Page 6 of 9 FirstFirst ... 23456789 LastLast
Results 101 to 120 of 167
  1. #101
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Posts
    565

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lagin View Post
    Reaper in itself is divisive.
    It's the same divisiveness as any other difficulty settings.

    This argument has been around since the beginning of the game. EE groups versus not. Having to have certain gear to be in certain groups, etc, etc, etc.

    Just play what is fun, challenging, and good for you. There have been massive discrepancies in player ability / character ability / gear since day 1.

    I came back and started mostly on H/E, now am mostly r1. Whatever - there have been people I've piked, people who've piked me, and people that were at the same speed. I've mostly had fun in all groups.

    The only way to have no divisiveness is to not have character progression - and then you don't have an MMO. You have an FPS where everyone starts the same every round.

    Man this argument is boring, and the only divisiveness is coming from players saying things are divisive.

  2. #102
    Community Member Maldorin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    355

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lagin View Post
    Reaper in itself is divisive.
    I think reaper was poorly designed and implemented.

    It narrows viable builds in an absurd way. It creates an even worse elitist snob environment than existed pre reaper. It is restrictive
    regarding over level penalties making grouping challenging.

    It's a mixed bag. It provides vets some added challenge but at a price to the overall health of the game. Meh. I've played for 8 months now after returning from a multi year break. I'm becoming bored again and Sharn doesn't really excited my interest. I'm probably done again. Not in an emotional rage quit kind of way but rather an apathetic disinterested shoulder shrug sort of way.

    And they really need to add some more quests and decent loot low to mid epic.

    I do think it would be funny if "reaper" in the end "killed" DDO.

  3. #103
    Community Member Maldorin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    355

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by boredGamer View Post
    It's the same divisiveness as any other difficulty settings.

    This argument has been around since the beginning of the game. EE groups versus not. Having to have certain gear to be in certain groups, etc, etc, etc.

    Just play what is fun, challenging, and good for you. There have been massive discrepancies in player ability / character ability / gear since day 1.

    I came back and started mostly on H/E, now am mostly r1. Whatever - there have been people I've piked, people who've piked me, and people that were at the same speed. I've mostly had fun in all groups.

    The only way to have no divisiveness is to not have character progression - and then you don't have an MMO. You have an FPS where everyone starts the same every round.

    Man this argument is boring, and the only divisiveness is coming from players saying things are divisive.
    I disagree with this. Divisiveness isn't an either or. It can be a little, a lot, a ton. Reaper created even more. And there was too much already.

  4. #104
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2017
    Posts
    565

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Maldorin View Post
    I disagree with this. Divisiveness isn't an either or. It can be a little, a lot, a ton. Reaper created even more. And there was too much already.
    Sure, and I said it's the same. I disagree there should be less - it won't cater to as many people. It's the same as the self-healing argument.

  5. #105
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    475

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    I don't want to, and don't intend, to get involved in this conversation or thread, but I feel it is important to make the distinction between "we won't balance the game around Reaper (difficulty)" and "we will never make necessary changes to Reaper infrastructure". I believe we do not largely "balance the game around reaper", but in the case of a quest that quickly becomes the "only" quest for Reaper XP, sometimes adjustments need to be made.
    I welcome your input as Community Manager into this discussion, even if I do not agree with your assessment. Personally, I think you (and other Devs) should be a little more proactive in these discussions.

    Regarding "balancing the game around Reaper": Adjustments need to be fully considered as to how they will impact most (if not all) players. Changes should not made haphazardly. This is why "balancing the game around reaper" becomes an issue. Too often the Devs have made changes based on higher levels of play and difficulty, irrespective of broader considerations (e.g., Epic Defensive Fighting, the nerf of the Monk Class core ability, recent changes to "Sealed in Amber"). This is what leads to the alienation of a large blocs of players, and so the loss of customers for SSG.

  6. #106
    Community Member
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    326

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    I don't want to, and don't intend, to get involved in this conversation or thread, but I feel it is important to make the distinction between "we won't balance the game around Reaper (difficulty)" and "we will never make necessary changes to Reaper infrastructure". I believe we do not largely "balance the game around reaper", but in the case of a quest that quickly becomes the "only" quest for Reaper XP, sometimes adjustments need to be made.
    They fear the up coming changes that the game desperately needs to balance reaper and add longevity to the player base, as well as an improve disposition that having plenty to do will create, because it will slows down the progression of ez power from reaper trees. Going forward a greater percentage will be playing r6-10 these changes must happen unless you want to give us r11-20 it's up to you, but people leave the game at both ends of the spectrum.

    The echo chamber this forum provides is an issue for the majority you need to reach out to the player base as a whole through the log-in screen letting them know about the forums, engaging them on things like Sharn while embracing short term pain for the entire player base, for long term success for the entire player base.

    Letting some classes have it all and most not is also shorting the time people will spend money on your salary, most will play the meta when it's 150% better and get bored sooner, again this is up to you short term or long you decide.

  7. #107
    Community Member redoubt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    6,320

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Alrik_Fassbauer View Post
    I did Haverdasher a few days ago in Reaper difficulty for the very first time. Why doesn't do anyone this quest ? It's Reaper difficulty, after all. It's what people want.
    Because reaper is not actually a difficulty level for challenge. It is a difficulty level for progression.

    As with the original epics which were only level 20, reaper was supposed to be for challenge. The first clock cycle after they put in better rewards of any kind, reaper failed as a challenge setting. This is why we see changes for the sake of reaper (which we were promised would not happen) affecting non-reaper in detrimental ways.
    Should a reaper see me? I think Death itself should have to make a spot check when I'm rolling up behind him. -- Krimsonrane

  8. #108
    Community Member redoubt's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    6,320

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    I don't want to, and don't intend, to get involved in this conversation or thread, but I feel it is important to make the distinction between "we won't balance the game around Reaper (difficulty)" and "we will never make necessary changes to Reaper infrastructure". I believe we do not largely "balance the game around reaper", but in the case of a quest that quickly becomes the "only" quest for Reaper XP, sometimes adjustments need to be made.
    1. Please elaborate on the necessary changes to reaper infrastructure and how they impact non-reaper. (I think most of the consternation is that this change hit non-reaper difficulty levels.)

    2. Amber was far from the only quest for reaper xp. I'm sure your stats show you that a small portion of the player base abused it. I can tell you that my guild runs ravenloft two ways. 1) start to finish for xp and saga. 2) repeats a specific quest when someone needs a loot item. I've never heard anyone say, hey, lets to run amber for reaper xp. I guess we should have. Since we are getting punished for what the other have done, we should change how we quest into the "loot early, loot often" or the "abuse it before they nerf it" modes?
    Should a reaper see me? I think Death itself should have to make a spot check when I'm rolling up behind him. -- Krimsonrane

  9. #109
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    479

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by redoubt View Post
    Because reaper is not actually a difficulty level for challenge. It is a difficulty level for progression.

    As with the original epics which were only level 20, reaper was supposed to be for challenge. The first clock cycle after they put in better rewards of any kind, reaper failed as a challenge setting. This is why we see changes for the sake of reaper (which we were promised would not happen) affecting non-reaper in detrimental ways.
    If reaper isn't a challenge then you aren't running it. In order for it to become anywhere near mundane you need a party full of fleshed out toons with appropriate past lives and geared and optimized to the teeth that are correctly playing their roles.

    Something tells me you aren't remotely close to that level.

  10. #110
    Community Member Alcides's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    602

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    I don't want to, and don't intend, to get involved in this conversation or thread, but I feel it is important to make the distinction between "we won't balance the game around Reaper (difficulty)" and "we will never make necessary changes to Reaper infrastructure". I believe we do not largely "balance the game around reaper", but in the case of a quest that quickly becomes the "only" quest for Reaper XP, sometimes adjustments need to be made.
    The problem with reaper is the lack of people who have decent tanks (not always required but definitely an enabling role for r7+). I spent 2 years of work and several otto's boxes due to my absence of several years in order to have a single reaper capable tank. Not all player's have the means or grit to do that. There needs to be some additional ways for players to get necessary past lives beyond just levelling since there is also a gear aspect to consider and all those things take time.

    There are probably about 5 to 10 reaper 10 capable tanks on Argonnessen that play regularly.

  11. #111
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2013
    Posts
    479

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Alcides View Post
    There are probably about 5 to 10 reaper 10 capable tanks on Argonnessen that play regularly.
    There's 2 on Thelanis.

  12. #112
    Community Member Maldorin's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
    Posts
    355

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by boredGamer View Post
    Sure, and I said it's the same. I disagree there should be less - it won't cater to as many people. It's the same as the self-healing argument.
    There also exists now a further division between low skulls, mid skulls, high skulls. I have friends with 60+ reaper points. They generally want to at least do R3-R5. There are power elite that want R9 or R10.

    You have alt players and busy people that stay around 1 or 2 skulls. Or maybe their build only functions in low skull.

    So it's like they took elite and divided that into two (reaper/elite) then divided reaper into generally low, mid and high skulls. Throw in TR trains and it's just silly sometimes trying to group.

    I am in a large guild. Last night for example there were about 50 players online in my guild. 1 was my same level (23). About 10 capped, about 10 or 12 low heroic. The rest scattered across the 30 level spectrum.

    Add to that trying to match preferred difficulty level with character level in order to group it's almost comical. I guess on the plus side my level 20 toons can be power leveled as a soul stone in someone's back pack in legendary R5 quests.

    I'm sure they'll get around to squashing that eventually.

  13. #113
    Community Member
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    326

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Emerge2012 View Post
    There's 2 on Thelanis.
    Quote Originally Posted by Alcides View Post
    The problem with reaper is the lack of people who have decent tanks (not always required but definitely an enabling role for r7+). I spent 2 years of work and several otto's boxes due to my absence of several years in order to have a single reaper capable tank. Not all player's have the means or grit to do that. There needs to be some additional ways for players to get necessary past lives beyond just levelling since there is also a gear aspect to consider and all those things take time.

    There are probably about 5 to 10 reaper 10 capable tanks on Argonnessen that play regularly.
    2 Birds with one fix ARMOR-UP2.0

    alternatively completely rework Stalwart Defender/Sacred Defender trees.

  14. #114
    Community Member SerPounce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    1,481

    Default

    People just love these "gotchas." Is the game "balanced around reaper" because mobs were added to one quest? Is a two year old out of context quote a blood oath? Reaper is part of the game so of course balance decisions are made in light reaper difficulty to some extent. Reaper difficulty has also turned out to be vastly more popular than the devs probably thought. If they thought 20% of people would use it, and in fact 95% of people do that's going to impact how it's weighted in balance decisions. There is a vastly higher proportion of people people on these forums that hate reaper and refuse to play it than in game. Not that there's anything wrong with disliking reaper, do whatever makes you happy, as long as you understand that other people are going to do their thing too which in many cases will involve making use of the 10 reaper difficulties.
    Last edited by SerPounce; 04-02-2019 at 01:56 PM.

  15. #115
    Community Member Vish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Too Stoned AZ
    Posts
    2,112

    Default

    Ya,
    You guys are right about divisiveness

    We should get rid of casual, normal, hard, and elite
    And just be reaper

    There, everybody playing together
    Fixed it for ya
    Vishantii (the bird man)
    Kil (heroic and epic completionist)

    Sarlona, Heart of Wisdom

  16. #116
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Wisconsin, birthplace of D&D
    Posts
    26,332

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Vish View Post
    Ya,
    You guys are right about divisiveness

    We should get rid of casual, normal, hard, and elite
    And just be reaper

    There, everybody playing together
    Fixed it for ya
    Yep, on day one of playing DDO let the brand new players (who get thrown under the bus in every thread now days it seems) get to the harbor with their starter gear and go into Dirks on R1 and see how that turns out, heh.

  17. #117
    Community Member SerPounce's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    1,481

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Yep, on day one of playing DDO let the brand new players (who get thrown under the bus in every thread now days it seems) get to the harbor with their starter gear and go into Dirks on R1 and see how that turns out, heh.
    Makes as much sense as forcing people with years of experience and accumulated power to play elite or lower.

    And who throws new players under the bus? It seems nothing is more sacrosanct on these forums than the vaunted new player. So much that whenever someone wants to argue for or against a change they haul out the "think of the newbs!" cry despite it rarely having anything to do with their real reasons. Case in point this thread: is it really fresh off the boat newbs that are going to be affected by more mobs on elite+ in a lvl 11 p2p quest? Hardly. But no one wants to admit they just want an easy farm.




  18. #118
    Community Member Vish's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Too Stoned AZ
    Posts
    2,112

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Yep, on day one of playing DDO let the brand new players (who get thrown under the bus in every thread now days it seems) get to the harbor with their starter gear and go into Dirks on R1 and see how that turns out, heh.
    Make better players out of them

    I run r1 harbor with no gear

    I bet those lfms be full tho
    Vishantii (the bird man)
    Kil (heroic and epic completionist)

    Sarlona, Heart of Wisdom

  19. #119
    Master Assassin nokowi's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    5,928

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    I don't want to, and don't intend, to get involved in this conversation or thread, but I feel it is important to make the distinction between "we won't balance the game around Reaper (difficulty)" and "we will never make necessary changes to Reaper infrastructure". I believe we do not largely "balance the game around reaper", but in the case of a quest that quickly becomes the "only" quest for Reaper XP, sometimes adjustments need to be made.
    The rational response is that we understand you will need to make changes within reaper as the game progresses, and for whatever reasons you deem necessary.

    The unpopularity of this decision has a couple different reasons, depending on who is affected.

    1. N/H/E Players

    SSG promised us they would not make changes based on reaper design. This doesn't mean you can't make changes, it means that decisions about reaper should nor be negatively impacting non-reaper, or at a minimum every effort is made to make change in light of what non reaper players enjoy. Your recent decisions seem to ignore this crowd entirely - and players have asked for some clarity on whether you will continue to ignore this crowd, or if you plan to live up to your promise when reaper was created.

    2. Reaper players that enjoyed this quest for what was unique

    Making the same group composition the meta for every quest is tiresome and boring. Halls full of mobs, etc. It doesn't slow down the meta much at all, but it ruins play for certain builds and groups. When you make a quest that is enjoyable to more builds, and then kill what was fun, it seems like a sub-optimal design decision. Players have offered numerous solutions that would handle your desire to limit RXP/time - the only goal you stated, which may be very telling to players concerned about player enjoyment and quality of play. The spiteful DM makes changes to limit players without any concern at all about player enjoyment. Please stop playing the role of the spiteful DM, and focus on quality of game play as you adjust rewards.

    3. Those that really took advantage of the RXP/time

    From your stated goal, this is the crowd your solution should have been targeted against, without affecting 1 and 2. Your solutions seem heavy handed and poorly thought out.



    There are also complaints about reaper in general, but these should probably be in their own thread.
    Last edited by nokowi; 04-02-2019 at 02:27 PM.
    It's much easier to demonize those providing feedback (whining, childish, bringing the forums down, etc) or minimize their voice (small number, vocal, etc) than to accept the fact that the agro/stealth system just missed the mark.
    A good company learns to listen to their customers.

  20. #120
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Wisconsin, birthplace of D&D
    Posts
    26,332

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by SerPounce View Post
    People just love these "gotchas." Is the game "balanced around reaper" because mobs were added to one quest? Is a two year old out of context quote a blood oath? Reaper is part of the game so of course balance decisions are made in light reaper difficulty to some extent. Reaper difficulty has also turned out to be vastly more popular than the devs probably thought. If they thought 20% of people would use it, and in fact 95% of people do that's going to impact how it's weighted in balance decisions. There is a vastly higher proportion of people people on these forums that hate reaper and refuse to play it than in game. Not that there's anything wrong with disliking reaper, do whatever makes you happy, as long as you understand that other people are going to do their thing too which in many cases will involve making use of the 10 reaper difficulties.
    If a company employee posted it, its regarded as an ironclad promise. I mean, look at how often the buzzwords from unrelated posts multiple years old get regurgitated into conversations on a whim as excuses for opposing good customer suggestions. Turning the search-fu up to 11, finding these and trotting them out seems to be the norm, but when understanding someones position requires some small modicum of homework on the issue, the search-fu doesnt even get turned on, much less turned up. The heavy leaning on buzz phrases takes over at that point, and anything that cannot be explained away gets demonized instead. Those pesky customers yelling and screaming about being told one thing and then given another. Cant possibly understand why that is. Dont they know the SpaghettiCode® doesnt allow for this MassiveUndertaking®?

Page 6 of 9 FirstFirst ... 23456789 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload