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Thread: Reaper LHoX

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zites View Post
    I have the fix for you takeoff all your gear reset your reaper points to zero don't play meta builds so no more monk no more uber completionest cc/instakill casters no more assassin's no more tempest. If that don't work for you just try rolling a brand new character and I mean the whole guild not just one or two people and see how easy R10 is. If all else fails we can all go outside and play ha ha ha Ha ha ha.....
    Ok, you're one of those. R10 should be balanced around the uberpletionists with all the gear and past lives one could hope to obtain. Telling folks to do naked runs, run sub-optimal builds and roll up a new character are all really dumb arguments. Unfortunately, there are many people like you that feel it is our job, not SSGs, to create a challenging gaming experience - despite the fact that most quests and raids offer 14 difficulty selections ranging from Casual through R10.

    Naturally, due to power creep over time and player experience over time, the playerbase will be capable of completing higher and higher difficulties. Eventually, the only choices will be to acknowledge that vets can complete R10 content, or revamp the entire system again - most obviously by expanding the Skull levels from R1-10 to R1-20 or something.

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xanthrawl View Post
    Ok, you're one of those. R10 should be balanced around the uberpletionists with all the gear and past lives one could hope to obtain. Telling folks to do naked runs, run sub-optimal builds and roll up a new character are all really dumb arguments. Unfortunately, there are many people like you that feel it is our job, not SSGs, to create a challenging gaming experience - despite the fact that most quests and raids offer 14 difficulty selections ranging from Casual through R10.
    FWIW I actually do have a first life character to run reaper on. When we ran the new quest yesterday my main was in a reincarnation so i brought my 0PL alt. Although yea there were characters with numerous PL and whatnot, I actually do like running my first lifer in reaper, it’s quite fun.
    Afunkymunky/Drkivorkian, Helter Skelter on Ghallanda

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  3. #23
    Community Member Dreppo's Avatar
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    The real problem here, which was pointed out by the OP, is charm mechanics in reaper. A charmed mob is as good as several teammates. This is an imbalance that affects not just HoX, but any reaper quest.

    The very obvious solution is apply the same adjustments to charmed mobs that players get. Similarly hires, pets, and summons. Simple rule: If they're working for our side, they get the same adjustments we do.

    Mind you this would make HoX close to impossible to complete on R10, due to the raid's unique design, but it's fine to have a challenge for those that want it. And they could actually compensate for this in HoX by bringing X'yzzy's stats down, since they know exactly what will be beating on her (charmed dogs).

  4. #24
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dreppo View Post
    The real problem here, which was pointed out by the OP, is charm mechanics in reaper. A charmed mob is as good as several teammates. This is an imbalance that affects not just HoX, but any reaper quest.

    The very obvious solution is apply the same adjustments to charmed mobs that players get. Similarly hires, pets, and summons. Simple rule: If they're working for our side, they get the same adjustments we do.

    Mind you this would make HoX close to impossible to complete on R10, due to the raid's unique design, but it's fine to have a challenge for those that want it. And they could actually compensate for this in HoX by bringing X'yzzy's stats down, since they know exactly what will be beating on her (charmed dogs).

    you are mixing HOX mechanics with other stuff which is nonsensical.

    Hound is based on charming the puppies and buffing them to defeat xzzzzzzy.
    Players were tailoring their builds and epic destinies and past lives for the specific purpose to optimize charms and damage by charmed puppies.
    The players that made the effort to specialize their builds effectively making them inferior in pretty much every other content without resetting enhancement trees and epic destinies.
    With co-ordination and practice they kept bumping the reaper bar to get ideal completions assuming everyone came together effectively.

    ..and their reward.. fu players.. remove reaper from HOX..
    Turning this into a non-reaper just invalidates the whole reason to take the charm/pet buff lines for endgame players.
    They have effectively screwed HOX out of playability for the players that put the effort into playing the higher difficulty content and made the pet/summons/charm lines pointless.

    So what happens now.. players respec out of the charm lines and stop running HOX..

    They are not adjusting the raid mechanics to make it easier for pugs.. they just removed Reaper from HOX effectively killing the reason for a significant portion of the player base to run it.
    Jotmon -
    Guild: Degenerate Matter - 200
    Argo-Jotmon(HC 28/42,EC 26/36,IC 17/15,RC 14/30), Jotlock(HC 38/42,EC 36/36,IC 15/15, RC 0/30)..
    and several once viable raiding alts dumped into the packmule stables..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Too bad I 'purchased' maximum character slots for my account, SSG has now chosen to cater the giveaway perks to benefit multiple freebie accounts instead of the paying customers.

  5. #25
    Community Member Shadow_Jumper's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JOTMON View Post
    They have effectively screwed HOX out of playability for the players that put the effort into playing the higher difficulty content and made the pet/summons/charm lines pointless.
    Charms are still extremely effective, not just in LHoX. If you charm the soldiers in Night Market correctly they will kill the boss in approx. 5-10 seconds with no other player input.

  6. #26
    Community Member Epicstorms's Avatar
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    Oh come on, really.

    You closed reaper HoX because it was too easy because of charmed mobs? Too high RXP/min? Seriously?

    It was actually fun to run that once in a while, but because you can't handle a fix (This has been around for many months / years by now), you close it entirely? Sorry, but what a poor decision.

    If you're concerned about RXP/min, fix Amber already.
    What's that? You fixed amber already?
    Hah, no you didn't.

  7. #27
    Community Member Strambotica's Avatar
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    rpx/min is a real joke.

    first 10 - 30 min to fill the raid + go in 3 min fail + recall rebuff (5 min) + go in 3 min fail + recall rebuff (5 min) + refill people who drops 5min + go in 6 min complete the raid.
    (and is for a party from big guilds, add more fails to a pug)

    yeah.... super rpx/min.

    that being said, ALL the high reaper FIRST time its a lot of exp. So can't understand the real problem with this one quest, that actually its a raid... so really good first time bonus, and ok exp every 3 days.


    (Sorry, if being a bit redundant... im just angry :P )

    Edit: and for those talking about Amber: remember that for that quest you need to go in fishing for the good card and the good password, if it not. Recall redo.
    Last edited by Strambotica; 12-06-2018 at 07:27 PM.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Epicstorms View Post
    Oh come on, really.

    You closed reaper HoX because it was too easy because of charmed mobs? Too high RXP/min? Seriously?

    It was actually fun to run that once in a while, but because you can't handle a fix (This has been around for many months / years by now), you close it entirely? Sorry, but what a poor decision.

    If you're concerned about RXP/min, fix Amber already.
    What's that? You fixed amber already?
    Hah, no you didn't.
    I agree they should just nerf charms and CC's 50% make Reapers immune to it and leave LHoX and Amber alone. Those in the know, know why they don't nerf charms and CC's don't we.
    Don't act like they don't try to dissuade you from running things in a way that they see as cheesy. BTW they know about amber your hilarious they designed the quest.

  9. #29
    Community Member Strambotica's Avatar
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    btw... the charms its already nerf on reaper. in R10 a Charm or even a Web last only 6 sec. yeap... 6 sec.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strambotica View Post
    btw... the charms its already nerf on reaper. in R10 a Charm or even a Web last only 6 sec. yeap... 6 sec.
    lets cut it down to 3 sec. yep 3 sec.

  11. #31
    Community Member FuryFlash's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zretch View Post
    LHoX completion time is gated by the amount of damage the puppies put out relative to Xyzzy's health. On hard, the pups can take Xyzzy to vulnerable without needing to collect more stones, but still it takes more five minutes. On elite, it takes another round of stones, so it's far more than 5 minutes for a completion as it seems like the respawns of the mind flayers are on a timer. The only way to make the raid go faster is if the pups start hitting harder wile Xyzzy's overall hitpoints stays stagnant. Guess what reaper does....

    So now there's no reaper, and the entire foundation over having **** drop rates blows up.

    It really shouldn't matter how long it takes to complete the raid, as long as it requires the same level of teamwork, coordination, gearing, or whatever gating metric you want to use. The reality is that any raid can be completed at most 1 time per 3 days for no real dollars spent, and at most 8 times in 7 days for loot before you hit chest ransack. If your group/guild is looking to ransack a raid, whether the raid takes 5 minutes or 45 minutes, you can manage to get 1 completion done in 3 days, or 8 completions done in 7 days (if you're willing to buy timers).
    Nice detailed explanation of my point in the earlier post. I also agree with your general analysis, that these runes should not be balanced so heavily around the completion times, since these are already balanced by raid timers.

  12. #32
    Community Member mr420247's Avatar
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    Sucks hard but ya it was coming

    Casters can't do anything but nanny bot sevs game
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  13. #33
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow_Jumper View Post
    Charms are still extremely effective, not just in LHoX. If you charm the soldiers in Night Market correctly they will kill the boss in approx. 5-10 seconds with no other player input.
    too many whiners are crabs in the pot.. cant be happy about players/builds rising to the top and performing well..., instead they focus their efforts on complaints until nerfs pull them down.

    people are crying in the forums that its easy to charm but they are not the players that have built effective toons to play this role.
    They are spectators... all they see is someone else doing well instead of building comparable useful toons.

    sure, charms can be effective.. but it takes heavy investment to hit the effective benchmarks and focussed spamming successful charms to keep the mob under control while limiting the charmer from effectively contributing anything else.

    many other builds can be effective when built well..
    brute force DPs is still desirable, insta-kills, fury shotters, assassins, froggers, etc.. even tanks are desired in todays game but they still take investment to be decent.


    Screwing over content doesn't help the game, nerfing stuff just pushes players to adapt to something else that works..
    Removing raids from Reaper .. that's not good for anyone.


    Whiner crabs are still whiner crabs...
    Jotmon -
    Guild: Degenerate Matter - 200
    Argo-Jotmon(HC 28/42,EC 26/36,IC 17/15,RC 14/30), Jotlock(HC 38/42,EC 36/36,IC 15/15, RC 0/30)..
    and several once viable raiding alts dumped into the packmule stables..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Too bad I 'purchased' maximum character slots for my account, SSG has now chosen to cater the giveaway perks to benefit multiple freebie accounts instead of the paying customers.

  14. #34
    Community Member noinfo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JOTMON View Post
    you are mixing HOX mechanics with other stuff which is nonsensical.

    Hound is based on charming the puppies and buffing them to defeat xzzzzzzy.
    Players were tailoring their builds and epic destinies and past lives for the specific purpose to optimize charms and damage by charmed puppies.
    The players that made the effort to specialize their builds effectively making them inferior in pretty much every other content without resetting enhancement trees and epic destinies.
    With co-ordination and practice they kept bumping the reaper bar to get ideal completions assuming everyone came together effectively.

    ..and their reward.. fu players.. remove reaper from HOX..
    Turning this into a non-reaper just invalidates the whole reason to take the charm/pet buff lines for endgame players.
    They have effectively screwed HOX out of playability for the players that put the effort into playing the higher difficulty content and made the pet/summons/charm lines pointless.

    So what happens now.. players respec out of the charm lines and stop running HOX..

    They are not adjusting the raid mechanics to make it easier for pugs.. they just removed Reaper from HOX effectively killing the reason for a significant portion of the player base to run it.
    This
    Time effort and co-ordination. HOX is a raid that you can't make right once it goes wrong with dps and brute force. Yes it is fast due to the nature of it the raid, its timed. It is going to fail more times than any other raid of that difficulty if something goes wrong.

    This is a poor choice.
    Milacias of Kyber

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  15. #35
    Community Member noinfo's Avatar
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    Default So What Purpose Does LHoX Serve now?

    So lets take a look at what the raid is good for now:

    Loot- The loot really still is not something I would put on my character now. Not really competitive even upgraded.
    Runes- See above before they nerfed the idea of RAID runes for the new tokens at least they had a use
    XP- nah
    rxp- That excuse was smashed in this thread, I don't have to address that issue of a once every 3 day run with rxp + good opportunity to fail.
    new raid currency- drops 7 or 8 on elite if I read right.

    This change might as well of just had the hound put down and that is a genuine shame, I actually enjoyed it though never completed an R10 and now never will.
    Milacias of Kyber

    Leader of the Crimson Eagles Kyber

  16. #36
    Community Member kmoustakas's Avatar
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    Everything everyone says just points out to the bad design of reaper in general.
    Social Justice W...arlock (5e toon)
    OkarisRage, big fat purple wolf (because no need to be a bear with the new epic defensive fighting feat-getting past lives of druid and pdk so my artificer is better <3)

  17. #37
    Community Member kmoustakas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zites View Post
    I have the fix for you takeoff all your gear reset your reaper points to zero don't play meta builds so no more monk no more uber completionest cc/instakill casters no more assassin's no more tempest. If that don't work for you just try rolling a brand new character and I mean the whole guild not just one or two people and see how easy R10 is. If all else fails we can all go outside and play ha ha ha Ha ha ha.....
    If anyone wants the challenge of starting from zero, he doesn't have to do any of that stuff. He can just go and play a new game instead
    Social Justice W...arlock (5e toon)
    OkarisRage, big fat purple wolf (because no need to be a bear with the new epic defensive fighting feat-getting past lives of druid and pdk so my artificer is better <3)

  18. #38
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    Ehi you removed reaper diff?

    Sincerely i dont see full of party doing this.
    Really dont understand devs

    We had a fun raid to play in reaper and u remove it?

    Consider the same 1/3 of the party doing r10 can do elite in less time
    In game in Cannith as
    Aborim Master (main toon) --- Nickallin (my tank)--- Jjnick (warlock 30) --- Nickpunick ()--- Nickruvido (my healer)--- Nickallinone (shuri build)
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  19. #39
    Community Member btolson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Alled78 View Post
    We had a fun raid to play in reaper and u remove it?
    That's not the point of this game

  20. #40
    Community Member ThomasMink's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xanthrawl View Post
    Ok, you're one of those. R10 should be balanced around the uberpletionists with all the gear and past lives one could hope to obtain.
    I remember when Reaper was advertised as not being balanced around anything and was supposed to be where the devs actively try to just outright kill you.
    Guess that mindset changed somewhere along the line.
    "Everybody's got a price" - 'The Million Dollar Man' Ted DiBiase

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