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  1. #1
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    Default Prove Your Worth spike trap descent

    I just picked up 3BC recently and I've been working through that saga...lemme just say Prove Your Worth seems like a really carpy quest design :P The spike trap fall comes off pretty much like a "Jack Jibbers Blade" gear check. I'm an Arti so I can do the "deliberate death" method and teleport my dog through it, but I just dont like the idea philosophically of a quest where you're supposed to die to complete it.

    I realize there's also a safe path through, but with the long long runout to get there every time you die, I think learning it the hard way is also a carpy thing to expect players to do.

    OK, soapbox aside, here's my question - what mitigates the spike damage? PRR does, I know, but does Dodge? Incorp? Blurry? Is there any way to actually tank through the spikes solo without getting your Reflex over 100?

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    Community Member MistaMagic's Avatar
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    Avoiding them helps . There is a route through the spikes btw
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    Founder & Super Hero Arkat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MistaMagic View Post
    Avoiding them helps . There is a route through the spikes btw
    Indeed there is!

    But if you can't figure the route out, having a 100 Reflex save is just as good.
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    https://ddowiki.com/page/Trap#Mitigating_trap_damage

    Which trap exactly and what difficulty ?

    I've never had much problem in there except elevator traps - and I've never had 100 reflex save as far as I can remember.

    But aside from mitigation:
    - there are lower difficulties
    - there are ways to get raised in a quest without running back out, not sure I understand the comment.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MistaMagic View Post
    Avoiding them helps . There is a route through the spikes btw
    Yeah, but like I said, learning it the hard way means dying a lot until you do, and having to run all the way back out IMO is too steep a death penalty for that process, thats my complaint.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkat View Post
    Indeed there is!

    But if you can't figure the route out, having a 100 Reflex save is just as good.
    I'm about halfway there right now - and my reflex stat is my main stat too :P lol

    Quote Originally Posted by boredGamer View Post
    https://ddowiki.com/page/Trap#Mitigating_trap_damage

    Which trap exactly and what difficulty ?

    I've never had much problem in there except elevator traps - and I've never had 100 reflex save as far as I can remember.

    But aside from mitigation:
    - there are lower difficulties
    - there are ways to get raised in a quest without running back out, not sure I understand the comment.
    Yeah, that page doesnt have info on spike traps - they definitely cant be Evaded, but I didnt know if they could be Dodged where Uncanny Dodge would be useful to pop first.

    And did you read my post? I'm just opposed to the idea of having a quest where you die and rez yourself as part of an intended pathway in the quest. Also that means losing XP bonuses So I'm asking for ideas how to do it and live, until I'm comfortable enough to just navigate it.

    I did go ahead and complete it on HE just to get flagged for the Guide, at least.

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    Cosmetic Guru Aelonwy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MistaMagic View Post
    Avoiding them helps . There is a route through the spikes btw
    There is a route through the spikes however due to various graphic settings and possibly graphic card issues as well it is not always visible to all players. I know because I play side by side with my hubby and he got an entirely new computer last year. The route through the spikes is readily visible on his computer whereas on mine it doesn't appear until I am right upon it (or actually trying to go through it) and far too late for me to attempt to use it. Otherwise on my screen it appears from above before I jump as a solid column of spikes. If I do not have godly saves I either wait for hubby to open the gate below by the shrine or I die and summon a hireling to me to raise me at the bottom. This is the only part of the quest I dislike, and I really enjoy it on heroic especially the reference to Princess Bride which always makes me smile.
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    Yeah, that page doesnt have info on spike traps - they definitely cant be Evaded, but I didnt know if they could be Dodged where Uncanny Dodge would be useful to pop first.

    And did you read my post? I'm just opposed to the idea of having a quest where you die and rez yourself as part of an intended pathway in the quest. Also that means losing XP bonuses So I'm asking for ideas how to do it and live, until I'm comfortable enough to just navigate it.

    I did go ahead and complete it on HE just to get flagged for the Guide, at least.
    None of this makes any sense to me - again - it would be helpful - which difficulty and which trap are you talking about ? Maybe it's clear to others but not to me (the first one?) - I'm not sure what trap in there can't be evaded. When I'm on an evasion build the whole quest seems trivial trap wise.

    The intended pathway is not to die at all. I normally don't die in that quest. So it's not an "intended pathway" - or a Lost at Sea prick finger / die sort of situation. I appreciate you implying I didn't read your post - really helps a conversation along.

    You lose 10% TOTAL for as many deaths as you want until you figure it out. Who cares? Then you'll be comfortable enough to navigate it. Or again, figure it out on a lower difficulty.

    Ideas will be easier if you say which trap / difficulty.

  8. #8
    Community Member vryxnr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    I'm just opposed to the idea of having a quest where you die and rez yourself as part of an intended pathway in the quest. ... So I'm asking for ideas how to do it and live, until I'm comfortable enough to just navigate it.
    That is not the intent. The intent is to use the clear path through, and to not just faceplant into the spikes. If you want to face-tank through them, you'll need either 100+ reflex, or tank level HP with tank level prr to survive. Or have a hireling teleport to your corpse at the bottom, or some form of self rez... OR have a party member do it for you (Prove your Worth has shortcuts that allow one person to do the dirty work then let the rest in without having to navigate the traps).

    But dying to the wall-spikes on theway down the shaft towards the puzzle then rezzing afterwards is not the 'intended' strat. That is simply a consequence of not being able to do it (yet).




    SPOILERS:




    The path starts at the far right corner, then goes counter-clockwise from there until 2/3rds of the way down. From there it's directly across the middle, then straight down. The only 'gear check' is some form of Feather Fall.
    Last edited by vryxnr; 06-24-2019 at 02:48 PM.

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    Cosmetic Guru Aelonwy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boredGamer View Post
    None of this makes any sense to me - again - it would be helpful - which difficulty and which trap are you talking about ?

    Ideas will be easier if you say which trap / difficulty.
    I'm pretty sure he means the Epic version and this trap:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sUa3Kl_hG7k

    Which on my computer doesn't look quite so easy to navigate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by vryxnr View Post
    The path starts at the far right corner, then goes counter-clockwise from there until 2/3rds of the way down. From there it's directly across the middle, then straight down. The only 'gear check' is some form of Feather Fall.
    This. I think of it as "across (to the far right), circle, across, down" and that usually gets me through with ~1 hit. You can also self-heal while falling, and since you know it's coming proc stuff like Affirmation or Blood Feast beforehand. But really, as long as it's not a graphics issue (and I've never had one?) you just look for the not-spiky-bits and try to find more of that path that is made of those.
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    Community Member Tricosene's Avatar
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    The first few times I died.

    Then I used Cocoon and the extra hit points plus healing over time let me make it, at least long enough to get an idea of how it worked.

    That is really the key, in my opinion--you need to survive long enough to see how it works a few times.

    Now I can just feather fall down, albeit with a heal spell ready to go off, and I make it without hardly any issue.

    It took me maybe six times to figure it out.



    TLDR: You asked how to mitigate the damage. I use Cocoon.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aelonwy View Post
    There is a route through the spikes however due to various graphic settings and possibly graphic card issues as well it is not always visible to all players.
    Yeah this sounds like what I'm experiencing too. I tried to just eyeball my way down - after seeing a video so I knew what to look for - but I still got nailed by several layers of spikes that didnt appear until I was already in them. I thought it was the clear path, but then boom, impaled with no chance to react.

    Quote Originally Posted by boredGamer View Post
    None of this makes any sense to me - again - it would be helpful - which difficulty and which trap are you talking about ? Maybe it's clear to others but not to me (the first one?) - I'm not sure what trap in there can't be evaded. When I'm on an evasion build the whole quest seems trivial trap wise.

    The intended pathway is not to die at all. I normally don't die in that quest. So it's not an "intended pathway" - or a Lost at Sea prick finger / die sort of situation. I appreciate you implying I didn't read your post - really helps a conversation along.

    You lose 10% TOTAL for as many deaths as you want until you figure it out. Who cares? Then you'll be comfortable enough to navigate it. Or again, figure it out on a lower difficulty.

    Ideas will be easier if you say which trap / difficulty.
    Sorry, EH. Didnt realize that the shaft was different on Heroic till I went back and played it through - like I said, I just picked up 3BC. All the other traps are trivial (well elevator got me once or twice as I learned, oddly it took me several runs through it before I realized they were nontrivial traps, lulled me into a false sense of security lol). The spike traps can be evaded but the save is crazy high compared to everything else.

    And I still stand by my original statement - if "just get your hire to rez you" is the best way to get past it, that's a fault in design IMO. And I think that was very clear in my OP, so I dont know why you took issue with that if you read it all. And if "just keep dying till you learn the path" is the intent, that's also faulty, especially if there's graphical issues with the element.


    Quote Originally Posted by Tricosene View Post

    TLDR: You asked how to mitigate the damage. I use Cocoon.
    That was my first thought too but the 150 HP seems to only buy you one mistake, and then stops healing. Didnt seem to cut it for me on EH, maybe your PRR is much better than mine.

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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post

    And I still stand by my original statement - if "just get your hire to rez you" is the best way to get past it, that's a fault in design IMO..
    Now that I know what traps you're talking about - the answer:

    It is not the intent. Therefore your statement is invalid. I didn't even think of that trap as a problem spot.

  14. #14
    Community Member Tricosene's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    That was my first thought too but the 150 HP seems to only buy you one mistake, and then stops healing. Didnt seem to cut it for me on EH, maybe your PRR is much better than mine.
    My PRR isn't always that good, it depends upon the build. But most of the time, I don't even hit the spikes anymore. For me, it's one of the easiest parts of the dungeon.

    But for you--you're not seeing the spikes until you hit them? You are in a whole world of hurt, then. You're right, Cocoon isn't likely enough. You best solution might just be a cleric hire to resurrect you, as messed up as that is, unless you can play with your graphics and find a way to consistently see the spikes in advance so you can navigate around them.

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    I only ever try it when I have the ED Undying Vanguard active. It is cheese I know, but means that I can get through without dying - I have manual dexterity issues that make navigating through spikes (same with the Crucible) somewhere between insanely difficult and impossible.

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    Community Member FuzzyDuck81's Avatar
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    It was wonderfully satisfying running it on my mastermaker arty & just plummeting through - good old unbreakable forcefield
    I used to be with it, but then they changed what it was, now what's it is weird and scary to me.

  17. #17
    Community Member lyrecono's Avatar
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    Besides featherfall and navigating through,
    There is the old "hireling parked safely then summoned to yourself after your soulstone landed to rez you" method.

    But there is also an easier option, after getting in and killing the cannons (canith dogs in heroic) that hide behind the 2 pannels at the start and wait there for your party members to have made it through the spike fall and pull the lever to let you through.

    Edit:
    You can also do it on casual a few times to get the featherfalling navigation down.
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    Community Member Ausdoerrt's Avatar
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    Sounds like an object (or environment?) drawing distance issue, maybe. Have you tried playing with that? I usually play with those turned up to high / very high.
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    Community Member Tahlee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aelonwy View Post
    There is a route through the spikes however due to various graphic settings and possibly graphic card issues as well it is not always visible to all players.
    This happens to me too, I'm in the spikes before I see a path through. As a strategy in epic I run the quest in Unyielding Sentinel and use the epic moment Undying Vanguard that gives you all those hit points, to get me through, i take feather fall off, hit the epic moment and survive the fall and trap. I too dislike dying in a quest if avoidable.
    Hope that helps,

    Yours Truly,

    Tahlee

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    Have featherfall obviously, after opening jump to the back right side, then as you fall move down in a counterclockwise motion from above to be in the clear path.

    Jibbers/death is not the learning curve if you are running on elite, a lower level is the learning curve.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tahlee View Post
    This happens to me too, I'm in the spikes before I see a path through. As a strategy in epic I run the quest in Unyielding Sentinel and use the epic moment Undying Vanguard that gives you all those hit points, to get me through, i take feather fall off, hit the epic moment and survive the fall and trap. I too dislike dying in a quest if avoidable.
    Hope that helps,

    Yours Truly,

    Tahlee
    This works too. I go to DC when soloing WGU or 2toed on high difficulties for the flesh to stone immunity.
    Last edited by Cantor; 06-25-2019 at 08:33 AM.

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