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  1. #1
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    Default People dont do anything outside xp grind.

    Nearly always.

    It was a terrible idea to turn this game into such an endlesss grind of xp. Can we expect the ability to combine 3x triple completionist characters into 1 godly completionist anytime soon ?

    They should have a teleport to the boss room and gain action boost +100% damage clikies.

  2. #2
    Community Member Axeyu's Avatar
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    Yeah, the ETR meta is aweful. HTR is great and was very well designed and though out, but with ETR they really messed up.

  3. #3
    Community Member Tscheuss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axeyu View Post
    Yeah, the ETR meta is aweful. HTR is great and was very well designed and though out, but with ETR they really messed up.
    Nice thesis. What are your supporting details?

  4. #4
    Community Member Rys's Avatar
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    They do. They just don't come to the formus to complain about it

  5. #5
    Community Member Axeyu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tscheuss View Post
    Nice thesis. What are your supporting details?
    After you ETR you still play the same quests with the same character, only now without your high level gear and with a destiny that does not fit your character as much and that you don't like as much. Playing with a capped destiny becomes a waste of time and you never really reach a point where the exp/min of the quests stops mattering, so it will always just be the same quest that you run.

  6. #6
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rys View Post
    They do. They just don't come to the formus to complain about it
    Wrong.

    I look at the lfm panel out of the amazing 10 LFMs 8 is

    " Instert XP milk Quest on EN x3 "


    I am not complaining, im totally fine with this. In fact i can too go do something else! Id rather play with a party tho, at level quests for fun.

  7. #7
    Community Member BigErkyKid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janave View Post
    Nearly always.

    It was a terrible idea to turn this game into such an endlesss grind of xp. Can we expect the ability to combine 3x triple completionist characters into 1 godly completionist anytime soon ?

    They should have a teleport to the boss room and gain action boost +100% damage clikies.
    It is a combination of an endless xp grind and farming whatever new content comes out for a couple weeks. After top a month, the mass goes back to eTRs.

    Otherwise, for someone who already has all the relevant hPLs, can someone tell me what is there to do?

    For me, it is obvious that if you play a game long enough there will be some element of repetition or time sink. The question is the replay value. My point is that for eTRs with static content and a small selection of quests to eTR, replay value is at an all time low. In addition, as people have said, you have to play outside of destiny, when you are character is probably less powerful (duh).

    To add insult to injury, the "optimal" way to do it is zerging EN-EH quests where there is little to no probability of failing.

    Here is my question for you guys, when has this game changed from a dungeon crawl to a full trivially easy dungeon grind?

  8. #8
    Uber Uber Completionist
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    Quote Originally Posted by janave View Post
    Nearly always.
    Nice disclaimer.

    I think you're mistaken though.

    The XP grind is optional for sure. Epic TRing at this moment in time is tedious, repetitive and very quickly loses any appeal. That's almost entirely down to the lack of Epic content, which is a problem that will eventually take care of itself as more packs are added and more of the existing packs get the Epic treatment. The other factor is that you're basically just playing the exact same build over and over through that content and Epic levels don't add any variety to that experience. That's why I've had to go back to Heroic TRing to break up the Epic levels for the sake of my own sanity despite the fact I'm getting nothing from the Heroic levels in terms of character power, just the enjoyment of running them.

    If you find yourself grinding for XP and hating the whole thing, then you are 100% doing it wrong. It's then up to you as an individual to do something about that before you get completely jaded and burnt out by the whole thing and end up walking away from a game that you otherwise enjoy.

    There is the other side to the argument of course, that answers your subject title with "So what?" .... provided it's within the rules of the game, they can do what they want. Don't worry about what others are doing for their idea of fun and just concentrate on what you want to do.

  9. #9
    Community Member Powskier's Avatar
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    it is player choice to run off destiny karma or mindlessly do same runs.Just do heroic tr in a class related to sphere you r running...then epic...then heroic ..rinse repeat...take your time.... enjoy the scenery.

  10. #10
    Community Member Tscheuss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axeyu View Post
    After you ETR you still play the same quests with the same character, only now without your high level gear and with a destiny that does not fit your character as much and that you don't like as much. Playing with a capped destiny becomes a waste of time and you never really reach a point where the exp/min of the quests stops mattering, so it will always just be the same quest that you run.
    Ah, okay. I see your confusion, now. Epic Reincarnation is not a true reincarnation, so it is not meant to play the same as a TR. As for which destiny you choose to level, that is a choice made by the player, not dictated by the developers. Further, whether the experience/minute matters is also a decision made by the player, as is the choice to run the same quest over and over. You can play DDO as a game, or you can work it like a second/third job. If you choose to treat DDO as a job, you have only yourself to blame when it starts feeling unfun.

  11. #11
    Community Member BigErkyKid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tscheuss View Post
    Ah, okay. I see your confusion, now. Epic Reincarnation is not a true reincarnation, so it is not meant to play the same as a TR. As for which destiny you choose to level, that is a choice made by the player, not dictated by the developers. Further, whether the experience/minute matters is also a decision made by the player, as is the choice to run the same quest over and over. You can play DDO as a game, or you can work it like a second/third job. If you choose to treat DDO as a job, you have only yourself to blame when it starts feeling unfun.
    Once you have played all the quests in epics (there aren't that many) and they don't have anymore the surprise value but all DDO offers you as an end game is to repeat them, you want to do it as fast as possible.

    Because a big group of people (those who buy into the current end game) no longer play the game for the sake of a dungeon crawl, rather for the end rewards. So the OP is spot on. For this people, if they could find a way to go directly to the boss and kill it in a fraction of the time it usually takes to do the quest, they would do it. In fact, they currently do it.

    If you play this game long enough with enough intensity you will either go into the optimal build / optimal XP or stop playing. PUG a bit. That's all you can find in the majority of the groups. And I can't blame them, flower sniffing is nice the first few times you go through the field. After the Nth time, sanity requires that you just get across as fast as possible.

    It is not player's fault, it is just all DDO has to offer. Players adapt or leave. A lot have left, the remaining grind the **** out of the game.

  12. #12
    Community Member Axeyu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tscheuss View Post
    Ah, okay. I see your confusion, now. Epic Reincarnation is not a true reincarnation, so it is not meant to play the same as a TR. As for which destiny you choose to level, that is a choice made by the player, not dictated by the developers. Further, whether the experience/minute matters is also a decision made by the player, as is the choice to run the same quest over and over. You can play DDO as a game, or you can work it like a second/third job. If you choose to treat DDO as a job, you have only yourself to blame when it starts feeling unfun.
    The metagame is what it is. It's very naive to ignore it and blaim the negative consequences on player choices.

  13. #13
    Community Member bartharok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Axeyu View Post
    The metagame is what it is. It's very naive to ignore it and blaim the negative consequences on player choices.
    If you dont like the consequences of your choices, who SHOULD you blame then.
    Dystopia = utopia achieved

  14. #14
    Community Member Axeyu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartharok View Post
    If you dont like the consequences of your choices, who SHOULD you blame then.
    When the choice you made is to play the game as intended and incentivised the blaim falls on the devs.

  15. #15
    Community Member BigErkyKid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bartharok View Post
    If you dont like the consequences of your choices, who SHOULD you blame then.
    A game is designed in a way that encourages X behavior. Players do X. Blame the players.

    Nice logic you got there!

  16. #16
    Staggering LightBear's Avatar
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    Yeah, how about those heroic past life's.
    Feel free to put up a LFM I'd say.

    The xp grind has always been there, together with the grind for gear.

    Btw, I like the suggestion to be able to combine characters.
    For me how ever a triple heroic completionist is still far away and epic triple completionist isn't something I want to focus on right now.
    And then there is Iconic past life as well, I still have to start that one up.

  17. #17
    Community Member Rys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janave View Post
    Wrong.

    I look at the lfm panel out of the amazing 10 LFMs 8 is

    " Instert XP milk Quest on EN x3 "


    I am not complaining, im totally fine with this. In fact i can too go do something else! Id rather play with a party tho, at level quests for fun.
    A lot of players are playing 'out of the lfm panel' but I agree that lfm panel looks most of the time as you described. That does not mean that the whole ddo community does nothing but xp grind tho.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rys View Post
    A lot of players are playing 'out of the lfm panel' but I agree that lfm panel looks most of the time as you described. That does not mean that the whole ddo community does nothing but xp grind tho.
    It doesn't it's true. But it's not a silly thing to assume based on that... Let's talk about the options DDO offers for players. No PvP, at least none that's entertaining. No challenges, whether its the actual challenges or the quests, neither are difficult enough to make most players play them over and over motivated to achieve a new personal record.. Monster Manuals discontinued, look up STEAM, achievements are one of the most popular thing out there, MM was awesome and it pushed (some) players into some quests to hunt down rare beasts and monsters alongside fellow adventurers...

    The OP is kinda right... What is there to do besides grinding XP. Even grinding gear is getting tedious for 2 reasons I can think of: 1)Duping. And 2)Power Creep, items becoming useless the next update, why bother farming?!

    Me sad too sometimes

  19. #19
    Community Member Rys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigErkyKid View Post
    It is a combination of an endless xp grind and farming whatever new content comes out for a couple weeks. After top a month, the mass goes back to eTRs.

    Otherwise, for someone who already has all the relevant hPLs, can someone tell me what is there to do?

    For me, it is obvious that if you play a game long enough there will be some element of repetition or time sink. The question is the replay value. My point is that for eTRs with static content and a small selection of quests to eTR, replay value is at an all time low. In addition, as people have said, you have to play outside of destiny, when you are character is probably less powerful (duh).

    To add insult to injury, the "optimal" way to do it is zerging EN-EH quests where there is little to no probability of failing.

    Here is my question for you guys, when has this game changed from a dungeon crawl to a full trivially easy dungeon grind?
    Sometimes when I read your posts I wonder why are you still playing. You describe the game as an endless grind and I almost get an impression that it became some kind of job for you that you don't enjoy but you have to do it because of ..uhm why exactly? Zerging enormals and ehards, tr, etr then again ad nauseam for a little bonus is what you have made from the game by your own choice. You don't have to do it. Noone forced you.

    I don't consider myself as an uber elite player so I do still find some challenge in the game. I often spent some time at the cap, tweaking the build, farming gear (the grind I choose to do because I find the satisafaction in it and I do enjoy the process), running EEs I like, running EEs that are difficult for me to beat, descovering new tactics, running raids with parties, soloing raids, etc. And eventually I will TR or ETR if some interesting build catches my eye or if I feel like doing so. If the game becomes too grindy for you, stop yourself for a bit and think why exactly are you doing it. You might realise something important.

  20. #20
    Community Member moomooprincess's Avatar
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    Which is one reason why I solo. I don't XP grind, I am more of a favor for TP and loot grinder.

    XP grind gets highly monotonous for me. I can run a quest three times at most, and then I am done on that quest for quite some time.

    Some players goals are to reach completionist. As with all goals, we want to accomplish that in the most efficient and fastest manner possible.
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