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  1. #1
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    Default PVP needs REWARDS

    There is no rewards for PVP in this game besides eprops and generally negative karma and reputation. You should be rewarded for killing other players, just saying. But Standing Stone Games appears to be in the business of selling bunny ears instead of making PVP exciting and rewarding. The original DDO designers did intend to enable PVP in this game otherwise there wouldn't be the tavern brawl and PVP arenas.

    Put PVP balance to the side for a moment and think about the PVP rewards SSG should be adding to the game. Should they be purely cosmetic or should they be stuff like tomes, XP, items/gear/skills you can also use in PVE etc.

  2. #2
    Founder & Hero cdbd3rd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Politician View Post
    There is no rewards for PVP ....
    WAI.

    And since you're here in the protected zone, I will simply remind you of your own words thrown at another forumite just a bit ago...

    Quote Originally Posted by Politician View Post
    Quit spamming the forums with your attention-seeking topics.
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  3. #3
    Community Member psykopeta's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Politician View Post
    . But Standing Stone Games appears to be in the business of selling bunny ears instead of making PVP exciting and rewarding. The original DDO designers did intend to enable PVP in this game otherwise there wouldn't be the tavern brawl and PVP arenas.
    not sure if u knew it but... oh surprise! SSG is just a new brand name for Turbine, so no, the didn't intend to enable PVP, it just happens that when DDO was released there were more players, so the chance of having ppl with e-peen complex was higher, that's why they put the tavern brawl and pvp arenas

    just a tiny example, what cordovan posted in 2016 to explain what was happening cause ppl could think weird things

    "The Lord of the Rings Online and Dungeons & Dragons Online have been acquired by Standing Stone Games, a newly-formed independent game studio made up of the same groups that have been working on LOTRO and DDO for years." <---- that's why you would go to turbine support pages... til today? or did they finally "fixed" it? XD

    i think that you may have that part and well... if u check the original game... well, in a game u're supposed to play with ppl around you, saying something like "hey let's make a pvp tournament" would prolly qualify for the farwin awards of history, not year, you would directly jump to history
    psykopeta is finally baconpletionist because there isn't anything to delay it more - thelanis, where the gimps claim to be pros and noobs claim to be pros, no newbies allowed(unless they claim to be pros), we have enough drama w/o them. PS: I post only in the latest thread shown in main page, in the weird case u want something from me, feel free to send pm

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Politician View Post
    Put PVP balance to the side for a moment and think about the PvP rewards SSG should be adding to the game. Should they be purely cosmetic or should they be stuff like tomes, XP, items/gear/skills you can also use in PVE etc.
    If* rewards are ever put in for PVP, they should be purely cosmetic. Make them unique and awesome looking, sure... but nothing that will ever impact the PvE part of the game.

    *IMHO, no rewards of any type, cosmetic or no, are needed or required. PvP is fine as-is: an afterthought of an afterthought.


    Edit: As for the "original DDO designers intended there to be PvP". No. No, they didn't. They argued against it all through the closed beta. They only bowed to player pressure around update 3 or 4, after many players said DDO would die a quick death if it didn't have PvP because WoW did. So, they added the pits. They added Death Match and Capture the Flag a few years after.
    But, as far as the original vision of DDO goes - PvP wasn't in it.
    Last edited by Memnir; 02-07-2019 at 05:41 PM.
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  5. #5
    Community Member lyrecono's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Politician View Post
    There is no rewards for PVP in this game besides eprops and generally negative karma and reputation. You should be rewarded for killing other players, just saying. But Standing Stone Games appears to be in the business of selling bunny ears instead of making PVP exciting and rewarding. The original DDO designers did intend to enable PVP in this game otherwise there wouldn't be the tavern brawl and PVP arenas.

    Put PVP balance to the side for a moment and think about the PVP rewards SSG should be adding to the game. Should they be purely cosmetic or should they be stuff like tomes, XP, items/gear/skills you can also use in PVE etc.
    pvp in a cooperative class based pve game?

    So, a Darwin award then?
    Quote Originally Posted by FlimsyFirewood View Post
    I play a guy with a two-hander not just in this game, but in every game that has 'em.
    Quote Originally Posted by J-mann View Post
    Not to derail the thread, but then can you make 2hf NOT suck so much compared to 2wf or swf?
    Quote Originally Posted by FlimsyFirewood View Post
    8 pages in, that train has already sailed. The dead horse is canned into cat food by now.

  6. #6
    Community Member Ripjaw7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lyrecono View Post
    pvp in a cooperative class based pve game?

    So, a Darwin award then?
    I agree,

    Pvp in a game where people work together is not the best. It would make the came too competitive and nobody would want to help one another achieve their goals. Many people would be getting upset and some people will take it too far...

    My fellow friends and guildies use the PvP areas to test our characters and abilities on one another to see what we could improve on.


    I do not believe that SSG will develop more into PvP because they are trying to get people together, not split them apart. Many pvp games are competitive, and do not have the "quest" structure of DDO. I think that nobody would use the PvP reward system if it came out anyway. Since Sharn is coming to DDO very soon (or already has), many people will be learning that.

    So, to sum that all up: PvP should not be a thing in DDO, as it will become too competitive. DDO is a "players versus computer", not a Player versus Player".
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  7. #7
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    Go play another game.
    Just awestruck, wether it be a Dragon flying overhead Stormreach, that glowing character who just zoomed in'n'out of the Pub, or that i can drink a Beholder under the table and best of all rescuing Damsels in distress.

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  8. #8
    Community Member Ralmeth's Avatar
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    No.
    1) This could easily be abused by just killing a dual boxed character over and over.
    2) The developers need to spend time on those efforts that give them the best return on their time invested. As few people PvP it doesn't make business sense for them to spend any time on PvP.

    Having said that, why can't you organize your own PvP tournament if that's your thing that includes a player provided award? For example, everyone could put in an item that goes to the winner.
    The best part of the 10th Anniversary of DDO...the description on the Oatmeal Raisin Kookie,
    "From a distance you thought this was a chocolate chip kookie. Now you're sad."

  9. #9
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    But - but - PvP is its own reward.... or at least that's what I hear from gankers.

    Plenty of PvP games - it didn't work for DDO - being a cooperative play game and all - lets keep it that way.

    Nothing stopping PvP minded people from gathering in the taverns and one-shotting each other till their hearts content or from organizing your own events and rewards.

    Or from going to other games that cater to your playstyle - for that matter.

    Can we please put this nonsense and failed ddo experiment to rest?

  10. #10
    Community Member awar1234's Avatar
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    Default No

    No. PVP brings out the worst in human behavior

  11. #11
    Community Member banjo174's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Politician View Post
    The original DDO designers did intend to enable PVP in this game otherwise there wouldn't be the tavern brawl and PVP arenas.
    There is PvP in Diablo 3... Do people do it..? No... Many games have PvP as an option, but that doesn't mean that is the main focus of the game. Its just there for a quick laugh, then back to actually playing the game. Although I do wish that DDO could introduce a fair PvP aspect. But it is simply not possible with the amount of power creep needed for PvE. Just look at all of the PvE games with huge amounts of power creep.

    Diablo 3, Path of exile, Warframe. All of these games have PvP, but it is a joke, just because of the amount of power creep. You poke someone, and they fall over dead. Its basically a competition of who can poke who the fastest. That is what DDO has become, and that is why PvP is totally dead now.


    Funny note: Someone that I killed in the wayward, still has me on his ignore list to this day. I dunno, I guess he didn't like me killing him in a PvP zone.
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  12. #12
    Community Member HungarianRhapsody's Avatar
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    If Turbine/SSG ever do put award's into PVP that have a benefit in games you know that people will immediately start farming that rather than simply playing PVP because they enjoy it. And they won't be farming it against other players will be forming it against accounts that they create specifically to beat for PVP rewards.

    Edit - awards, not Wards
    Last edited by HungarianRhapsody; 04-04-2019 at 04:48 PM.
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  13. #13
    Community Member lyrecono's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HungarianRhapsody View Post
    If Turbine/SSG ever do put award's into PVP that have a benefit in games you know that people will immediately start farming that rather than simply playing PVP because they enjoy it. And they won't be farming it against other players will be forming it against accounts that they create specifically to beat for PVP rewards.

    Edit - awards, not Wards
    Yeah, kinda like they look for the path of least ressistance by farming easy reaper quests with optimised reaper farming buids, not for the challenge but for the power it brings in the reaper trees.

    There was another game that gave great power in pvp gear (other endgame gear was not obtaineble because of the rarety of endgame drops and critical crafting procs) so the only currency was pvp points, wich you gained by pvp kills and lost by dieing in pvp, so the only reliable way for years was to kill weaker toons from opposing factions (wich was easy because the entire game was open to pvp without level restrictions).
    People also started pvp builds only, not pve ready builds (shortage of viable tanks, healers, etc), simular to ddo.
    It killed the game because if a new player unknowingly joined a server dominated by the other faction, he or she would get stuck around lv 30 (a sweet spot for pvp exp), constantly getting killed before reaching decent xp instances (85+% of the exp and ingredient farming was done on large open world maps where getting killed by a well hidden rogue was happening every few minutes.
    People left in droves and the devs have a third of the western servers running.
    Quote Originally Posted by FlimsyFirewood View Post
    I play a guy with a two-hander not just in this game, but in every game that has 'em.
    Quote Originally Posted by J-mann View Post
    Not to derail the thread, but then can you make 2hf NOT suck so much compared to 2wf or swf?
    Quote Originally Posted by FlimsyFirewood View Post
    8 pages in, that train has already sailed. The dead horse is canned into cat food by now.

  14. #14
    Community Member Yokido's Avatar
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    I think SSG / DDO Players as a whole might be able to wrap their head around a pvp system that doesn't use your actual character, but a "pvp-only" character with limited customization. Perhaps something involving guild airships?

    If this were the case it would largely equalize players based on level etc, making it so even the most advanced players/guilds can only achieve minute bonuses to effect the pvp battle. I would also believe a unique bonus/reward could be granted to the victor (and a consolation for the loser) if a design like the above was created.

    The main obstacle(s) would be worth vs cost, and difficulty to code (which might be rather simple, such as a temporary but complete deactivation of all equipment/stats/feats/EDs/buffs/spells/abilities/etcetc to be replaced by whatever minute augmentation is allowed for the pvp battle, such as keeping use of a single item slot)

    Another potential obstacle, as pointed out by an above poster, would be redirecting too much traffic from the pve aspect of the game towards the pvp aspect of the game if a reward is involved. Make the reward relatively easy to get, yet enticing and non-stackable, like the Bottomless flask of Rum. New items can then be added in periodically (or dare I say, temporarily, for the seasonals) to retain player interest at Dev discretion.
    Last edited by Yokido; 06-04-2019 at 05:10 AM.

  15. #15
    Community Member HungarianRhapsody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Politician View Post
    There is no rewards for PVP in this game besides eprops and generally negative karma and reputation. You should be rewarded for killing other players, just saying. But Standing Stone Games appears to be in the business of selling bunny ears instead of making PVP exciting and rewarding. The original DDO designers did intend to enable PVP in this game otherwise there wouldn't be the tavern brawl and PVP arenas.

    Put PVP balance to the side for a moment and think about the PVP rewards SSG should be adding to the game. Should they be purely cosmetic or should they be stuff like tomes, XP, items/gear/skills you can also use in PVE etc.
    If PvP rewards are ever added to DDO, it will be important for them to not be usable in PvE. We don't need another grind on top of Reaper XP, Heroic Past Lives, Racial Past Lives, Reaper XP, Epic Past Lives, More Epic Past Lives, S/S/S that drop so infrequently that we might as well not have some of them, and Reaper XP.
    No one in the world ever gets what they want
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  16. #16
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    If there ever was to be competition among players for cosmetics, I'd make it group-based cosmetic based on how well the group accomplishes certain game activities.

    A leaderboard for the fastest completion of certain raids, lowest death count, detailed statistics and names of the people that accomplished such a feat.

    The game is NOT balanced around PvP. The only way to have players compete is by making them compete in the actual content.

  17. #17
    Community Member Alrik_Fassbauer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by awar1234 View Post
    No. PVP brings out the worst in human behavior
    This is my personal opinion as well.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Politician View Post
    There is no rewards for PVP in this game besides eprops and generally negative karma and reputation.

    So if you're properly getting your negative reputation and karma, all is working as it should.

    Quote Originally Posted by Politician View Post
    You should be rewarded for killing other players
    Most places, if you kill a player, you're "rewarded" with a prison sentence.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    As a general rule we don't intend for a single spawn area to cause any dungeon alert, and certainly not red dungeon alert. This basically isn't ever a goal in our designs

  19. #19
    Community Member Orratti's Avatar
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    If it was an exciting fight between two well matched opponents then winning is your reward. If it was just you owning people any reward you deserved you wouldn't want.

  20. #20
    Community Member Bolo_Grubb's Avatar
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    Devs please do NOT waste time on PVP
    Kill'em all and let their favorite deity sort'em out
    BoloGrubb / DJGrubb / Gijo

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