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  1. #1
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    Default Armor Up - Developer Diary #1

    Greetings,

    To give insight to player about the changes involved with our Armor Up changes, Paladin buffs, and other balance changes we are writing a series of developer diaries to explain upcoming changes we have planned for the game.

    In this first offering we will discuss some extensions to our basic systems so players can more easily understand how all of this works together. With this post players should become more familiar with the following:

    ~ Physical Resist Rating (or PRR), the new formula the increases its power, and the bonuses to PRR that heavier armors will grant.
    ~ Magical Resist Rating (or MRR), the new rating that will mitigate magical damage, and the bonuses to MRR that heavier armors will grant.
    ~ Melee Power, the new melee specific attribute similar to Spellpower, and how certain static effects will scale with this new attribute.
    ~ Ranged Power, the new missile specific attribute similar to Spellpower, and how it might affect future abilities.
    ~ Improvements to the mitigation of heavier armors.

    NOTE: I realize some of this is math heavy designer speak, but we felt that the DDO players interested in these details would benefit from a post about how all of this fits into our greater balancing plan, and how it begins to put pieces into place for future balancing.


    We are expanding some of our existing systems to give much needed tools to balance characters in both heroic and epic levels. To understand some of our upcomg changes, players will want to familiarize themselves with four attributes which extend the current system.


    Physical Resist Rating
    The attribute is used to mitigate physical damage of all types. The game already has Physical Resist Rating. We are changing the mitigation formula of this attribute, effectively buffing its power. The new formula:

    100 / (100 + Rating)

    This boost will help mitigate the damage of melee enemies in Epic Elite and will help players to build characters that can survive toe to toe with those enemies.


    Magical Resist Rating
    This new attribute is the magical equivalent of PRR. It can be increased by wearing armor, gearing up Sheltering effects, and picking certain enhancements. This rating works on most magical effects. It will not reduce force, bane and some other special effects. The mitigation this rating provides following a similar formula as PRR.

    100 / (100 + Rating)



    Melee Power
    The new attribute is essentially the melee version of Spellpower. Melee Power will not only increase the damage of straight weapon damage, but certain static effects from enhancements will now scale up with Melee Power allowing them to be more useful in epic levels. Melee Power will be gained from certain enhancements and from some melee epic destinies. Our plan is to have future loot include Melee Power. This rating increases melee attacks by the following formula.

    (100 + Rating) / 100

    As we rebalance static effects found in enhancements we will make these scale with Melee Power so they increase as you gain power and new loot. As an example, several Paladin damage sources that were previously static will now scale with Melee Power.



    Ranged Power
    This new attribute is ranged version of Melee Power, or if you prefer the ranged equivalent to Spellpower. This rating increases missile attacks by the following formula.

    (100 + Rating) / 100

    This rating won't be used much in our first set of chancges but is a future tool for ranged builds.



    With the description of these new attributes in mind, we next want to update you to upcoming changes to heavy armor and shields.

    Buffing Heavy Armor
    We've already talked about our plans for making heavier armors and shields more effective, and we want to update you with the latest design. Wearing armor will now provide bonus mitigation by increasing your Physical Resist Rating and Magical Resist Rating. We have updated values below.

    Note that the values are changed from previously announced values. This is due to the fact that the Physical Resistance Rating formula has changed to offer more mitigation for each point. With the new PRR formula these new values offer similar mitigation to those previously announced.

    Physical and Magical Resist Ratings offered by armor
    Robes or Outfits: No PRR, no MRR
    Light Armor: 10 PRR, 10 MRR if armor has enchantments. (This is in addtion to the current PRR bonus of 2 + (BAB / 2.0) )
    Medium Armor: 20 PRR, 20 MRR if armor has enchantments. (This is in addtion to the current PRR bonus of 4 + (BAB / 1.5) )
    Heavy Armor: 30 PRR, 30 MRR if armor has enchantments. (This is in addtion to the current PRR bonus of 6 + BAB )


    Shields will give additional PRR and, if enchanted, MRR.

    Physical and Magical Resist Ratings offered by sheilds
    Buckler: None
    Light Shield: 5 PRR, 5 MRR if shield has enchantments.
    Heavy Shield: 10 PRR, 10 MRR if shield has enchantments.
    Tower Shield: 15 PRR, 15 MRR if shield has enchantments.

    In addition, characters who are proficient with shields can also use the larger shields for defense against magical attacks that would normally require a Reflex saving throw. Instead of (or in addition to) using your Reflex saving throw to mitigate the damage you can deflect the damage off your shield. This is represented by increasing your Physical and Magical Resist Ratings against those types of attacks when using a shield. Note that you gain this additional mitigation whether you make your Reflex saving throw or not.

    Physical and Magical Resist Rating multiplier against magical attacks that normally allow a Reflex saving throw.
    Buckler: 1.0 (no additional mitigation)
    Light Shield: 1.0 (no additional mitigation)
    Heavy Shield: 2.0
    Tower Shield: 2.0

    This means that characters with heavier armor and/or heavy or tower shields have an alternate mitigation against large area of effect attacks to help them compete in high level content with characters who use Evasion.


    Resistance Rating Caps and Evasion
    In addition, there are new or changed caps on certain scores based on the armor you are wearing.

    Buckler: None
    Light Shield: None
    Heavy Shield: No Evasion feat
    Tower Shield: No Evasion feat

    Magical Resistance Rating Cap for armor

    Robes or Outfit: 100
    Light Armor: 200
    Medium Armor: No cap
    Heavy Armor: No cap

    Note that we have designed this so characters cannot gain both Evasion and the shield bonus coupled with high levels of resistance rating. This is intentional, as a character with both would be too powerful.


    Magical Resistance Rating and Loot
    Magical Resistance Rating will appear on existing and future items with the Sheltering effect. All items with the Sheltering effect will give an amount of MRR equal to the PRR of that effect. Note that armor type will still limit the amount of MRR you can have. In the future items may offer additional sources of PRR and/or MRR in addition to sheltering effects.


    How does all of this work in future balancing?


    In the next Armor Up developer's diary we will talk about the following topics:
    ~ Melee Power and scaling static abilities in epic elite.
    ~ Updated changes to Paladin to help them be fun and competitive in Heroic and Epic Elite content.

    Sev~
    Last edited by Severlin; 07-28-2014 at 06:50 PM.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Severlin View Post
    ~ Melee Power, the new melee specific attribute similar to Spellpower, and how certain static effects will scale with this new attribute.
    Oh wow, Melee Power. I was wondering when they were going to get to adding that MMORPG stat... I never wanted to bring it up, so as not to give anybody ideas...

    Quote Originally Posted by Severlin View Post
    This boost will help mitigate the damage of melee enemies in Epic Elite and will help players to build characters that can survive toe to toe with those enemies.
    It looks backwards to start with the stats of EE monsters and base character power on enabling people to survive that. Epic Elite wasn't meant to be manageable. It would make more sense to design the characters, and then maybe adjust EE enemies if they're too high in comparison.

  3. #3
    Community Member Nayus's Avatar
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    I need to ask this but will Docents be compatible with this mechanic? When PRR came up Docents were thrown aside with smaller bonuses that desconsider your BAB, even though we have to spend a feat to get a generic weaker layout. There are people in this game getting 32% dodge with a light armor and yet a Mithral Body has a MDB of 5, I can't possibly make 5 become 32.

    Excellent changes but I would like to see Warforgeds (and Bladeforgeds) actually making some use of it. A ranger or a fighter can simply equip robes or light armors at will but we have to spend feats on it.

    This isn't even a powergaming issue, Zeus and Cetuses are blitzers and will get max dodge.

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    Interesting. Will our standard bonuses from say Power Attack and Deadly Items be converted to Melee Power or left as is?

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    Hopeless Romantic dunklezhan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scrabbler View Post
    Oh wow, Melee Power. I was wondering when they were going to get to adding that MMORPG stat... I never wanted to bring it up, so as not to give anybody ideas...
    Well, quite.
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  6. #6
    Community Member Zzevel's Avatar
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    Our plan is to have future loot include Melee Power.
    Dont bother, if you can't go back and add it to old eq then why have it? all you are doing is making all of the eq in the game obsolete. Either update the old eq (because IT NEEDS IT ANYWAY), add it to cannith crafting, or forget it all together... I am sick of constantly re-gearing because of a huge change that the players are not asking for.

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    +1 communication.
    +1 for listening to the player base.
    +1 initiative.

    still concerned that the PRR and MRR of heavy armor won't scale enough for lv30 EE content coming.

    concerned about MP and RP - will have to see how that pans out.

    and will existing feats be updated to reflect? Such as defensive fighting stance?
    Last edited by UurlockYgmeov; 07-28-2014 at 04:56 PM. Reason: my kobold powered spell checker is on Union Break

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    Community Member FranOhmsford's Avatar
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    Hang on a minute...Melee and Ranged POWER?

    Are you kidding Devs? Yet another way for Elitists to lord it over casuals and newbies REALLY?

    What stat is going to govern this? Strength I suppose? What of Dex, Int, Con Builds?

    Are we going to get YET MORE gear we can't fit in?


    What happened to the D&D in DDO?!?

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    Quote Originally Posted by FranOhmsford View Post
    Are you kidding Devs? Yet another way for Elitists to lord it over casuals and newbies REALLY?
    What stat is going to govern this? Strength I suppose? What of Dex, Int, Con Builds?
    How much of a difference do you see in Spell Power between an Intelligence build Wizard and a Charisma build Sorc? Ability scores will probably be no more than a tiny contribution to Melee Power.

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    Please remember to take into account older mithral armors when you make these changes. Wearers of those armors should be benefiting from them, not having a disadvantage.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Severlin View Post
    Magical Resistance Rating and Loot
    Magical Resistance Rating will appear on existing and future items with the Sheltering effect. All items with the Sheltering effect will give an amount of MRR equal to the PRR of that effect. Note that armor type will still limit the amount of MRR you can have. In the future items may offer additional sources of PRR and/or MRR in addition to sheltering effects.
    Is this going to include PDK/divine past lives that currently give +3 PRR, are those also going to include +3 MRR? What about the monk earth stance?

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    Community Member HatsuharuZ's Avatar
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    Thank you for improving the PRR formula and making armor/shields more useful! However, I have a problem with Ranged/Melee Power....

    Wouldn't it be simpler to just lower the damage enemies deal out in epic elites? Or perhaps lower their CRs a bit? I don't like adding yet *another* stacking bonus to the game, atop all of the other things I feel I have to equip to deal optimal damage and have good defense.

    For damage, we already have +stat items and "Deadly" items. Furthermore, everyone needs a +constitution item, deathblock item, striding item... the list goes on! Why not just make epic elites a bit easier for melees by decreasing incoming damage a bit?

  13. #13
    Community Member Cleanincubus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Severlin View Post
    Physical and Magical Resist Ratings offered by armor
    Robes or Outfits: No PRR, no MRR
    Light Armor: 10 PRR, 10 MRR if armor has enchantments. (This is in addtion to the current PRR bonus of 2 + (BAB / 2.0) )
    Medium Armor: 20 PRR, 20 MRR if armor has enchantments. (This is in addtion to the current PRR bonus of 4 + (BAB / 1.5) )
    Heavy Armor: 30 PRR, 30 MRR if armor has enchantments. (This is in addtion to the current PRR bonus of 4 + BAB )

    Sev~
    Wow. Lame. I have 2 characters who wear robes/outfits, and neither have Evasion.

    These are not simply pieces of cloth that characters wear for decoration, they are magically enchanted items, most of which offer Armor bonuses. Yet they won't even offer Magical Resist Ratings...even when worn by magic users? Two out of the three classes that typically wear robes/outfits, don't have Evasion. So give other armor users benefits, but don't give the robe/outfit users any, because it will benefit 1 single class* too much. Typical development strategy...

    *I'm not including Rogues, because they can wear Light Armor without any penalties.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by FranOhmsford View Post
    Hang on a minute...Melee and Ranged POWER?

    Are you kidding Devs? Yet another way for Elitists to lord it over casuals and newbies REALLY?

    What stat is going to govern this? Strength I suppose? What of Dex, Int, Con Builds?

    Are we going to get YET MORE gear we can't fit in?


    What happened to the D&D in DDO?!?
    My *guess* is that Melee Power (MP) would be STR-based, Ranged Power (RP) would be DEX-based. It seems only logical.



    Additionally, my question is: are these (MP/RP) going to have new skills, like "spellcraft" for "spell power"? If so, are there going to be any adjustments to skill points? Or are you just going to add another skill (or 2) like last time? You *do* realize fighters are incredible skill-starved as it is, right? If new skills are added without any other changes to skills, this would be *bad* (IMO).

    Also, you say there will be feats that grant MP/RP? Again, are these new feats, or will MP/RP be added to some existing feats (or both)? Fighters may have a bunch of feat slots, but rangers/paladins/barbarians do not.

    I can see where this could get very messy, very quickly.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Severlin View Post
    Melee Power
    The new attribute is essentially the melee version of Spellpower. Melee Power will not only increase the damage of straight weapon damage, but certain static effects from enhancements will now scale up with Melee Power allowing them to be more useful in epic levels. Melee Power will be gained from certain enhancements and from some melee epic destinies. Our plan is to have future loot include Melee Power. This rating increases melee attacks by the following formula.

    (100 + Rating) / 100

    As we rebalance static effects found in enhancements we will make these scale with Melee Power so they increase as you gain power and new loot. As an example, several Paladin damage sources that were previously static will now scale with Melee Power.



    Ranged Power
    This new attribute is ranged version of Melee Power, or if you prefer the ranged equivalent to Spellpower. This rating increases missile attacks by the following formula.

    (100 + Rating) / 100

    This rating won't be used much in our first set of chancges but is a future tool for ranged builds.


    Sev~
    So... is it your intention to use this to scale up enhancements that are "+X damage on melee/ranged attacks" and/or "you perform a melee/ranged attack at +X[W]"? What about enhancements that are "you do 1-10 acid/force/whatever damage on successful vorpal/crit/whatever"?
    Last edited by Violentbeginning; 07-28-2014 at 05:35 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleanincubus View Post
    Wow. Lame. I have 2 characters who wear robes/outfits, and neither have Evasion.

    These are not simply pieces of cloth that characters wear for decoration, they are magically enchanted items, most of which offer Armor bonuses. Yet they won't even offer Magical Resist Ratings...even when worn by magic users? Two out of the three classes that typically wear robes/outfits, don't have Evasion. So give other armor users benefits, but don't give the robe/outfit users any, because it will benefit 1 single class* too much. Typical development strategy...

    *I'm not including Rogues, because they can wear Light Armor without any penalties.
    You do realize that the system right now works the exact same way, right? They are simply not changing inherent amounts of PRR/MRR on robes/outfits.

  17. #17

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    Thank you for sharing your thoughts and ideas!

    Quote Originally Posted by Severlin View Post
    Greetings,. . .
    Sev~
    Ok but I am not crazy about the ranged and melee power thing. Sounds like another 'deadly' gear thingy that will be needed now. I can't fit anything more on my builds, and my hybrids certainly can't fit two things. But then, I could always just skip it, right? But what melee/ranged skips Deadly items even after all the complaining?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cleanincubus View Post
    Wow. Lame. I have 2 characters who wear robes/outfits, and neither have Evasion.

    These are not simply pieces of cloth that characters wear for decoration, they are magically enchanted items, most of which offer Armor bonuses. Yet they won't even offer Magical Resist Ratings...even when worn by magic users? Two out of the three classes that typically wear robes/outfits, don't have Evasion. So give other armor users benefits, but don't give the robe/outfit users any, because it will benefit 1 single class* too much. Typical development strategy...

    *I'm not including Rogues, because they can wear Light Armor without any penalties.
    This is the key thing. Why should plate armor be better at resisting magic than cloth? the idea of magic is that it overcomes such things. If anything, I would scale it in the opposite direction--the lighter the armor, the higher the MRR.
    There is a triangle in my mind that is probably inaccurate but I will throw it out: magic user defeats tank. Light skirmisher kills magic user. Tank kills light skirmisher. So somehow they should all be vulnerable in this way. Ok, end of bizarre idea.

    I like the idea of shield blocking getting a very good MRR.

    Will magical resistance therefore be put under MRR? Might make drow less squishy, but then many use them in the light skirmisher builds.

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  18. #18
    Community Member ChicagoChris's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Severlin View Post
    Greetings,
    Physical and Magical Resist Ratings offered by armor
    Robes or Outfits: No PRR, no MRR
    Light Armor: 10 PRR, 10 MRR if armor has enchantments. (This is in addtion to the current PRR bonus of 2 + (BAB / 2.0) )
    Medium Armor: 20 PRR, 20 MRR if armor has enchantments. (This is in addtion to the current PRR bonus of 4 + (BAB / 1.5) )
    Heavy Armor: 30 PRR, 30 MRR if armor has enchantments. (This is in addtion to the current PRR bonus of 4 + BAB )

    ...

    Sev~
    Please, please get Mithral right this time
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  19. #19
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    im more reading than posting in these threads because im too dumb for DDO math formulas. what sticks out is Melee and Ranged Power. sounds awfully like a damage meter ive seen suggested on the forums before. it would be nice to see how much dps I can dish out, but I fear the drama that will ensue.
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    Community Member Seikojin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by John_Rove View Post
    You do realize that the system right now works the exact same way, right? They are simply not changing inherent amounts of PRR/MRR on robes/outfits.
    Yeah, and what is to stop them from adding mrr bonuses and prr to robes/clothes? Nothing. So I see nothing wrong with clothes and robes having nothing by default.

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