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  1. #1
    The Hatchery Zoda's Avatar
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    Default Class balance - artificer

    Since we are getting bard/pally/barb balancing updates around this time, I think it'd be a good time to look into arties. The last good thing that happened to this poor class was the Juggernaut build, that simply took advantage of the reconstruction spell of the artificers and a class split that had enough bonus feats to supplement the complete absence of dps in enhancements with feats (releasing the bladeforged race made this obsolete though). It generally used a two hander and a bow with maxed strenght instead of intelligence and crossbows/runearms/spells, was hardly fit the description of an artificer. That was before the enhancement pass, and ever since arti is a dying class as a result of mediocre trees, but more importantly the lack of an epic destiny. Before MOTU, it was one of the most "complete" classes DDO had to offer, they were welcome in any group, any time, yet now they can barely bring more to the table than traps skills and deadly weapons. It is awkward that it is one of the strongest classes to level up to 20, and then when you get into epics it turns out to be the weakest, simply because the lack of it's own epic destiny. The Harper Agent tree is one step towards salvation for them, but they are still without their own epic destiny, with a very unique playstyle (spellcasting + ranged + runearm, hardly cowered by anything, shiradi gets the closest probably).

    So all in all, what I'm asking for is arti destiny... it took me a few rounds to get this one out.
    Main: Zodaroth - heroic & epic completionist pure dwarven warlock
    Alts: Zodynkar (caster), Zodirkeal (archer), Zodinn (lab rat)
    ---- Death N Taxes -------------------------------------------------------Argo -----

  2. #2
    Community Member Wizza's Avatar
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    About time they give them their own ED, /signed
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    Farwil, Chaos Gamblers - Argonessen.

  3. #3
    Community Member PsychoBlonde's Avatar
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    Yeah, there needs to be an epic destiny that does something interesting with runearms (and possibly trap crafting). There are destinies for literally everything else. DC casting? Check. Melee? Check. Bows? Check. Tanking? Check. Throwing weapons? Check. Tactical DC's? Check. Sneak Attack? Check. Healing? Check. Nuking? Check. Pets? Check. Bard songs? Check. Runearm? Chirp chirp chip . . .
    I edited a book!

    Thelanis player: Arekkeh, Kimberlei (heroic completionist), Lehren (heroic/epic completionist), Natheme, Terpsikhore

  4. #4
    Community Member Panzermeyer's Avatar
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    /signed

    Not just an Arti ED but they also need to new updated Runearms for cap.
    Panzermeyer - Huge Terry Brooks Shannara Fan

    Main
    Jelara Shannara - PDK
    Steel Shrine (TR XX - Barb x3, Drd x3, FvS x3, Pal x2, Rgr x1, Rog x2, Sorc x3, Wiz x3 - EtR X - Arc x3, Div x2, Mart x3, Prim x3 - ItR II - PDK x2)
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    Challenge Farmer
    Eritria Shannara - Human Swashbuckler
    (TR VII - Ftr x3, Sorc x1, Wiz x3 EtR - Prim x1)
    Kirisin Shannara - Sun Elf Shadovar Infiltrator (TR XIV - Barb x1, Bard x1, Clc x3, Fvs x3, Sorc x3, Wiz x3 - EtR V - Mart x2, Div x3 - ItR - MLE x1)


  5. #5
    The Hatchery Zoda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panzermeyer View Post
    /signed

    Not just an Arti ED but they also need to new updated Runearms for cap.
    The new runearm from u23 actually looks cool.
    Main: Zodaroth - heroic & epic completionist pure dwarven warlock
    Alts: Zodynkar (caster), Zodirkeal (archer), Zodinn (lab rat)
    ---- Death N Taxes -------------------------------------------------------Argo -----

  6. #6

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    I agree they do need a new Epic Destiny and another enhancement tree.
    Will put that on my possible future projects list which is empty atm.

  7. #7
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    Arti is eagerly waiting its turn on the "class tweak" train. Bard-Pally-Barb probably needed the love more than Arti, but its definitely up there in the second tier behind those three.

    Harper looks like it may serve as a bona fide offensive tree for Repeater users, though I'd still like to see a third tree added for Artis so there can be a fully dedicated Caster tree, a fully dedicated Repeater tree (with active abilities, not just passives like with Harper), and then a Runearm/Pet tree.

    An Arti-focused ED though? I'm not sure how you'd accomplish that. I'm very reticent to ask for too much generalization...I don't want to see an Arti ED that looks like the BE or AT tree - a bunch of unrelated bonuses that don't synergize very well. Runearms are inherently limited...I'd rather see them diversify in functionality (ie more creative Runearm effects than just "5 bolts of damage in Green!" vs "5 bolts of damage in Purple!"). And pets need much more than an ED to bring them to viable functionality.

    By Epic, Artis are going to be leaning more towards the casting side, or more towards the weapon side. As long as there's one destiny that caters well to each playstyle, I'm OK with that. DC, FotW, and the new LD might all serve as adequate Repeater destinies. Whether Magister/Draconic/Angel are adequate caster destinies for an Arti, someone else can gauge...

    To make an actual Arti tree that boosted casting, ranged, pet, and/or runearm efficacy, all within the same tree, I feel would be stretched too thin to give anything more than a mediocre bonus to any of those things. Especially since runearms and pets need an overhaul of their basic mechanics; otherwise an ED for them would just be lipstick on a pig.

  8. #8
    Community Member Panzermeyer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoda View Post
    The new runearm from u23 actually looks cool.
    The Arti needs more than one.

    Like most things one end game rune arm severely limits the options for the class at end game as everyone will have to build around that one rune arm. That is silly.
    Panzermeyer - Huge Terry Brooks Shannara Fan

    Main
    Jelara Shannara - PDK
    Steel Shrine (TR XX - Barb x3, Drd x3, FvS x3, Pal x2, Rgr x1, Rog x2, Sorc x3, Wiz x3 - EtR X - Arc x3, Div x2, Mart x3, Prim x3 - ItR II - PDK x2)
    Alts
    DamsonRhee Shannara - PDK Swashbuckler
    Challenge Farmer
    Eritria Shannara - Human Swashbuckler
    (TR VII - Ftr x3, Sorc x1, Wiz x3 EtR - Prim x1)
    Kirisin Shannara - Sun Elf Shadovar Infiltrator (TR XIV - Barb x1, Bard x1, Clc x3, Fvs x3, Sorc x3, Wiz x3 - EtR V - Mart x2, Div x3 - ItR - MLE x1)


  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    Arti is eagerly waiting its turn on the "class tweak" train. Bard-Pally-Barb probably needed the love more than Arti, but its definitely up there in the second tier behind those three.

    Harper looks like it may serve as a bona fide offensive tree for Repeater users, though I'd still like to see a third tree added for Artis so there can be a fully dedicated Caster tree, a fully dedicated Repeater tree (with active abilities, not just passives like with Harper), and then a Runearm/Pet tree.

    An Arti-focused ED though? I'm not sure how you'd accomplish that. I'm very reticent to ask for too much generalization...I don't want to see an Arti ED that looks like the BE or AT tree - a bunch of unrelated bonuses that don't synergize very well. Runearms are inherently limited...I'd rather see them diversify in functionality (ie more creative Runearm effects than just "5 bolts of damage in Green!" vs "5 bolts of damage in Purple!"). And pets need much more than an ED to bring them to viable functionality.

    By Epic, Artis are going to be leaning more towards the casting side, or more towards the weapon side. As long as there's one destiny that caters well to each playstyle, I'm OK with that. DC, FotW, and the new LD might all serve as adequate Repeater destinies. Whether Magister/Draconic/Angel are adequate caster destinies for an Arti, someone else can gauge...

    To make an actual Arti tree that boosted casting, ranged, pet, and/or runearm efficacy, all within the same tree, I feel would be stretched too thin to give anything more than a mediocre bonus to any of those things. Especially since runearms and pets need an overhaul of their basic mechanics; otherwise an ED for them would just be lipstick on a pig.
    Thanks for the feedback.

    I thought of a possible double spin on Artificer ED, just a long shot, but its in the back of my mind.
    Hopefully when the Barbarian Project passes into NDA, I will have more time.

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