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  1. #1

    Default Bard Trapper for new players

    For an excellent charisma-based swashbuckler that has EE-capable crowd control, see the Count of Monte Cristo build by CThruTheEgo.

    The first few dozen posts in this thread have an unusually high signal-to-noise ratio, well worth reading as we debate the merits of the various build choices made.


    This build is still in the theorycrafting stage, but I have run a pure bard to cap so it's not totally theory.

    The concept will be two different builds: First life will be strength-based and totally F2P. After the first life the plan is to TR into an int-based Harper version, possibly adding in 3 fighter levels for defensive stance. That will be a much later post, when I actually get there. Since this will compete with my completionist for play time it might take a while, but I do plan to roll up the first life now to participate in mikarddo's 10 week competition, so I wanted to post this for my own reference.

    For the Improved Critical feat, choose the one that's best for the weapons you can reasonably acquire. See the Gear post (at some point in the future) for more info.


    Bard Trapper
    18/2 Bard/Rogue
    True Neutral Human


    Level Order

    1. Rogue. . . . . .6. Rogue . . . . .11. Bard . . . . . 16. Bard
    2. Bard . . . . . .7. Bard. . . . . .12. Bard . . . . . 17. Bard
    3. Bard . . . . . .8. Bard. . . . . .13. Bard . . . . . 18. Bard
    4. Bard . . . . . .9. Bard. . . . . .14. Bard . . . . . 19. Bard
    5. Bard . . . . . 10. Bard. . . . . .15. Bard . . . . . 20. Bard



    Stats
    . . . . . . . .28pt . . 32pt . . Level Up
    . . . . . . . .---- . . ---- . . --------
    Strength. . . . 16. . . .16. . . .4: STR
    Dexterity . . . 14. . . .14. . . .8: STR
    Constitution. . 14. . . .14. . . 12: STR
    Intelligence. . 14. . . .14. . . 16: STR
    Wisdom. . . . . .8. . . . 8. . . 20: STR
    Charisma. . . . .8. . . .12. . . 24: STR
    . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: STR


    Skills
    . . . . . R .B. B .B. B .R. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B. B .B
    . . . . . 1 .2. 3 .4. 5 .6. 7 .8. 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
    . . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
    Perform . 2 .2. . .1. 3 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
    Disable . 4 .1. 1 .1. . .2. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
    Search. . 4 .1. 1 .1. . .2. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
    Spot. . . 4 .1. 1 .1. . .2. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
    UMD . . . 4 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 23
    Concent . 2 . . 2 .1. 2 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 1 .1. 22
    Balance . 4 . . . . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .7
    Open Lo . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
    Jump. . . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
    Haggle. . 4 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4
    Swim. . . 3 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .3
    Tumble. . 1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1
    . . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
    . . . . .44 .9. 9 .9. 9 11. 9 .9. 9 .9. 9 .9. 9 .9. 9 .9. 9 .9. 9 .9



    Feats

    .1. . . . : Single Weapon Fighting
    .1 Human. : Magical Training
    .3. . . . : Precision
    .6. . . . : Extend Spell
    .9. . . . : Improved Single Weapon Fighting
    12. . . . : Improved Critical: Piercing OR Slashing OR Bludgeoning
    15. . . . : Empower Healing Spell
    18. . . . : Greater Single Weapon Fighting
    21 Epic . : Inspire Excellence
    24 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
    26 Destiny: Lasting Inspiration
    27 Epic . : Epic Reflexes
    28 Destiny: Perfect Single Weapon Fighting


    Spells

    1. Expeditious Retreat, Cure Light Wounds, Detect Secret Doors, Remove Fear, Merfolk's Blessing
    2. Cure Moderate Wounds, Heroism, Rage, Invisibility, Blur
    3. Displacement, Haste, Cure Serious Wounds, Good Hope, <Any>
    4. Freedom of Movement, Dimension Door, Cure Critical Wounds, <Any>
    5. Greater Heroism, Shadow Walk, Mass Cure Light Wounds, Greater Dispel Magic
    6. <Any>, <Any>, <Any>


    Enhancements (80 AP)

    Swashbuckler (38 AP)
    • Confidence, Swashbuckling, Uncanny Dodge, Panache, Roll with the Punches
      1. On Your Toes III, Tavern Shanties I
      2. Deflect Arrows, Fast Movement, Double Strike Boost III
      3. Skirmisher, Resonant Arms III
      4. On the Mark II, Low Blow
      5. Thread the Needle, Second Skin I, Exploit Weakness, Coup de Grace: Melee

    Warchanter (32 AP)
    • Skaldic: Rage, Weapon Training, Song of Heroism, Fighting Spirit, Victory Song
      1. Enchant Weapon, Rough and Ready III
      2. Iced Edges III, Sprint Boost I
      3. Ironskin Chant III, High Spirits III, Frozen Fury III, Strength
      4. Reckless Chant III, Northwind I, Strength

    Spellsinger (4 AP)
    • Spellsinger
      1. Lingering Songs III

    Human (6 AP)
    • Damage Boost, Strength, Saves Boost
      1. Improved Recovery

    Leveling Guide
    1. (bank 4 AP)
    2. Skaldic: Rage, Enchant Weapon, Confidence, Tavern Shanties I, On Your Toes III
    3. Fast Movement, Deflect Arrows
    4. Swashbuckling, Skirmisher, Resonant Arms I
    5. Resonant Arms III
    6. Spellsinger, Lingering Songs III
    7. Rough and Ready II, Weapon Training, Sprint Boost I
    8. Uncanny Dodge, Iced Edges III
    9. Song of Heroism, High Spirits III
    10. Double Strike Boost II
    11. Damage Boost, Low Blow, Double Strike Boost III
    12. Strength, On the Mark I
    13. On the Mark II, Saves Boost, Rough and Ready III
    14. Panache, Thread the Needle, Coup de Grace: Melee
    15. Exploit Weakness, Ironskin Chant II
    16. Ironskin Chant III, Frozen Fury I, Strength
    17. Fighting Spirit, Reckless Chant III
    18. Northwind I, Frozen Fury III
    19. Improved Recovery, Second Skin I, Roll with the Punches
    20. Strength, Victory Song


    Destiny (24 AP)

    Fatesinger
    1. Allure III, Music of the Spider Queen, Strength
    2. Strength
    3. Aria III, Strength
    4. Echoes of Martial, Strength
    5. Fragment of Clarity II, Fragment of Valor I, Strength
    6. Strength


    Take your free +2 tome from 1750 favor as int; a +2 int tome (at minimum) will be assumed for the harper version.

    The Fatesinger destiny is far from optimized; it's just for flavor on a first life, then once it's maxed TR into the int-based harper version and switch to either LD or DC.

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  5. #5

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    Here are some videos of this character running mikarddo's 10 week competition on a first life. All quests are run true solo (no hireling) on elite:

    Week 1, Level 1: Kobold Assault
    Week 2, Level 3: Small Problem (rolled an artie for this since bard aggro issues make keeping brawny alive without hire problematic)
    Week 3, Level 4: The Pit
    Week 3, Level 7: Temple of Elemental Evil - pt 1 (failed run, died on way to end fight)
    Week 4, Level 7: CR14 Kobold Chaos

  6. #6
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    It's probably unfair to post before you finish filling the thread, but a few comments / suggestions:
    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    .1 Human. : Magical Training
    I would skip this feat and take Magical Studies from Spellsinger instead, which grants it free. Might I suggest squeezing in Shield Mastery & ISM instead? You have to drop one of your metamagics, but the extra PRR from ISM and +10% Dodge from Skirmisher are nice survivability bonuses.
    12. . . . : Improved Critical: Slashing
    I'm inferring you plan to use sickles?
    15. . . . :
    Here is where I would put ISM.
    Fatesinger
    I recommend taking Turn of the Tide; it's not the greatest Epic Moment, unfortunately, but it's nice to have for boss fights & the like. Certainly it's more interesting than another +1 STR.
    Major build threads: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard / Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
    My Build Index: a Motley Menagerie of Original Rapscallions, Pugilists, and Gimps!

  7. #7
    Bacon Queen MadCookieQueen's Avatar
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    I think unbongwah hits the main points of suggestions:

    .1. . . . : Single Weapon Fighting
    .1 Human. : Shield Mastery
    .3. . . . : Precision
    .6. . . . : Empower Healing Spell or Maximize or Quicken all for Cure Critical Wounds Use (if it was me, I'd recommend Quicken, as you cannot afford to have your healing spell interrupted and I'm not planning on a new players having to twist in Rejuv Cocoon)
    .9. . . . : Improved Single Weapon Fighting
    12. . . . : Improved Critical: Slashing
    15. . . . : Improved Shield Mastery
    18. . . . : Greater Single Weapon Fighting
    21 Epic . : Inspire Excellence
    24 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
    26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting -- Please note this requires 1 maxed destiny out of Primal...A fresh off of korthos person will not have this, expect them to take Toughness
    27 Epic . : Epic Reflexes
    28 Destiny: Lasting Inspiration Makes more sense (and by this point you will have a maxed out Arcane destiny for it), longer Inspire Excellence is a benefit for everyone, and more songs allows a new player to use Reign, Fascinate or refresh beneficial songs more often.

    On a 28 point build with only 8 CHA they will not be able to cast anything out of the Bard spell book without charisma items, their fascinate, perform, UMD, will suffer, which affects CDG DCs, sonic power for SB sonic procs and overall crowd control (fascinate can save your tail end and you can run around while playing it). I would recommend dropping the Strength and the INT down a bit (15/12 respectively) to get a higher Charisma.

    On skills, Id recommend fitting some Heal in there as anything to boost your Healing Spells is ideal. Potions and scrolls can and do get interrupted, thus why using Cure Critical is vital (trust me as someone who plays Bards like there's not tomorrow)

    Enhancements:

    Swashbuckler (42):
    C: Confidence (1), Swashbuckling (1), Uncanny Dodge (1), Panache (1), Roll with the Punches (1)
    I: On Your Toes III (3), Blow by Blow III (3),
    II: Sword Dance III (6), Action Boost: Double Strike III (6), Fast Movement (2)
    III: Elegant Footwork (2), Fast Movement (2), Style – Skirmisher (1), Resonant Arms III (6),
    V: Thread Needle (2), Exploit weakness (2), CDG (2)


    Spellsinger (5):
    C: Spellsinger (1)
    I: Lingering I (1), Magical Studies III (3)

    Human (3):
    C: Damage Boost
    I: Improved Recovery


    Warchanter (30):
    C: Skaldic Rage (1), Weapon Training (1), Song of Heroism (1),Fighting Spirit (1)
    I: Rough and Ready III (3), Enchant Weapon (2)
    II: Iced Edges III (3), Action Boost: Sprint III (3)
    III: Iron Skin Chant III (3), STR I (2), Frozen Fury III (3)
    IV: Reckless Chant III (3), Northwind II (4)

    For a leveling order I recommend human (heal amp is very nice to have early), Spellsinger (spell points are a must), Swashbuckler (this is your core enhancement tree) and Warchanter (icing on the cake...pun intended). I'd go back and forth with swashbuckler and warchanter in leveling them up but always go swashbuckler first.



    For 6th level spells I recommend, Hero's Feast, Cure Moderate Mass and Otto's Irresitable

    as for Fatesinger...you really want Reign in there. I would rethink that as well.

  8. #8
    Community Member Tinco's Avatar
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    I wouldn't recommend IC:slashing for a new player. There are decent sickles out there, but not one of them is particularly easy to acquire. Piercing weapons are the way to go; decent rapiers, shortswords and daggers drop pretty often.

    Another very valid option for new players, especially trappers, is going full human for GH.
    The best days are the days you don't have to wear socks or shoes.

  9. #9
    Bacon Queen MadCookieQueen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tinco View Post
    I wouldn't recommend IC:slashing for a new player. There are decent sickles out there, but not one of them is particularly easy to acquire. Piercing weapons are the way to go; decent rapiers, shortswords and daggers drop pretty often.

    Another very valid option for new players, especially trappers, is going full human for GH.
    Not just sickles but handaxes are also slashing, but rapiers tend to be a better choice.

    Bards get GH as a spell (level 13 Bard) and in the Warchanter Tree (Core 3) as a song version.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tinco View Post
    I wouldn't recommend IC:slashing for a new player. There are decent sickles out there, but not one of them is particularly easy to acquire.
    Widowblight is particularly easy to acquire, and is from a F2P quest. And...paralyzing!

    I say it's particularly easy because it's a turn-in mechanic outside the quest -- like the shards from Tear of Dhakaan -- meaning difficulty is irrelevant and no completion (or boss fight) is required. So blast through on casual, completely ignoring Whisperdoom, run to the three spots where the papers drop and keep trying.

    Widowblight was way overpowered against everything during heroic levels on my last swashbuckler life, ignoring the yellow numbers from all the DR it doesn't break.

    An example of a difficult to acquire item would be Tharkuul's Bane, which is a crazy uber DR breaker for heroics but nigh impossible to deliberately farm. Invaders! is hard enough for a new player to complete once, and you have to complete it ~7 times just for a chance to get a single pull. I blasted through it on elite 20 times and only got two or three chest pulls, with no joy. I just lucked out and found one on the ah for 12 shards buyout (!) so I grabbed it, but it's definitely not required. Widowblight more than gets the job done.

  11. #11

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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    I would skip this feat and take Magical Studies from Spellsinger instead, which grants it free.
    At the cost of another 3 AP, but it's easy enough to drop Strength and Saves Boost (which I take for the crucible swim) from the human tree to fit it in. I personally wouldn't, but it's a legitimate option, for sure. (I "wouldn't" as in I didn't on my swashbuckler life, and didn't miss it.)

    Might I suggest squeezing in Shield Mastery & ISM instead? You have to drop one of your metamagics, but the extra PRR from ISM and +10% Dodge from Skirmisher are nice survivability bonuses.
    You can't. Rogues aren't proficient with shields, so you don't qualify for shield mastery at level 1.

    The human bonus feat is actually super tricky. As a rogue, metamagics are obviously out, and every other combat feat taken requires at least 1 BAB. I originally set it as Skill Focus: Perform, but then when I rolled it up in-game it turns out that SF:P still requires Bard levels, even though the skill itself no longer does. So even that isn't an option. In the end I was left choosing between toughness and magical training. I deemed magical training the better choice.

    This build positively screams to be a Shadar-kai since the human bonus feat is a throw-away, but if they don't get the bonus skill point per level the skills will be stretched pretty thin.

  12. #12
    Bacon Queen MadCookieQueen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post

    The human bonus feat is actually super tricky. As a rogue, metamagics are obviously out, and every other combat feat taken requires at least 1 BAB. I originally set it as Skill Focus: Perform, but then when I rolled it up in-game it turns out that SF:P still requires Bard levels, even though the skill itself no longer does. So even that isn't an option. In the end I was left choosing between toughness and magical training. I deemed magical training the better choice.

    This build positively screams to be a Shadar-kai since the human bonus feat is a throw-away, but if they don't get the bonus skill point per level the skills will be stretched pretty thin.
    You're right, I completely missed that rogues dont' get shields, but you might want to consider this for a feat line up for getting around the BAB and proficiency issues:

    .1. . . . : Single Weapon Fighting
    .1 Human. : Dodge
    .3. . . . : Precision
    .6. . . . : Empower Healing Spell or Maximize or Quicken
    .9. . . . : Improved Single Weapon Fighting
    12. . . . : Improved Critical: Slashing or Piercing
    15. . . . : Shield Mastery
    18. . . . : Greater Single Weapon Fighting
    21 Epic . : Inspire Excellence
    24 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
    26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting -- Please note this requires 1 maxed destiny out of Primal...A fresh off of korthos person will not have this, expect them to take Toughness
    27 Epic . : Improved Shield Mastery
    28 Destiny: Lasting Inspiration

  13. #13

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    I did actually consider dodge, but it seemed like overkill. With skirmisher, the one thing you're not lacking is dodge.

    EDIT: I also considered Exotic Weapon: Kama for the brush hook, since hey, it's a throwaway feat anyway, right? But sadly Exotic Weapon also requires 1 BAB.

  14. #14
    Bacon Queen MadCookieQueen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    I did actually consider dodge, but it seemed like overkill. With skirmisher, the one thing you're not lacking is dodge.
    there is no overkill...just kill ^^

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by MadCookieQueen View Post
    On a 28 point build with only 8 CHA they will not be able to cast anything out of the Bard spell book without charisma items
    I view it like wisdom for a paladin or ranger. It's a fair point to keep in mind, though, since paladins and rangers don't have to worry about it until level 4, whereas you'll want to start casting buffs immediately at level 2. Fortunately the cha pots in the market are ML2.

    their fascinate, perform, UMD, will suffer, which affects CDG DCs
    On my swashbuckler life, my fascinate was more than sufficient. Losing 3 off the DC should still be close to no-fail for heroics.

    Strength and the INT down a bit (15/12 respectively) to get a higher Charisma.
    Int is needed for skill points, already stretched thin.

    On skills, Id recommend fitting some Heal in there as anything to boost your Healing Spells is ideal. Potions and scrolls can and do get interrupted, thus why using Cure Critical is vital (trust me as someone who plays Bards like there's not tomorrow)
    11 heal (the most you can get from a cross-class skill) would be a negligible benefit for the cost.

    Also, I use concentration. I suspect you are accustomed to running Epic Elite, where concentration does nothing, so you don't put any ranks in it. If you max it it works great everywhere else, no quicken needed. On my swashbuckler life I did all my healing with cure spells.

    Swashbuckler (42):
    C: Confidence (1), Swashbuckling (1), Uncanny Dodge (1), Panache (1), Roll with the Punches (1)
    I: On Your Toes III (3), Blow by Blow III (3),
    II: Sword Dance III (6), Action Boost: Double Strike III (6), Fast Movement (2)
    III: Elegant Footwork (2), Fast Movement (2), Style – Skirmisher (1), Resonant Arms III (6),
    V: Thread Needle (2), Exploit weakness (2), CDG (2)
    If I were to add 4 AP to the swashbuckler tree I'd go straight for Second Skin.

    How is Blow By Blow? Wiki says the damage doesn't scale with sonic power, so it's just the crit range increase. That's of course still good, though. What's the cooldown? Does it cost mana to use?

    I'm not a fan of guard procs, so Sword Dance doesn't appeal to me. I especially don't like it in "don't kill those mobs" quests like Sleeping Dust. I think Deflect Arrows has better defensive utility. Looking more closely at Elegant Footwork, that does look nice on a skirmisher. Not sure why you put Fast Movement in a second time at tier 3; it's only in tier 2 from what I understand/remember.

    Spellsinger (5):
    C: Spellsinger (1)
    I: Lingering I (1), Magical Studies III (3)
    Lingering III is a very high priority since the build is running with Skaldic Rage going 24/7.

    Warchanter (30):
    C: Skaldic Rage (1), Weapon Training (1), Song of Heroism (1),Fighting Spirit (1)
    I: Rough and Ready III (3), Enchant Weapon (2)
    II: Iced Edges III (3), Action Boost: Sprint III (3)
    III: Iron Skin Chant III (3), STR I (2), Frozen Fury III (3)
    IV: Reckless Chant III (3), Northwind II (4)
    30 AP in the tree and then not to take full BAB from the ML18 core? I can't say I agree with you here. Full BAB is one of my main motivators to take 18 bard levels in the first place.

    For a leveling order I recommend [...] Spellsinger (spell points are a must)
    Solved by the magical training feat.

    For 6th level spells I recommend, Hero's Feast, Cure Moderate Mass and Otto's Irresitable
    On my swashbuckler life I never once cast a level 6 spell.

    as for Fatesinger...you really want Reign in there. I would rethink that as well.
    Cool, I'll definitely check it out. To be honest, all I did was grind out a million xp in two days of cheap farms (Spiesx2 / VON3x2 / WizKingx2) to max it out and then TRed. I didn't really use anything in it in any meaningful way.

    Which would be better, do you think: Legendary Dreadnought or Divine Crusader?

  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by MadCookieQueen View Post
    there is no overkill...just kill ^^
    There is a cap, though.

  17. #17
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadCookieQueen View Post
    26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
    28 Destiny: Lasting Inspiration
    On a first-lifer, I would suggest Lasting Inspiration at lvl 26 and PSWF at lvl 28; max out Fatesinger first, then move onto Martial to max out SD or LD second. You could in theory make a beeline for Primal, but it takes almost 2.9M XP just to get there (FS 4 -> SD 3 -> LD 4 -> Shiradi), plus another 720K XP to unlock FotW (since Shiradi has very little to offer this build), by which point you've hit lvl 25 and still need 1,980K XP to max out FotW (or PA, though it's not much better than Shiradi for this build).
    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    You can't. Rogues aren't proficient with shields, so you don't qualify for shield mastery at level 1.
    Ahhh, shazzbot, I keep forgetting that. You could start bard instead, but that means giving up 8 skill pts and probably screws up your trap skill progression.
    The human bonus feat is actually super tricky.
    On future lives, if you go INT-based w/Harper, Insightful Reflexes is the obvious choice; then you only need enough DEX for Precision after tome. On a first-lifer, though...SF:UMD maybe? That's the skill the average newbie is gonna need the most help boosting, IMHO, esp. if you dump-stat CHA.
    Major build threads: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard / Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
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  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    On a first-lifer, I would suggest Lasting Inspiration at lvl 26 and PSWF at lvl 28; max out Fatesinger first, then move onto Martial to max out SD or LD second. You could in theory make a beeline for Primal, but it takes almost 2.9M XP just to get there (FS 4 -> SD 3 -> LD 4 -> Shiradi), plus another 720K XP to unlock FotW (since Shiradi has very little to offer this build), by which point you've hit lvl 25 and still need 1,980K XP to max out FotW (or PA, though it's not much better than Shiradi for this build).
    Sold. I'll go ahead and make that change.

    On future lives, if you go INT-based w/Harper, Insightful Reflexes is the obvious choice
    Exactly. The human bonus feat and all its headaches on this build is one of the reasons I'm thinking an int-based harper variation would be a good fit. (I also read up on MadCookieQueen's 15/3/2 bard/fighter/rogue int-based harper "first draft", which is why I mentioned the 3 fighter levels in the OP. I hadn't considered the fighter levels but have been kicking around the harper variation for a few weeks, ever since I realized the human bonus feat dilemma.)

    then you only need enough DEX for Precision after tome. On a first-lifer, though...SF:UMD maybe? That's the skill the average newbie is gonna need the most help boosting, IMHO, esp. if you dump-stat CHA.
    It's certainly an option, but I think Magical Training offers a better ROI. All the choices are pretty meh when you get right down to it. My thinking is that a new player will most notice having an extra 80 spell points (plus echoes!) over a couple extra dodge (which may be wasted due to MDB cap), a few extra UMD (which they may never even use), or a few hit points.

  19. #19
    Community Member Tinco's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    Widowblight is particularly easy to acquire, and is from a F2P quest. And...paralyzing
    Yes, it's a very good weapon, but my experiences and a watchful eye on the AH over several months tell me that it's extremely hard to get. I got one named item (the trinket) from 40-50 whisperdoom item turn-ins when I tried to farm it. Maybe that was bad luck, but being able to work with almost-guaranteed end-reward list items is pretty much a major prerequisite for a newbie-build for me.

    The GH from human was a brainlapse on my part, although it would be available earlier than the spell version and you can always spec out of it later.

    [EDIT]Regarding Low Blow: You pretty should have this to reliably use CdG. LB->CdG is a fast and easy bread-and-butter-combo for a Swashbuckler.
    Last edited by Tinco; 04-21-2015 at 12:45 PM.
    The best days are the days you don't have to wear socks or shoes.

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tinco View Post
    Yes, it's a very good weapon, but my experiences and a watchful eye on the AH over several months tell me that it's extremely hard to get. I got one named item (the trinket) from 40-50 whisperdoom item turn-ins when I tried to farm it. Maybe that was bad luck, but being able to work with almost-guaranteed end-reward list items is pretty much a major prerequisite for a newbie-build for me.
    I'm guessing this was before they increased the drop rate for pretty much all heroic named items? (At least from the pre-Shadowfell content.)

    If I recall correctly, it took me fewer than 10 runs, and it was the second or third named item I was offered. It may have been fewer than 8 runs; not sure if I even ransacked one alt. It definitely was not the first named item to appear, meaning they seemed to have a pretty decent chance to drop.

    I have no qualms recommending the Sword of the Thirty to new players, for example, and that's much harder to farm. Widowblight is what amounts to a rare wilderness chest but the "rare" has a 100% spawn rate.

    EDIT: I would bet money that the reason you don't see them on the auction house is because most people aren't even aware of that loot list, and most of the ones who are aware of it probably don't bother if they even run the quest at all. It's not exactly great XP/Minute. (I personally only turned in for that reward one time in four years before farming up my Widowblight.)

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