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  1. #1
    Community Member burningwind's Avatar
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    Default hmm i was thinking..

    would it be better if turbine remove all level requirement on equipment? i mean in real dnd i don't think there is level requirement for equipment.. come to think about it, it would be much much more fun if there are no level requirement on equipment.. i wonder if its just me..

  2. #2
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by burningwind View Post
    i wonder if its just me..
    It's just you.

  3. #3
    Community Member Red_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by burningwind View Post
    hmm i was thinking...
    I hope it didn't hurt.

    But in all seriousness, it's a balance issue. In PnP the DM has control over what loot is found. Thus if a player finds a +5 Holy Defender of Dragon Disintegrating at level one... Well, all but the worst DMs wont even consider putting that in a level 1 adventure.

    In a video game there's nothing preventing Joe Epic-Level from giving his buddy Eric Newguy that +5 holy defender of dragon disintegrating the instant they step off the boat from Korthos. Or the full suit of Platemail of Invincibility On Heroic Difficulty, or the Rings of Everything Dies Instantly. Min level on gear serves the same purpose as the DM assessing which pieces of magic loot should be in his dungeons and any (if they exist) magic shops.

    And yes, my gear examples are hilariously exaggerated.
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  4. #4
    Community Member PermaBanned's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by burningwind View Post
    would it be better if turbine remove all level requirement on equipment? i mean in real dnd i don't think there is level requirement for equipment.. come to think about it, it would be much much more fun if there are no level requirement on equipment.. i wonder if its just me..
    While it would definitely add a level of convenience to Reincarnating strapping on your best gear and never needing to hit the bank while leveling up, that's about the only thing I would call good about this idea...
    Now excuse me while I wander off to arm myself with Grilled Cheese Sandwiches and hunker down behind my Armored Beer Refrigerator, while I have the UFO's take control of the Congresional Wives with the help of the International Cocaine Smugglers and the Evil Geniuses for a Better Tomorrow

  5. #5
    Community Member Jeremiah179's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    While it would definitely add a level of convenience to Reincarnating strapping on your best gear and never needing to hit the bank while leveling up, that's about the only thing I would call good about this idea...
    Ill toss the OP a bone and say - condensing the ML more might be nice to give us a little more replay-ability.


    A. We could have ML0,4,8,12,16,20,24,28 and then drop everything down to the nearest ML for everyone.

    B. Or to control giving stuff away, we could drop the ML XX levels on any item you bind to yourself with the ritual thingy....like say 3-4 levels or something.

    In case B, you get Pinion and can use it at level 23, but you bind it and can use it at level 20 if you ever ETR or TR that character.
    Or Gianthold items drop from 25 to 22, etc.

    To make it a "second use" effect, just make it so you have to have the item equipped to do the "effect" on it...
    Jeremiiah - Isaiiah - Zephaniiah - Ghallanda - Old Timers Guild

  6. #6
    Community Member AbyssalMage's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by burningwind View Post
    would it be better if turbine remove all level requirement on equipment? i mean in real dnd i don't think there is level requirement for equipment.. come to think about it, it would be much much more fun if there are no level requirement on equipment.. i wonder if its just me..
    Nope, thought about the same thing.

    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Knight View Post
    I hope it didn't hurt.

    But in all seriousness, it's a balance issue. In PnP the DM has control over what loot is found. Thus if a player finds a +5 Holy Defender of Dragon Disintegrating at level one... Well, all but the worst DMs wont even consider putting that in a level 1 adventure.

    In a video game there's nothing preventing Joe Epic-Level from giving his buddy Eric Newguy that +5 holy defender of dragon disintegrating the instant they step off the boat from Korthos. Or the full suit of Platemail of Invincibility On Heroic Difficulty, or the Rings of Everything Dies Instantly. Min level on gear serves the same purpose as the DM assessing which pieces of magic loot should be in his dungeons and any (if they exist) magic shops.

    And yes, my gear examples are hilariously exaggerated.
    Lol, reminds me of the comics in Dragon magazine (forgot the name. They even have a board game I believe).

    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    While it would definitely add a level of convenience to Reincarnating strapping on your best gear and never needing to hit the bank while leveling up, that's about the only thing I would call good about this idea...
    More bank space :-)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeremiah179 View Post
    Ill toss the OP a bone and say - condensing the ML more might be nice to give us a little more replay-ability.

    A. We could have ML0,4,8,12,16,20,24,28 and then drop everything down to the nearest ML for everyone.

    B. Or to control giving stuff away, we could drop the ML XX levels on any item you bind to yourself with the ritual thingy....like say 3-4 levels or something.

    In case B, you get Pinion and can use it at level 23, but you bind it and can use it at level 20 if you ever ETR or TR that character.
    Or Gianthold items drop from 25 to 22, etc.

    To make it a "second use" effect, just make it so you have to have the item equipped to do the "effect" on it...
    To control giving stuff away, just make it BTA or BTC. BTC prevents it from ever going to a twink. Regardless, I like the idea but most players would grow bored of such a system as it would trivialize all but the latest "greatest" content .

  7. #7
    The Hatchery
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Knight View Post
    And yes, my gear examples are hilariously exaggerated.
    Are they? I seem to remember reading about a silly "halfling" being twinked with uber mithril armor. I really hate it when powergamers twink their friends that way, it ruins the game for the rest of us when even a gimp build like that halfling had can do end game stuff just because of the twink items.

    It's definitely an N-word.

  8. #8
    Community Member Lonnbeimnech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Red_Knight View Post
    I hope it didn't hurt.

    But in all seriousness, it's a balance issue. In PnP the DM has control over what loot is found. Thus if a player finds a +5 Holy Defender of Dragon Disintegrating at level one... Well, all but the worst DMs wont even consider putting that in a level 1 adventure.
    Nah, the best DM's would put in things like that. The difference is that the owner of the sword would be a high level fighter or fallen paladin with many other nifty weapons and a henchman wizard with a scrying orb that hunts down the players, or something like that.

    or put in a dragon that the players would foolishly think they were supposed to fight since they just found this dragon killing sword. Only to find out the dragon likes to assume the form of an elven sorcerer, and as an elf isn't vulnerable to the dragon slaying aspect of the weapon, and kills the party, or whatever.

    Can't do stuff like that in ddo, since the quests are the same each time you run them.

  9. #9
    Community Member the_one_dwarfforged's Avatar
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    bunch of haters...

    lvl 1 esos anyone? /signed
    Quote Originally Posted by Severlin View Post
    Fighter is fine, though I agree it is behind Paladin. Their greatest weakness is actually saving throws.
    statements like this are why i have no confidence in the dev team.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by burningwind View Post
    would it be better if turbine remove all level requirement on equipment? i mean in real dnd i don't think there is level requirement for equipment.. come to think about it, it would be much much more fun if there are no level requirement on equipment.. i wonder if its just me..
    If we would play "vanilla D&D" then I would agree. If you look at the available equipment and the game time required to craft/mend/repair armour/weapons/etc. then there would be no point in level restrictions. The campaign setting (i.e. the supposed technological level) would restrict available armours, weapons and ingredients (e.g. knowledge of bronzemaking, ironmaking, steelmaking, etc., availability of natural resources). The game master would have you hunt several weeks/months of game time for rare crafting ingredients. There would be the danger of a player character dying of old age before accumulating a full decked out equipment set (Powergamers would then surely switch to elves/drow because of their long lifespans or pursue a way to lichdom or to become a sentient undead).

    In DDO as in most MMOs there are reasons for level restrictions. To impede trade. To force players to run certain content. To somewhat slow down power creep on lower levels.

    I could live with no level limits if item decay would be "reintroduced" for every piece of equipment. Yes, DDO still has item durability but let's be honest, when was the last time you lost a piece of equipment due to its max durability reaching 0?
    Last edited by deuxanes; 05-18-2014 at 07:25 AM.

  11. #11
    Community Member Zantax's Avatar
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    In PnP game, if I would be GM and my players would want to get powerful items on early levels really bad then sure, I would give some to them. However all of those items would be intelligent with incredible high Ego. Oh yea, that would be fun ;p

  12. #12
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by burningwind View Post
    would it be better if turbine remove all level requirement on equipment?
    No.

    OTOH, I wouldn't mind if Turbine borrowed a page from LOTRO and introduced gear which leveled up with you. You kinda-sorta have that with the Challenge gear and the upgradeable raid loot and the crafting systems. But I was thinking of the Legendary items in LOTRO which gain XP from using them and grow in power as you level them up. [At least I think that's how it worked; been a long time since I played LOTRO.]

  13. #13
    Community Member Red_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deuxanes View Post
    Yes, DDO still has item durability but let's be honest, when was the last time you lost a piece of equipment due to its max durability reaching 0?
    Two days ago actually. I don't usually bind gear that I pick up at lowish levels. Or that I suspect can easily be replaced with the same or better. My lev 18 monk for instance has a belt which is down to 60% max durability. And a sorc just had their boots become useless when I went to fix them.
    Finding ones past, present, and future in the threads of destiny.

  14. #14
    Community Member Red_Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zantax View Post
    In PnP game, if I would be GM and my players would want to get powerful items on early levels really bad then sure, I would give some to them. However all of those items would be intelligent with incredible high Ego. Oh yea, that would be fun ;p
    Evil! I like it. Nothing says "beware what you wish for" like finding that insanely powerful sword, and then discovering it has forced you to slaughter six towns full of innocent women and children... when you're playing a paladin.

    Reminds me a bit of a really bad DM I had once. He'd thought it was a Good Idea to give the party's fighter (me) a +3 bastard sword of demon slaying (+5 specifically against demons). This sword also had a specific name, and if I ever figured out the name it's full power would be unlocked. My fighter was level 1. I, as a player, thought that was too powerful of a weapon to give to a level 1 character. So in-character my fighter spent 2 sessions (weeks game time) mulling over the nature of who gave him the sword. He'd never heard of a 'good' demon. And seriously distrusted the nature of the giver, and gift.

    So at the end of the 2nd session he drew the sword and plunged it into the ground. In a very rocky area. I rolled a natural 20 for the str check to drive the sword into the ground, so the current DM (we were doing round robin DMing for the campaign) ruled the sword was stuck there really well. And wasn't going to be drawn by anyone less then a destined hero. Once the weapon was removed from the campaign in that way, the person who gave it to me whined about how now I'd never discover the awesome abilities of the sword. He also told me what the name had been. What was the name? Why, none other then "Lifedrinker Soulslicer". I never learned what the full powers were for the sword. Just the name alone says it all.

    Then again, this was a person who thought sending level 1 adventurers to help a village of 'good' demons who are under attack by a balor and it's army of hellspawn was a good idea. Why were *we* sucked into this battle instead of the powerful champions that must be running around? Because the party's incompetent druid (current DM's character when it's someone else's turn to DM) was the reincarnation of a great druidic hero and was the prophesied destined hero to save this village. Even staying in-character, I scoffed this idea. This druid had consistently done more to help the enemies we fought then us. His favorite spell was Entangle, which he would center on my dwarven fighter. Thus entrapping pretty much the entire party, himself included usually. Meanwhile the enemies we were fighting kept not being in the area of effect, or would be strong enough to break free easily. Such as entangling the party... and the ogre we were fighting.
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  15. #15
    Community Member moomooprincess's Avatar
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    I want no ML on gear.

    I want all monsters to die as soon as I aggro them, I don't even want to have to decide how to fight them. Just make it happen.

    I want all loot that drops to be mine, even if it is for another player.

    I want all quest XP and favor immediately, I don't want to have to work for it.

    I want to be level 30 immediately. Sio what if level cap is 28, okay modify that, I want to always be two levels above level cap.

    I want to be uber reincarnated. You know, just give me all past lives.

    I want the WIN Button.

    I want the servers to always grant me access, even if there is no electricity. I want ALL access.

    Oh, I also want all of this without having to pay for it.
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  16. #16
    Community Member Luxgolg's Avatar
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    On the flipside of this, why level at all? Start us at 28. Same theory. Reduced XP for running easier content like Harbor. We can farm whatever gear we need/want and take it from there

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