builds due to TTS. Don't make this mistake again. Ranger should not be the only viable bow class either.

    Simply a moderate increase in attack speed (~20%?) should put Bow in a decent position at least. This should be possible without engine rework. Either by increasing the base or BAB scaling of attack speed, or just giving all bows (or quivers) an inherent stacking haste that only applies to bows. Nerf TTS/Manyshot if required.

    EDIT: You could also allow whirling wrists to apply at least partially to bows.
    Last edited by LurkingVeteran; 07-10-2019 at 01:49 PM.

  20. #20
    Community Member Eddexp's Avatar
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    Talking Well

    this discussion always gets fun. Bows are buggy, thf is underpowered, monks unarmed are nerfed to the ground, shields are broken, xbows are buggybears, repeaters are safe by gm power.


    if you are not in meta rush you cant get rxp and game with no reaper is scaling up to compensate the growing power of that.


    a really new level of fun.
    [<O>] Orien: Set(-TCompletionist-)

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