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  1. #1
    Community Member Ripjaw7's Avatar
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    Default Character DPS not going as planned

    Ok, so I have a level 29 Character that has 6 levels of Ftr, 6 levels of Bbn, and 8 levels of Drd. Multi-classing allowed me to be able to spend points in a Bbn enhancement tree that has to do with Rage. There is something wrong with my character right now because at level 29, I am only hitting for about 200 and want to be hitting for more on high reaper levels. I have a Strength of 46 and that is a problem in of itself. Is there something I can do to be able to hit higher like in the 1ks naturally? I am using the Epic Riftmaker and have a Sentient Gem with 3 fills of Prowess in it. I do not think it is the weapon tho, I think it is just something with my character. Any suggestions?
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    Riftmaker is a problem right away, it doesn't have legendary dice.

    And that str is really really bad.

    Assuming this is a wolf build?

    Which tree is your T5? Enhancements are half a character's power.
    Last edited by Cantor; 06-25-2019 at 09:22 AM.

  3. #3
    Community Member Ripjaw7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cantor View Post
    Riftmaker is a problem right away, it doesn't have legendary dice.

    And that str is really really bad.

    Assuming this is a wolf build?

    Which tree is your T5? Enhancements are half a character's power.

    I am hoping to get a different weapon through using the epic Riftmaker. (Torn or Tremor from Baba Raid)

    This is a wolf build with my T5 points in the Drd wolf tree (Nature's Warrior) I use the Winter wolf form.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ripjaw7 View Post
    I am hoping to get a different weapon through using the epic Riftmaker. (Torn or Tremor from Baba Raid)
    You might try to get Tail from toxic treatment in the meantime.

    How is your str so low? there are trash tier +19 items. I think gear is part of the problem.

    Are you using rage? Primal scream? Ram's might? Frenzy? A combat trance like kta?

    what destiny? Those can't be blitz numbers right?

    PA or precision? You going for big hits or less misses? misses become an issue in legendary.

    You are probably in the right tree with that split, though it doesn't have as much mp built in.
    Last edited by Cantor; 06-25-2019 at 10:02 AM.

  5. #5
    DDO Players Council Renvar's Avatar
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    The 45 strength is probably a big part of the issue.

    You should have at least a +18 str item slotted, +6 insightful, and +4 quality. With a +1 exceptional augment. Also with +1 from your filigrees. And a Profane item. (Slotting Strength, Deadly, Accuracy, Doublestrike, and Armor Piercing are your primary goals for gear). That is +32 from gear.

    You have the Rams Might spell as a druid.

    Things to look for:

    Tome - +1 to +8 to strength. You didn't mention one. Hopefully you have one. If not, get the best you can.

    Try to get more strength from your AP spend, if you can. I'd not waste feats, twists, or epic destiny AP on strength.

    Primal Scream will give you another +5. Make sure you have that.

    You should try to gather the following sources of temp strength:

    Hezrou Cookies (+4 Profane, 2 more than a static item), Titan's Grip pots/WF Titan cookies (+6 Psionic), Deneith/Prowress Pots(+3 Alchemical), Yugo Pots(+2 stacking), Store Pots(+2 Stacking). All of those combined can add an extra +15 to your strength.

    There are a few other sources too,
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cantor View Post
    You might try to get Tail from toxic treatment in the meantime.

    How is your str so low? there are trash tier +19 items. I think gear is part of the problem.

    Are you using rage? Primal scream? Ram's might? Frenzy? A combat trance like kta?

    what destiny? Those can't be blitz numbers right?

    PA or precision? You going for big hits or less misses? misses become an issue in legendary.

    You are probably in the right tree with that split.
    Agree on the Tail. Its a very nice weapon and is fairly easy to farm.

    There are a lot of good wolf TH that help damage and the Riftmaker might be one of the worst TBH. Heck you could run into the mists and even grab an epic RL welfare weapon and use at 29.
    If you are STR to hit/dmg you need to find items, LR, whatever but your strength should be 20 points higher at least at this point. Weapon damage profile is king in DDO however on a melee build. You should be looking for ones that have high crit range, crit x dmg and base damage over anything else (in that range). And anything you can do to improve the (W) of your weapon through enhancements, feats, etc.

    Also did you max your natural fighting feats? You can take it up to 3 times and it should have priority over everything.

  7. #7
    Community Member SpartanKiller13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ripjaw7 View Post
    Ok, so I have a level 29 Character that has 6 levels of Ftr, 6 levels of Bbn, and 8 levels of Drd. Multi-classing allowed me to be able to spend points in a Bbn enhancement tree that has to do with Rage. There is something wrong with my character right now because at level 29, I am only hitting for about 200 and want to be hitting for more on high reaper levels. I have a Strength of 46 and that is a problem in of itself. Is there something I can do to be able to hit higher like in the 1ks naturally? I am using the Epic Riftmaker and have a Sentient Gem with 3 fills of Prowess in it. I do not think it is the weapon tho, I think it is just something with my character. Any suggestions?
    At that point you're probably better off with the Ravenloft free weapons (walk into the wilderness area, talk to the guy on the path, get a Morninglord Falchion). While Riftmaker has a better crit profile, that only draws ahead when you have a lot of other sources of base damage (which it sounds like you don't yet).

    Prowess set is pretty mediocre until you get 5-piece; I'd probably recommend Long Shadow for MP & a damage proc.

    You're level 29 and own Ravenloft. Even before getting raid stuff, I'd recommend getting a 3-piece DPS set and maybe a 5-piece Adherent's for stats. Crypt Raider or Silent Avenger would be my advice (Crypt Raider has better defenses, Silent Avenger better DPS). You should also consider grabbing some stat gear from Ravenloft (like Bracers of the Fallen Hero). 18 base Strength, 7 level-ups, 2 airship, and 19 from those = 46, and that's all of one item and no buffs/enhancements/tomes to equal your current stat. Add on Ram's +2, Frenzy +2, Rage +6, Scream +5, Stalwart +6 if you run Medium, ED stuff, random +1 enhancements, more items, etc etc and you'll be in a lot better shape. You can usually aim for Enhancement, Insight, Quality, Profane, and Exceptional to stat fairly reasonably, with Alchemical & Artifact being a bit harder.

    Do you currently have Deadly, Seeker, Armorpiercing, Deception, Doublestrike, Accuracy, and Speed itemized?
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    I'm running an 11/8/1 Brb/Druid/Fighter right now and am out dpsing you with a one handed vulkoor's edge, and a random assortment of ravenloft gear (mists set), It's very suboptimal so if I'm outdpsing you then something is very wrong with your build or gear.

    When you say you're doing 200 damage in high reaper, you're not talking R7+ right? Because that'd be pretty impressive damage for a riftmaker with 46 strangth in high skulls.

    Looks like gear is probably 50% pf your problem, and enhancements the other 50%

    I'd recommend grabbing a ravenloft morninglord falchion and using that as a placeholder until you can get some actually good gear (Torn, Tail of the scorpion, Echo/Reflection of Blackrazor, I'd only recommend Tremor if you're going a silvanus build), the base damage dice along will put it slightly ahead of Riftmaker even with the lowered crit multi.

    You're T5 natures warrior? While that's a pretty decent tree with a lot of nice utility, T5 Frenzy Berserker is overall a better dps tree, making sure to get the T5 +2 crit multi and T4 Crazy strike, which will be huge dps increases especially if you grab the morninglord falcion.

    Other than that how is the rest of your gear? you should try to have at least 1 set bonus from either Ravenloft in order from best to worst(Silent avenger, Crypt raider, Mists) or Sharn (part of the family), with sharn being optimal if you're using non-light armor as it's better dps than crypt raider and mists, and roughly tied with silent avenger.

    Your other gear might also be a problem, you're strength is incredibly low, you should be hitting at least low 60s, with my split hitting high 70's with only a +3 str tome, though the higher amount of barb levels on my split gives me slightly more str from rage.

    There are a ton of good strength items lying around such as the mighty stormreach guardian helmet or legendary bracers of the fallen hero.


    You should also have a good deadly, accuracy, and double strike item, and try and get at the very least insightful bonuses to str/deadly/accuracy, with quality and other bonuses being a well bonus.


    Giving a full list of your gear and build would help people to give you more specific advice.
    Last edited by FlavoredSoul; 06-25-2019 at 11:58 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by SpartanKiller13 View Post
    At that point you're probably better off with the Ravenloft free weapons (walk into the wilderness area, talk to the guy on the path, get a Morninglord Falchion). While Riftmaker has a better crit profile, that only draws ahead when you have a lot of other sources of base damage (which it sounds like you don't yet).

    Prowess set is pretty mediocre until you get 5-piece; I'd probably recommend Long Shadow for MP & a damage proc.

    You're level 29 and own Ravenloft. Even before getting raid stuff, I'd recommend getting a 3-piece DPS set and maybe a 5-piece Adherent's for stats. Crypt Raider or Silent Avenger would be my advice (Crypt Raider has better defenses, Silent Avenger better DPS). You should also consider grabbing some stat gear from Ravenloft (like Bracers of the Fallen Hero). 18 base Strength, 7 level-ups, 2 airship, and 19 from those = 46, and that's all of one item and no buffs/enhancements/tomes to equal your current stat. Add on Ram's +2, Frenzy +2, Rage +6, Scream +5, Stalwart +6 if you run Medium, ED stuff, random +1 enhancements, more items, etc etc and you'll be in a lot better shape. You can usually aim for Enhancement, Insight, Quality, Profane, and Exceptional to stat fairly reasonably, with Alchemical & Artifact being a bit harder.

    Do you currently have Deadly, Seeker, Armorpiercing, Deception, Doublestrike, Accuracy, and Speed itemized?
    Good advice.

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    What epic destiny are you in?

    Take the advise above and get a Ravenloft freebie weapon. Then, increase your strength. Enhancement bonus, Insightful bonus, Quality bonus. Get your strength into the mid 60s to low 70s minimum unbuffed standing on the ship. Finally, look at your melee power. If you find you can't sustain a blitz, look at a different tree than Legendary Dreadnought (I know! Heresy!). Primal Avatar gives +5% damage, +1 crit mult on 19-20, and 10 melee power per core in wolf form. Go up the left and right sides adding to your STR and get the wolf form combat enhancers. 60 Melee power in Primal is about the same as having a 7 stack of blitz on all the time without the need to maintain it. It's not optimal, but it's a viable alternative until you optimize your gear, enhancements, and playstyle.

    Finally, reset your expectations. 1k standard hits aren't just something you get by transforming into a wolf. 1k standard hits are pretty rarified air that require not just gear but gear with mythic and / or reaper melee power bonuses, tomes, maxed out filagrees, etc. When I was first starting out on my wolf builds, mid 500s standard hits were pretty common and the more you tweek and work on the build, the more you can push those numbers up.

    I'm sure someone will come along with their first life toon in green gear who gets 1ks all the time, but ignore that nonsense. What's nice about melee is that you can improve it almost endlessly in a variety of different ways. Adding melee power, adding damage bonuses, adding accuracy, tweeking your crit profile, adding doublestrike, adding armor piercing and fort bypass. All of these things stack and mulitply together to ramp up your DPS, and once you pop that haste boost, it's quite a rush.
    Last edited by Zretch; 06-25-2019 at 12:52 PM.

  11. #11
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    I currently have druid wolf build and for a weapon slot Blackrazor is much better then Tail. Also use on lv 30 Legendary feat Scion of the Ethereal Plane and max out you hide skill. Also items with Deadly helps.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seljuck View Post
    I currently have druid wolf build and for a weapon slot Blackrazor is much better then Tail. Also use on lv 30 Legendary feat Scion of the Ethereal Plane and max out you hide skill. Also items with Deadly helps.
    15-20x2 cirt range on tail vs 17-20x2on blackrazor = huge edge tail

    7.5{2d4+4} +15 x1.5 = 107.5 base dmg on tail vs 7{2d6+6} +15 x1.5 = 148.5 base dmg = edge blackrazor

    metalliine + byeshk on tail vs crystal on blackrazor = edge tail

    The extended crit profile range is going to mean 10% more crits. If you have a strength of 90 and have +9 enhancement bonus to damage +21 Seeker and +14 deadly +40 Melee Power (very assumable) then your crit with a tail on 15-16 is going to be 107.5+45+9+21+14=239x3 in wolf form on a tail = 717 crit dmg which at a 10% rate = 71.7 damage per hit (averaged). There is also a lot more to it than that honestly. But even if you used the OP of 48 STR, +9 enhancement bonus from wolf tree and,0 seeker 0 deadly, 20 MP then it would be 107.5+24+9=146.3x3 = 43.9 damage per hit (averaged). Well you could say well my base damage would be a gain on 17-20 although on my crits and you would be right. But 17-18 would net you 17.2 per hit gain (averaged) and 19-20 would net you 26.7 per hit gain (averaged). So if you add it up then blackrazor has an addition of 43.9 per hit average over base damage considering crit profile range and multiplier. So in the OPs case you are even but as your base additions such as seeker, deadly, enhancement bonuses to dmg, melee power, etc come into play, crit profile range will be king at end game. And to be honest I was doing simple math and the reality is even the OPs damage is higher than I put on paper since a lot more than I showed comes from static additions to damage, Leg Scorpion Tail will pull way ahead.

    This is why most of people prefer Tail or one of the modern raid weapons.
    Last edited by jskinner937; 06-25-2019 at 02:00 PM.

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    Reflection of Blackrazor should be the endgoal for a weapon unless running a silvanus build.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrTrolol View Post
    Reflection of Blackrazor should be the endgoal for a weapon unless running a silvanus build.
    I think if you have no DR mobs then yes the upgraded version has another +14 damage and 100DC Phantasmal Killer which is really nice on an AOE attack. But the reference above was Leg Echo of Blackrazor. And on DR mobs in reaper Tail pulls way ahead of both.

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    Community Member MrTrolol's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jskinner937 View Post
    I think if you have no DR mobs then yes the upgraded version has another +14 damage and 100DC Phantasmal Killer which is really nice on an AOE attack. But the reference above was Leg Echo of Blackrazor. And on DR mobs in reaper Tail pulls way ahead of both.
    While it may have been my gear doing well, I broke through almost every DR alongside having crystal, on my reflection, plus the extra damage from souls is great.

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    Well, barbarian mixed with druid sounds like a bear build?
    Try to get a Epic Elemental Bloom or if that takes to long a Moonbeam, they should not break your oath.
    And bear helps with special attacks while raged that are typed as a spell.

    Besides that items with Deadly help a lot on your normal hits, Seeker helps on crits and Melee Power helps on some typed damages.

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    Quote Originally Posted by jskinner937 View Post
    15-20x2 cirt range on tail vs 17-20x2on blackrazor = huge edge tail

    7.5{2d4+4} +15 x1.5 = 107.5 base dmg on tail vs 7{2d6+6} +15 x1.5 = 148.5 base dmg = edge blackrazor

    metalliine + byeshk on tail vs crystal on blackrazor = edge tail

    The extended crit profile range is going to mean 10% more crits. If you have a strength of 90 and have +9 enhancement bonus to damage +21 Seeker and +14 deadly +40 Melee Power (very assumable) then your crit with a tail on 15-16 is going to be 107.5+45+9+21+14=239x3 in wolf form on a tail = 717 crit dmg which at a 10% rate = 71.7 damage per hit (averaged). There is also a lot more to it than that honestly. But even if you used the OP of 48 STR, +9 enhancement bonus from wolf tree and,0 seeker 0 deadly, 20 MP then it would be 107.5+24+9=146.3x3 = 43.9 damage per hit (averaged). Well you could say well my base damage would be a gain on 17-20 although on my crits and you would be right. But 17-18 would net you 17.2 per hit gain (averaged) and 19-20 would net you 26.7 per hit gain (averaged). So if you add it up then blackrazor has an addition of 43.9 per hit average over base damage considering crit profile range and multiplier. So in the OPs case you are even but as your base additions such as seeker, deadly, enhancement bonuses to dmg, melee power, etc come into play, crit profile range will be king at end game. And to be honest I was doing simple math and the reality is even the OPs damage is higher than I put on paper since a lot more than I showed comes from static additions to damage, Leg Scorpion Tail will pull way ahead.

    This is why most of people prefer Tail or one of the modern raid weapons.
    then numbers are from raid blackrazor, really not easy to have. Better consider the +4 normal version in this thread

    I think a detailed build is necessary if uwant an help:

    Tell us all items
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    Quote Originally Posted by LightBear View Post
    Well, barbarian mixed with druid sounds like a bear build?
    Try to get a Epic Elemental Bloom or if that takes to long a Moonbeam, they should not break your oath.
    And bear helps with special attacks while raged that are typed as a spell.

    Besides that items with Deadly help a lot on your normal hits, Seeker helps on crits and Melee Power helps on some typed damages.
    I thought the same thing.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alled78 View Post
    then numbers are from raid blackrazor, really not easy to have. Better consider the +4 normal version in this thread

    I think a detailed build is necessary if uwant an help:

    Tell us all items
    All enhancement
    Features and stat
    Tomes
    Agreed without more specifics to crunch numbers it’s hard to say how the true impact of weapon damage and critical profile will compare weapon to weapon. However I just threw in some low likely achieves me examples compared to very low end numbers. I think what is clear is that the more additional additions to base damage there is the more impactful Crit profile becomes to overall damage. To me at end game on a well built toon/gear crit range is King.

    And great catch on my error in the previous example.

    Let me stand corrected....

    7.5{2d4+4} +15 x1.5 = 107.5 base dmg on tail vs 7{2d6+4}+15 x1.5 = 136.5 base dmg = edge blackrazor

    metalliine + byeshk on tail vs crystal on blackrazor = edge tail

    The extended crit profile range is going to mean 10% more crits. If you have a strength of 90 and have +9 enhancement bonus to damage +21 Seeker and +14 deadly +40 Melee Power (very assumable) then your crit with a tail on 15-16 is going to be 107.5+45+9+21+14=239x3 in wolf form on a tail = 717 crit dmg which at a 10% rate = 71.7 damage per hit (averaged). There is also a lot more to it than that honestly. But even if you used the OP of 48 STR, +9 enhancement bonus from wolf tree and,0 seeker 0 deadly, 20 MP then it would be 107.5+24+9=168.6x3= 50.6 damage per hit (averaged). Well you could say well my base damage would be a gain on 17-20 although on my crits and you would be right. But 17-18 would net you 8.7 per hit gain (averaged) and 19-20 would net you 21.8 per hit gain (averaged). So if you add it up then blackrazor has an addition of 30.5 per hit average over base damage considering crit profile range and multiplier. So in the OPs case you are even but as your base additions such as seeker, deadly, enhancement bonuses to dmg, melee power, etc come into play, crit profile range will be king at end game. And to be honest I was doing simple math and the reality is even the OPs damage is higher than I put on paper since a lot more than I showed comes from static additions to damage, Leg Scorpion Tail will pull way ahead.

    This is why most of people prefer Tail or one of the modern raid weapons.


    Although I agree the stacking +1 damage and +1 MP starts changing things when you stack up to 20 but considering that only stacks on each vorpal and decays that is very difficult to quantify. It can take 25% of a quest or more to roll 20 twenty times without decay in even a long quest with lots of mobs even on a fast attacking wolf build this is very situational. And only maxing out will even compare to maxed out toon honestly. Now that I have done the math, I think Tail beats the upgraded version as well straight up, but it’s certainly a close call all things considered and I think overall I would prefer the vampirism when up against non-DR mobs.

  20. #20
    Community Member HungarianRhapsody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seljuck View Post
    I currently have druid wolf build and for a weapon slot Blackrazor is much better then Tail. Also use on lv 30 Legendary feat Scion of the Ethereal Plane and max out you hide skill. Also items with Deadly helps.
    Blackrazor.is better than Tail if you are breaking Dad and stacking all of the Blackrazor bonuses. That's not all the time and Tail.is way easier to get. You should have both if you're going to have Blackrazor.

    Also, don't forget that Arboria will make your next life easier when the +2 extra Enhancement sticks to the weapon after you reincarnate. Arboria is going to be better for some builds and Etherial better for others. Either one is good.

    Best tips: do what the people above said about Enhancements.
    Like your way through some Ravenloft Reaper runs and beg the other party members to pass you the gear so you can get some.decmet Strength, Dex, Con, Accuracy, Deadly, Seeker, and Deception.

    Grab the Ravenloft Falchion until you get a better weapon. Farm Toxic Treatment until you have a Tail (ask for help getting that so you don't have to run that annoying quest any more than necessary). Then go work on a Blackrazor if you really want one. That will take a while.
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