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  1. #1
    Community Member Deslen's Avatar
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    Default Deadliest Monsters... and weakest!

    I love the Monster Manual... I dig through it all the time, just enjoying seeing what I've done this life, overall, etc. One thing I started to pay more attention to, Defeats Suffered, got me thinking...

    Which monsters are the most dangerous, going off Killsefeats Suffered Ratio? This list, obviously, is drawn strictly from my personal experience, but I'd love to see how others fare!

    Deadliest:

    10 Fire Elementals 362:1 (4703 Kills, 13 Deaths)
    9 Mind Flayers 327:1 (981 Kills, 3 Deaths)
    8 Water Elementals 307:1 (614 Kills, 2 Deaths)
    7 Beholders 213:1 (3402 Kills, 16 Deaths)
    6 Abashai 154:1 (2776 Kills, 18 Deaths)
    5 Ice Flensers 120:1 (963 Kills, 8 Deaths)
    4 Driders 79:1 (395 Kills, 5 Deaths)
    3 Liches 36:1 (79 Kills, 2 Deaths)
    2 Draegloths 28:1 (113 Kills, 4 Deaths)
    1 Dragons 17:1 (121 Kills, 7 Deaths)


    Some surprised me (Driders, Draegloths), but some certainly did not! (Beholders and Dragons)

    Now, for the opposite, the weakest...

    10 Rats 3114:1 (6228 Kills, 2 Deaths)
    9 Bugbears 3214:1 (3214 Kills, 1 Death)
    8 Bearded Devils 3777:1 (3777 Kills, 1 Death)
    7 Kobolds 4188:1 (46068 Kills, 11 Deaths)
    6 Wolves 4222:1 (16889 Kills, 4 Deaths)
    5 Spiders 4387:1 (35092 Kills, 8 Deaths)
    4 Shadows 5376:1 (5376 Kills, 1 Death)
    3 Zombies 5997:1 (23988 Kills, 4 Deaths)
    2 Scorpions 7017:1 (14034 Kills, 2 Deaths)
    1 Bats 7378:1 (14756 Kills, 2 Deaths)


    So, what do you guys think? What are your scores? Takes a minute to figure out, but a fun little exercise, IMO!

    Side note: I used Slain (Party) Account totals in my calculations.
    AKA Lyrin on Khyber

  2. #2
    Community Member banjo174's Avatar
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    Default Kinda Surprised me what I found

    These are my Kills per death

    Horned Devils = 3.538
    Dragon = 20
    Purple Worms = 58
    Beholder = 88
    Water Elemental 150.130
    Drider 216
    Mind Flayer 216
    Hell Cat 286
    Abishai 323.6470
    Lich 389

    I also apparently have a total death count of 1356
    and a total kill count of, 1,727,825
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  3. #3
    Community Member Ausdoerrt's Avatar
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    Default

    I only have one question: how do you die to freakin' BATS? Or does this include the exploding bats from Sharn?
    "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. ... People's heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true." Terry Goodkind

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ausdoerrt View Post
    I only have one question: how do you die to freakin' BATS? Or does this include the exploding bats from Sharn?
    They can gang up on someone.
    Also, dying to bats is often due to a buff they periodically receive from the Lag Monster. Entering at a low-ish epic level in Thunderholme Slayers, I shamefully died to a pack of bats while that buff got stacked more than once.

    I'd petition the Lag Monster as being the deadliest, but since it's not in the Monster Manual, we can't really figure the numbers out.

  5. #5
    Community Member Deslen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ausdoerrt View Post
    I only have one question: how do you die to freakin' BATS? Or does this include the exploding bats from Sharn?
    I have died once for every 7k bats I've killed... Probably from champs in the midst of other things.
    AKA Lyrin on Khyber

  6. #6
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    Bats might just get lucky and ninja kill you. I imagine there's probably been a few cases where, say, an Umber Hulk stuns someone and a bat happens to be nearby, since they're both cave monsters, and the bat happens to land the killing blow.

  7. #7
    Community Member AbyssalMage's Avatar
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    Going on memory, but Abishai and Water Elemental seems accurate. At least these seem the most memorable.

    I guess when I can reconnect I will have to check this out. I usually sit in the Market a few times a week doing nothing. This will give me something to look at.
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    They have been tweaking the game since I started and often I disagree with them. They focus on wrong stuff, over or under compensate and abandon too much stuff. Every once in awhile they get something right, if only temporarily.

  8. #8
    Community Member Deslen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AbyssalMage View Post
    Going on memory, but Abishai and Water Elemental seems accurate. At least these seem the most memorable.

    I guess when I can reconnect I will have to check this out. I usually sit in the Market a few times a week doing nothing. This will give me something to look at.
    It might surprise you just how much time you can kill browsing the monster manual ^.^
    AKA Lyrin on Khyber

  9. #9
    Community Member Alrik_Fassbauer's Avatar
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    My guess is that it is rather fresh beginners to the game who die of bats.
    I've had lots of deaths when I was new to the game because of critters I nowadays laugh about.

    My personal "Eureka !" moment was when I had a guard item equipped. Bats died really fast of that. Since then, I love guard items.
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    English is not my first language - misinterpretations galore !

  10. #10
    Community Member vryxnr's Avatar
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    I may do this as well at some point... however some ratios will not be as accurate as I'd like thanks to an annoying fact (at least on my screen) of once you get over 100k kills, the MM can't actually hold that large of a number so the last digit gets cut off. XD

    (yes, some monster types I have killed stupid amounts of)

    edit: heh, and some are also off due to various MM volumes being more recent than others. "I know I've killed more than tha- oh yeah, newer volume". ...also "No deaths? I know I've died to that before, oh, before the MM for it was released. ^_^" ...Also fun seeing some high death counts and remembering exactly where most of them happened (trying a higher reaper skull than usual and getting to a boss that destroyed me many times until I eventually triumphed)
    Last edited by vryxnr; 06-07-2019 at 04:13 PM.

  11. #11
    Community Member Alrik_Fassbauer's Avatar
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    I still only have the first few volumes - that's why I'd like to have a sale on all of them.
    "Archbishop Dryden wants to talk to you to tapper this dale."
    "Archbishop Dryden wants to talk to you to tap on this dale."
    "Archbishop Dryden wants to talk to you to tap on this tale."
    English is not my first language - misinterpretations galore !

  12. #12
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    How did you track the number of times you have died? Manually? Or is there some feature I am not aware of?

  13. #13
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    Just by sheer numbers, "human" leads by a shockingly wide margin. The number of times they have killed me (144) utterly dwarfs everything else. Mind you, I've killed around 135,000 of them, so it's not like I didn't deserve it.

  14. #14
    Forum witchdoctor Hobgoblin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaeveTuohy View Post
    How did you track the number of times you have died? Manually? Or is there some feature I am not aware of?
    must resist posting /death........ whew made save.


    in mm there is a column where it tells u defeats. thats how many times u have died to that type of critter
    main toons: hauteur(silly caster) Sttomper (silly barbarian)-jammiee (Silly paladin)
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  15. #15
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    Default

    Interestingly I have killed a Rusty Iron Kitchen Key twice.

  16. #16
    Community Member LazarusPossum's Avatar
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    Being a stick fighter, my acrobat-assassin hasn't suffered any deaths vs monsters such as aberrations or the like. His worst encounters have been instances of being overwhelmed by sheer numbers, mostly in early levels. Hobgoblins, kobolds, etc.
    "Why is stuff so hard?" - William Murderface

  17. #17
    Community Member vryxnr's Avatar
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    Crunched the numbers, os here is my score sheet at this moment

    ...the top 10 weakest enemies for me are:

    10: Efreet (11,339 killed, 1 death. Or a 0.00881912% chance of dying to them)
    9: Warforged Titan (15 killed, 0 deaths)
    8: Glabrezu (180 killed, 0 deaths)
    7: Lion (829 killed, 0 deaths)
    6: Iron Golem (1,004 killed, 0 deaths)
    5: Mudmen (1,050 killed, 0 deaths)
    4: Bugbear (1,848 killed, 0 deaths)
    3: Iron Defender (2,478 killed, 0 deaths)
    2: Scorrow (3,552 killed, 0 deaths)
    1: Bat (10,170 killed, 0 deaths)

    ...and now the top 10 deadliest (for me, at this moment... based on ratio of kills per death)

    10: Human* (101,960, 293 deaths; or one death per 347.986 killed, or a 0.287% chance of dying when fighting one)
    9: Ogre (8,620 killed, 25 deaths; or one death per 344.8 killed, or a 0.289% chance of dying when fighting one)
    8: Werewolf (2,359 killed, 9 deaths; or one death per 262.11 killed, or a 0.38152% chance of dying when fighting one)
    7: Hellcat (2,524 killed, 10 deaths; or one death per 252.4 killed, or a 0.3962% chance of dying when fighting one)
    6: Hill Giant (8,179 killed, 34 deaths; or one death per 240.5 killed, or a 0.4157% chance of dying when fighting one)
    5: Orthon (6,139 killed, 32 deaths; or one death per 191.8 killed, or a 0.52126% chance of dying when fighting one)
    4: Beholder (1,824 killed, 12 deaths; or one death per 152 killed, or a 0.657895% chance of dying when fighting one)
    3: Horned Devil (255 killed, 3 deaths; or one death per 85 killed, or a 1.1765% chance of dying when fighting one)
    2: Dragon (589 killed, 45 deaths; or one death per 13.088~ killed, or a 7.54% chance of dying when fighting one)
    1: Purple Worm (159 killed, 14 deaths; or one death per 11.357 killed, or an 8.805% chance of death when fighting one) (though to be fair this one was skewed due to running Army of Shadow on a higher reaper skull than I should have and being stubborn at the end fight)

    * = Kill counts over 100k get the ones digit cutoff in my MM, for these I assumed a 0, and thus may not be 100% accurate)
    Last edited by vryxnr; 06-08-2019 at 06:01 PM.

  18. #18
    Community Member FuryFlash's Avatar
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    Here's my list:

    Top 10 Most Dangerous Enemies:

    Name Kills Deaths KDR
    Dragon 178 7 25.4
    Beholder 1839 56 32.8
    Lich 349 9 38.8
    Mind Flayer 1009 17 59.4
    Werewolf 1371 23 59.6
    Flesh Render 2883 38 75.9
    Bear 934 11 84.9
    Hezrou 1386 16 86.6
    Drider 1164 13 89.5
    Purple Worm 94 1 94

    Top 10 Least Dangerous Enemies:

    Name Kills Deaths KDR
    Bat 16417 0 No Deaths
    Mudman 1253 0 No Deaths
    Hellcat 1231 0 No Deaths
    Lion 986 0 No Deaths
    Succubus 465 0 No Deaths
    Horned Devil 259 0 No Deaths
    Glabrezu 82 0 No Deaths
    Warforged Titan 39 0 No Deaths
    Gargoyle 8235 1 8235
    Air Elemental 5178 1 5178

  19. #19
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    One thing that stands out to me is the animations used by various creatures to attack. So even on high difficulty settings monsters like cats don't seem all that dangerous because of their slow and distracted way of attacking.

    But monsters with short animations that also may include multiple hits, a large AoE, an unexpectedly long reach, or those lacking tells for their attacks have always seemed the most dangerous to me on characters that have to be up close. And all of this hardly matters to builds that can play at range.

    Two stand-out bosses are the demon lord at the end of the Tethamyr chain who does not seem to have a cleave attack, and Sorjek in epic Tempest Spine whose slightest movement can apparently deliver a trample attack for a huge amount of damage.

    Thanks.
    Last edited by blerkington; 06-09-2019 at 02:32 AM.
    Astrican on Khyber

  20. #20
    Community Member brian14's Avatar
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    You got me intrigued. So I spent half an hour writing down my MM scores (party kills / times died). Most results were expected, some were not.

    I suppose the "least dangerous" monsters are the one who never killed me at all. Well...

    Horned devil 38 kills 0 deaths
    Iron golem 385 kills 0 deaths
    Yugoloth 462 kills 0 deaths
    Succubus 714 kills 0 deaths
    Mudman 1479 kills 0 deaths
    Fiendish Lion 4065 kills 0 deaths

    Last two are understandable; first four? I guess I only go against those when I am prepared.

    Aside from these, here are my ten best scores:

    Rat 13795 13 : 1061 to 1
    Zombie 30502 27 :1130 to 1
    Wolf 17719 15 :1181 to 1
    Troll 21814 18 :1212 to 1
    Hill giant 3700 3 :1233 to 1
    Kobold 64214 49 :1310 to 1
    Lion 1318 1 :1318 to 1
    Sahuagin 20107 8 :2513 to 1
    Bugbear 6805 1 :6805 to 1
    Bat 13228 1 :13228 to 1

    And ten worst:

    Dragon 175 21 :8 to 1
    Glabrezu 19 2 :9.5 to 1
    Warforged titan 23 1 :23 to 1
    Beholder 2493 85 :29 to 1
    Purple worm 31 1 :31 to 1
    Abishai 3676 54 :68 to 1
    Hezrou 2009 29 :69 to 1
    Monstrous plant 2201 27 :82 to 1
    Yuan-ti 1286 15 :86 to 1

    Except for plants, I don't think there are any surprises here. Now I am going to run The Deal and The Demon on epic casual, to make sure my glabrezu score becomes even.
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