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  1. #1
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    Default No challenge left in the game?

    Hey everyone. I just returned to DDO after a 5 or 6 year hiatus and it strikes me how incredibly spoiled we are for loot and XP these days. On my first day of playing, I looted a +4 INT item in the Waterworks. Back when I used to play, a +4 INT item was a huge thing, something to get really excited about. I think I was level 12 when I got my first +4 stat item. Now, I sell +3 and +4 stat items to the general vendor because I don't have room for them all. And I've been playing for 5 days and just hit lvl 8.

    Also, I've soloed everything on elite so far, without even breaking a sweat. And that's without being able to disable traps. I just load up on resist/protection from energy and 2-3 temporary hit points spells and walk right through the traps. Grouping used to be an absolute must unless you wanted to stick to normal difficulty.

    I'm even starting to wonder if I want to continue playing since there seems to be no challenge at all...

    I guess I'm not the only one? And does it get better soon or is epic the only challenge left in the game?

    Cheers

  2. #2
    Community Member AbyssalMage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunklezhan View Post
    If they'd left Champs closer to their first iteration I suspect the op would be having more problems
    Because everyone enjoys being one shotted. Turbine doesn't need to implement champions if they wanted to allow players to be one shotted. It's bad enough that on EE, it's still possible (although thankfully very unlikely) unless you are either Barbarian, Paladin, or a TYWA Dwarf. There is nothing like taking 800+ damage in an instant. Kinda like Disintegrate to the face during HE levels.
    Quote Originally Posted by hp1055cm View Post
    They have been tweaking the game since I started and often I disagree with them. They focus on wrong stuff, over or under compensate and abandon too much stuff. Every once in awhile they get something right, if only temporarily.

  3. #3
    Hopeless Romantic dunklezhan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AbyssalMage View Post
    Because everyone enjoys being one shotted. Turbine doesn't need to implement champions if they wanted to allow players to be one shotted. It's bad enough that on EE, it's still possible (although thankfully very unlikely) unless you are either Barbarian, Paladin, or a TYWA Dwarf. There is nothing like taking 800+ damage in an instant. Kinda like Disintegrate to the face during HE levels.
    I said closer. Not exactly the same. The nerf was needed - but it didn't need to be as big a nerf as it was.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    The best of the best DDO players generally overperform when given a real challenge
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  4. #4
    The Hatchery Wipey's Avatar
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    If you were looking for interesting combat, you could not have chose worse than warlock in heroics heh.
    Latest p2w pet project, completely disregarding any power vs content balance.

    It's not really much better in epics. EN and EH are completely trivial for anyone with slightest amount of gaming/ddo experience. EE is routine for lot of people since new producer changes.
    There are still couple classes or archetypes that might offer more than "gather 10 EE mobs and autoattack" but it's the same combat most the time. No healing, crowd control, mob pulling, line of sight use, spell/weakness/mobs knowledge needed.
    No respect for mobs, traps or or "champions". No real danger of failing.

    And no, I don't remember doing hards as a new player either. Took me few years to start solo elites, then start joining old epics, another year or two to even attempt epic elites or joining good raiding people.
    I remember preparing for raids, learning and failing quests too.

    But apparently it makes more sense for Turbine to appease easy button forum lobby and removing what's left from class diversity and different options completely.

    tl;dr I'd abandon warlock if you are looking for interesting combat and some sense of progress or achievement.
    Welcome back.

    Shahang (evo cleric), Wipekin (tempest), Nezhat (barbie) Ghallanda/Devourer

  5. #5
    Community Member Darkmits's Avatar
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    Lower level quests are always easy in the vast majority of games to help introduce players. If you want to see how well you remember the game, go for "Proof is in the Poison" solo at level 6, especially without past lives and gear from them or from alts.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wipey View Post
    No healing, crowd control, mob pulling, line of sight use, spell/weakness/mobs knowledge needed.

    That's very sad to hear. For me, these points are the essense of what made DDO combat so superior to all other MMOs. Especially crowd control and mob knowledge. I remember having an entire tab in my backpack full of weapons to bypass different DRs.


    So, what class would be more fun to play then? I'm interested in artificer (possibly with splash of rogue?) and pure wizard/pale master. Would those be better for me?

  7. #7
    Founder Grimborn's Avatar
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    First of all welcome back. That being said, for a fun build try a bard. The game has changed a lot since the old days of having to have a full group to accomplish a given quest.
    The easy button has been available since the free to play module was born. Most builds are way more powerful now then ever before. Knowledge of any given quest will give you
    great advantage to complete the quest. Warlock is way over powered. I TR'd my sorc into one, when he gets to 20 I will TR him back to a air savant sorc again. More fun for me
    in that class anyways. Good luck and hope you stick around for awhile.
    Gum Shoe~Drow Elf Rogue Hackin Slash~Human Fighter
    Timkin~Drow Elf Sorc Aarone Stone~Human Bard
    Tarnaa~Human Favored Soul Alcaden~Human Paladin
    Tipsee McStagger~Halfling Rogue Brawwn~Half-Orc Barbarian

  8. #8

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    welcome back!

    Certain classes are the equivalent of training wheels on bicycles; vets with self-esteem would not be caught playing them to cap. Pure barbs, warlocks and paladins got ridiculous buffs and self sufficiency. They are fine for newbs, though.

    Pure rogue assassins are highly tactical and require live action combat and tactical play (stealth, bluff, aggro control etc) to optimize, for example.
    Wiki dashboard with some useful stealthplay links
    Proud Knight of the Silver Legion, Cannith: Saekee (main; epic completionist), Naerfelka (farmer), Saelegion (parked level 4)
    Quote Originally Posted by Annex View Post
    Hope extinguished leaves fading memories of better times.

  9. #9

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    Welcome back. Reaper mode is coming next year...

  10. #10
    Community Member bartharok's Avatar
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    I made a new oddball toon on a new server and made him a one man guild. Suddenly the game became harder.
    Dystopia = utopia achieved

  11. #11
    Community Member Tlorrd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AbyssalMage View Post
    Because everyone enjoys being one shotted. Turbine doesn't need to implement champions if they wanted to allow players to be one shotted. It's bad enough that on EE, it's still possible (although thankfully very unlikely) unless you are either Barbarian, Paladin, or a TYWA Dwarf. There is nothing like taking 800+ damage in an instant. Kinda like Disintegrate to the face during HE levels.
    It's called making a build with PRR/MRR and other damage mitigation techniques (displacement, various cloud obscurement, ghostly, blur, etc, etc) all of these things are available as clickies, scrolls, or part of a class enhancements/spells or epic destinies. Just be creative and EEs become easy and you won't be one shotted.

  12. #12
    Community Member Jetrule's Avatar
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    Stay with your warlock and keep running elite. Your first hard quest that will kill you is coming up in a at level ToEE run with your level 9 solo warlock. Then there are the new archon and devil's gambit quests. Running those at level solo on your character will be very challenging. Wheloon, Stormhorns, Shavarath, all in the upper heroics will test you as well. Any of these with a good party, or a multi tr well equipped and tomed character solo become much less challenging. Most of the old content has not changed while characters power has incremented upwards. The Newer quests however are by and large more balanced to current character capabilities.
    Percivaul Dusol, BadRandall and Shortpact--The Silver Legion

  13. #13
    The Hatchery Enoach's Avatar
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    I also remember a time getting a masterwork weapon was a celebration and being jealous of the person that looted the +1 weapon . When breaking every barrel wasn't just for XP but to get some coin or potions we could not afford. When turning in collectables helped us by stocking players with cure wands, and even those who could not use the wands would get them to hand to a wizard/sorcerer/cleric/bard in the party to help the party succeed in a quest.

    You are not wrong, years ago the loot was harder to get. Couple that with True Reincarnation where players have stored the "best gear for that level"
    Last edited by Enoach; 09-27-2015 at 01:24 PM.

  14. #14
    Community Member Kawai's Avatar
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    Thumbs up shinies

    Quote Originally Posted by Enoach View Post
    I also remember a time getting a masterwork weapon was a celebration and being jealous of the person that looted the +1 weapon . When breaking every barrel wasn't just for XP but to get some coin or potions we could not afford. When turning in collectables helped us by stocking players with cure wands, and even those who could not use the wands would get them to hand to a wizard/sorcerer/cleric/bard in the party to help the party succeed in a quest.

    You are not wrong, years ago the loot was harder to get. Couple that with True Reincarnation where players have stored the "best gear for that level"
    +1

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jetrule View Post
    Stay with your warlock and keep running elite. Your first hard quest that will kill you is coming up in a at level ToEE run with your level 9 solo warlock. Then there are the new archon and devil's gambit quests. Running those at level solo on your character will be very challenging. Wheloon, Stormhorns, Shavarath, all in the upper heroics will test you as well. Any of these with a good party, or a multi tr well equipped and tomed character solo become much less challenging. Most of the old content has not changed while characters power has incremented upwards. The Newer quests however are by and large more balanced to current character capabilities.
    Yeah, I hadn't even though of that. Very good point.

    I've been thinking about buying ToEE to try something new. Do I need access to Forgotten Realms to play it? Someone mentioned that the other day, which I found pretty odd since it was originally a Greyhawk module.

    Gianthold is also something I am considering.

    Another option is to just buy a month of VIP to try out different packs before buying, I guess.

  16. #16
    Community Member Sisma's Avatar
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    Any decent build played by a "good player" (where "good player" simply stands for anyone who knows what he's doing) can easily own every low level content, literally as knife thru butter. From Gianthold on is a whole new story, just because DDO has so much more to offer now than 5 years ago. And it has yo be this way, no one wants to play a game that doesn't change in time...
    Proud member of the Silver Legion

  17. #17
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    I went ahead and bought one month of VIP. I will level up to at least 15 and try to run newish content only before I pass any sort of judgement.

    Everything after Demon Sands is kind of new to me, though, even though I did a bit of Gianthold and Vale (I think.. if Vale is where Rainbow in the Night is? I remember the name because of.. well.. Dio. Metal ftw) back in 2010. I actually got to lvl 16 with some ******** 8 ftr/6 rgr/2 bbn TwF build I did. I have no idea what it was I was trying to achieve but I still have the character.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darkmits View Post
    Lower level quests are always easy in the vast majority of games to help introduce players. If you want to see how well you remember the game, go for "Proof is in the Poison" solo at level 6, especially without past lives and gear from them or from alts.
    I don't think that is his point. He is an old DDO player, he remembers the lower levels being much much harder, now they are a joke. I concur with him and it doesn't even require a multi-TR character to see that.

    As for the "easy to help new players", why do we have casual, normal, hard, and elite if players can easily do elite? Aren't those lesser difficulties there for that very purpose?

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by tarkin1980 View Post
    I went ahead and bought one month of VIP. I will level up to at least 15 and try to run newish content only before I pass any sort of judgement.

    Everything after Demon Sands is kind of new to me, though, even though I did a bit of Gianthold and Vale (I think.. if Vale is where Rainbow in the Night is? I remember the name because of.. well.. Dio. Metal ftw) back in 2010. I actually got to lvl 16 with some ******** 8 ftr/6 rgr/2 bbn TwF build I did. I have no idea what it was I was trying to achieve but I still have the character.
    Won't change much. Some of the new content will be a bit harder (TOEE), but that is only if you don't have the shiny new armor up gear. Other than that, it is going to be faceroll everything unless you really try to push higher than your level content and then the "hard" will be being 1 shot by some random mob. Enjoy the new content though, for a first run they are interesting, but you will find the game very quickly becomes a boring process of pounding buttons. /shrug

  20. #20
    Community Member bartharok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xenich View Post
    Won't change much. Some of the new content will be a bit harder (TOEE), but that is only if you don't have the shiny new armor up gear. Other than that, it is going to be faceroll everything unless you really try to push higher than your level content and then the "hard" will be being 1 shot by some random mob. Enjoy the new content though, for a first run they are interesting, but you will find the game very quickly becomes a boring process of pounding buttons. /shrug
    Umm... Either you really shouldnt be playing the game, or you are exaggerating for effect. Or something else...
    Dystopia = utopia achieved

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