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  1. #41
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    If taking the full shield mastery line, twisting in Legendary Shield Mastery becomes a no-brainer, yes?
    Correct: that's +7% doublestrike and +15 PRR, so it helps both offensively and defensively. The tricky question is: when should you make your way to Unyielding Sentinel to be able to Twist it?
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  2. #42

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    I'm reconsidering the shield mastery lines, though not so much as to commit to the change this life. For my edification, it looks like the full line plus the twist nets you:

    +20 PRR
    +15% doublestrike

    Two feats and a twist is expensive, but that's a lot of return on the investment. Probably about right for the cost. Doublestrike is awesome, and 15% is a lot.

  3. #43
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    I look at it this way:

    Dashing Scoundrel: +10% doublestrike with zero defensive perks
    Skirmisher w/out Shield Mastery feats: +10% Dodge (bucklers have no base PRR, correct?)
    Skirmisher w/ISM but w/out Legendary SM: +8% doublestrike +10% Dodge +5 PRR
    Skirmisher w/LSM: +15% doublestrike +10% Dodge +20 PRR

    It's a long-term investment, but you receive gradual improvements to your offense and defense as you level a first-lifer. And once you unlock LSM, it's great being able to Twist it on future lives as soon as you hit lvl 20.
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  4. #44

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    The other drawback of dashing scoundrel is you get nothing in your offhand, while a buckler can hold lots of goodies, even if just cannith crafted.

    For example, with masterful craftsmanship you can slap Seeker +8 on a buckler for ML4, which for the Tiefling Assassin's Blade will net you 9.6 damage per swing. (+24 damage per crit, 8 crits per 20 rolls: 24 * 8 = 192 / 20 = 9.6)

    Add stunning at level 12 (Seeker +8 of Stunning +8) to help out warchanter's tier 3 Frozen Fury and you're getting a lot of mileage out of the slot compared to an empty hand.

    EDIT: It's worth pointing out that both shards can be made unbound, though the two examples will be ML6 and ML14 without masterful; still quite useful.

    EDIT 2: Can also toss a blue slot on there for ML16 w/masterful to add in some extra PRR, or maybe just making it easier to slot resistance or fortification.

  5. #45
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Pardon me if this is a simple question - I'm still getting my legs back underneath me.

    I see on some of these you show both SWF and Shield Mastery trees ... ddowiki seems to show they don't stack. Do they indeed work together?
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  6. #46
    Bacon Queen MadCookieQueen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    Pardon me if this is a simple question - I'm still getting my legs back underneath me.

    I see on some of these you show both SWF and Shield Mastery trees ... ddowiki seems to show they don't stack. Do they indeed work together?
    Yep...it was confirmed that they do work together and there are no plans to change it.

  7. #47
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadCookieQueen View Post
    Yep...it was confirmed that they do work together and there are no plans to change it.
    Ah - good to know! I'm still stuck at work so I'm theory-crafting while I'm here.

    Side question (not-bard related), SWF and THF both work w/ bastard swords? Anyone know?
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    Side question (not-bard related), SWF and THF both work w/ bastard swords? Anyone know?
    They lock each other out. If you take one, the game won't let you take the other.

    As for SWF and shield feats stacking, strictly speaking they don't: You only get melee power from one or the other, whichever is higher. (And I think melee power was removed from the shield feats this last update.) But they both will function, so you get all the different bonuses: attack speed, ability mod multiplier, doublestrike, PRR, and of course melee power from one line.

  9. #49
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Ah well, too much to ask for both on the sunblades.
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  10. #50
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    I see on some of these you show both SWF and Shield Mastery trees ... ddowiki seems to show they don't stack. Do they indeed work together?
    Normally you can't equip a shield and benefit from SWF, as you probably noticed on the wiki: "Requires fighting with a single one-handed (melee) weapon, and wielding only an orb, runearm, or nothing in your off hand." Swashbucklers are a special case due to the Skirmisher enhancement: "While Swashbuckling with a Buckler in your off hand, you gain 10% Dodge, and you may use a Buckler and still benefit from the Single Weapon Fighting line of feats." Note that the second effect does not depend on Swashbuckling being active, which means you can combine SWF+SM with regular weapons too, but you lose out on Swashbuckling's tasty crit bonuses and other goodies. I've theory-crafted...well, perhaps save that discussion for another thread.
    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    Side question (not-bard related), SWF and THF both work w/ bastard swords?
    As stated, the SWF and THF feats are mutually exclusive. However, I believe if you use Unbridled Fury, you will temporarily gain GTHF and it will stack w/GSWF.
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  11. #51
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    The tricky question is: when should you make your way to Unyielding Sentinel to be able to Twist it?
    Thinking about possible ED leveling plan for a first-lifer:
    • Level Fatesinger to 3 (720K XP), open first Twist slot
    • Switch to Magister, level it to 1 (+180K XP), Twist in Unearthly Reactions
    • Switch back to Fatesinger and level to 4 to unlock SD (+360K XP)
    • Switch to SD and level it to 3 (+720K XP)
    • Switch to GMoF and level it to 4 (+1,080K XP)
    • Switch to US and level it to 2 (+420K XP) to unlock Legendary SM. Upgrade your 1st Twist slot and replace Unearthly Reactions with LSM.
    • At this point you should be at about 3.5M epic XP (lvl 25), so go back to Fatesinger and max it out (+900K XP), after which you can level to 26 and take Lasting Inspiration. You should also be able to open up your 2nd Twist slot by now (5+1+4+3+2=15 ED lvls -> 5 Fate pts) and can put, say, Unearthly Reactions or Brace for Impact in it.
    • Now you need to max out either GMoF (+900K XP), SD (+1,260K XP), or LD (+1,980K XP) in order to take PSWF at lvl 28.


    I'd actually suggest making Martial ED Sphere the first one you fill up, since at this point you'll have the most Karma in Martial Sphere anyway and Doublestrike is the obvious EPL feat to take.
    Major build threads: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard / Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
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  12. #52

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    Note to self:

    With build as written, switch level 2 skills to take 2 ranks of perform, 0 ranks of concentration, then the other way around at level 3.

    Otherwise you don't qualify to cast Skaldic Rage until level 3. (Free to take, but need 4 trained ranks to use.)

    EDIT: Build is now updated for this change.

  13. #53
    Community Member Raeaddil's Avatar
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    Default Thanks for your builds.

    Another nice build Ellisdee37. I appreciate the builds both you and Unbongwah do. I have been working on a number of builds of both of you and very much enjoy them.

  14. #54
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    Currently rolling up Unbongwah's version (just prefer having a shield instead of nothing in the off-hand).

    Thanks, both of you, for a build I finally am having fun with.

  15. #55
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    As stated, the SWF and THF feats are mutually exclusive. However, I believe if you use Unbridled Fury, you will temporarily gain GTHF and it will stack w/GSWF.
    I can't think of a super compelling reason to do so, but in theory in Fury w/ the THF feats you could conceivably have all the SWF + Shield feast + THF feats firing as long as you're using a Sunblade (Sunblade, Star of Day, Celestia).

    Now I just need to invent the reason.
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by Trollocks View Post
    Currently rolling up Unbongwah's version (just prefer having a shield instead of nothing in the off-hand).
    His version is very good, probably better, but just to clarify, both versions have a shield in the off-hand.

  17. #57
    Community Member redoubt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    Ah well, too much to ask for both on the sunblades.
    Sunblade is a short sword with extra damage and a bastard sword graphic. As far as I know, it has never done the 1.5 damage or glancing blows. Am I wrong on this?
    Should a reaper see me? I think Death itself should have to make a spot check when I'm rolling up behind him. -- Krimsonrane

  18. #58
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by redoubt View Post
    Sunblade is a short sword with extra damage and a bastard sword graphic. As far as I know, it has never done the 1.5 damage or glancing blows. Am I wrong on this?
    Not 1.5, but it did do glancing blows (like 2 years ago) - I've been gone, so haven't checked in a while.

    I could probably check today.

    EDIT: Forum search shows ... https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...glancing+blows

    EDIT2: The reason I'm looking at this is that some things (Iced Edges) proc on each glancing blow. IIRC, so does Reign. My theory-fu is old and rusty though, having just come back.
    Last edited by voodoogroves; 05-07-2015 at 12:58 PM.
    Ghallanda - now with fewer alts and more ghostbane

  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    His version is very good, probably better, but just to clarify, both versions have a shield in the off-hand.
    Oops. Sorry. I think it was him putting emphasis on the shields that confused me.

  20. #60
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trollocks View Post
    Oops. Sorry. I think it was him putting emphasis on the shields that confused me.
    Both builds use bucklers with Skirmisher; the distinction is my build also takes the Shield Mastery feats for the reasons cited, while OP's takes Magical Training + an extra metamagic.
    Major build threads: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard / Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
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