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  1. #1
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    Default Bravery Bonus On, Off, Who Knows?

    I know that these days, a lot of people are running only one character, and it's probably pretty easy to remember if you've got your Bravery Bonus turned off in that case. But some of us still run a lot of alts (I have 30 characters and I run all of them), and it's hard to remember to even check my Bravery Bonus.

    Now, when a Monk is Uncentered, you have a little Exclamation Point icon that shows up. Same if you're using weapon with which you have no proficiency. The same icon shows up when Guild Fame announcements are made (which constantly makes me check to see if I'm uncentered or wielding the wrong weapons, so PLEASE change the Guild Fame icon, maybe a crown or something like that).

    So, as far as I'm concerned, it should be a snap for you to add an icon (perhaps a B with a "No" glyph over it?) that shows up when your Bravery Bonus is turned off. I lost out on a ton of epic XP the other day because my bonus was turned off (I guess I had turned it off so as to not break my streak on some dailies a few days before). I know this has happened to other folks.

    I'm just saying, if you can tell me that a guild I've never heard of and don't care anything about has reached guild level 150, you can tell me if my gosh darned Bravery Bonus is turned off.

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Community Member SiliconScout's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OfElectricMen View Post
    I know that these days, a lot of people are running only one character, and it's probably pretty easy to remember if you've got your Bravery Bonus turned off in that case. But some of us still run a lot of alts (I have 30 characters and I run all of them), and it's hard to remember to even check my Bravery Bonus.

    Now, when a Monk is Uncentered, you have a little Exclamation Point icon that shows up. Same if you're using weapon with which you have no proficiency. The same icon shows up when Guild Fame announcements are made (which constantly makes me check to see if I'm uncentered or wielding the wrong weapons, so PLEASE change the Guild Fame icon, maybe a crown or something like that).

    So, as far as I'm concerned, it should be a snap for you to add an icon (perhaps a B with a "No" glyph over it?) that shows up when your Bravery Bonus is turned off. I lost out on a ton of epic XP the other day because my bonus was turned off (I guess I had turned it off so as to not break my streak on some dailies a few days before). I know this has happened to other folks.

    I'm just saying, if you can tell me that a guild I've never heard of and don't care anything about has reached guild level 150, you can tell me if my gosh darned Bravery Bonus is turned off.

    Thanks!
    Personally I just leave it on. If it breaks I really don't care it only takes 5 quests to get it back up there and I say that as someone who has had a streak of over 1,000 and broken it freely.

    That said they could / should make it a buff or maybe even a toggle feat/stance everyone gets for free instead so those who do care could tell.
    Last edited by SiliconScout; 06-15-2019 at 08:12 AM.

  3. #3
    The Hatchery Enoach's Avatar
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    You can talk to any of the Marshals and the dialog will tell you if you have it on, you will be asked if you want to turn it off. Or if you have it off, you will be asked if you want to turn it on.

    I run multiple characters and this is how I remember if it is off or on.

    As a rule, since there is no useful benefit to me, I turn it off when I reach level 30. In this way I know that my characters of that level have it turned off.

    ---
    But as pointed out by the previous poster, 5 is the magic number. Anything more then 5 has no actually value. It is also very simple to get to 5 if you break that streak.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enoach View Post
    You can talk to any of the Marshals and the dialog will tell you if you have it on, you will be asked if you want to turn it off.
    Ah, the classic "just do this" - death of UX/UI and experience.

    BB should simply not reset at this point - having a mechanic that depends on you going to pause or unpause is inane at best. You're sure brave until you go pause the bonus, then unpause it after being cowardly? None of it makes any sense.

  5. #5
    Community Member hp1055cm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boredGamer View Post
    BB should simply not reset at this point - having a mechanic that depends on you going to pause or unpause is inane at best. You're sure brave until you go pause the bonus, then unpause it after being cowardly? None of it makes any sense.
    It is actually pretty lucid.
    If it makes no sense to you then it is probably because you don't understand the origin of the Bravery Marshall, or what the purpose of bravery bonus is.

    Like many things in this game it is entirely optional to use.
    Quote Originally Posted by Arkat View Post
    You need to change the name of "Everything is Nothing" to something else like "Up to 4 Things are Nothing."
    Doesn't sound as fun, does it? That's because it isn't and THAT'S what matters. So much for making the game more "fun."

  6. #6
    Founder salmag's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SiliconScout View Post
    Personally I just leave it on. If it breaks I really don't care it only takes 5 quests to get it back up there and I say that as someone who has had a streak of over 1,000 and broken it freely.
    Exactly what he said.

    I leave it on permanently.
    How about... Planescape or Dark SUN?

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  7. #7
    The Hatchery Enoach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boredGamer View Post
    Ah, the classic "just do this" - death of UX/UI and experience.

    BB should simply not reset at this point - having a mechanic that depends on you going to pause or unpause is inane at best. You're sure brave until you go pause the bonus, then unpause it after being cowardly? None of it makes any sense.
    well, there is a more UI way already implemented, but it does require that the player reads the dialog when they open the Quest Entrance . I could have pointed that that one out as well.

    My points did not detract from the suggestion, they simply pointed out the already available option and how they can be used. And how with the present system you can "know".

    The problem I have is this idea of using language that that makes it sound like there presently not a way to know until it is too late in that you already lost it. When there are actually two ways to "know" this information, but they do require some action on the part of the player.

  8. #8
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    Just make this bonus be a permanent part of the xp gained.

    XP in this game is really silly. It's one of the few things I very much dislike about it.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by hp1055cm View Post
    It is actually pretty lucid.
    If it makes no sense to you then it is probably because you don't understand the origin of the Bravery Marshall, or what the purpose of bravery bonus is.

    Like many things in this game it is entirely optional to use.
    Inane and lucid are not mutually inclusive in any way - so your first statement is meaningless. I never said it makes no sense, I said that it is inane.

    2nd - please enlighten us as to the origin of the bravery marshall or what this amazing purpose is - instead of just saying I don't understand it.

    Just because something is optional doesn't mean it can't be made better, hence the point of the thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Enoach View Post
    well, there is a more UI way already implemented, but it does require that the player reads the dialog when they open the Quest Entrance .

    When there are actually two ways to "know" this information, but they do require some action on the part of the player.
    Yes, these are both bad UX suggestions. Running back from a quest, to pause a bravery bonus, that you would basically ALWAYS WANT PAUSED INSTEAD OF BREAKING BONUS - makes no sense.

    There are very few times you would break BB and WANT to do it. Therefore pausing / unpausing is, as I said, inane.

    Quote Originally Posted by GramercyRiff View Post
    Just make this bonus be a permanent part of the xp gained.

    XP in this game is really silly. It's one of the few things I very much dislike about it.
    This makes much more sense than our current situation. That - or remove the ability to pause. Having a "bravery bonus" and an ability to "pause being brave" is silly.
    Last edited by boredGamer; 06-15-2019 at 01:22 PM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by boredGamer View Post
    2nd - please enlighten us as to the origin of the bravery marshall or what this amazing purpose is - instead of just saying I don't understand it.
    The Bravery Marshall was an almost unfathomably bad "solution" to problems inherent in the Bravery system. There has been an undercurrent of opposition to BB for years due to the complexity of the system, its unfortunate tendency to break once in a while, and most importantly its inherent anti-grouping nature.

    The most common suggestion has always been to give full streak bonus on the first run every time, essentially just pretend everyone's streak is a minimum of 5 no matter what it really is. For all intents and purposes that is how it plays out in the modern game anyway. There was a huge discussion about it a few years back, and instead of adopting something like this:

    if (streak < 5 ) streak = 5;

    They went with making the whole thing even more complicated, not to mention an order of magnitude more complex to program, by introducing the Bravery Marshall. It was an astonishing waste of time.

  11. #11
    Community Member TedSandyman's Avatar
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    Or, just turn it off and leave it off.

    It doesn't make sense. They should get rid of it.

    That is, get rid of it and not make it permanent.

    I always thought it was funny that you could lose your bravery bonus for running a quest that is a much higher level than you are, but if you run a much lower level quest, you wont lose the bravery bonus.

    For example:

    If I'm level 10 and run a level 12 on normal, I lose my bonus.
    If I'm level 10 and run a level 2 on normal, I don't lose my bonus.

  12. #12
    The Hatchery Enoach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by boredGamer View Post
    ...


    Yes, these are both bad UX suggestions. Running back from a quest, to pause a bravery bonus, that you would basically ALWAYS WANT PAUSED INSTEAD OF BREAKING BONUS - makes no sense.

    There are very few times you would break BB and WANT to do it. Therefore pausing / unpausing is, as I said, inane.



    ...
    I'm not sure if you are intentionally trying to make me laugh, but I'm glad I didn't take a drink of my coffee first

    First you may think the implementation is silly, but I often wonder if that is because you suffer from the same issue that many people do - You don't want to be bothered with reading.

    The pausing/unpausing was implemented because of two reasons:

    1. People don't realize how easy it is to regain the full bonus (and the actual amount of XP lost if not getting the full bonus)
    2. People have ascribed a value to the number over 5

    When a person comes to the realization of the actual numbers and the value this becomes less of an issue.

  13. #13
    Community Member Epicstorms's Avatar
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    I'd say do:
    1. Remove the 5+ bonus permanently. Just add full bonus on the first run.
    or
    2. Remove the bravery marshal and everytime you normally break BB, you simply lose 5 or 10 hard/elite completions on your streak.

  14. #14
    Community Member Deslen's Avatar
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    Actually, the reason the bravery marshall was introduced was for end-game raiding. A lot of people wouldn't raid if it broke their streaks before their next life.

    As for bravery bonus and being capped, iirc, bravery bonus still affects your reaper xp.
    AKA Lyrin on Khyber

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enoach View Post
    I'm not sure if you are intentionally trying to make me laugh, but I'm glad I didn't take a drink of my coffee first

    First you may think the implementation is silly, but I often wonder if that is because you suffer from the same issue that many people do - You don't want to be bothered with reading.

    The pausing/unpausing was implemented because of two reasons:

    1. People don't realize how easy it is to regain the full bonus (and the actual amount of XP lost if not getting the full bonus)
    2. People have ascribed a value to the number over 5

    When a person comes to the realization of the actual numbers and the value this becomes less of an issue.
    If you do 3 quests on hard and paused... you lost exp by pausing. People who pause are concerned with that big streak, not exp.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Deslen View Post
    Actually, the reason the bravery marshall was introduced was for end-game raiding. A lot of people wouldn't raid if it broke their streaks before their next life.

    As for bravery bonus and being capped, iirc, bravery bonus still affects your reaper xp.
    Bravery bonus has no effect on Rxp

  17. #17
    Community Member Oxarhamar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OfElectricMen View Post
    I know that these days, a lot of people are running only one character, and it's probably pretty easy to remember if you've got your Bravery Bonus turned off in that case. But some of us still run a lot of alts (I have 30 characters and I run all of them), and it's hard to remember to even check my Bravery Bonus.

    Now, when a Monk is Uncentered, you have a little Exclamation Point icon that shows up. Same if you're using weapon with which you have no proficiency. The same icon shows up when Guild Fame announcements are made (which constantly makes me check to see if I'm uncentered or wielding the wrong weapons, so PLEASE change the Guild Fame icon, maybe a crown or something like that).

    So, as far as I'm concerned, it should be a snap for you to add an icon (perhaps a B with a "No" glyph over it?) that shows up when your Bravery Bonus is turned off. I lost out on a ton of epic XP the other day because my bonus was turned off (I guess I had turned it off so as to not break my streak on some dailies a few days before). I know this has happened to other folks.

    I'm just saying, if you can tell me that a guild I've never heard of and don't care anything about has reached guild level 150, you can tell me if my gosh darned Bravery Bonus is turned off.

    Thanks!
    Update 27 ~snip

    There is now an NPC in the Hall of Heroes and on guild airships that allow a character to temporarily suspend their Bravery Bonus. This is a toggle, and will remain in effect until toggled again by speaking to the NPC. The Bravery Bonus will not reset nor increment when suspended.

    https://www.ddo.com/en/update-27-release-notes

    YW

  18. #18
    Community Member CaptainPurge's Avatar
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    Default No UI changes, be best

    Quote Originally Posted by OfElectricMen View Post
    But some of us still run a lot of alts (I have 30 characters and I run all of them), and it's hard to remember to even check my Bravery Bonus.
    Just put your Bravery Bonus status in your characters' bios for easy reference for yourself. Spend 2 seconds updating it if you change it. NO need to clutter up the UI.

  19. #19
    I <3 DDO rfachini's Avatar
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    I suggested either never losing your streak or making a command line way to check the BB or toggle it.
    A UI toggle would be great, but it's probably easier to make your streak status non-losable.
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  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainPurge View Post
    Just put your Bravery Bonus status in your characters' bios for easy reference for yourself. Spend 2 seconds updating it if you change it. NO need to clutter up the UI.
    You could do this for literally everything. Inventory tracking ? No problem - put it in your bio.

    Of course - 2 seconds x 100 things + being absolutely mind numbing? Seems more like work than a game.

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