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  1. #21
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    Default Yet another contestant

    Cerlinad, a halfling rogue who uses weapons as short as he is, takes up your challenge!

    Level 2: Lizard-Hugger: Stopping the Sahuagin, 2 kills
    Level 4: The Saint: Stealthy Repossession, all prophets alive, 25 kills
    Level 6: The Insurrectionist: Irestone Inlet, kill only the officers and free the prisoners (4 kills, 3 misadventures)
    Level 9: The Insurrectionist, Redux: Gwylan's Stand, kill only the officers and complete quest (5 kills max)
    Level 10: The Cache Break: Claw of Vulkoor, 1 kill, all optionals, 45 breakables
    Level 12: The Bauble Purser: Maraud the Mines, no kills.
    Level 13: The Scalpel: Frame Work, 1 kill, no alarms.
    Level 14: The Liberator: Blockade Buster, all optionals (no limits on kills)
    Level 15: The Fallen Albatross: The Crucible, solo; hirelings permitted. No other conditions.
    Level 16: Invisible Stalker: Through a Mirror Darkly, no kills prior to elevator ride.
    Level 17: The Wiles Master: The Mask of Deception, 60 misadventure kills. No completion necessary. (the 'fun' break.)
    Level 18: Best Intender: Good Intentions, reach end fight with no kills.
    Level 19: The Peacebreaker: Schemes of the Enemy, 25 misadventure kills, no actual kills, no completion necessary.

    The above will be updated with links to the screenshots as they are completed.
    Last edited by digital_terror1; 11-22-2017 at 01:42 AM. Reason: Adding link to screenshot

  2. #22

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    Quote Originally Posted by digital_terror1 View Post
    Cerlinad, a halfling rogue who uses weapons as short as he is, takes up your challenge!

    Level 2: Lizard-Hugger: Stopping the Sahuagin, 2 kills
    Level 4: The Saint: Stealthy Repossession, all prophets alive, 25 kills
    Level 6: The Insurrectionist: Irestone Inlet, kill only the officers and free the prisoners (4 kills, 3 misadventures)
    Level 9: The Insurrectionist, Redux: Gwylan's Stand, kill only the officers and complete quest (5 kills max)
    Level 10: The Cache Break: Claw of Vulkoor, 1 kill, all optionals, 45 breakables
    Level 12: The Bauble Purser: Maraud the Mines, no kills.
    Level 13: The Scalpel: Frame Work, 1 kill, no alarms.
    Level 14: The Liberator: Blockade Buster, all optionals (no limits on kills)
    Level 15: The Fallen Albatross: The Crucible, solo; hirelings permitted. No other conditions.
    Level 16: Invisible Stalker: Through a Mirror Darkly, no kills prior to elevator ride.
    Level 17: The Wiles Master: The Mask of Deception, 60 misadventure kills. No completion necessary. (the 'fun' break.)
    Level 18: Best Intender: Good Intentions, reach end fight with no kills.
    Level 19: The Peacebreaker: Schemes of the Enemy, 25 misadventure kills, no actual kills, no completion necessary.

    The above will be updated with links to the screenshots as they are completed.
    great to have you Cerlinad! If you can, post the completions here as a new post and then make the links on the above post to those later ones
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked at level 4!)


  3. #23
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    Default Stealthy Repo done



    I need to point out that the person shown on the party list with me never actually stepped into the quest. We were just partied up for voicechat.
    Last edited by digital_terror1; 11-22-2017 at 02:58 AM.

  4. #24

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    Quote Originally Posted by digital_terror1 View Post


    I need to point out that the person shown on the party list with me never actually stepped into the quest. We were just partied up for voicechat.
    Congratz! I thought that was an insanely fun challenge when I attempted it
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked at level 4!)


  5. #25
    Waylander of the Stolen Blade Cambo's Avatar
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    Default Return to DDo

    Ok so reading this stealth stuff has inspired me to come back after a break.
    Original Character from 2006 - no play for 6-7 years and then back for a year and my friends left again....so away for 7-8 months.
    My rogue is lvl 19 but a Shadar-kai so I cant Reincarnate until lvl 28?...
    Can I use a heart of wood and play at lower levels and level up as I want to do higher level quests?


    Hoping Stealth isn't too borked...lol
    Not sure how long before I start if I have to make 28 then TR...but this is to tell the Devs you got another player back to paying VIP...fix stealth, please.
    -------------------------------------------------------------
    Backstory:

    Cambo Neebong
    Waylander of the Stolen Blade

    It's dark, very dark, and damp. The young halfling woke slowly from a concussed slumber. His last memory was of his Pa throwing him from the back of the wagon into a storm culvert as the riders approached. They were further from home than anyone he knew had ever been as they had been traveling for weeks to escape the pursuit. In his mind he recalled the screams and then there was blackness. How may hours had passed?

    Still a young child in the world of halfling's Cambo was only 12, but he had heard enough stories to know that if the black riders came to your village you had to run, and few would live to make it home. He knew his Pa, crippled and relying on a walking stick to get around, would not be one of them. Tears welled in his eyes transforming the dust on his face into a concrete mask that matched his resolve to find his Pa. But where would he start? he was hungry and he had to survive.

    Life was harsh for a young halfling used to the comforts of a warm burrow, but these were different times and the outside world had come crashing in on him. Cambo survived living off the land eating wild berries and roots, and as he grew on the game he brought down with a rough slingshot made in the months, or was it years? that had passed. Time had shown his natural affinity for thrown weapons, and he had become stealthy, able to sneak up on even the most skittish of ground foul in the long grass.

    In his fight for survival, he had grown in rage after he found his fathers trampled corpse all those years ago, and then despair that he was lost and did not know what to do. However he survived, though many halfling's would have preferred death, Cambo was no longer a normal halfling. His experiences had strengthend something inside of him and time for surviving was over, he wanted to make the men that destroyed his village, and killed his family, and especially his Pa, pay for what the had done.

    Cambo became a Waylander using his natural gifts of stealth and guile to search and learn about the black riders. Nothing would stand in his way, and he needed means to gather information and make his plans. Cambo accepted that he would need to do thing's he had never dreamed of in his previous life. If it advanced his cause he took what he needed, including lives. Cambo, Waylander of the Stolen Blade was born.

    -----------------------------------------------------------
    I've been playing DDO from 2006 albeit with a large break of 7 years from 2009 to 2016. I am a casual player who played with mates, but I keep strange hours and often solo or PUG. My main character Cambo has always been a halfling rogue, based on an AD&D character I played from the 1980's.
    ------------------------------------------------------------

    Success tracking here - will link once done.

    Level 2: Stopping the Sahuagin, 0 kills - Completed 31st Dec 2017
    Level 4: Stealthy Repossion, all prophets alive, 25 kills - Completed 4th Jan 2018
    Level 6: (did at lvl5, 3kills, 3 misadventures) Irestone Inlet, kill only the officers and free the prisoners - Completed 4th Jan 2018
    Level 8: (did at lvl7, 4 Kills, 5 misadventure) : The Assassination of Rowan Watzun - (Spies in the House), 10 kills max, no traps, no prisoners - Completed 6th Jan 2018
    Level 9: (did at lvl8, 4 Kills, 17 misadventure) The Insurrectionist, Redux: Gwylan's Stand, kill only officers and complete (5 kills max) - Completed 8th Jan 2018
    Level 10: (46 breakables) The Cache Break: Claw of Vulkoor, 1 kill, all optionals, 45 breakables: - Completed 23rd Jan 2018
    Level 12: (did at lvl10, 0 kills) The Bauble Purser: Maraud the Mines, no kills. - Completed 24th Jan 2018
    Level 13: (did at level 12, 1+1 misfortune kill) The Scalpel: Frame Work, 1 kill, no alarms. - Completed 31st Jan 2018
    Level 14: The Liberator: Blockade Buster, all optionals (no limits on kills) - Completed 11th Feb, 2018
    Level 15: The Fallen Albatross: The Crucible, solo; hirelings permitted. No other conditions. - Completed 12th Feb, 2018
    Level 16: Invisible Stalker: Through a Mirror Darkly, no kills prior to elevator ride. - Completed 27th Feb, 2018
    Level 17: The Wiles Master: The Mask of Deception, 60 misadventure kills. No completion necessary. (the 'fun' break.) - Completed 28th Feb, 2018
    Level 18: (did at level 17) Best Intender: Good Intentions, reach end fight with no kills. - Completed 1st March, 2018
    Level 19: (did at 18, 41 misadventure) The Peacebreaker: Schemes of the Enemy, 25 misadventure kills, no actual kills, no completion necessary. - completed 12th march, 2018

    ----------------COMPLETED!!!!!!!!!!
    Last edited by Cambo; 03-11-2018 at 10:05 AM.
    Cambo Neebong "Waylander of the Stolen Blade", well borrowed really...
    Lover of Loot, All Things Shiny and Participant in R.O.G.U.E Part Quatre Stealth Challenge.
    Woot: Hall of Fame Post - Eldritch Device Recipes

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cambo View Post
    Ok so reading this stealth stuff has inspired me to come back after a break.
    Original Character from 2006 - no play for 6-7 years and then back for a year and my friends left again....so away for 7-8 months.
    My rogue is lvl 19 but a Shadar-kai so I cant Reincarnate until lvl 28?...
    Can I use a heart of wood and play at lower levels and level up as I want to do higher level quests?


    Hoping Stealth isn't too borked...lol
    Not sure how long before I start if I have to make 28 then TR...but this is to tell the Devs you got another player back to paying VIP...fix stealth, please.
    -------------------------------------------------------------
    Success tracking here - will link once done.

    Level 2: Lizard-Hugger: Stopping the Sahuagin, 2 kills
    Level 4: The Saint: Stealthy Repossion, all prophets alive, 25 kills
    Level 6: The Insurrectionist: Irestone Inlet, kill only the officers and free the prisoners (4 kills, 3 misadventures)
    Level 9: The Insurrectionist, Redux: Gwylan's Stand, kill only the officers and complete quest (5 kills max)
    Level 10: The Cache Break: Claw of Vulkoor, 1 kill, all optionals, 45 breakables
    Level 12: The Bauble Purser: Maraud the Mines, no kills.
    Level 13: The Scalpel: Frame Work, 1 kill, no alarms.
    Level 14: The Liberator: Blockade Buster, all optionals (no limits on kills)
    Level 15: The Fallen Albatross: The Crucible, solo; hirelings permitted. No other conditions.
    Level 16: Invisible Stalker: Through a Mirror Darkly, no kills prior to elevator ride.
    Level 17: The Wiles Master: The Mask of Deception, 60 misadventure kills. No completion necessary. (the 'fun' break.)
    Level 18: Best Intender: Good Intentions, reach end fight with no kills.
    Level 19: The Peacebreaker: Schemes of the Enemy, 25 misadventure kills, no actual kills, no completion necessary.


    The above will be updated with links to the screenshots as they are completed.
    Hey Cambo, welcome back! I remember you! How exciting!

    Yes, you can reincarnate at 30--i have never done it on an iconic but I believe you would go to 30, then ER to 20 and then TR to 1. I am not sure but I do believe you can use your lesser heart and just go through the lower levels even though you already have the experience; just level as you wish. That is a good strategy if possible since SDK get some great stealth tools in their racial cores.

    But double-check the use of the lesser heart before doing this, I am not sure!
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked at level 4!)


  7. #27
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    Hey Saekee,

    Good on you for making this thread. It's been a few months since I've played DDO, but I think I'll come back eventually (I mean, why else would I have to come to check the forums?) For the past month I've been traveling for work, which will be ending in a couple weeks. But other than that, my two friends, who I have done nearly everything with in this game for roughly two years now, have quit for the foreseeable future. If they don't come back, I don't know if I'd be able to stick around for long. Not that I can only enjoy DDO with close friends, but I sure as hell am not gonna be a solo player or depend on LFMs.

    But, when I get some time I could take a crack at some minimum-kill runs, though I'd have to TR a character back into a rogue first.

  8. #28

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qezuzu View Post
    Hey Saekee,

    Good on you for making this thread. It's been a few months since I've played DDO, but I think I'll come back eventually (I mean, why else would I have to come to check the forums?) For the past month I've been traveling for work, which will be ending in a couple weeks. But other than that, my two friends, who I have done nearly everything with in this game for roughly two years now, have quit for the foreseeable future. If they don't come back, I don't know if I'd be able to stick around for long. Not that I can only enjoy DDO with close friends, but I sure as hell am not gonna be a solo player or depend on LFMs.

    But, when I get some time I could take a crack at some minimum-kill runs, though I'd have to TR a character back into a rogue first.
    Great to hear from you! It is a fun set of challenges and this will be available for a long time—no rush! Note that not all the conditions involve minimum kills—some are wacky like Vulkoor & breakables (probably the toughest) or Stealthy Repossession and knocking off non-prophets. For Crucible and Blockade Buster there are no minimum kills too!
    If you decide not to attempt it, just PM me and I will put your toon in some honorary category.
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked at level 4!)


  9. #29
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    This evening, I was fooling around in Framework on my capped rogue. No achievement of course, just trying to see if I could get to the chieftain without raising an alarm or getting DA, so I have a good method if I attempt the quest at level. I managed a completion using a noisemaker for the opening the last gate and bluff-pulling the chieftain, without getting DA or the minotaurs sounding the alarm so I'm sure a good rogue could do it at level too, even with the current stealth system.

    One thing I noticed during a run that went bad was the enemies lost track of me when I was perched invisible and in stealth on top of a warning bell, not that far from where I was detected. This seems to tie in with your earlier observation about jumping around helping to shake off pursuing monsters. Perhaps if their pathing is confused by being above ground level it helps.

    Something else I suspect is causing problems with dungeon alert taking so long to go down is the alarm mechanism. What I suspect is happening is that groups of monsters are constantly alarming each other about the presence of an enemy. So when one loses interest it is not for long, because the monster is being re-alarmed by its friends, leading to these incredibly long periods of DA. I'm not opposed to the idea of monsters alarming each other, provided it works plausibly, but in combination with the telepathic location they use to find us while we're in stealth it makes for a pretty silly combination.

    Anyway, since there doesn't seem to be a fixed interval for monsters to lose interest in searching for an enemy, they don't all give up at once and stop. And although moving far away helps, it can also mean the alert is transmitted back to enemies you already sneaked past, which just makes things worse.

    If anyone has more suggestions about how to shake off teleporting monsters I'd be all ears.

    Thanks.

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    This evening, I was fooling around in Framework on my capped rogue. No achievement of course, just trying to see if I could get to the chieftain without raising an alarm or getting DA, so I have a good method if I attempt the quest at level. I managed a completion using a noisemaker for the opening the last gate and bluff-pulling the chieftain, without getting DA or the minotaurs sounding the alarm so I'm sure a good rogue could do it at level too, even with the current stealth system.

    One thing I noticed during a run that went bad was the enemies lost track of me when I was perched invisible and in stealth on top of a warning bell, not that far from where I was detected. This seems to tie in with your earlier observation about jumping around helping to shake off pursuing monsters. Perhaps if their pathing is confused by being above ground level it helps.

    Something else I suspect is causing problems with dungeon alert taking so long to go down is the alarm mechanism. What I suspect is happening is that groups of monsters are constantly alarming each other about the presence of an enemy. So when one loses interest it is not for long, because the monster is being re-alarmed by its friends, leading to these incredibly long periods of DA. I'm not opposed to the idea of monsters alarming each other, provided it works plausibly, but in combination with the telepathic location they use to find us while we're in stealth it makes for a pretty silly combination.

    Anyway, since there doesn't seem to be a fixed interval for monsters to lose interest in searching for an enemy, they don't all give up at once and stop. And although moving far away helps, it can also mean the alert is transmitted back to enemies you already sneaked past, which just makes things worse.

    If anyone has more suggestions about how to shake off teleporting monsters I'd be all ears.

    Thanks.
    for framework, I would fly in using the nearby catapult, bypassing the gate and its traps. While the dialogue is occurring with the chieftain, only two scouts are active; I would stone them. Then I would pull the chieftain to the area behind the throne. The problem is that he manages to pull a ton of mobs up there if burst dps is too low...

    That sounds correct about DA—a spreading system. I was doing R1 Rusted Blades. I tainted the wrack with Improved Invisi active and DDoored out. Then the snowball appeared; DA just kept growing to eventually red when I had stepped down by the bell. Many drow warriors poured in. It may be that they activated some even that were standing in the corridors, but I am not sure. ( I decided to ddoor back up again, clear the mobs on the upper level and then the boss.)
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked at level 4!)


  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saekee View Post
    Great to hear from you! It is a fun set of challenges and this will be available for a long time—no rush! Note that not all the conditions involve minimum kills—some are wacky like Vulkoor & breakables (probably the toughest) or Stealthy Repossession and knocking off non-prophets. For Crucible and Blockade Buster there are no minimum kills too!
    If you decide not to attempt it, just PM me and I will put your toon in some honorary category.
    I don't need any special honors

    I do want to try some min kill runs.. I'd especially like to try tandem min-kill runs. But I need to fix up my rogue, I think I left her behind in TR limbo because I had no gear for her leveling build.

    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    If anyone has more suggestions about how to shake off teleporting monsters I'd be all ears.

    Thanks.
    As far as I can tell, teleporting monsters get a hard-lock on you. I doubt they're truly supposed to, it's likely just a quirk of the teleport mechanic: what probably happens is their teleportation ability ignores whether or not they know where you are, and once they teleport on top of you they get to see you since you're right in front of them.

    The only way to do this is to forcibly shed aggro. One sort of cruddy way is to just allow them to kill you, and either use Jibbers or be near a rez shrine. Not good if you're going for deathless runs, of course.

    Maybe you could experiment with summons? Summon a monster, use Diplomacy to divert aggro, and then sneak away. I have no idea how mobs behave in this situation, let alone teleporting mobs, I've used summons to reposition mobs but never to shed aggro, I don't know if the mob will forget about you when the summon dies, or if it will try to search before giving up finding you (in which case, for teleporting mobs, you're back to square one.)

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qezuzu View Post
    As far as I can tell, teleporting monsters get a hard-lock on you. I doubt they're truly supposed to, it's likely just a quirk of the teleport mechanic: what probably happens is their teleportation ability ignores whether or not they know where you are, and once they teleport on top of you they get to see you since you're right in front of them.

    The only way to do this is to forcibly shed aggro. One sort of cruddy way is to just allow them to kill you, and either use Jibbers or be near a rez shrine. Not good if you're going for deathless runs, of course.

    Maybe you could experiment with summons? Summon a monster, use Diplomacy to divert aggro, and then sneak away. I have no idea how mobs behave in this situation, let alone teleporting mobs, I've used summons to reposition mobs but never to shed aggro, I don't know if the mob will forget about you when the summon dies, or if it will try to search before giving up finding you (in which case, for teleporting mobs, you're back to square one.)
    That's good advice. I will play around with it and see if it works.

    Thanks again for your help.

  13. #33

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    I used a summon in Rusted Blades before DDooring away from the rack and it seemed to really help (poor troll though).

    Ghoste would use the ‘sacrificial dog’ (lowbie celestial dog summon) to initially draw aggro and shift mobs around.
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked at level 4!)


  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saekee View Post
    for framework, I would fly in using the nearby catapult, bypassing the gate and its traps. While the dialogue is occurring with the chieftain, only two scouts are active; I would stone them. Then I would pull the chieftain to the area behind the throne. The problem is that he manages to pull a ton of mobs up there if burst dps is too low...

    That sounds correct about DA—a spreading system. I was doing R1 Rusted Blades. I tainted the wrack with Improved Invisi active and DDoored out. Then the snowball appeared; DA just kept growing to eventually red when I had stepped down by the bell. Many drow warriors poured in. It may be that they activated some even that were standing in the corridors, but I am not sure. ( I decided to ddoor back up again, clear the mobs on the upper level and then the boss.)
    That's a clever approach, well done. Two issues with my solution were that monsters sometimes do spawn right in those alcoves and the chieftain will try to move away.

    It seemed best to get him into the alcove, position yourself so he's blocked in and can't wander back out, and so you don't have to move (and thereby make noise) while fighting him. I think using bluff a second time (after initially pulling him in) helps to keep him from raising the alarm for a short time after you attack him.

    And yes, once you have monsters moving after you using telepathy to determine your location regardless of sight and hearing range, intervening obstacles and your stealth scores, and spreading the alarm to other groups, DA seems to go absolutely nuts.

    I shouldn't keep railing about this issue, but that autolocation is by far the single worst problem with the stealth system we have now and it has just got to be fixed. The concept of an alarm makes perfect sense, but its lousy implementation and interaction with autolocation is what makes this all such a big mess.

    Thanks.

  15. #35
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    After a bazillion attempts at Irestone and Gwylans, I find this challenge to be just too aggravating to continue with. Cerlinad withdraws from it. Good luck to anyone else who works at it. The prize and bragging rights just are not worth the aggravation and heightened blood pressure to me.

  16. #36

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    Quote Originally Posted by digital_terror1 View Post
    After a bazillion attempts at Irestone and Gwylans, I find this challenge to be just too aggravating to continue with. Cerlinad withdraws from it. Good luck to anyone else who works at it. The prize and bragging rights just are not worth the aggravation and heightened blood pressure to me.
    Oh No!!! Are you sure you don’t want to just postpone those quests for another life? Maybe another build split that will make it easier?

    I found that those ones mainly just suffered aggro DA which cools down; if you use invisi scrolls and their traps (in Gwylan’s) against them, it is not too bad.
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked at level 4!)


  17. #37

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    Let me add that if anyone is having a tough time, feel free to post here asking for tips. I have some tips and suggestions posted in the links to my successes.
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked at level 4!)


  18. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    That's a clever approach, well done. Two issues with my solution were that monsters sometimes do spawn right in those alcoves and the chieftain will try to move away.

    It seemed best to get him into the alcove, position yourself so he's blocked in and can't wander back out, and so you don't have to move (and thereby make noise) while fighting him. I think using bluff a second time (after initially pulling him in) helps to keep him from raising the alarm for a short time after you attack him.

    And yes, once you have monsters moving after you using telepathy to determine your location regardless of sight and hearing range, intervening obstacles and your stealth scores, and spreading the alarm to other groups, DA seems to go absolutely nuts.
    I might toy with your approach too but it is so much easier waiting there above him. I use a flaming sphere and noisemakers to pull him up. I think my toon died due to lack of haste boost not achievable yet due to AP. With haste boost I could have dropped him quickly.
    On my run, I had the full red DA AND died even though I did not raise any scout alarms. Pyrrhic victory.
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked at level 4!)


  19. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saekee View Post
    Let me add that if anyone is having a tough time, feel free to post here asking for tips. I have some tips and suggestions posted in the links to my successes.
    This is a nice offer and I think would be very helpful to those of us who are still learning all the techniques and how to use them. If you think it is within the scope of this thread, I'd be very glad to see a list and discussion of the various techniques and tools you use.

    Most of my stealth runs involve using noisemakers and bluff to move creatures around, when they are in the way of where I want to go. Here are some things that more experienced stealth players probably already know but might be useful to other people like me who are still learning.

    Noisemakers can be placed in a line, to move monsters further away than using one by itself. If the ground is uneven, like other traps if you jump while placing it, the trap will appear in the air and fall onto the ground. That helps in those places where it is normally difficult to place traps.

    Bluff is much harder to use on some monsters than others. In particular, anything that is a divine caster of some sort usually has a significantly higher requirement than other monsters of the same type, so don't bluff them first. Bluff will also prevent monsters from alerting their friends to your attack, if you can kill them quickly enough (doesn't have to be an assassination but be careful not to move around so you make noise that might alert others).

    Glitterdust traps are also very useful because apart from blinding enemies, you can assassinate enemies that have been blinded by them even if you have their aggro. The traps have a large enough AoE that you can back up a bit to avoid a blinded enemy's wild swings (if they aren't also webbed) and the duration is long enough for assassinate to come off cooldown again (possibly twice) even if you led with it.

    Tremorsense has a larger detection radius than hearing or sight for monsters that haven't been attacked yet. So if the terrain is right, you can pull monsters with tremorsense (such as reapers) away from their groups. They do not alert their friends until they actually see you, and obstacles like crates and corners can help you stay unseen.

    If you have an ability that lets you phase out when you tumble, it can be used in stealth to pass through monsters without being detected. That can be useful for getting past monsters in narrow corridors without moving them around, but you have to be quick about it because lingering in front of them will increase your chances of detection.

    Again, I'd be very interested in seeing what other little tips and tricks people have, so maybe this thread could include a list of those techniques and some commentary about how best to make use of them. Most of the other resources I've found online do not address the recent changes to stealth and aggro.

    Thanks again to everyone posting here for such an interesting and informative thread.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qezuzu View Post
    Maybe you could experiment with summons? Summon a monster, use Diplomacy to divert aggro, and then sneak away. I have no idea how mobs behave in this situation, let alone teleporting mobs, I've used summons to reposition mobs but never to shed aggro, I don't know if the mob will forget about you when the summon dies, or if it will try to search before giving up finding you (in which case, for teleporting mobs, you're back to square one.)
    I attempted Sins of Attrition today and this technique worked with a single orthon. The orthon killed the summon but did not chase me afterwards. I had not wounded it at all; perhaps things would have been different if I had. When I left stealth later to call another summon, the orthon did not teleport to me.

    Sins is one of the quests I feel like it would be a particularly good achievement to do as a minimum kills run. There are a number of good stealth set pieces in it that I've been able to do in isolation, but so far stringing them all together into a single flawless run has eluded me. One thing I don't seem to have any control over is misadventure kills; I get varying low numbers of them each time, and it's not from pulling monsters into traps.

    Another quest that I'd like to do (or see done) as a minimal kills and no detection run is A Cabal for One. I think it's an interesting quest because of the lack of room to move around in and the fairly high monster density. There are few empty spaces to pull groups of monsters into, so it's quite a tense undertaking.

    Thanks.
    Last edited by blerkington; 11-27-2017 at 05:01 PM.

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