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  1. #1

    Default 2019 ED Pass: Arcane Sphere

    Hello! This is an early look at the Epic Destiny Pass currently slated for Update 43. (The second Sharn raid is coming before this, so there's still a bit of time before this reaches Lamannia). A few notes about this pass, before we get to details:

    We had a few primary goals in the Epic Destiny pass, compounded by a very slim time-frame of 3 weeks for principal changes.
    • First and foremost, try to put each Destiny in a place where it's worth using for at least some builds.
    • Fix bugs and remove things that hinder fun or usability
      • You'll notice that every Epic Moment that required you to do weird things to charge it up no longer requires that.

    • Improve the ability for people to play in Destinies that match their Archetype (ranged characters in Shiradi, etc) without significantly hindering the current ability for people to play in Destinies that don't (casters in Shiradi, etc)


    Like we said above, the timeframe was slim. We didn't hit everything we would have liked to, and there are still abilities within individual Destinies that still probably aren't worth taking. We're listening for feedback here, but our ability to act on it is similarly time-restricted; we're unlikely to further revamp whole trees or add completely new skills at this time, but we may be able to make number tweaks and fix outstanding bugs.

    That said, this is the thread for Arcane Sphere Destinies, so let's dive in. Be sure to check out the other Sphere threads when you're done, as well as the topic on new Epic Past Lives coming with these changes.

    Magister
    This tree has quite a few neat things but didn't do the one thing it was supposed to do: Be the king of DC Casting. Twisting Magister's bonuses and going into other trees where you got relevant Ability Score increases provided a better bonus than this tree. Only that's not fun, and we'd rather see dedicated DC casters live here and get cool abilities with their DCs. We focused on that goal, and made a few of their other abilities spicier to go with it. The Sigils still aren't good; they fell a bit low on the priority list relative to other things. If there are simple number tweaks we can make to make them more worth using, we're all ears.

    • Added +1 to all Spell DCs to each Core (in addition to what those cores were doing already).
    • Imperceptible Casting adds +10 Universal Spell Power while active.
    • Fade into the Weave adds +25 Universal Spell Power while active.
    • Variable Resistance is unlinked from Sigil of Energy Negation.
    • Master of (Spell School) also increases DCs for that school by an additional 1/2/3.
    • Arcane Tempest moves to a 30-second cooldown, and a 10-second duration. 30 SP.
    • Arcane Tempest is no longer linked to Sigil of Battering Spellcraft
    • Arcane Tempest now costs 1AP
    • Arcane Tempest can now use the Quicken, Maximize, Empower, and Intensify Metamagics
    • Arcane Tempest now has a faster cast animation and cast time
    • Arcane Tempest no longer has a (previously-unlisted) saving throw
    • Arcane Adept now costs 1AP
    • Removed the Saving Throw from Arcane Tempest. (Yeah, it's a DC tree but we wanted it to be good no matter what school you were in.)
    • Arcane Spellsurge now has a 1 minute cooldown. 20 SP
    • Nullmagic Aura no longer requires charging. Now has a 4 minute cooldown.


    Draconic Incarnation
    This is another tree that has good things but is hampered by its restrictiveness. It's meant to be the king of elemental nuking, but the lack of metas and scaling DCs made that hard. It also didn't get that much extra spell damage relative to other Destinies, which was... weird. We fixed a lot of that.

    • Each Core now adds 5% Spell Crit Damage in addition to what it already does.
    • Go Out With A Bang, Energy Burst, and Energy Vortex now apply the Quicken, Empower, Maximize, Embolden, and Intensify Metamagics
      • Acid versions of these spells are now Conjuration spells
      • These spells should now be considered part of their Elements for the purpose of Caster Level increases (other than Savant's caster level increases, which were already working).

    • Go Out with A Bang, Energy Burst, and Energy Vortex now use their spell schools' (Evocation/Conjuration) bonuses as part of their DC calculation.
    • Flyby Attack now adds Evocation modifiers to its DC (Conjuration for the Acid version).
    • Dragon Breath no longer uses Charges.
      • Dragon Breath now has a 25 second cooldown.
        • Dragon Breath spells are now considered part of their spell school for the purpose of Caster Level/Max Caster Level increases.
        • Breath attacks now list Evocation/Conjuration as part of their DC calculation (they were already using it)

    • Black Dragon Breath is now a Conjuration spell.
      • (See below for related Dragonborn changes)

    • Draconic Fury's cooldown reduced to 1 minute
    • Draconic Hunger's Temp HP and SP are now 10x your Epic level.
    • Fearsome Invulnerability no longer needs to be charged.
      • It no longer says it does an Intimidate effect, on account of that functionality never being implemented ever.
      • It now also adds +30 PRR, MRR, and MRR Cap for the duration
      • It now has a 4 minute cooldown.

    • Energy Vortex, Draconic Hunger, and Fearsome Invulnerability now cost 1AP each.



    BONUS: Dragonborn Racial Tree Changes
    Dragonborn's dragon breath SLAs have always kept some parity with Draconic Incarnation, so we made some changes there to gel with the above Draconic Incarnation changes.

    • Dragonborn's Racial Black Dragon Breath is also now a Conjuration spell
    • Dragonborn Breath Attacks now scale with 100% Spell Power (which puts them on the standard spell damage progression we made after this skill)
    • Dragonborn's True Power enhancement now adds Conjuration DCs in addition to its Evocation DCs.


    Fatesinger
    What a weird tree. Fatesinger had a lot of fundamental issues that could only be solved by getting rid of the abilities entirely. We basically threw a lot of it out and Lynnabel built a new one. Here it is. (Note that we're listing the full tree here rather than individual changes, it's clearer that way.) General rule of thumb: The Hymns cost 2AP, as do the standard Ability Score increases. The rest cost 1AP per rank.



    Cores:

    • Core 1: Fatesinger's Rep: Each core grants you +10 Melee Power, +4 Ranged Power, +25 Spell Points, 10 universal spell power, +1 Arcane Caster Level, +2 Effective Bard Levels and +2 Maximum Bard Songs. You also gain Inspire Courage if you didn't have it before.
    • Core 2: Glitter of Fame: +1 All Stats and all saves
    • Core 3: Harmonic Resonance: Attacks have a chance of building up Resonance on your enemies, increasing their Sonic vulnerability and reducing their Armor Class by 2 per stack (max 10)
    • Core 4: Intoxicating Presence: Enemies that strike you have a chance to be Fascinated.
    • Core 5: Grandeur: Friendly spellcasts bestow bonus AC (+3) and PRR (+3), offensive spellcasts now build up Harmonic Resonance (internal cooldown)
    • Core 6: Majesty: You are now immune to Charisma Damage, do not suffer from Arcane Spell Failure, also +25 Universal Spell Power


    Tier 1:

    • First Harmonic Chord: Your inspire courage has +1/2/3 hit, dam, saves vs fear, and +3/6/9 Universal spell power. Also, you gain an additional +1/2/3 to Hit, Damage, and +3/6/9 Universal Spell Power
    • Siren's Song: Relocated, turns into a second Fascinate button (aka another cooldown version of Enthrall)
    • Music of the Spider Queen: also now adds Neutralize Poison to your Bardic Inspiration
    • Dirge: Make it actually work and be good, otherwise no change
    • +1 Str/Cha


    Tier 2:

    • Second Harmonic Chord: Your inspire competence has an additional +1/2/3 skills. Also, you gain +1/2/3 all skills.
    • Bound Fate: relocated, no change (this is the active)
    • (this space intentionally left blank)
    • Reign: relocated, no change
    • +1 Str/Cha


    Tier 3:

    • Third Harmonic Chord: Your inspire greatness has an additional +1/2/3 PRR and 0/0/10 Healing/Neg/Repair amp. Also, you gain an additional +0/0/10 healing/neg/repair amp and +1/2/3 PRR
    • Grim Fate: relocated, no change (this is the passive that makes the active better)
    • Arcane Hymn: You sing a magical Hymn that resonates within the Arcane Sphere. When you activate this ability, your target is surrounded by magical energies, bestowing Resonance. (HYMNS: Each member of your party, including yourself, may only benefit from one Hymn at a time, regardless of source. Attempting to activate this ability on someone else will dispel this Hymn from your former target. If you attempt to activate a different Hymn on someone who is already benefiting from this Hymn, it will dispel this Hymn as it applies the new one. You may activate this ability on yourself.)
      • Arcane: +1 INT WIS CHA, +20 Universal SP, +2 Spell Penetration, +4 UMD, +10% fire/cold/acid/electric absorb

    • Aria: relocated, no change
    • +1 Str/Cha


    Tier 4:

    • Fourth Harmonic Chord: Your Inspire Heroics grants +1/2/3 AC, dodge, and saves. Also, you gain an additional +1/2/3 AC and saves
    • Martial Hymn:
      • Martial: +1 STR DEX WIS, +2 Sneak Dice, +20 max HP, +10 PRR and MRR, +5 AC, +10 Melee and Ranged Power

    • Divine Hymn: Another hymn, this time divine sphere themed
      • Divine: +1 STR CHA WIS, +1 Smite Evil, +2 to hit, dam, confirm critical hits, +10 PRR and +25 Positive and Negative Spell Power.

    • Primal Hymn: Another hymn, this time primal sphere themed
      • Primal: +1 WIS DEX CON, +25 HP, +10 Spell Resistance and healing amp, +10% Thrown and Bow attack speed, +3 Str while raging

    • +1 Str/Cha



    Tier 5:

    • The Fifth Chord: You have a new Bard Song in your Bardic Ballad/Inspire Courage - Inspire Transcendence - +1 spell DCs, +1 tactics bonuses, +3 Spell Resistance and True Seeing. Also, you benefit from +1 DCs, tactics, +3 SR and are immune to blindness and have true seeing
    • Free Metamagic: Pick between Eschew, Extend, or Enlarge
    • Masquerade: Also now has 10% spell cost reduction
    • Bladesong: 2d6 Sonic damage on hit scaling with spell power, 3% competence to melee attack speed, also +1 Critical Multiplier on 19-20
    • +1 Str/Cha


    Tier 6:

    • Greater Shout SLA: 6 second cooldown.
    • Free Metamagic 2: Pick between Quicken, Embolden, or Intensify
    • Turn of the Tide: Clean up what it actually gives you, make sure it's actually working as intended
    • +1 Str/Cha


    EDIT: Additionally, the following changes will be making it in for Fatesinger's existing abilities:
    Music of the Spider Queen's duration now matches Bard song durations
    Dirge's DC is now d20 + Perform
    Aria's threat reduction is now 20/40/60%
    Siren's Song and Chord of Disruption damage take effect even if the Mesmerize doesn't land (aka bosses)
    Bound Fate's DC is now d20 + Perform
    Bound Fate's immobilization now actually immobilizes faster creatures
    Bound Fate's immobilization now lasts slightly longer
    Bound Fate now has a 1 minute cooldown.
    Improved Turn of the Tide:
    - No longer a Bard Song
    - 3 minute cooldown
    - Sonic and Light Damage now applies to bosses
    Last edited by Steelstar; 06-03-2019 at 04:41 PM. Reason: added extra fatesinger notes
    We don't only build for the builds that exist.
    We don't only build for the builds that are good right now.

    The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.

  2. #2
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    Since Bards also support DEX and INT builds via Swashbuckler Different Tack, can we get 4 options, STR, DEX, INT, or CHA, for Fatesinger ability scores?

  3. #3
    Community Member btolson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post

    Fearsome Invulnerability no longer needs to be charged.
    • It no longer says it does an Intimidate effect, on account of that functionality never being implemented ever.
    • It now also adds +30 PRR, MRR, and MRR Cap for the duration
    • It now has a 4 minute cooldown.
    Can this ability's regenerate effect be described in the tooltip? How many HP/sec? is it positive healing?

  4. #4
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    No idea why you're spending so much effort on Arcane Tempest in Magistar. Magistar is an extremely AP starved tree as multiple abilities in the tree require 3 points to select and have 3 point pre-requisites. After putting your 12 AP into your prime stat (failure to do so is a loss of DCs), and after spending 2 more points on tier 1 skills which do nothing for your casting, to unlock tier 2 skills, you only have 10 AP left to work up to Master of (Spell School). Each rank requires 3 AP to max out, so you put 3 into Specialist, Augmentation, and Familiarity and...yea, you get to put 1 into Master of. You can put 2 into there if you only spend 2 into Familiarity, but you can never put 3 into that skill unless you give up main stat increases. So OK, to get Master of maxed, you clip 1 stat increase and pick up +2 DC in a single school at the expense of potentially 1 DC in all schools if your main stat is now an odd number. *You haven't taken any other ability in the entire tree!* No sigils, no tempest, no nullmagic anything. There aren't the APs for any of it, including spell penetration!

    Perhaps consider making the Specialist, Augmentation, Familiarity, and Master of lines be a single selection that costs 2 AP for full benefit, retaining the same pre-requisites. You could then go all the way up the tree, at least. You'd still only have two points left over for spell pen and you still couldn't take any of the flavor skills (sigils, nullmagics, tempest, etc), but it would be a bit easier to check almost all of the required boxes. Recall, I can get full DC benefit including full penetration from Exalted Angel today and still have points left over to take a big AoE heal (divine wrath), wings, and a very nice debuff for some flavor. It would be nice if Magistar could provide offer a little bit of flavor for those at which the tree is targeted (DC casters).
    Last edited by Zretch; 06-03-2019 at 01:46 PM.

  5. #5
    Community Member Arkbusya's Avatar
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    Default nice nice

    Nice job, Inquisitive scoundrel will become great (but only if bug with swashbucler are corrected)
    Ghallanda Server - Main toon Arkbusya (arti focused) - Guild "La griffe d emeraude"

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zretch View Post
    No idea why you're spending so much effort on Arcane Tempest in Magistar. Magistar is an extremely AP starved tree as multiple abilities in the tree require 3 points to select and have 3 point pre-requisites. After putting your 12 AP into your prime stat (failure to do so is a loss of DCs), and after spending 2 more points on tier 1 skills which do nothing for your casting, to unlock tier 2 skills, you only have 10 AP left to work up to Master of (Spell School). Each rank requires 3 AP to max out, so you put 3 into Specialist, Augmentation, and Familiarity and...yea, you get to put 1 into Master of. You can put 2 into there if you only spend 2 into Familiarity, but you can never put 3 into that skill unless you give up main stat increases. So OK, to get Master of maxed, you clip 1 stat increase and pick up +2 DC in a single school at the expense of potentially 1 DC in all schools if your main stat is now an odd number. *You haven't taken any other ability in the entire tree!* No sigils, no tempest, no nullmagic anything. There aren't the APs for any of it, including spell penetration!

    Perhaps consider making the Specialist, Augmentation, Familiarity, and Master of lines be a single selection that costs 2 AP for full benefit, retaining the same pre-requisites. You could then go all the way up the tree, at least. You'd still only have two points left over for spell pen and you still couldn't take any of the flavor skills (sigils, nullmagics, tempest, etc), but it would be a bit easier to check almost all of the required boxes. Recall, I can get full DC benefit including full penetration from Exalted Angel today and still have points left over to take a big AoE heal (divine wrath), wings, and a very nice debuff for some flavor. It would be nice if Magistar could provide offer a little bit of flavor for those at which the tree is targeted (DC casters).
    I'm not here to stop anyone from putting 100% of their points in DCs. I think it's boring, but that's not especially important. You do you.

    Arcane Tempest is there for those who want to drop big damage on stuff part-time.
    We don't only build for the builds that exist.
    We don't only build for the builds that are good right now.

    The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.

  7. #7
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    Added +1 to all Spell DCs to each Core (in addition to what those cores were doing already).
    Master of (Spell School) also increases DCs for that school by an additional 1/2/3.


    With the nerf to EA, this will cause a pendulum swing, not balance. DC casting is already the king of reaper runs, one CC+Necro caster can make R10 into epic casual once the numbers are met.

  8. #8
    Forum witchdoctor Hobgoblin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janave View Post
    Added +1 to all Spell DCs to each Core (in addition to what those cores were doing already).
    Master of (Spell School) also increases DCs for that school by an additional 1/2/3.


    With the nerf to EA, this will cause a pendulum swing, not balance. DC casting is already the king of reaper runs, one CC+Necro caster can make R10 into epic casual once the numbers are met.
    the only nerf to ea is reborn right? u still have the core dc boost from it? now we have more options for divines
    main toons: hauteur(silly caster) Sttomper (silly barbarian)-jammiee (Silly paladin)
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    Will the new fatesinger use the ballad even without bard levels? Or is it still the old version of inspire courage?

  10. #10
    Community Member Lonnbeimnech's Avatar
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    +5% spell crit seems like overkill and not too helpful

    I'm at 92% fire crit on my sorc right now on live, and it's not even a teifling, or maxed out for spell crits. putting him at 130% doesn't seem helpful.

    how about +1 on caster level and max caster level in there

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    Community Member thunir's Avatar
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    Default Core 4 and 5

    It looks like we got rid of the 10% mechanic off of Glitter of Fame. Thank you.
    I always felt the worst cop out was 4 and 5 tier guards on a build that will almost always stay displaced/ wear mostly light armor. Intoxicating Presence is worthless even if it did work.

    Also, Aria and Reign should have their buff time tied to bard songs. We were told this was going to happen, it never did , then their buff times were dropped in the song pass.

    Cores:

    Core 1: Fatesinger's Rep: Each core grants you +10 Melee Power, +4 Ranged Power, +25 Spell Points, 10 universal spell power, +1 Arcane Caster Level, +2 Effective Bard Levels and +2 Maximum Bard Songs. You also gain Inspire Courage if you didn't have it before.
    Core 2: Glitter of Fame: +1 All Stats and all saves
    Core 3: Harmonic Resonance: Attacks have a chance of building up Resonance on your enemies, increasing their Sonic vulnerability and reducing their Armor Class by 2 per stack (max 10)
    Core 4: Intoxicating Presence: Enemies that strike you have a chance to be Fascinated.
    Core 5: Grandeur: Friendly spellcasts bestow bonus AC (+3) and PRR (+3), offensive spellcasts now build up Harmonic Resonance (internal cooldown)
    Core 6: Majesty: You are now immune to Charisma Damage, do not suffer from Arcane Spell Failure, also +25 Universal Spell Power

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lonnbeimnech View Post
    +5% spell crit seems like overkill and not too helpful

    I'm at 92% fire crit on my sorc right now on live, and it's not even a teifling, or maxed out for spell crits. putting him at 130% doesn't seem helpful.
    I think you're talking about Spell Crit Chance.

    This bonus is Spell Crit Damage Multiplier.
    We don't only build for the builds that exist.
    We don't only build for the builds that are good right now.

    The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.

  13. #13
    Community Member Lonnbeimnech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    I think you're talking about Spell Crit Chance.

    This bonus is Spell Crit Damage Multiplier.
    ah, my mistake.

  14. #14
    Community Member ThomasHunter's Avatar
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    Default Reign

    I really enjoyed seeing the potential changes here! I am a bit sad that there is no change to Reign though as the duration was nerfed during the recent Bard tweak. Is there any way to make this last longer, especially if you have Bard songs already?

    I also think that I tried it on a non Bard melee recently (Reign), but once I ran out of my initial changes I never got them back (it was twisted in). Is this WAI? Sadly that would make it meaningless as a Twist.

    Thanks for reading!

    Adventurers For An Improved Reign
    Taleisin

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    Quote Originally Posted by ThomasHunter View Post
    Is there any way to make this last longer, especially if you have Bard songs already?
    I don't have a good way of making their durations scale, but they can definitely go up from 5 minutes (Aria too). What sounds good? 10 minutes? 15 minutes?
    100% radical, enthusiasm enthusiast.

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    Squirrel Enthusiast Lokeal_The_Flame's Avatar
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    Default Disappointing..........

    There is so much more you could do!

    Suggestions:

    1-Put in something that allows spellswords and runearms to scale based on someone's highest spell power and spell critical chance. For example if my repair spell power is my highest, my runearm will use that, or if my negative energy spellpower is highest, my spellswords will all use that! This will give melee artificers and Eldritch knights the Oomph they need!

    2-Since the twists reset every time you become a level 30, add something to each tree that activates at level 30 based on which Scion feat someone took!

  17. #17
    Community Member Rogue_Trapper's Avatar
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    Looks good! But, I would like to know the extent of what all the abilities in Fatesinger are. As I am to lazy to lookup what the currently do, the "relocated, no change" or "also now" are not cool.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    I'm not here to stop anyone from putting 100% of their points in DCs. I think it's boring, but that's not especially important. You do you.

    Arcane Tempest is there for those who want to drop big damage on stuff part-time.
    Personally I would like to see an epic moment that is actually useful and worth spending points for imo.
    Afunkymunky/Drkivorkian, Helter Skelter on Ghallanda

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  19. #19
    Community Member thunir's Avatar
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    Default Majesty looks great

    That being said intoxicating presence is horrible:

    Anything hitting you is not going to get fascinated, you are either attacking it directly or it’s getting hit with burst damage. It does nothing for you.

    The blinding guard of majesty at least worked, but again why give guards to builds that as largely trying to avoid getting hit.
    Last edited by thunir; 06-03-2019 at 03:07 PM.

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    Martial Hymn:
    Martial: +1 STR DEX WIS, +2 Sneak Dice, +20 max HP, +10 PRR and MRR, +5 AC, +10 Melee and Ranged Power

    Primal Hymn: Another hymn, this time primal sphere themed
    Primal: +1 WIS DEX CON, +25 HP, +10 Spell Resistance and healing amp, +10% Thrown and Bow attack speed, +3 Str while raging
    Could Martial also offer INT? Wis is only really a Martial stat for Monks+Falconry, but Int is a martial stat for Rogues, anything with Harper (incl. all xbows right now), EKs, Swashbucklers, etc.

    Also, while this change isnt the right place to address the overall shortcomings of bow archers...seems like a primal archer (or any bow build) would still greatly prefer the Martial hymn to 10% bow speed

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