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Thread: Compendium Lite

  1. #141
    Community Member Systern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JonD View Post
    I like the concept of the Sagas not being in a separate window which needs to be brought up, but I don't think the choose-a-character dropdown should filter the quest list as it does in this mock-up. Suppose you wanted to go back to showing all characters in the quest list, so you go to the dropdown box where EllisDee has handily provided a "Show All" option, the columns reappear in the quest list, and then the Sagas table gets confused about what it's supposed to be doing because it can't show all characters at once. Obviously, this depends on exactly how the event handling is done, but I don't want to see EllisDee get tied in knots over an edge case.

    JonD
    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    The sagas screen already handles that case now. When you go to the sagas screen from the Tools screen, there is no active character selected. I did it that way because I felt the list of saga quests was valuable data even if you didn't use the compendium to track any characters.

    (If you then click the blank column header where the active character name would be, it opens the character screen with no character selected. Overkill, possibly?)
    As Ellis said, the current top option of the combo box is blank. This functionality is already existing.

    It's also pictured in the first mock-up screen I included. Notice the Dropdown is empty, and the displayed saga is more of a mint-green than Widdershin's forest-green, and the character column is the default grey. :P


    Basically I'm asking that he kill frmSagas.

    If he adds the spiffy functionality of flipping the notes field to the selected character. I'll thank him profusely, and then point out that it would make more sense to create a new tab called "Details" that has the Tomes and Past Lives controls on it, since you no longer need to dig into Edit Characters to get to notes (recommended in a frame that can be disabled easily if no char is selected). And since there's a details tab, you can put favor on that and kill off the Patrons form too! (Basic VB app design principle of mine. Use tabs or Child windows, but not both if at all possible.)

    And then the "Edit Characters" form can be renamed "Config" since it'll just have app settings and character creation settings.

    And then Progress sort can be added to "Left Click Action" so it's not a drop down with only one choice (unless you make more).

    And then I will be content to know my suckage is complete.

  2. #142

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    Yep, my thoughts exactly. The only thing you missed is adding a challenge tab to remove the challenge form as well.

    I'm wondering about adding a characters tab strip above the quests list itself. You could pick the active character (or Show All) from that tab, which would update the quests list on the left and and also the active right pane if it's on sagas, challenges, or notes / overview. It would be more intuitive there, as it would be filtering the quests list below it. It would also be weird there, because when it's set to Show All you would have two lists of characters on top of each other: tabs letting you "activate" a character, and column headers letting you edit characters.

    Would that be better than a dropdown on the right, do you think?

    If he adds the spiffy functionality of flipping the notes field to the selected character. I'll thank him profusely, and then point out that it would make more sense to create a new tab called "Details" that has the Tomes and Past Lives controls on it, since you no longer need to dig into Edit Characters to get to notes (recommended in a frame that can be disabled easily if no char is selected). And since there's a details tab, you can put favor on that and kill off the Patrons form too!
    I was thinking Overview, but yeah, exactly.

    When no character is specified, instead of all the spinners, tomes and past lives could be shown with a grid interface, similar to the skills grid in the character planner. This would let you see tome data for all your characters at once, which would be particularly useful when staring at a tome in a chest and wondering if any of your characters need it.

    It could also include raid timers. I'm thinking those could be handled in the quests list itself, where when you paint progress on a raid the timer automatically starts. Once active, instead of the progress difficulty, that cell would show time remaining. (HH:MM updating once a minute, then MM:SS updating every second once it's less than an hour.) Right click the cell to set, adjust and remove timers.

    But then on the Overview tab in the right, I could add a little table showing both the time remaining and the end time for all that character's active timers. As in "17 hours" in one column and "Tomorrow 8:36pm" in the other.

  3. #143
    Community Member Systern's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    Yep, my thoughts exactly. The only thing you missed is adding a challenge tab to remove the challenge form as well.
    Yea, I did.... I mean, uhm, I didn't wanna go from 'suck so hard' to 'absolute black hole'! Yeahhh...


    I'm wondering about adding a characters tab strip above the quests list itself. You could pick the active character (or Show All) from that tab, which would update the quests list on the left and and also the active right pane if it's on sagas, challenges, or notes / overview. It would be more intuitive there, as it would be filtering the quests list below it. It would also be weird there, because when it's set to Show All you would have two lists of characters on top of each other: tabs letting you "activate" a character, and column headers letting you edit characters.

    Would that be better than a dropdown on the right, do you think?
    How scalable is that? I take advantage of the main 4 I play being in one compendium and mules in another, but I can see that getting unwieldy for the people that run 20 alts in one compendium.
    I kinda prefer a combo box because it's less "visual noise" when the app is used as a companion to my questing like I currently use it.

    But, you already have the framework of the code written with the existing Quests tab panel, so I don't think it'd take you more than 20 mins to cut, paste, tweak, and run it to see if you like it.


    I was thinking Overview, but yeah, exactly.
    I thought that, then debated if tomes and past lives are a "general overview" thing, or a "detailed deep-dive" thing... Tomato, Toe-actually-botanically-it's-a-fruit,-a-berry-to-be-precise,-and-not-a-vegetable-mato.


    When no character is specified, instead of all the spinners, tomes and past lives could be shown with a grid interface, similar to the skills grid in the character planner. This would let you see tome data for all your characters at once, which would be particularly useful when staring at a tome in a chest and wondering if any of your characters need it.
    I like this idea a lot.

    It could also include raid timers. I'm thinking those could be handled in the quests list itself, where when you paint progress on a raid the timer automatically starts. Once active, instead of the progress difficulty, that cell would show time remaining. (HH:MM updating once a minute, then MM:SS updating every second once it's less than an hour.) Right click the cell to set, adjust and remove timers.

    But then on the Overview tab in the right, I could add a little table showing both the time remaining and the end time for all that character's active timers. As in "17 hours" in one column and "Tomorrow 8:36pm" in the other.
    Oooh, oooh! If you're going to do timers... What would be more useful for me isn't raid timers, but ransack timers. I JUST got Ravenloft 2 weeks ago, and ransacked 6 of my characters looking for choice loot (burnscar sash, keylock ring, yadda) so having the option to add a ransack timer (168 hours) into this list would be truly magnificent.

    Probably pretty easy. I like that suggestion for being both easy and useful, but only if I were currently working on the programs. Which I wasn't...
    "I wasn't" is past tense, unlike "I'm not".... Muahahah! I guess that's why I suck. Hey at least I didn't start singing "I'd like to buy the world a coke, and keep it company..." and put that earworm in your brain.

  4. #144

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    Quote Originally Posted by Systern View Post
    What would be more useful for me isn't raid timers, but ransack timers. I JUST got Ravenloft 2 weeks ago, and ransacked 6 of my characters looking for choice loot (burnscar sash, keylock ring, yadda) so having the option to add a ransack timer (168 hours) into this list would be truly magnificent.
    That's not a bad idea. Any thoughts on how to implement it?

    The problem with handling chest timers in the quests list itself (similar to raid timers as described above) is that there are two pieces of data to show, but only room for one: The timer countdown, and the number of times you've opened the chest. In a perfect world it would also show the end time ("Tomorrow 8:36pm") but now that's three datapoints.

    So if the quests list isn't the place for it, I could do a grid in the character Overview tab named Farming. You would manually add quests to the farming list (maybe by right-clicking it in the quests list and choosing "Add Farm") and then click something in the farming list to increment(/edit) completions. You'd also be able to manually edit the timer, using whatever interface I come up with for editing raid timers. (Writing a control to allow choosing a date/time will be actual work, but at least that would be different and interesting.)

    That's just spitballing. Feedback welcome.



    The biggest issue I have preventing me from starting this right now is very minor but crucial. Right now, if you shrink the compendium window, the left and right panes snap together into one unified pane. The cutoff for this is when the tabs overlap the Play button, which allows a right pane when the total window width is just under 1600 pixels on my screen. That pixel count changes based on the user's DPI settings in Windows.

    Adding more tabs and a dropdown could end up being so wide that on certain DPI settings, even a standard 1920x1080 display might not be able to show two panes, but just barely, leaving a vast ocean of blank space on the right with the unified tabs on the left taking up only half the screen.

    That means I need to come up with a space-efficient interface for all these new goodies, and I can't really wrap my head around starting anything until I nail down the interface. That's what led to me wondering about character tabs on the left.

    Maybe just add a "Character" tab to the end of the right pane tabs, and put the dropdown inside that tab. The tab could also have its own tabs along the top, just under the main tab. Maybe something like:

    Notes | Links | XP | Wilderness | Characters
    Overview | Epic Sagas | Heroic Sagas | Challenges | Timers

    The two-story tab concept turned out better than I expected with the augment picker in the crafting planner, so I don't hate this idea in theory. I think it would be a bit clunky but fairly efficient in terms of usability once you got used to it.

    More ideas welcome.

    EDIT: Timers being its own tab may be unnecessary; I could potentially add them to Overview.

  5. #145
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    The sagas screen already handles that case now. When you go to the sagas screen from the Tools screen, there is no active character selected.
    Ah, I've only ever gone there from right-clicking the character name. Never mind, then. With the amount of options to explore and discover, try persuading SSG that you should design the next wilderness...

    Quote Originally Posted by Systern View Post
    As Ellis said, the current top option of the combo box is blank. This functionality is already existing.
    It's also pictured in the first mock-up screen I included. Notice the Dropdown is empty, and the displayed saga is more of a mint-green than Widdershin's forest-green, and the character column is the default grey. :P
    The fact that you included a blank option in a *mock-up* is not an indication that it is already present in the actual software, so save the sarcasm in future, please.

    Quote Originally Posted by Systern View Post
    Basically I'm asking that he kill frmSagas.
    Yes, and I was concerned about a particular detail to which Ellis has already responded, so I'm not sure why you felt like you needed to jump in with dodgy logic. Repeating your request with slightly different phrasing as though I was too stupid to understand it in the first place was unnecessary.

    Quote Originally Posted by Systern View Post
    Basic VB app design principle of mine.
    I know from personal experience that, just as battle plans never survive contact with the enemy, design principles never survive contact with the real world.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    I'm wondering about adding a characters tab strip above the quests list itself. ... Would that be better than a dropdown on the right, do you think?
    For the reasons you went through, I think the dropdown would be better. As long as there's a nice clear "Filter For Character:" (or similar) label, it should be fine.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    When no character is specified, instead of all the spinners, tomes and past lives could be shown with a grid interface, similar to the skills grid in the character planner. This would let you see tome data for all your characters at once, which would be particularly useful when staring at a tome in a chest and wondering if any of your characters need it.
    Any chance of adding favor onto that tab? If I need to grab a few extra DDO points, being able to tell at a glance who's closest to a threshold is really handy.

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    It could also include raid timers.
    As long as you could (also) manually adjust the timer, that would be excellent. When finishing a raid at 2 a.m. some people are unlikely to consider going to the compendium to start a timer as a high priority.

    JonD
    Last edited by JonD; 02-13-2019 at 05:31 AM.

  6. #146

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    Quick update to let you know that I haven't been working on my lite tools at all. Looking at file dates, the last time I sat down to work on them was February 23rd.

    I have not abandoned them, but I still as yet have no motivation to update them for the Sharn expansion. (That global AP tome is a kick in the teeth. Everything else is straightforward.) I'm very fond of my lite tools and have no desire to see them fade into history, but just no motivation yet.

    I'll post back when I start working on them again. Maybe in May? Who knows.

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    Quick update to let you know that I haven't been working on my lite tools at all. Looking at file dates, the last time I sat down to work on them was February 23rd.

    I have not abandoned them, but I still as yet have no motivation to update them for the Sharn expansion. (That global AP tome is a kick in the teeth. Everything else is straightforward.) I'm very fond of my lite tools and have no desire to see them fade into history, but just no motivation yet.

    I'll post back when I start working on them again. Maybe in May? Who knows.
    Do what you have to do for your mental health, friend - and thanks for all the inspired love you have already spent. I appreciate it and use your tools and other guides often.

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