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  1. #1
    Community Member Wizza's Avatar
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    Default Turbine: What to avoid in the new Raid

    1) Spell points drain mechanic.
    2) Escort a NPC raid.
    3) Giant belly-God with to-hit box problems.
    4) Giant circles on the ground that deals 2000 damage if you don't have 3142534265464% absorption and/or Improved Evasion with 99 saves.
    5) 6 identical Puzzles that requires 2 persons to do them, 2 other killing trash and the other 8 to stand around doing nothing.
    6) ONLY FOUR RAID NAMED LOOT of which 2 sucks and 2 don't.
    7) Flagging with random drops like Necropolis 4.
    8) Huge wilderness to run every single time to get to the quest (MA and LoB).
    9) Red-named trash mobs that keeps respawning with over 300k HP that can charge at you and slow/knock you down.



    Bye.
    Last edited by Wizza; 08-18-2014 at 09:19 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rys View Post
    Severlin and Severlin Online. PLAY FOR FREE* NOW!

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    Farwil, Chaos Gamblers - Argonessen.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wizza View Post
    1) Spell points drain mechanic.
    2) Escort a NPC raid.
    3) Giant belly-God with to-hit box problems.
    4) Giant circles on the ground that deals 2000 damage if you don't have 3142534265464% absorption and/or Improved Evasion with 99 saves.
    5) 6 identical Puzzles that requires 2 persons to do them, 2 other killing trash and the other 8 to stand around doing nothing.
    6) ONLY FOUR RAID NAMED LOOT of which 2 sucks and 2 don't.



    Bye.
    /signed

    The new raids actually have 6 named items and none of them really suck. If you don't like the named items you always have the option to take 10 phlogs for your 20th. I like that option.

    I am not a big fan of puzzles in raids in general. I like that in shroud people can run water, open locks, heal or do something else if they don't know the puzzle. Titan is awful with most of the party on a ladder. For shroud people use solvers on their cell phones so where is the real challenge there. In deathwyrm a party will never let you learn those if someone else can do it faster so it' a bad mechanic.
    CC Casting Druid: https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...C-Summer-Build
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    Several characters on Sarlona all starting with "Rand" in the Guild "Guardians of House Cannith". My main four characters are Randowl (18 rogue 2 artificer mechanic - hope to go back to DC casting some day), Randslar (Bard 14 / Fighter 4 / Rogue 2 Swashbuckler), Randek (Druid CC Caster 17/Fvs 3) and Randomall (Rogue 20 assassin).

  3. #3
    Community Member RD2play's Avatar
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    I agree with most but about
    Quote Originally Posted by Wizza View Post
    4) Giant circles on the ground that deals 2000 damage if you don't have 3142534265464% absorption and/or Improved Evasion with 99 saves.
    You know you can physically dodge these right ? some things do require skill so learn the game (srry) ontop there will be changes to mitigation next update to adres the "no evasion" problem.

    I would add 7) impossible flagging mechanic based on random drops.

  4. #4
    Hopeless Romantic dunklezhan's Avatar
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    /signed to no silly 'gather RNG drops from pre quests' flagging mechanics.
    also - NO NEW CRAFTING SYSTEMS. Please reuse or expand something that's already there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    The best of the best DDO players generally overperform when given a real challenge

  5. #5
    Community Member Nestroy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RD2play View Post
    I agree with most but about

    You know you can physically dodge these right ? some things do require skill so learn the game (srry) ontop there will be changes to mitigation next update to adres the "no evasion" problem.

    I would add 7) impossible flagging mechanic based on random drops.
    /signed for 7)

    /not signed for the physical dodge. Depending on the environment physically dodging is possible, seems possible but you get killed by semipermeable walls none the less or is just impossible. Furthermore, that´s exactly what rpg rules are for - that the player has not to physically dodge things, that his toon is theoretically or mechanically able to do. That´s the basic idea of saves. So we may concentrate on other things than physically dodging game mechanics. The same goes for evasion. Ofc I may time any trap in the game (or at least many of them), but evasion gives me the chance not to physically do this, but it´s done by the game mechanics. So adding mechanics that simply do not work that way (or force lv. 24 quests to be run with endgame geared toons) is just bad game design. If I want to play Super Mario, I will not play DDO. If DDO forces me to play Super Mario, I will quit one day and look for an MMO where I may concentrate on the MMO aspect, not on the jump&run aspect of the game.

    By the way, until most recently (eStB and e3bc) this has not been any 2nd thought of me. OK, we had some more or less funny minigames in DDO, like the Abbot raid or Necro III rat race. They were more or less fun to play from time to time, but at last they were few and far in between and most of the time in a raid group or larger party there was no need to be the one person to do the game always and ever. Only the latest trends raised the concern that DDO gets more like Super Mario in the future. Hopefully this trend will get reversed one day or the other. I love my DDO and will not switch to my boys WII any time soon. By the way, if they really include more Super Mario Online features in the future, please make my funboard work with DDO, and please give us more implemented controller support. And please make the game more lag free. Super Mario on the WII works perfectly well and is a totally lag free experience...
    Last edited by Nestroy; 08-17-2014 at 06:57 AM.

  6. #6
    Community Member RD2play's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nestroy View Post
    /not signed for the physical dodge. Depending on the environment physically dodging is possible, seems possible but you get killed by semipermeable walls none the less or is just impossible. Furthermore, that´s exactly what rpg rules are for - that the player has not to physically dodge things, that his toon is theoretically or mechanically able to do. That´s the basic idea of saves. So we may concentrate on other things than physically dodging game mechanics. The same goes for evasion. Ofc I may time any trap in the game (or at least many of them), but evasion gives me the chance not to physically do this, but it´s done by the game mechanics. So adding mechanics that simply do not work that way (or force lv. 24 quests to be run with endgame geared toons) is just bad game design. If I want to play Super Mario, I will not play DDO. If DDO forces me to play Super Mario, I will quit one day and look for an MMO where I may concentrate on the MMO aspect, not on the jump&run aspect of the game.
    .
    The physical dodge has been in the game as long as I remember, "see a kobold shaman cast lightning, strafe or jump out of the way or hide behind a corner", same holds for other ray spells. the area attacks from the dragons in the new raids are just an extension to this mechanic. I can agree that the airships in 3bc are a bit OP since the area needed to dodge is too large, and you get hit even if outside of the circles. that said It is one of the mechanics I love about this game, same a needing to aim ranged/melee attacks, if you want to play a click and cycle1-10 while standing there game you are free to try any of the million other mmo's WoW clones and such! I love the action combat and the player skill needed that comes with it.

  7. #7
    The Hatchery Wipey's Avatar
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    For the love of Mystra, no more "Raider's Boxes", raid lag and easily duped crafting ingredients.
    If you wanna have the content to have some lasting value.

    No false 6 tome promises.

    And last try ( I have to ), maybe reward higher difficulties ? It can be just a little, extra 1 stat point or extra colorless slot and people WILL run it.
    Shahang Nezhat Bellezza Wipekin Farida of Ghallanda

  8. #8
    Founder Dorian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dunklezhan View Post
    /signed to no silly 'gather RNG drops from pre quests' flagging mechanics.
    also - NO NEW CRAFTING SYSTEMS. Please reuse or expand something that's already there.
    We need some more crafting pieces to fill up our bags and make even more of a mess of the inventory system.

    It might sell some more huge bags in the ddo store.
    Dorian

  9. #9
    Community Member Ryiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wizza View Post
    4) Giant circles on the ground that deals 2000 damage if you don't have 3142534265464% absorption and/or Improved Evasion with 99 saves.
    Or maybe people need to just learn to get out of the fire?
    Ryiah | Raeyah | Reikara
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  10. #10
    Community Member Wizza's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slarden View Post
    /signed

    The new raids actually have 6 named items and none of them really suck. If you don't like the named items you always have the option to take 10 phlogs for your 20th. I like that option.
    I disagree. One raid has 3 items and the other has 4. Dethek Runestone (Large Shield), Ward Token (Ring) are totally useless and they belong to the 4 items raid (Thunder peak). So, 2 out of 7 items are bad. One raid has only 2 items worth something (Dragon Masque and Meridian Fragment). That's what I call a failure.

    Not mentioning the drop rates of those. Don't get me started on that. And +6 tomes. The famous +6 tomes.

    Quote Originally Posted by slarden View Post
    I am not a big fan of puzzles in raids in general. I like that in shroud people can run water, open locks, heal or do something else if they don't know the puzzle. Titan is awful with most of the party on a ladder. For shroud people use solvers on their cell phones so where is the real challenge there. In deathwyrm a party will never let you learn those if someone else can do it faster so it' a bad mechanic.
    I guess this is personal preference. I love the pre-raid of Titan, I love Abbot and I like Deathwyrm's end fight, the puzzles and I actually like the mirror ones (they just put too many of them).

    Quote Originally Posted by RD2play View Post
    t

    You know you can physically dodge these right ? some things do require skill so learn the game (srry) ontop there will be changes to mitigation next update to adres the "no evasion" problem.

    I would add 7) impossible flagging mechanic based on random drops.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryiah View Post
    Or maybe people need to just learn to get out of the fire?
    Quote Originally Posted by RD2play View Post
    t

    You know you can physically dodge these right ? some things do require skill so learn the game (srry) ontop there will be changes to mitigation next update to adres the "no evasion" problem.

    I would add 7) impossible flagging mechanic based on random drops.
    That's right. It must be me who is bad at the game and not the yellow circles hitting people 20 meters away. Or, god forbid, lag in DDO. Or, even more hilarious, yellow circles targeting dead people so you can't even raise. Teach me guys please

    I forgot to add 2 options. The flagging mentioned and the long ass run to the wilderness. I'm gonna add those.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rys View Post
    Severlin and Severlin Online. PLAY FOR FREE* NOW!

    *maybe
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  11. #11
    Community Member johnny2bd's Avatar
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    /signed except for #1. Hitting casters is the only real way to get a challenge in a quest any more.

  12. #12
    Community Member Wizza's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by johnny2bd View Post
    /signed except for #1. Hitting casters is the only real way to get a challenge in a quest any more.
    Yup, makes sense. Draining 3k Spell points on hit, so much fun! I hope we get this mechanic in every quest actually.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rys View Post
    Severlin and Severlin Online. PLAY FOR FREE* NOW!

    *maybe
    Farwil, Chaos Gamblers - Argonessen.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wizza View Post
    Yup, makes sense. Draining 3k Spell points on hit, so much fun! I hope we get this mechanic in every quest actually.
    Hi,

    Maybe for the sake of variety, we could have a ki draining mechanism. I can hear the screams already.

    Thanks.
    Astrican on Khyber

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wizza View Post
    1) Spell points drain mechanic.
    2) Escort a NPC raid.
    3) Giant belly-God with to-hit box problems.
    4) Giant circles on the ground that deals 2000 damage if you don't have 3142534265464% absorption and/or Improved Evasion with 99 saves.
    5) 6 identical Puzzles that requires 2 persons to do them, 2 other killing trash and the other 8 to stand around doing nothing.
    6) ONLY FOUR RAID NAMED LOOT of which 2 sucks and 2 don't.
    7) Flagging with random drops like Necropolis 4.
    8) Huge wilderness to run every single time to get to the quest (MA and LoB).
    /signed

    Good list!

  15. #15
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    Hi,

    Maybe for the sake of variety, we could have a ki draining mechanism. I can hear the screams already.

    Thanks.
    They gonna drain internet bandwidth, at least that affects all of us. Noone has beaten the best of L.A.G yet, i heard it has an udead form too, which is a lot more evil. It uses high DC instacrash you onto desktop, and curses for a +50% ward on logins.

  16. #16
    Community Member Wizza's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blerkington View Post
    Hi,

    Maybe for the sake of variety, we could have a ki draining mechanism. I can hear the screams already.

    Thanks.
    Ah, now that is funny. Draining Reconstruct's cooldown (so it's always on CD), monk speed and Divine Might/Action boost charges.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rys View Post
    Severlin and Severlin Online. PLAY FOR FREE* NOW!

    *maybe
    Farwil, Chaos Gamblers - Argonessen.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by janave View Post
    They gonna drain internet bandwidth, at least that affects all of us. Noone has beaten the best of L.A.G yet, i heard it has an udead form too, which is a lot more evil. It uses high DC instacrash you onto desktop, and curses for a +50% ward on logins.
    Hi,

    That sounds about right. I think it's already being tested in the dragon raids before a full release.

    Whether or not you think casters are OP, it's nice to have their help in raids. Buffing, healing, crowd control, killing things, it's always useful.

    That SP drain mechanic in CITW is wretched, and it hurts my ranger just as badly as it does those naughty overpowered casters. It punishes everyone in the group, not just the people playing casters. I don't feel like game imbalance is being avenged in any useful way when I see divines who are healing me in raids run out of SP.

    I wonder if that was the tip of the monetisation initiative which went on to give us other great things like paying to move around in deliberately-made-difficult-to-navigate explorer areas.

    Good list by the way, OP. Let's hope when the design the new raid they can see it from the perspective of a player who may want to run it more than once and have fun doing it.

    Thanks.
    Astrican on Khyber

  18. #18
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wizza View Post
    1) Spell points drain mechanic.
    2) Escort a NPC raid.
    3) Giant belly-God with to-hit box problems.
    4) Giant circles on the ground that deals 2000 damage if you don't have 3142534265464% absorption and/or Improved Evasion with 99 saves.
    5) 6 identical Puzzles that requires 2 persons to do them, 2 other killing trash and the other 8 to stand around doing nothing.
    6) ONLY FOUR RAID NAMED LOOT of which 2 sucks and 2 don't.
    7) Flagging with random drops like Necropolis 4.
    8) Huge wilderness to run every single time to get to the quest (MA and LoB).



    Bye.
    1. I actually like this in CITW. its something different that forces players to be more cautious and use their head instead of just power healing and power nuking everything. it also forces players to be more self sufficient. I know that people say this raid forces people to chain chug sp pots, but I see it a little differently. yes, ive been in there as a Paladin and as a Ranger so I know what its like to have sp sucked dry.

    2. not a fan of this either, but only because you have to babysit the NPC while also looking out for yourself, others in the group and mobs. their AI isn't good enough to be just escorted and know they will be ok.

    3.. that is something the devs really should fix, but right now, you just have to hit on her right side. my only real complaint is that I cant zoom my camera out far enough to see the boss above her bellybutton. ive always had this problem playing melees and fighting bigger than life mobs.

    4. devs need to look into character saves a little more on that one. combat log even says different things depending on difficulty.

    5. I cant really comment on this myself since I have yet to do that raid, but it sounds to me that's no good. a raid should have everyone involved and not require that only a few people do the work.

    6. this can differ from player to player. ive seen people use weapons that they think are awesome, but most say its junk. however, it does seem to be the trend these days that maybe a few items are sought after and the rest are meh or junk. I would like to see raid loot attract all builds with a nice variety.

    7. I don't have an issue with this as long as people help each other out. often I see groups loot and scoot to move onto the next quest. normally I can get my sigil pieces in a helpful group running Orchard no more than 2-3 times each quest. 6 players in a group passing sigil pieces makes it much much easier than throwing up an lfm and saying "IP" when you might have 2-3 people. sigil pieces is what does turn off people and flagging for Litany, but in my experience, its mainly because people aren't trying to fill a group and helping each other out. I am not opposed, though, to doing the 4 sides in Litany 1x vs the 4x to do each side and recalling out each time.

    8. teleporter would have solved that issue. im fine with a raid in a wilderness as long as you can teleport there or the run is short like Hound or VOD.

  19. #19
    Community Member Indianwiz's Avatar
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    Default Excellent !

    Quote Originally Posted by Wizza View Post
    1) Spell points drain mechanic.
    2) Escort a NPC raid.
    3) Giant belly-God with to-hit box problems.
    4) Giant circles on the ground that deals 2000 damage if you don't have 3142534265464% absorption and/or Improved Evasion with 99 saves.
    5) 6 identical Puzzles that requires 2 persons to do them, 2 other killing trash and the other 8 to stand around doing nothing.
    6) ONLY FOUR RAID NAMED LOOT of which 2 sucks and 2 don't.
    7) Flagging with random drops like Necropolis 4.
    8) Huge wilderness to run every single time to get to the quest (MA and LoB).
    /signed.

    Please update this in OP:

    9) No new ingredients [which can be duped].

    Also I am suggesting the loot to have same drop rate as Frenzied Berserker ring (you know when DDO was all barbs and this was a highly sought after item and there were screams when it dropped? ah I miss old DDO).

  20. #20
    Community Member legendkilleroll's Avatar
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    No chance of happening but id like no bypasses to be allowed, atleast for first few months to add some longevity to it

    With how many cards some have, people will have their 20th within a week, alot of the loot and then its "there is nothing to do in this game!"

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