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  1. #1
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Default Please change system to not reset raid completion counters when TR'ing

    I find it annoying that TR's reset the incremental counters for raids.

    I ultimately end up skipping many raids that I would likely reflag for If I know I am going to TR at any point in the near future.
    as a result I just run a smaller group of XP quests and then rinse repeat..

    I think many other players are in the same situation.. why bother fully flagging for/run raids if you know you are going to TR.
    Some players wont TR and becme stuck running certain raids and having difficulty filling those raids as others move on to higher level content or dont want to wait and TR

    I don't see any detrimental side to not resetting the counters.. you would still have to flag and run the raid, but would still be eligible for your 20th incremetals over multiple lives.

    Should benefit long term playability and continuous rerunning of raids for all levels of gameplay.
    Jotmon - Let's not forget why we play these games - to have fun - ~
    Guild: Degenerate Matter - 200 (Former Guilds: ChaosKnights, Big Damn Heroes, Shadowfiends, Order of the Drow, Unusual Suspects, Raided R)
    Argo-Jotmon(Completionist - before the Otto's/XP pots easymode), Jotmonheals(Clr17/Rog2/Mnk1-Epic Completionist), Whatthetruck.. and many many more alts..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.

  2. #2
    Community Member Oxarhamar's Avatar
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    Agreed!

    I skip just about every raid

    In my years of playing and many lives I have only seen 3 20th lists due to being a TR junky.

  3. #3
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    I hated TR'ing my favor toon after a bugged Epic Reincarnation forced me to reset and seeing all my competion counters get reset..
    Jotmon - Let's not forget why we play these games - to have fun - ~
    Guild: Degenerate Matter - 200 (Former Guilds: ChaosKnights, Big Damn Heroes, Shadowfiends, Order of the Drow, Unusual Suspects, Raided R)
    Argo-Jotmon(Completionist - before the Otto's/XP pots easymode), Jotmonheals(Clr17/Rog2/Mnk1-Epic Completionist), Whatthetruck.. and many many more alts..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.

  4. #4
    Founder Dorian's Avatar
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    I agree.

    ...and I think Turbine will also agree. They want people TR'ing ...and anything that stops someone from TR'ing is a barrier to ddo store sales (xp pot, stones, hearts).
    Dorian

  5. #5
    Community Member Ghwyn's Avatar
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    that makes no sense. A tr is a new life.
    Gwhyn Saige - heroic and epic completionist, loving the EK build
    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...elee-wizard-EK

  6. #6
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghwyn View Post
    that makes no sense. A tr is a new life.
    sort of... it is a reincarnation where many of the things you have done are reset like favor
    but you keep all your gear and gain a past life bonus, monster manual slayers, or crafting XP.

    I am just saying what harm is there in keeping incremental counters on raid completions... I think the overal lgame benefit would outweigh any arguments.
    Jotmon - Let's not forget why we play these games - to have fun - ~
    Guild: Degenerate Matter - 200 (Former Guilds: ChaosKnights, Big Damn Heroes, Shadowfiends, Order of the Drow, Unusual Suspects, Raided R)
    Argo-Jotmon(Completionist - before the Otto's/XP pots easymode), Jotmonheals(Clr17/Rog2/Mnk1-Epic Completionist), Whatthetruck.. and many many more alts..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.

  7. #7
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    /signed

    Completely logical reasoning. Love it ;D

  8. #8
    Community Member janave's Avatar
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    This one is still a good idea.

  9. #9
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    I think this is a really good idea, it would give people more incentive to flag/run raids while leveling.

  10. #10
    Community Member Ragnarnessaja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ghwyn View Post
    that makes no sense. A tr is a new life.
    In all seriousness it doesn't really matter. You should never, ever put "Lol but the Lore says this!" in front of a true quality of life change.

    Everybody knows the population is suffering from a decline. A change of this nature would encourage everyone to partake in content that they otherwise wouldn't.

    There is literally no downside to this suggestion being implemented.

  11. #11
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ragnarnessaja View Post
    There is literally no downside to this suggestion being implemented.
    Keep in mind you will lose the ability to farm points more than once per character if they decide to not reset completions in order to give you what you want here.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  12. #12
    Community Member Ragnarnessaja's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Keep in mind you will lose the ability to farm points more than once per character if they decide to not reset completions in order to give you what you want here.
    I don't farm points. If I need something from the store, I buy it, as it was intended.

    The only reason they allow people to 'farm points' in the manner you're talking about in the first place, is because it takes such a ridiculously long time to get anything of substance.

    And the reason they give you free points in the first place? To make you want to buy points.

  13. #13
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ragnarnessaja View Post
    I don't farm points. If I need something from the store, I buy it, as it was intended.

    The only reason they allow people to 'farm points' in the manner you're talking about in the first place, is because it takes such a ridiculously long time to get anything of substance.

    And the reason they give you free points in the first place? To make you want to buy points.
    Im making sure folks understand what they are asking for, and what they will lose if it happens.

    There are plenty of folks who do farm points. There are even threads talking about the best builds to do so, and order to run quests in. People who have TRd alot over the years and dont fall into the trap of impulse spending ended up with alot of points accumulated over that period of time.

    Saying there is literally no downside to this suggestion, is incorrect, for a significant portion of the player population.

    Wouldnt surprise me if they just sold the flags in the store. Get into von 5-6 without having to run 1-4, 395 Tp.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  14. #14
    Community Member redoubt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Keep in mind you will lose the ability to farm points more than once per character if they decide to not reset completions in order to give you what you want here.
    Are the raid completion counters the same data field as the favor tracking?

    Go ahead and wipe the favor and reset the quests, but keep the RAID completions number. If this is technically doable (and how would it not be?) then I think they should do it.

    I also, will not bother with certain raids sometimes because I know I'm going to TR. I'm also currently "stuck" at cap waiting to get two completions of CITW, but I can't get a group together. The way it looks, I will have capped my character on Monday night, but not TR for an entire week, while waiting for the next weekend to get the raids done. If I could keep the 18 completions, I would have already TR'd...

    Then again, I'm probably one of the player types they don't like. While I have 8 mules and 4 play ready characters, I really only play one anymore. So while I'm waiting for these completions, I'm not running other characters and not helping fill many groups. Sure I'll jump in something else if I could use the loot while I wait, but I've only run one quest in the last two days because of this...
    /sigh

  15. #15
    Community Member Psiandron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Im making sure folks understand what they are asking for, and what they will lose if it happens.

    There are plenty of folks who do farm points. There are even threads talking about the best builds to do so, and order to run quests in. People who have TRd alot over the years and dont fall into the trap of impulse spending ended up with alot of points accumulated over that period of time.

    Saying there is literally no downside to this suggestion, is incorrect, for a significant portion of the player population.

    Wouldnt surprise me if they just sold the flags in the store. Get into von 5-6 without having to run 1-4, 395 Tp.

    Agreed. I know a number of people who farm points.

    Also, I think that getting 20 raid completions is supposed to be an accomplishment, hence the bonus to the reward. What you're talking about JOTMON moves it in the direction of being a given.
    Quote Originally Posted by MalkavianX View Post
    and then dropped it like a burning kitten

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psiandron View Post
    Agreed. I know a number of people who farm points.

    Also, I think that getting 20 raid completions is supposed to be an accomplishment, hence the bonus to the reward. What you're talking about JOTMON moves it in the direction of being a given.
    This supposes that sitting in one level range and running a raid nonstop is more of an accomplishment than running the raid over many lives. I don't think that's true.

  17. #17
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Keep in mind you will lose the ability to farm points more than once per character if they decide to not reset completions in order to give you what you want here.
    I think you failed to read what I was asking for.

    I am asking not to reset completion counters which is completely different than favor.

    Favor should reset..every life should have to reflag and rerun the quests... that is expected.

    All I was asking to remain was the completions counters..

    you know... when you do /completions or /raid completions... the part that accululatesd for 20th incremental rewards....
    Last edited by JOTMON; 06-18-2014 at 01:19 PM.
    Jotmon - Let's not forget why we play these games - to have fun - ~
    Guild: Degenerate Matter - 200 (Former Guilds: ChaosKnights, Big Damn Heroes, Shadowfiends, Order of the Drow, Unusual Suspects, Raided R)
    Argo-Jotmon(Completionist - before the Otto's/XP pots easymode), Jotmonheals(Clr17/Rog2/Mnk1-Epic Completionist), Whatthetruck.. and many many more alts..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.

  18. #18
    Community Member shadowowl's Avatar
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    ya would be nice i've run shroud like 60 times but never managed to do 20 in a single life as I tr so often I think i got up to 12 once lol I still flag in process of xping but don't run the raid itself much anymore.
    and currently i'm not going to tr until i get 20 of each of the new ones since i've run both 20-30 times each but not 20 in one life. my tr addiction usually wins out over raids. sadly the only toon i have that has managed 20 raid completions of any raid is a first life bard that i use as a filler when guildies run raids and I'm not at level or flagged yet lol.

  19. #19
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psiandron View Post
    Also, I think that getting 20 raid completions is supposed to be an accomplishment, hence the bonus to the reward. What you're talking about JOTMON moves it in the direction of being a given.

    Yes this is almost what I am saying.
    The raid would still have to be run in incrementals of 20 for your chance at the special reward list,... just not pidgeon-holed into one life... DDO has evolved past the only 1 life llimitation.

    and really, so what if I get my incremental 20's spreading them out across multiple lives, I believe DDO as a whole would benefit by the end result of more at level flagging and raid runs vs overlevel farming or skipping all together.
    Last edited by JOTMON; 06-18-2014 at 01:10 PM.
    Jotmon - Let's not forget why we play these games - to have fun - ~
    Guild: Degenerate Matter - 200 (Former Guilds: ChaosKnights, Big Damn Heroes, Shadowfiends, Order of the Drow, Unusual Suspects, Raided R)
    Argo-Jotmon(Completionist - before the Otto's/XP pots easymode), Jotmonheals(Clr17/Rog2/Mnk1-Epic Completionist), Whatthetruck.. and many many more alts..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.

  20. #20
    Hopeless Romantic dunklezhan's Avatar
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    I'd completely forgotten there was a 20th completion reward list for raids! I've only ever seen it in shroud back when cap was 20, and there really wasn't anything else to do but try to make your Greensteel or TR (or do the former so you could do the latter and be uber at L11). I don't see the lists, because I don't use loot as a motivation to run a raid, I run them if there happens to be a group going and I'm flagged.

    But there's a clear number of players who DO do those 20 runs to get specific things, and for some reason they enjoy doing so - this suggestion has no drawbacks that I can see: if favour and flagging is reset but completions isn't, this seems completely reasonable to me.

    Re the lore perspective, which I'm pretty keen on: My view is that 'loot drop rates' are nothing to do with Lore, verisimilitude or anything else like that. Its just a way of abstracting reward. 20th completion lists are a 'still not got the damn thing? Here you go' mechanic, which is entirely metagamey in and of itself. Nothing wrong with that going between lives, and no reason it should need to affect TP/favour rewards unless those systems are linked behind the scenes, which is also nothing to do with whether completions continuing between lives would be a good or bad thing.

    Hopefully Turbine can put it on the list of things to add. +1 OP.
    Quote Originally Posted by Vargouille View Post
    The best of the best DDO players generally overperform when given a real challenge

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