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Thread: nerf train

  1. #1
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    Default nerf train

    Just read that the devs are going to look at Dire Charge and Frog because we all spoke up about Frog being > EIN after the current nerf. We all need to be super vocal against this.

    Nico

  2. #2

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nickodeamous View Post
    Just read that the devs are going to look at Dire Charge and Frog because we all spoke up about Frog being > EIN after the current nerf. We all need to be super vocal against this.

    Nico
    Truth be told, our plans for changes of that magnitude rarely have anything to do with anyone being vocal about anything.

    We have no current plans for any changes to Mass Frog.

    We have no currently-slated plans for changes to Dire Charge, though it's overpowered and has been for years. There may come a time in the future where we do change it, but it won't because of any discussion here.

    We talk internally about around 10x the number of changes that eventually turn into reality. Things that need to change for balance reasons, but that we don't immediately pull the trigger on for logistical or production reasons.
    Last edited by Steelstar; 06-05-2019 at 12:56 PM.
    We don't only build for the builds that exist.
    We don't only build for the builds that are good right now.

    The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Truth be told, our plans for changes of that magnitude rarely have anything to do with anyone being vocal about anything.

    We have no current plans for any changes to Mass Frog.

    We have no currently-slated plans for changes to Dire Charge, though it's overpowered and has been for years. There may come a time in the future where we do change it, but it won't because of any discussion here.

    We talk internally about around 10x the number of changes that eventually turn into reality. Things that need to change for balance reasons, but that we don't immediately pull the trigger on for logistical or production reasons.
    thanks for the response! It is much appreciated by i'm sure most of the monks out there.

    Nico

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Truth be told, our plans for changes of that magnitude rarely have anything to do with anyone being vocal about anything.
    I love seeing statements like this, truly, thank you. The forums are a great place for the community to voice concerns and ideas but it is always reassuring to be reminded that the true decision-making was not derived from forum activity. I feel much more confident (and excited) in DDO and its future when we get to see posts and activity from the developers talking about their goals, decision-making processes, and investigative research. Seeing your process is always cool (at least, I think so), but most importantly I think it shows that you are:
    A) listening to/watching what we post
    B) taking it "with a grain of salt"
    C) making decisions based on results of your own investigation

    Ultimately, I think that's the way it should be done. The voice of the community should be able to function as a voice of reason and a checks-and-balance system, but not necessarily drive real requirements. Developers are the only ones that can see the whole picture, and the user-base should be the controlled study.

  5. #5
    Community Member HouseAtreides's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    I definitely understand the EiN comparison to Frog from your end but on our end, when everyone says "yeah but Frog kills this many enemies at this cooldown and everyone uses it and it's the only reason this content is completable" it just makes me think "ugh, Frog is too good." Ideally, ED t6's (formerly known as Epic Moments) aren't directly comparable in power to the level 28 Epic Feats. Frog and Dire Charge are definitely overtuned, I'm sure we'll cross that bridge eventually,
    I mean, this was just posted so I don't know why you'd react so defensively to this post from OP
    AoK

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    Quote Originally Posted by HouseAtreides View Post
    I mean, this was just posted so I don't know why you'd react so defensively to this post from OP
    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    Yes. Eventually and now are different words. Eventually the sun will explode, but right now it's a pretty beautiful day Speaking pretty seriously, though, we have no plans to change Frog or Dire Charge. I'm sorry for giving you that impression.
    So, after I posted this, there was some back and forth with Lynnabel. see above for her response. looks like there are no plans to change Frog or Dire Charge. Just wanted to add this.

  7. #7
    Community Member HouseAtreides's Avatar
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    After blatantly saying that the abilities are OP and we will cross a bridge of nerfing them later the comments were walked back, you're correct.

    Not what i was referring to though. You were chastised for saying that any comments we make dont matter to them regarding nerfs, but them saying that us comparing the abilities of frog and EIN had them thinking of nerfing was literally posted and was the entire reason you said this in the first place lol.
    Last edited by HouseAtreides; 06-05-2019 at 04:30 PM.
    AoK

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    Quote Originally Posted by HouseAtreides View Post
    After blatantly saying that the abilities are OP and we will cross a bridge of nerfing them later the comments were walked back, you're correct.

    Not what i was referring to though. You were chastised for saying that any comments we make dont matter to them regarding nerfs, but them saying that us comparing the abilities of frog and EIN had them thinking of nerfing was literally posted and was the entire reason you said this in the first place lol.
    Yup, I think you are correct! I have to see how this plays out, but they keep saying it does matter, but what was said above contradicts this...

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Truth be told, our plans for changes of that magnitude rarely have anything to do with anyone being vocal about anything.

    We have no current plans for any changes to Mass Frog.

    We have no currently-slated plans for changes to Dire Charge, though it's overpowered and has been for years. There may come a time in the future where we do change it, but it won't because of any discussion here.

    We talk internally about around 10x the number of changes that eventually turn into reality. Things that need to change for balance reasons, but that we don't immediately pull the trigger on for logistical or production reasons.
    How you talk, can you give example?
    For example when you discuss Arcane destiny changes.

    Lets compare Magister epic moment. And Draconic epic moment. 20 seconds full immunity to spells for full party OR 30 PRR/MRR for youself. How you balance this things?
    Or +11 extra DC for Magister OR buffs to draconic SLA's which gets resisted/evaded since you dont have that +11 DC buff from magister.

  10. #10
    Uber Completionist kuzka111's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Truth be told, our plans for changes of that magnitude rarely have anything to do with anyone being vocal about anything.

    We have no current plans for any changes to Mass Frog.

    We have no currently-slated plans for changes to Dire Charge, though it's overpowered and has been for years. There may come a time in the future where we do change it, but it won't because of any discussion here.

    We talk internally about around 10x the number of changes that eventually turn into reality. Things that need to change for balance reasons, but that we don't immediately pull the trigger on for logistical or production reasons.

    from about 1 year now i see only melee nerfs:
    - now you say you should sooner or later nerf dire charge
    - nerf for combat brute
    - nerf for prowress set
    - nerfed power surge on fighter ( yes nerf i got max 6 power surge bc capston on kensai is just... 2nd power surge is not action boost so its dont get combat brute oh thats geting nerfed too )
    - you guys gived 25% hp boost for every melee exept fighter and pally that almost killed both class (pally was dead...)


    so i want to ask whats the point to playing Fighter or Pally? when you can get like 3-6 lvls of them and you get all that are is good on them... ( Pally is joke and yes i know you want to improve him but when i see what you do with melee im just afraid...)


    IMO:

    -Fighter should get new power surge more charge example base 6 , lvl18 +3 , lvl 20 +3
    2nd idea change power surge to 2 min duration
    3th (imo best ) 5 charge but like deadly insticts

    -Fighter heavy armor feats shoudl give prr/mrr + ac ( atm ac is too hard to get compere to dodge...)

    -Paladin how is it that fighter got heavy armor feats and pally dont pally is low on feats then give him feat that gives him prr/mrr/ac scaled with lvl of pally

    -THF suck now every1 know that ppl, so lots of ppl write this give them crit/vorpal/doublestrike on glancing blows

    -if you dont want wolfs to be overpowerd then stop glancing blows on wolf from or just make it Twf form ( imo that always was stupid how thf weapon transform in to paw's)

    - another thing is heavy armors how is that when you do items all armors get same prr... ac suck atm like i said you need to sacrefice lots of dps too get good ac (dodge is very easy to get)
    imo you should boost ac on armors or change amout of prr on armor how is it that outfit (clothing) give same dmg reduc that heavy armor... and dont tell me that heavey get more form bab bc its just nothing
    at otufit i can easy get 200+prr even when at heavy amror i get 250+ prr its only 1-2% more reduction.... bc of formula you invented


    to all haters:
    -yes i only melee
    -yes my fav is heavy amrorer with THF
    -yes im UBER/ULTIMATE complesionist and i so crapy player that im whining here (sarcasm xD)

    but to tell you the truth guys atm i paly less and less bc all build that i did are just **** and its not bc im geting old or just weak or somthing just this game started to hate melee's(fighter/pally)
    and i dont say that barb/monk/ranger are op they are just in way better spot now (barb should get some love too)


    btw i did thead about this half year ago and most ppl said i just panic

    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...ility-whining!
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