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  1. #1
    Community Member chipotle47's Avatar
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    Default Dwarf Rogue Assassin - Reaper and Raid Focused

    First let me give credit to Shadow Jumper for his expertise on assassins. His build thread which I highly encourage you to read if interested in rogue assassins is here:

    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...A-Reaper-Rogue

    While most of my initial thoughts on my build were thankfully confirmed by Shadow-Jumper, I had a few variations which I kept and a few variations which I discarded after consulting him.
    I'm posting my version as a slightly different take on the class. I have always liked rogues, and especially assassins. They are my favorite class no question. I also like dwarves, they are my favorite race. Thus I have always strived to build a max difficulty, end game dwarf assassin. To that end my build focuses much more on survivability, versatility and being able to perform different roles in the most variety of party makeups. I will discuss this more below but let me say that I wish I had Shadow Jumpers gear set up available. I don't currently have the mats to complete it so I maxed what I could with what I have based on what I want to be able to do but I feel like I could maximize a lot more if I played around with more options. Obviously I have sacrificed some dps for my options but it's still plenty good.

    Past lives - completionist, all melee classes x 3, racial completionist, epic completionist - Divine x 9, Primal x 9, Martial x 6, Arcane x 4.

    Dwarf
    Str 8 | Dex 18 | Con 20 | Int 12 | Wis 8 | Chr 6

    1 2WF
    3 Completionist
    6 Dragonmark
    9 ITWF
    12 Precision
    15 Imp Crit Pierce
    18 G2WF
    21 Sneak of shadows
    24 Improved Sneak Attack
    26 P2WF
    27 Epic Reflex |Swapped for OW Crit
    28 Toughness
    29 Dire Charge
    30 Epic Toughness / Ethereal Scion

    AP:
    13 Dwarf - (12 are racial) 4 cores and all dragonmarks.
    41 Assasin - all cores | Heartseeker, Stealthy x 3, Shiv x 3, Sneak Attack training all the way up | Crit mastery, Dex x 2 | Execute, Killer x 1 | All tier 5's but only 1 point in Light armor mastery
    3 Acrobat for 20% run speed
    10 Harper - 1st core, Weathered Traveler x 1, Toughness x 3, KNA x 3, Melee power x 2
    *** I do NOT take Harper Enchantment here for the +1 to weapon because it breaks Celestias and I want to keep those available for DR breakers.
    25 Vistani - 3 cores | Rapid Slash, Mist Stalker I and II | Haste Boost x 3 | Vistani Knife Training II - IV, Deadly Blades, Dex x 1 | Double Daggers, Celerity

    Destiny and playstyle: Shadowdancer or Blitz

    I currently run in Shadowdancer for about 80% of the content in game and switch to blitz for raids or if I'm in a well balanced group where I know the players. Because I end up playing with such a large variety of groups and players and such a variety of difficulty levels, I like the versatility of Shadowdancer. The biggest difference in dps from the two destinies is your action boosts are 20 sec cooldown in Blitz vs 30 in SD so you can trigger the Prowess tier 5 effect more often. Shadowdancer gives you 42 more melee power and 6d6 sneak attack from cores which essentially equals out the 70 melee power and other goodies from Dreadnaught but you don't have to keep up a 10 blitz. So it depends on if you want passive or situational dps depending on your playstyle and party. But there is no question blitz is higher dps.

    There are some other key things I like in Shadowdancer that add to survivability and utility that I like to play around with right now. Shadow form gives you 25% incorporeal (stacks with ghostly?) Meld, Lithe and Stealthy I don't have to twist. I get increased threat reduction, ddoor and the fastest sprint boost in the game also from cores. Shadow Manipulation has proven to be dangerously useful especially in high reaper as it is recognized as a crowd control effect and thus the 1 minute timer is significantly reduced. It acts as a dual instakill if you target correctly, charms long enough for that mob to kill something else and then it dies. It can be used the same as a mage would charm reapers too, if you want the other mobs to kill a reaper but the reaper will always save the instadeath with it's deathward on so be careful!

    I take the Dwarf Dragonmark as well for the 4 Radiant Forcefield clikies. These can be very useful in certain quests with certain parties where you or your tank need that little extra protection.
    These choices may not be the best option for you but I like the synergy and overall versatility they provide.

    Tier 1 - Stealthy x 3, Dex
    Tier 2 - Lithe x 3
    Tier 3 - Cloak of Shadow, Shrouding Strike x 3, Meld x 3
    Tier 4 - Improved Invis x 1
    Tier 5 - Shadow Manipulation, Untouchable, Executioner's Strike x 2
    Tier 6 - Shadow Form

    Twists: (with +3 tome of fate)
    Symmetric Strikes
    Balanced Attacks
    Melee Power Boost
    Legendary Tactics (for dire charge) - could swap with extra action boost or something else.
    Cocoon

    Gear:
    Armor - Legendary Mist Laden Vestments (mythic 4) | Slot Armored Agility +2
    Goggles - Legendary Green Steel - Air/Mat/Esc x 3 for HP and Hide bonus
    Helm - Legendary Executioner Helm (mythic 1)
    Neck - Legendary Reflective Bloodstone (For mist set and MRR)
    Trinket - crafted | Ins Dex 7, Dodge 15, Assassinate 7
    Cloak - Legendary Shadowhail Cloak | Slot Good Luck +2
    - Swap Legendary Mantle of Dwarven Commander with Festive Intel Augment for KNA
    Belt - Legendary Braided Cutcord (Mythic 3) | Slot False Life 40
    Ring - Legendary Ring of Nightfall (Mythic 1) | Slot Vitality 20
    - Swap Legendary Keylock Ring for traps
    Ring - Slave Lords Crafted | Con 17, Accuracy 28, Stunning 20, Quality Con 4
    Gloves - Molten Silver Gauntlets | Slot Golem Heart, Topaz of Power 250
    Boots - Legendary Flightfoot Greaves (mythic 1) | Slot Globe
    Bracers - Legendary Lore-Fueled Packbanner | Slot Draconic Soul Gem
    Main hand - Suffering / Prowess 5 piece of Dex(rare), Melee Power(rare), Attack and Dmg, Crit Confirm, PRR(rare)
    / Treachery 3 piece of Threat Reduction(rare), Dex(rare), Melee Power(rare)
    Off hand - Pain


    Relevant Stats: with store pots and dex yugo pot not in reaper (currently 35 points in reaper - stats adjusted)

    Dex - 87 (90 in reaper) (+8 Tome) -1 in blitz
    Con - 74 (77 in reaper) (+8 Tome) +1 in blitz
    Int - 68 with gear swap (+8 Tome)

    HP - 2187 In EDF stance (2522 in reaper) | Blitz - 2337 (2710 reaper)
    AC - 137
    Dodge - 30%
    Reflex save - 107 with GH (108 in reaper)
    PRR - 157 (166 in reaper)
    MRR - 75
    Doublestrike - 79% (99% with Rapid Strike)
    Melee Power - 141 +30 MTF | Blitz - 101 before blitzing (108 reaper)
    Hide - 143 (156 in shadow form in reaper)
    Balance - 134
    Assassinate - 89 with measure the foe (91 in reaper) (93 with Tensors) -1 in blitz
    Dire Charge - 110 with KNA active (112 in reaper) | 115 in blitz, 117 reaper

    I will try to do a dps test soon so we can see how much lower I am from Shadow Jumper.
    Last edited by chipotle47; 10-02-2018 at 09:43 AM.
    "The definition of success is rebuffing between deaths with great enthusiasm."

    Chippacabre, Chippotle, Chippmunk Funk, Chippinater, Chippin Dale, Chippling - Leader of Upper Caves of Anthia on Ghallanda

  2. #2
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    Nice write-up, thanks for doing it. It's interesting to see how other people are building and gearing their rogues at cap.

    I think you should take Overwhelming Critical in place of Epic Toughness. It will improve your DPS and I don't think you'd really notice the loss of HP on such a durable build anyway. And maybe you could also use your L28 destiny feat for another DPS or different defensive feat too.

    With your AP choices, Stealthy rank 3 does not currently seem to be providing the additional movement speed increase, so maybe you could get away with only going to rank 2. The only difference between Shiv 1 and 3 is the +[w] increase, so perhaps you could save another couple of points there for something else too.

    You might also benefit from an assassination weapon swap set. Put Assassination and Insightful Assassination on a cannith crafted weapon, then pair it with something else that has a second sentient gem with the Treachery set and Dex increases for another +4 on top of that. Then if you still want to keep your crafted trinket you could have it almost the same way (because Dodge can go in either the prefix or suffix slot) but with Healing Amp instead of the Assassination DC bonus.

    I hope this helps.
    Last edited by blerkington; 09-30-2018 at 04:44 AM.

  3. #3
    Community Member chipotle47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    Nice write-up, thanks for doing it. It's interesting to see how other people are building and gearing their rogues at cap.

    I think you should take Overwhelming Critical in place of Epic Toughness. It will improve your DPS and I don't think you'd really notice the loss of HP on such a durable build anyway. And maybe you could also use your L28 destiny feat for another DPS or different defensive feat too.

    With your AP choices, Stealthy rank 3 does not currently seem to be providing the additional movement speed increase, so maybe you could get away with only going to rank 2. The only difference between Shiv 1 and 3 is the +[w] increase, so perhaps you could save another couple of points there for something else too.

    You might also benefit from an assassination weapon swap set. Put Assassination and Insightful Assassination on a cannith crafted weapon, then pair it with something else that has a second sentient gem with the Treachery set and Dex increases for another +4 on top of that. Then if you still want to keep your crafted trinket you could have it almost the same way (because Dodge can go in either the prefix or suffix slot) but with Healing Amp instead of the Assassination DC bonus.

    I hope this helps.
    It definitely helps, Thanks!

    While you are right on the toughness feats, I'm not swapping them out on shear stubborn dwarf principal because I want the most HP I can have. Also I will sometimes switch to 2 piece opposition set if i need to get even more tanky.

    If I swap anything for OV crit, it would be epic reflex's as I don't see when rolling that 1 is gonna kill me with improved evasion. I'm probably going to do that soon.

    As for the Assassin AP, you have to get to 41 and so there aren't really any better places to put those points since they can't be spent in other trees.

    I just pulled the Icon of Ravenloft last night so now I'm gonna seriously look into farming more slaver mats for a closer set up to Shadow Jumper's.

    I like that assassin dc weapon swap idea, I'm gonna do that. Normally I HATE weapon swapping in combat because of that lag. Typically I'm the one going in, trying to pick off 2 of the weak and group them up at the same time for the caster cc so the swap sucks for that. However it would be very useful to have it when there is a tank around because then you have more time to be more selective.
    "The definition of success is rebuffing between deaths with great enthusiasm."

    Chippacabre, Chippotle, Chippmunk Funk, Chippinater, Chippin Dale, Chippling - Leader of Upper Caves of Anthia on Ghallanda

  4. #4
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    With the assassin AP, you wouldn't have to spend the ones you save in Shiv and Stealthy outside of the tree. But you could shave one point from both and have two more points in Killer instead, which might be helpful if you aren't already at or very close to 100% DS from other sources.

    The Icon is a really nice item now that both the deception proc and the DR bypass effects seem to be working. But if it is your main CON item then you will have problems if you run content where you might want to swap in a spell absorb item in that slot - unless you have a redundant con bonus on some other piece of gear.

    The alternative is going without, which might be fine, or using a jewelled cloak which breaks your silent avenger set bonus and removes some other effects you might prefer to keep. But perhaps the benefits of using the trinket outweigh the losses of being able to do that swap and losing the three things you had there before. This is definitely one of the harder decisions to make gearing an endgame assassin.

    I can understand your reluctance to use weapon swaps to boost your DC. It was something I didn't want to do at first, but once you're using a sentient weapon to boost your DC there's no reason not to have the other boosts on another weapon there too. Quickdraw from vistani means the delay is not that bad, and resetting the client every so often during longer sessions prevents weapon swaps from getting too sludgy.

    Weapon swapping seems to work fairly well in short encounters where you lead with an assassination or two and then change to your melee set before attacking other enemies. Might be worth a try anyway, because your DC is at a point where another seven points or so would make the ability a lot less likely to fail. There is a big difference in usefulness in endgame content between a DC in the low 90s and one near or at 100 but maybe this time you can have your cake and eat it too.

    Anyway, it seems like you've put in a lot of work to build and gear a really good character and I hope you have fun with it. Been good talking to you.

    Thanks.
    Last edited by blerkington; 09-30-2018 at 09:29 AM.

  5. #5
    Community Member chipotle47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    With the assassin AP, you wouldn't have to spend the ones you save in Shiv and Stealthy outside of the tree. But you could shave one point from both and have two more points in Killer instead, which might be helpful if you aren't already at or very close to 100% DS from other sources.
    I have 76ish% DS, so 1 stack of killer plus rapid strikes gives me 100%

    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    The Icon is a really nice item now that both the deception proc and the DR bypass effects seem to be working. But if it is your main CON item then you will have problems if you run content where you might want to swap in a spell absorb item in that slot - unless you have a redundant con bonus on some other piece of gear.

    The alternative is going without, which might be fine, or using a jewelled cloak which breaks your silent avenger set bonus and removes some other effects you might prefer to keep. But perhaps the benefits of using the trinket outweigh the losses of being able to do that swap and losing the three things you had there before. This is definitely one of the harder decisions to make gearing an endgame assassin.
    I use all sources of spell absorb including the magestar too, so ya, will have to think about that.

    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    I can understand your reluctance to use weapon swaps to boost your DC. It was something I didn't want to do at first, but once you're using a sentient weapon to boost your DC there's no reason not to have the other boosts on another weapon there too. Quickdraw from vistani means the delay is not that bad, and resetting the client every so often during longer sessions prevents weapon swaps from getting too sludgy.

    Weapon swapping seems to work fairly well in short encounters where you lead with an assassination or two and then change to your melee set before attacking other enemies. Might be worth a try anyway, because your DC is at a point where another seven points or so would make the ability a lot less likely to fail. There is a big difference in usefulness in endgame content between a DC in the low 90s and one near or at 100 but maybe this time you can have your cake and eat it too.

    Anyway, it seems like you've put in a lot of work to build and gear a really good character and I hope you have fun with it. Been good talking to you.

    Thanks.
    Ya I'm definitely gonna make that weapons swap and see how I like it. Right now I mostly stick to caster and range (low fort) targets but might be able to improve the variety of things I can confidently go after. Thanks for the input!
    "The definition of success is rebuffing between deaths with great enthusiasm."

    Chippacabre, Chippotle, Chippmunk Funk, Chippinater, Chippin Dale, Chippling - Leader of Upper Caves of Anthia on Ghallanda

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    Very nice well thought out build

    I was curious to know if there are good items with Insighful Sneak Attack bonuses worth adding to a rogue or ranger?
    1 Sneak attack 1d6 is listed as 3.5 damage and scales with 150% Melee or Ranged Power (think i have this right).

    Quote Originally Posted by chipotle47 View Post
    There are some other key things I like in Shadowdancer that add to survivability and utility that I like to play around with right now. Shadow form gives you 25% incorporeal (stacks with ghostly)?
    DDOWiki: Update 14 changed Ghostly to a 10% Incorporeal miss chance (stacking with Concealment, but no-longer stacking with other sources of incorporeal miss chance).

  7. #7
    Community Member chipotle47's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffey View Post

    I was curious to know if there are good items with Insighful Sneak Attack bonuses worth adding to a rogue or ranger?
    The Legendary Executioners helm has insightful deception 7 on it which is +7 to hit and +11 sneak dmg.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coffey View Post
    1 Sneak attack 1d6 is listed as 3.5 damage and scales with 150% Melee or Ranged Power (think i have this right).
    You are correct in terms of Sneak Attack Dice. There isn't really any GEAR per say in game though that I can think of that adds dice. Only things that add deception which is straight damage like that which is listed above.

    Quote Originally Posted by Coffey View Post
    DDOWiki: Update 14 changed Ghostly to a 10% Incorporeal miss chance (stacking with Concealment, but no-longer stacking with other sources of incorporeal miss chance).
    Thanks for this find!!!
    "The definition of success is rebuffing between deaths with great enthusiasm."

    Chippacabre, Chippotle, Chippmunk Funk, Chippinater, Chippin Dale, Chippling - Leader of Upper Caves of Anthia on Ghallanda

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    Quote Originally Posted by chipotle47 View Post
    There isn't really any GEAR per say in game though that I can think of that adds dice.
    Yea i think racial enhancements are the only other options to add SA dice other than multiclassing. And because SA doesnt crit i think it is better to add as much straight damage and attack speed to the build
    as you have with Vistani.

    And You definitely have a lot more survivability with Dwarf.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffey View Post
    Yea i think racial enhancements are the only other options to add SA dice other than multiclassing.
    You can increase your SA dice a little bit with some sentient weapon filigree sets. But it's not by much and the opportunity cost may mean it's not worth it.

    Thanks.

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