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  1. #1
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    Apr 2013
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    Default Christmas came early! The Update 39.2 Crusader

    [Update 39.2 brings with it epic defensive stance, which allows a paladin to gain a competence bonus to hit points without the Sacred Defender enhancements and medium or heavy armor or shield requirements. This opens up paladins in robes as high hit point alternatives to plate.

    Now handwrap monks were without dispute the most powerful melee in the game even before epic defensive stance gave them 25% more hitpoints. So we want to add some of their flavor in to rub off on our paladin, but we still want our paladin to retain some good ol' fashioned 2 handed beatdown, so we will mix the two together. I love me some cleaves, so our starting rotation is going to be the following:

    Whirlwind Attack (WWA) > Cleave > Great Cleave > Holy Retribution (HR)

    Cleave and Great Cleave hit only main hand and don't double strike, so we want to do Cleaves THF. Paladin gets upgraded versions of these cleaves free in their Knight of the Chalice tree.

    Holy Retribution is bugged with handwraps and only deals 1 hit with them, so we want to do Holy Retribution THF as well. HR charges are based on charisma, so we want a high charisma build. Charisma also powers divine might, so we can use the resulting really high strength to hit and damage and for tactics. HR is tier 5 Knight of the Chalice and is obtained at level 12. It also executes low health mobs, so we want this at the end of the rotation.

    Whirlwind Attack hits once with THF weapons. WWA hits once main and once off hand dual wielding weapons that are not hand wraps. WWA hits twice main hand and once offhand and can double strike/offhand double strike with hand wraps while monk centered. WWA is a 2 second cleave, unlike all others which are 1 second.

    Weapon swaps take 0.3 seconds to finish to use attacks with the new weapon, but you can still activate attacks and attack with the old weapon as they are swapping during this .3 seconds. So we are going to hit swap and immediately execute an attack with the equipped weapon before it finishes swapping. Macro it all together for ease of use.

    This gives a final 5 second macro rotation of:

    1 Staff* or Any w Weapon Swap don't wait 0 seconds > 2 Whirlwind Attack with Handwrap (WWA) 2 seconds (staff ends up equipped at end of WWA) >

    3 Cleave with staff 1 second > 4 Great Cleave THF Staff 1 second > 5 Handwrap Weapon Swap don't wait > 6 Holy Retribution THF Staff 1 second (handwraps end up equipped at end of HR)

    *You only have to be centered at the time you actually do WWA for the extra attacks, and if you don't use ki at all, it's not a loss to lose it while uncentered. So bust out the SoS if you have one.

    For bosses, we can just melt them with TWF handwraps. We can activate Prowess on our THF weapon, such as Torn, then hit HR while swapping to Duality with 40 melee power filligree, then dps with 115 stacked melee power additional from sentience.

    We will start off our leveling THF with some paladin levels with Carnifax, taking the cleave from KoTC, then swap over to TWF with handwraps at level 9 when we get WWA, then swap to our final rotation above when we hit level 12 and have all our abilities.

    Starting Stats:
    Strength 15+*
    Dex 13+*
    Int 9+*
    High + levels Charisma

    *based on tomes to fit feat requirements

    1 Paladin Two Handed Fighting #1 (Strength 15)
    2 Paladin
    3 Paladin Dodge (dex 13, tomes +3)
    4 Paladin
    5 Paladin
    6 Monk Mobility Spring Attack
    7 Monk Combat Expertise (int 13, tomes +4)
    8 Fighter Whirlwind Attack
    9 Fighter Two Weapon Fighting #1 Two Weapon Fighting #2 (dex 17, tomes +4)
    10 Paladin
    11 Paladin
    12 Paladin Two Weapon Fighting #3,
    13 Paladin
    14 Paladin
    15 Paladin Two Handed Fighting #2 (strength 17, tomes +8)
    16 Paladin
    17 Paladin
    18 Paladin Two Handed Fighting #3 Improved Critical: Blunt
    19 Paladin
    20 Monk
    21 Power Attack Epic Defensive Stance Autogrant
    24 IC:B
    26 Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
    27 Overwhelming Critical
    28 Perfect Two Handed Fighting
    29 Dire Charge
    30 Scion of Arborea Improved Critical Slashing

    Enhancements

    41 KoTC (all tier 5s)
    6 Sacred Defense PRR/MRR
    4-Shintao off hand%, HAmp

    End game weapons: Duality with 40 Melee Power. Torn with Prowess (Swap for HR and to activate action boosts on bosses)
    Last edited by Tilomere; 10-15-2018 at 10:45 PM.

  2. #2
    Community Member
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    Apr 2014
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    429

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Tilomere View Post
    Note: this build isn't exactly in the form I want since Holy Retribution is bugged with handwraps and only deals 1 of 3 attacks it is supposed to. As a result I am working around that with ranger and THF. I really would prefer for holy retribution to work properly, and to drop the ranger and THF feats, and drop 1 pally and 1 monk level, and to grab 4 FvS for sound burst (it's like ketchup, it goes with everything) and BoGW.

    Update 39.2 brings with it epic defensive stance, which allows a paladin to gain a competence bonus to hit points without the Sacred Defender enhancements and medium or heavy armor or shield requirements. This opens up paladins in robes as high hit point alternatives to plate.

    Now handwrap monks were without dispute the most powerful melee in the game even before epic defensive stance gave them 25% more hitpoints. So we want to add some of their flavor in to rub off on our paladin, but we still want our paladin to retain some good ol' fashioned 2 handed beatdown, so we will mix the two together.

    I love me some cleaves, so our starting rotation is going to be the following:

    Whirlwind Attack (WWA) > Cleave > Great Cleave > Holy Retribution (HR)

    Cleave and Great Cleave hit only main hand and doesn't double strike, so we want to do Cleaves THF. Paladin gets upgraded versions of these cleaves free in their Knight of the Chalice tree.

    Holy Retribution is bugged with handwraps and only deals 1 hit with them, so we want to do Holy Retribution THF as well. HR charges are based on charisma, so we want a high charisma build. Charisma also powers divine might, so we can use the resulting really high strength to hit and damage and for tactics. HR is tier 5 Knight of the Chalice and is obtained at level 12. It also executes low health mobs, so we want this at the end of the rotation.

    Whirlwind Attack hits once with THF weapons. WWA hits once main and once off hand dual wielding weapons that are not hand wraps. WWA hits twice main hand and once offhand and can double strike/offhand double strike with hand wraps while monk centered. WWA is a 2 second cleave, unlike all others which are 1 second.

    Weapon swaps take 0.3 seconds to finish to use attacks with the new weapon, but you can still activate attacks and attack with the old weapon as they are swapping during this .3 seconds. So we are going to hit swap and immediately execute an attack with the equipped weapon before it finishes swapping.

    This gives a final 5 second rotation of:

    1 Staff* or Any w Weapon Swap don't wait 0 seconds > 2 Whirlwind Attack with Handwrap (WWA) 2 seconds (staff ends up equipped at end of WWA) >

    3 Cleave with staff 1 second > 4 Great Cleave THF Staff 1 second > 5 Handwrap Weapon Swap don't wait > 6 Holy Retribution THF Staff 1 second (handwraps end up equipped at end of HR)

    *You only have to be centered at the time you actually do WWA for the extra attacks, and if you don't use ki at all, it's not a loss to lose it while uncentered. So bust out the SoS if you have one.

    For bosses, we can just melt them with TWF handwraps. We can activate Prowess on our THF weapon, such as Torn, then hit HR while swapping to Duality with 40 melee power filligree, then dps with 115 stacked melee power additional from sentience.

    We will start off our leveling THF with some paladin levels with Carnifax, taking the cleave from KoTC, then swap over to TWF with handwraps at level 9 when we get WWA, then swap to our final rotation above when we hit level 12 and have all our abilities.

    Starting Stats:
    Strength 15+*
    Dex 12+*
    Int 9+*
    High + levels Charisma

    *based on tomes to fit feat requirements

    1 Paladin Two Handed Fighting #1 (Strength 15)
    2 Paladin
    3 Paladin Dodge (dex 13, tomes +3)
    4 Paladin
    5 Paladin
    6 Monk Mobility Spring Attack
    7 Monk Combat Expertise (int 13, tomes +4)
    8 Ranger
    9 Ranger Two Weapon Fighting #1 Autogrant Whirlwind Attack
    10 Paladin
    11 Paladin
    12 Paladin Two Weapon Fighting #2 (dex 17, tomes +5)
    13 Paladin
    14 Paladin
    15 Paladin Two Weapon Fighting #3,
    16 Paladin
    17 Paladin
    18 Paladin Two Handed Fighting #2 (strength 17, tomes +8)
    19 Paladin
    20 Monk
    21 Epic Defensive Stance Autogrant Two Handed Fighting #3
    24 Improved Critical: Blunt
    26 Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
    27 Overwhelming Critical
    28 Perfect Two Handed Fighting
    29 Dire Charge
    30 Scion of Arborea Improved Critical Slashing

    Enhancements

    41 KoTC (all tier 5s)
    6 Sacred Defense PRR/MRR
    4-8 Shintao PRR while centered** off hand%, HAmp

    End game weapons: Duality with 40 Melee Power. Torn with Prowess (Swap for HR and to activate action boosts on bosses)

    ** Only if you are fighting centered THF with a staff. If you are using a SoS in heroics or Torn in epics as your THF weapon, for example, you won't need the Shintao PRR while centered.

    Since all crucial AP are obtained by level 12 (KoTC and SaD), and the full rotation is available at level 12, this is going to be a great leveling build. Even better if/when we can drop ranger for FvS soundburst when HR is fixed to with handwraps.
    This seems a huge stretch to get WWA into a paladin build. Is it worth it? I mean, I like whirlwind and all, but using a duality for a swap in weapon for a single attack on a paladin build seems like a horrible waste.

  3. #3
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    Apr 2013
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Zretch View Post
    This seems a huge stretch to get WWA into a paladin build. Is it worth it? I mean, I like whirlwind and all, but using a duality for a swap in weapon for a single attack on a paladin build seems like a horrible waste.
    I was going to use handwraps for bosses as well.

    The alternative with a pure pally 2hf is to only cleave 3 out of 5 seconds on groups, and to use THF on bosses.

    If you go TWF on a pali, say with VKF, then your cleaves are all going to be short ranged and lower damage.

    Swapped ranger to fighter, for additional feat.
    Last edited by Tilomere; 10-03-2018 at 01:38 PM.

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