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  1. #1
    Community Member thebeast1985's Avatar
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    Default Could it be the right time to Stop the embargo on Dimension Door?

    I think that these days, we all had our share of adventures without it.
    I'm pretty sure that at least the 1% of this game population would agree with me.
    I know that loads of time it has been asked, but hey, this time could be the good one?

    Please, a clickie, a store that sells scrolls, it's time to stop this plague. it's time to start giving what we deserve.

    Dimension Door for everyone!

    Cheers!

  2. #2
    The Hatchery Enoach's Avatar
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    Dimension Door is an option that is used to avoid/bypass aspects of a quest.

    But in each situation where Dimension Door allows that avoidance/bypass it is still possible to complete using a different strategy.

    Also, Dimension Door does have a potential griefing issue. Spells like Grease can be funny to even down right problematic if used in certain situations, but don't have the potential of locking someone out. An example of this would be casting Dimension Door over a chest in a Raid that has a lockout mechanic. Sure this can be done now by a caster or dragon marked human, but making this more available would mean that scrolls/clicky are cheap and open to anyone being a @!ck.


    The problem I see with making this more available then it already is, is that it will make UMD even more of a "required" feature of every build. One thing I'm not in favor of is making any feature be it a Class, Feat, Enhancement or Gear something that is "required".

  3. #3
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enoach View Post


    The problem I see with making this more available then it already is, is that it will make UMD even more of a "required" feature of every build. One thing I'm not in favor of is making any feature be it a Class, Feat, Enhancement or Gear something that is "required".
    Devs are smart enough to set up the dungeons with resources in mind. 100s scrolls of resurrection and raise are far greater impact and they were here with us all along.

    UMD is hard to balance, it is either too good or not good. Right now its pretty good, if the restorative scrolls were rare, may even call it balanced.

  4. #4
    Community Member lyrecono's Avatar
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    UMD, like any other DC in the game works like that, it's either too good or useless, there is no middle ground.

    i would love to see umd scrolls return to the in game vendors but with the devs attempt to emulate EA, the best you can hope for is a ddo store bought 1 time use item, like a cake.

    A monkey's paw kinda deal with ssg.....
    Quote Originally Posted by FlimsyFirewood View Post
    I play a guy with a two-hander not just in this game, but in every game that has 'em.
    Quote Originally Posted by J-mann View Post
    Not to derail the thread, but then can you make 2hf NOT suck so much compared to 2wf or swf?
    Quote Originally Posted by FlimsyFirewood View Post
    8 pages in, that train has already sailed. The dead horse is canned into cat food by now.

  5. #5
    Community Member shores11's Avatar
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    Default No

    Quote Originally Posted by thebeast1985 View Post
    I think that these days, we all had our share of adventures without it.
    I'm pretty sure that at least the 1% of this game population would agree with me.
    I know that loads of time it has been asked, but hey, this time could be the good one?

    Please, a clickie, a store that sells scrolls, it's time to stop this plague. it's time to start giving what we deserve.

    Dimension Door for everyone!

    Cheers!
    A big ole NO.
    Fizban - Avatar of Khyber
    Guild Leader of Legends: Where adventurers are born & Legends live.

  6. #6
    Community Member shores11's Avatar
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    Default There is "Middle Ground"

    Quote Originally Posted by lyrecono View Post
    UMD, like any other DC in the game works like that, it's either too good or useless, there is no middle ground.

    Your comment of "there is no middle ground" is 100% not accurate or true. DDO (D&D by extension) is based on developing a skill and making a successful die roll or not, that is your middle ground. In the age of min/max many players try to eliminate the middle ground but it is always there.
    Fizban - Avatar of Khyber
    Guild Leader of Legends: Where adventurers are born & Legends live.

  7. #7
    The Hatchery Enoach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janave View Post
    Devs are smart enough to set up the dungeons with resources in mind. 100s scrolls of resurrection and raise are far greater impact and they were here with us all along.

    UMD is hard to balance, it is either too good or not good. Right now its pretty good, if the restorative scrolls were rare, may even call it balanced.
    Quote Originally Posted by lyrecono View Post
    UMD, like any other DC in the game works like that, it's either too good or useless, there is no middle ground.

    i would love to see umd scrolls return to the in game vendors but with the devs attempt to emulate EA, the best you can hope for is a ddo store bought 1 time use item, like a cake.

    A monkey's paw kinda deal with ssg.....
    UMD for Raise Dead is 36, Resurrection is 44. Heal is 40.
    Dimension Door is 32

    As you can see you don't need as high a UMD score to have a chance of success.

    Quote Originally Posted by shores11 View Post
    Your comment of "there is no middle ground" is 100% not accurate or true. DDO (D&D by extension) is based on developing a skill and making a successful die roll or not, that is your middle ground. In the age of min/max many players try to eliminate the middle ground but it is always there.
    I agree, there are middle grounds based on what your goal. IE if you are simply looking for Master's Touch for Tower Shield or as a Cleric Dwarf War Axe proficiency a UMD score of 10 gets you 50% chance.

  8. #8
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    I had not considered DCs, only unlimited vendor access.

    Restorative scrolls are several times more OP than DD. There are a few instances where DD is absolutely great, restoratives are useful in the toughest and most rewarding content.

  9. #9
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    In twelve years of play I have pulled around 30 scrolls of DD, plus bought a few from the AH. Have gotten six from daily dice rolls since that started. That has been more than enough when not being able to cast it myself: others have it, another option used, etc.

    Would not mind seeing them show up more often on the daily dice rolls (I'm looking at you, Holy Aura!), but the point about chest griefing is very well taken.

    Or they could certainly make a cool new item with one charge and a VERY long cooldown.

  10. #10
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    Additional ideas instead of adding it to the endless supply plat vendors:

    Mysterious Remnant Turn in for a high cost: eg: 100 Remnant per DD scroll.
    For elite and reaper dungeons add a diceroll eg d6 to scroll loots, so there is a chance to loot 1+d6 rare scrolls.
    Could be added to the anniversary event for party favors, and possibly to other events.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by janave View Post
    Additional ideas instead of adding it to the endless supply plat vendors:

    Mysterious Remnant Turn in for a high cost: eg: 100 Remnant per DD scroll.
    For elite and reaper dungeons add a diceroll eg d6 to scroll loots, so there is a chance to loot 1+d6 rare scrolls.
    Could be added to the anniversary event for party favors, and possibly to other events.
    100 Mysterious Remnants is not a high cost. People have tens of thousands of them banked, many have hundreds of thousands.

  12. #12
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    Exclamation Welcome to Scroll-Mart

    Sitting on 900+ scrolls of Dimension Door so I would be upset.

    If your on Khyber and willing to pay fine price I got what you need.
    Otto boxes.
    2m xp stones heroic or epic.
    4m epic stones.
    legendary slavers mats are welcome.
    shards too if your taking the hit on the 33% fees.
    I guess worthless plat but they are costly.

    10 legendary slaver mats (any) for 1 scroll. Or 1k for a stack of 100
    200k plat for 1 scroll. Or 4 million plat for 20 scrolls.
    Otto box for 200 scrolls.
    Otto stone for 150 scrolls.
    100 shards for 10 scrolls. So technically 6 shards each after fees.
    4m otto stone 250 scrolls.
    2,500 point code for100 scrolls.
    1,500 point code for 50 scrolls.

    Prices may seem off but it is what it is, supply and demand.

    EDIT: Also not selling them all for plat so dont even try it.
    Last edited by Qwerty-Keyboard; 03-18-2019 at 01:28 PM. Reason: Bottom disclaimer

  13. #13
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    I agree, I think adding DD scrolls would not really be a bad or harmful thing for the game.

    DD is at best a convenience, its not going to let you do anything you couldnt already do, as others have pointed out. Its like Teleport in that regard, and having Teleport scrolls on vendors hasnt created any horrible side effects.

    I dont think it devalues native DD classes because having DD is not going to push anyone into one class or the other - its just lagniappe. And the change would be a boost for native DD classes too, since they could scroll DD instead of having to slot it - again, just like Teleport and other convenience spells, and probably Raise Dead too. Plus, slotting DD means you can Quicken it, so native casters still have better ability to use it as an escape-pod in combat.

    And I dont think it overvalues UMD anymore than it already is. Right now its already pretty much de facto required - or if not required, its at least so much more useful than any other skill that there's no good reason NOT to take it. But adding DD to the list of UMD scrolls isnt going to change how anyone approaches it...if you're not taking it for Raise Dead, Teleport, Greater Heroism, Heal, etc. then you're not taking it for DD either.

    Plus, if they do introduce DD scrolls to vendors, they can set the price high enough that DD becomes a plat sink (not high enough to discourage you, but high enough that its not a completely trivial cost), which the game definitely needs more of. It would be an ideal plat sink, because again, its a pure convenience and infers no material advantage to your actual stats and efficacy.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by MaeveTuohy View Post
    100 Mysterious Remnants is not a high cost. People have tens of thousands of them banked, many have hundreds of thousands.
    That's a bad argument because that represents years of buildup. Basing prices on that excludes new players that dont have those kind of backlogs of remnants. Pricing should be based on the assumption that a player starts with zero and earns as they go...so based on the rate of how fast you can earn them, not an assumption that you already have 100,000 saved up to spend.

    The backlog issue should be addressed with other means, like introducing special event items to spend them on, at exorbitant prices (like Champ Hunter week). Big one-time purchases that arent really a good value (with the logic that "there's nothing better to spend them on anyway"), not a de facto tax on regular consumable purchases to try and draw them down over time.

  15. #15
    Founder & Super Hero Arkat's Avatar
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    The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left. - Ecclesiastes 10:2 (NIV)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lynnabel View Post
    Hi Welcome

  16. #16
    Bwest Fwiends Memnir's Avatar
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    “Too much of anything is bad, but too much good whiskey is barely enough.” ~ Mark Twain

    .56773.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    That's a bad argument because that represents years of buildup. Basing prices on that excludes new players that dont have those kind of backlogs of remnants. Pricing should be based on the assumption that a player starts with zero and earns as they go...so based on the rate of how fast you can earn them, not an assumption that you already have 100,000 saved up to spend.
    Mysterious Remnants are easly farmmable. All it takes is a character close to lvl 18, not over, that can survive through the first wave of Devil's Assault. Include the build as a Warlock and even easier. Start quest on elite, complete first wave, getting rem's from the champs and the numerous champ chests that will spawn. At the end of first wave, recall out, reset, start it all over again.

    So, no. 100 remnants is not a large amount.

    And funny enough, if you could buy the DD scrolls with remnants, that would make the recalling out of the quest easier for a toon with UMD that didn't have the DD spell in the first place.

  18. #18
    Drow Machine Gunner Vasandralov's Avatar
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    The level 11 fighter hireling has Dimension Door as a dragon-mark. Park it at the entrance then click follow and cast when needed. Perfect is the enemy of good enough.

  19. #19
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    To compare Dimension Door Scrolls and Teleport Scrolls is like comparing Kobe Beef to Salad.
    Hush you vegetarians your eating my foods food and that offends me.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    That's a bad argument because that represents years of buildup. Basing prices on that excludes new players that dont have those kind of backlogs of remnants. Pricing should be based on the assumption that a player starts with zero and earns as they go...so based on the rate of how fast you can earn them, not an assumption that you already have 100,000 saved up to spend.

    The backlog issue should be addressed with other means, like introducing special event items to spend them on, at exorbitant prices (like Champ Hunter week). Big one-time purchases that arent really a good value (with the logic that "there's nothing better to spend them on anyway"), not a de facto tax on regular consumable purchases to try and draw them down over time.

    It was only an argument that 100 represented a high cost. It isn't. New players can earn those at an affordable rate and long term players would be able to afford 100 scroll stacks. If you want to make it expensive in remnants, it would need to be a lot more than 100.

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