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  1. #1

    Default Comfortably Numb ship buff discussion thread for U22

    Update 22, which should go live sometime in mid/late June, will bring an overhaul to guild airships. This thread is to figure out how we want to set up our ship under the new system.



    Notable changes:

    • There's a single "buff bar" on the top level of the ship that gives you (and your pet) all active ship buffs in a single interaction.
    • Ship buff timers last 3-6 hours depending on guild level
    • Ship buffs persist through death
    • Many (most?) ship buffs give scaled effects, with three different values based on your character's level:
      • Level 1 to 10
      • Level 11 to 20
      • Level 21+
    • Energy resistance (acid/cold/electricity/fire/sonic) drops from a flat 30 to 5/10/15, and now stacks with the resist energy spell.
    • Instead of extending ship buffs each month, once you buy a ship buff it's permanently available to the guild, even if we upgrade to a new ship. Officers are able to freely switch around any buffs we've purchased.
    • There is a separate legacy area on the ship where we can continue to place the old-style ship buffs, but it is doubtful we will be able to buy more of them. (Maybe stock up now on mules?)

    I'm assuming that because the ship buffs only need to be purchased once, they will be extremely expensive. So we'll make a plan for what we ideally want, and then may need to save up to buy them all.



    Our Stormglory Typhoon will have the following hookpoints when U22 goes live:

    • 13 small (new style)
    • 3 large (new style)
    • 10 crew, 14 small, 6 large (old style)




    Energy Shrines

    Energy shrines give resistance, absorption and spell power all in one. Plus, each individual energy shrine covers two energy types. (Fire & Light, Acid & Cold, Sonic & Electricity.) Based on our guild level there are two different tiers available to us:
    • Tier II: +5/10/15 energy resistance, +5/10/15 spell power, +?/?/5% absorption
    • Tier III: +5/10/15 energy resistance, +5/10/15 spell power, +?/?/10% absorption (fire & light only)




    We just recently hit guild level 88. I'm assuming that when U22 goes live (in around a month) we'll be at least level 90, but not yet 95. Here's the buffs available to a level 90 guild:

    (Note that all bonuses were checked on a 21+ level character, so some of the bonuses may be lesser for heroic characters.)

    Small Hookpoints (34 total, we can have any 13)
    • Arcane Sanctum (+1 saves vs. Enchantments, +25 Spell Points and +1 Spell Penetration)
    • Archery Range/Seasoned Archer (+2% Doubleshot)
    • Archwizard (+1 to all spell DCs)
    • Armory (+?/?/6 AC and +?/?/15% Fortification)
    • Banquet Hall (Heals ???? spell and hit points for 1 minute)
    • Bash the Breakable's Cargo Bay (+1 treasure level from chests)
    • Black Abbot's Shadow (+1 Turn Undead, Lay on Hands and Smite Evil. +4 AC (deflection) and +1 to saves vs Evil (enhancement) that doesn't stack with Protection from Evil)
    • Chronoscope (+3 Reflex saves, +40% movement speed while in public areas, doesn't stack with Pendant of Time)
    • Concert Hall (+1 saves vs. enchantments, +1 Bard Song and Action Boost per day)
    • Crusader's Chapel (+?/?/15 devotion and nullification)
    • Danger Room (+?/?/3 Disable Device, Hide, Open Lock, Search and Spot
    • Farshifter's Chambers (Teleporter with included Hall of Heroes teleport)
    • Fencing Master (+2% maximum dodge and +2 max dex bonus to armor)
    • Floating Rock Garden (+2 Strength and +2 Wisdom)
    • Forbidden Library (+?/?/3 Concentration, Heal, Repair, Spellcraft and Use Magic Device)
    • Game Hunter (+3 Fortitude saves and +5% damage to helpless enemies)
    • Grandmaster's Dojo (+2 Will Saves)
    • Guild Vault III (Guild and Officer Chests)
    • Hag's Apothecary (+20 hit points, +1 saves vs. poison and disease)
    • Ninja Assassin: (+0.25[W] and +6 to-hit when flanking)
    • Old Sully's Grog Cellar (+2 Charisma and +2 Constitution)
    • Orien Express (Mailbox, Auction House and Bank)
    • Otto's Irresistable Dance Hall (+?/?/3 Balance, Jump, Move Silently, Perform, Swim and Tumble)
    • Paradoxical Puzzle Box (+2 Dexterity and +2 Intelligence)
    • Sellsword's Tavern (Your Hirelings gain +3 to all ability scores)
    • Sign of the Silver Flame III (Fire + Light)
    • Shrine of Experience V (+5% xp)
    • Shrine of the Devourer II (Acid + Cold)
    • Stormreaver Memorial II (Electricity + Sonic)
    • Tactical Training Room (+2 to-hit, +?/?/6 damage on critical hits, +1 DC to Trip, Sunder and Slicing Blow)
    • Three Finger Thad's (General Vendor)
    • Throne Room (+?/?/3 Bluff, Diplomacy, Haggle, Intidimidate and Listen)
    • Trapsmith's Workshop (+5% Fortification bypass)
    • Wild Grove (+2 Wild Empathy per rest and +3 to all ability scores for summoned/charmed creatures)

    Large Hookpoints (6 total, we can have any 3)
    • Bathhouse (+10% healing amp, unconsciousness extends by +15 hitpoints and receive 10% less damage while helpless)
    • Cannith Crafting Hall (All five crafting stations plus crafting vendor)
    • Collegium of the Twelve (Wild Grove, Crusader's Chapel, Arcane Sanctum and Trapsmith's Workshop)
    • Grand Reliquary II (All energy shrines, Tier II (Fire+Light, Acid+Cold, Electricity+Sonic)
    • Greensteel Crafting Room (All four shroud altars, including the base item one from meridia)
    • Proving Ground (Grandmaster's Dojo, Armory, Archery Range and Tactical Training Room




    Here's the physical layout of the hookpoints on the new ship:

    Top Floor: Unable to see any hookpoints.
    First Floor: 8 Small & 2 Large Hookpoint.
    Second Floor: 5 Small & 1 Large Hookpoint.
    Cargo Hold: 10 Crew, 14 Small & 6 Large Hookpoints. (Legacy Shipbuffs only)



    I suppose it would be helpful to identify ourselves when offering ideas. I'm known in the guild as Ellis.

  2. #2

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    Here's the list of smalls split into categories:


    Stats
    Floating Rock Garden (+2 Strength and +2 Wisdom)
    Old Sully's Grog Cellar (+2 Charisma and +2 Constitution)
    Paradoxical Puzzle Box (+2 Dexterity and +2 Intelligence)

    Resists
    Sign of the Silver Flame III (Fire + Light)
    Shrine of the Devourer II (Acid + Cold)
    Stormreaver Memorial II (Electricity + Sonic)

    Skills
    Danger Room (+?/?/3 Disable Device, Hide, Open Lock, Search and Spot
    Forbidden Library (+?/?/3 Concentration, Heal, Repair, Spellcraft and Use Magic Device)
    Otto's Irresistable Dance Hall (+?/?/3 Balance, Jump, Move Silently, Perform, Swim and Tumble)
    Throne Room (+?/?/3 Bluff, Diplomacy, Haggle, Intidimidate and Listen)

    Convenience
    Banquet Hall (Heals ???? spell and hit points for 1 minute)
    Farshifter's Chambers (Teleporter with included Hall of Heroes teleport)
    Orien Express (Mailbox, Auction House and Bank)
    Three Finger Thad's (General Vendor)

    Saves and Defense
    Armory (+?/?/6 AC and +?/?/15% Fortification)
    Chronoscope (+3 Reflex saves, +40% movement speed while in public areas, doesn't stack with Pendant of Time)
    Fencing Master (+2% maximum dodge and +2 max dex bonus to armor)
    Grandmaster's Dojo (+2 Will Saves)
    Hag's Apothecary (+20 hit points, +1 saves vs. poison and disease)

    DPS
    Game Hunter (+3 Fortitude saves and +5% damage to helpless enemies)
    Ninja Assassin: (+0.25[W] and +6 to-hit when flanking)
    Tactical Training Room (+2 to-hit, +?/?/6 damage on critical hits, +1 DC to Trip, Sunder and Slicing Blow)
    Trapsmith's Workshop (+5% Fortification bypass)

    Casters
    Archwizard (+1 to all spell DCs)
    Arcane Sanctum (+1 saves vs. Enchantments, +25 Spell Points and +1 Spell Penetration)
    Crusader's Chapel (+?/?/15 devotion and nullification)

    Archers
    Archery Range/Seasoned Archer (+2% Doubleshot)

    Pets and Hirelings
    Sellsword's Tavern (Your Hirelings gain +3 to all ability scores)
    Wild Grove (+2 Wild Empathy per rest and +3 to all ability scores for summoned/charmed creatures)

    Miscellaneous
    Bash the Breakable's Cargo Bay (+1 treasure level from chests)
    Black Abbot's Shadow (+1 Turn Undead, Lay on Hands and Smite Evil. +4 AC (deflection) and +1 to saves vs Evil (enhancement) that doesn't stack with Protection from Evil)
    Concert Hall (+1 saves vs. enchantments, +1 Bard Song and Action Boost per day)
    Guild Vault III (Guild and Officer Chests)
    Shrine of Experience V (+5% xp)







    Here's the list of larges with detail on their constituent smalls:


    Bathhouse
    (+10% healing amp, unconsciousness extends by +15 hitpoints and receive 10% less damage while helpless)

    Cannith Crafting Hall
    (All five crafting stations plus crafting vendor)

    Greensteel Crafting Room
    (All four shroud altars, including the base item one from meridia)

    Grand Reliquary II
    • Sign of the Silver Flame II (Fire + Light)
    • Shrine of the Devourer II (Acid + Cold)
    • Stormreaver Memorial II (Electricity + Sonic)

    Collegium of the Twelve
    • Wild Grove (+2 Wild Empathy per rest and +3 to all ability scores for summoned/charmed creatures)
    • Crusader's Chapel (+?/?/15 devotion and nullification)
    • Arcane Sanctum (+1 saves vs. Enchantments, +25 Spell Points and +1 Spell Penetration)
    • Trapsmith's Workshop (+5% Fortification bypass)

    Proving Ground
    • Grandmaster's Dojo (+2 Will Saves)
    • Armory (+?/?/6 AC and +?/?/15% Fortification)
    • Archery Range/Seasoned Archer (+2% Doubleshot)
    • Tactical Training Room (+2 to-hit, +?/?/6 damage on critical hits, +1 DC to Trip, Sunder and Slicing Blow)

  3. #3
    Community Member Zhacko's Avatar
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    Hey all,

    Well, what I've noticed, with the exception of myself, Nick and I believe maybe one other guildie, the majority of us are massive physcal DPS and magical DPS. So, I would suggest that we direct the amenities to boosting physical and magical attacks. I like the one amenity that gives the +1 to treasure pulls as well.

    On a personal note, I don't think we need the large crafting rooms, we can just use the cargo hold to create the old Greensteel Altars.

    That's my thoughts. Thanks,
    James
    I am Rheinhart and Crytonian on Argonessen.

  4. #4

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    Hmmm, sitting down to process my thoughts on this, as opposed to just straight transcription, starting with the larges:


    Proving Ground
    • Grandmaster's Dojo (+2 Will Saves)
    • Armory (+?/?/6 AC and +?/?/15% Fortification)
    • Archery Range/Seasoned Archer (+2% Doubleshot)
    • Tactical Training Room (+2 to-hit, +?/?/6 damage on critical hits, +1 DC to Trip, Sunder and Slicing Blow)

    This one is nice. I put high premium on any DCs, and this large includes Trip DC. +2 Will saves is solid and +15% fort is solid. The doubleshot is largely pointless, since many (most?) range builds use manyshot and/or 10k stars, which makes doubleshot not really do anything. So this large then consolidates three smalls I like quite a bit. Seems like a quality value.


    Collegium of the Twelve
    • Wild Grove (+2 Wild Empathy per rest and +3 to all ability scores for summoned/charmed creatures)
    • Crusader's Chapel (+?/?/15 devotion and nullification)
    • Arcane Sanctum (+1 saves vs. Enchantments, +25 Spell Points and +1 Spell Penetration)
    • Trapsmith's Workshop (+5% Fortification bypass)

    I have characters that would gain specific benefits from the first three here: A pet-using wizard and a necro cleric. That said, the first three buffs in this list are meh at best, easily skipped. The last one is nice but could be had for a single small instead of taking up a large.


    Grand Reliquary II
    • Sign of the Silver Flame II (Fire + Light)
    • Shrine of the Devourer II (Acid + Cold)
    • Stormreaver Memorial II (Electricity + Sonic)

    The downside to using a large energy is that we don't get the benefit of Tier III fire & light, which we can get via smalls. The upside is consolidating three "must-haves" into a single large.


    Bathhouse (+10% healing amp, unconsciousness extends by +15 hitpoints and receive 10% less damage while helpless)

    I really, really, really, really, really like healing amp. It sucks that you have to spend a large on what amounts to a single solitary buff, since the other two aspects of this seem kind of crappy. In a pinch we can stock up on jorasco healing amp buffs and keep the amp going in the cargo hold down below.


    Cannith Crafting Hall (All five crafting stations plus crafting vendor)
    Greensteel Crafting Room (All four shroud altars, including the base item one from meridia)

    Both of these are neato but at this point it's pretty clear that the larges that give actual buffs are probably too nice to "waste" a slot on convenience items. In addition to being able to keep greensteel going old-style in the cargo hold, any officer can temporarily switch in a greensteel station in place of whatever if anyone needs to craft, then switch it back out after they finish crafting.



    My initial thoughts for the three larges are to go with:

    Proving Ground
    Grand Reliquary II
    Bathhouse

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    My initial thoughts for the three larges are to go with:

    Proving Ground
    Grand Reliquary II
    Bathhouse
    If I'm starting with the above three larges then I already have the following seven smalls for "free":

    0) Archery Range/Seasoned Archer (+2% Doubleshot)
    0) Armory (+?/?/6 AC and +?/?/15% Fortification)
    0) Grandmaster's Dojo (+2 Will Saves)
    0) Sign of the Silver Flame II (Fire + Light)
    0) Shrine of the Devourer II (Acid + Cold)
    0) Stormreaver Memorial II (Electricity + Sonic)
    0) Tactical Training Room (+2 to-hit, +?/?/6 damage on critical hits, +1 DC to Trip, Sunder and Slicing Blow)


    The stats and xp shrines are no-brainer must-haves:

    1) Shrine of Experience V (+5% xp)
    2) Floating Rock Garden (+2 Strength and +2 Wisdom)
    3) Old Sully's Grog Cellar (+2 Charisma and +2 Constitution)
    4) Paradoxical Puzzle Box (+2 Dexterity and +2 Intelligence)


    I'm big on DCs:

    5) Archwizard (+1 to all spell DCs)


    The skills are mostly skippable, but +3 guild bonus to UMD sounds very nice. Penciling that in:

    6) Forbidden Library (+?/?/3 Concentration, Heal, Repair, Spellcraft and Use Magic Device)


    The +1 loot bonus sounds kind of fun, and has already received a vote:

    7) Bash the Breakable's Cargo Bay (+1 treasure level from chests)


    Chronoscope sounds super nice for first lifers and anyone with evasion:

    8) Chronoscope (+3 Reflex saves, +40% movement speed while in public areas, doesn't stack with Pendant of Time)


    A teleporter would be nice:

    9) Farshifter's Chambers (Teleporter with included Hall of Heroes teleport)


    I don't hate convenience on the ship, and since it only costs one small for all three, let's see if it fits:

    10) Orien Express (Mailbox, Auction House and Bank)


    An extra action boost is huge:

    11) Concert Hall (+1 saves vs. enchantments, +1 Bard Song and Action Boost per day)


    With two spots left, it's time to start emphasizing DPS:

    12) Trapsmith's Workshop (+5% Fortification bypass)
    13) Game Hunter (+3 Fortitude saves and +5% damage to helpless enemies)


    That leaves the following buffs not taken:

    Arcane Sanctum (+1 saves vs. Enchantments, +25 Spell Points and +1 Spell Penetration)
    Banquet Hall (Heals ???? spell and hit points for 1 minute)
    Black Abbot's Shadow (+1 Turn Undead, Lay on Hands and Smite Evil. +4 AC (deflection) and +1 to saves vs Evil (enhancement) that doesn't stack with Protection from Evil)
    Crusader's Chapel (+?/?/15 devotion and nullification)
    Danger Room (+?/?/3 Disable Device, Hide, Open Lock, Search and Spot
    Fencing Master (+2% maximum dodge and +2 max dex bonus to armor)
    Guild Vault III (Guild and Officer Chests)
    Hag's Apothecary (+20 hit points, +1 saves vs. poison and disease)
    Ninja Assassin: (+0.25[W] and +6 to-hit when flanking)
    Otto's Irresistable Dance Hall (+?/?/3 Balance, Jump, Move Silently, Perform, Swim and Tumble)
    Sellsword's Tavern (Your Hirelings gain +3 to all ability scores)
    Three Finger Thad's (General Vendor)
    Throne Room (+?/?/3 Bluff, Diplomacy, Haggle, Intidimidate and Listen)
    Wild Grove (+2 Wild Empathy per rest and +3 to all ability scores for summoned/charmed creatures)

    Of these buffs, I wouldn't mind the extra turn/loh per rest, but that's pretty niche. +2% dodge could be nice, though most builds that care about dodge cap their dodge without it. Ninja Assassin would be a must-have if the +0.25[W] applied to all attacks. My reading is that it only applies to flanking, in which case, meh. The general vendor is separate from the "restore hp and mana" guy, and neither of them appear to recharge your clickies. So I'm thinking we keep Sully going in the cargo hold and skip both of the new guys. So I'm comfortable skipping these four.

    The trap skills guy could be useful; I could be convinced to take that over something. I don't personally ever use the guild chest, but if you guys really like it I won't object to trying to squeeze it in.



    That makes my "perfect" setup the following:

    3 Large
    Proving Ground
    Grand Reliquary II
    Bathhouse

    13 Small
    1) Shrine of Experience V (+5% xp)
    2) Floating Rock Garden (+2 Strength and +2 Wisdom)
    3) Old Sully's Grog Cellar (+2 Charisma and +2 Constitution)
    4) Paradoxical Puzzle Box (+2 Dexterity and +2 Intelligence)
    5) Archwizard (+1 to all spell DCs)
    6) Forbidden Library (+?/?/3 Concentration, Heal, Repair, Spellcraft and Use Magic Device)
    7) Bash the Breakable's Cargo Bay (+1 treasure level from chests)
    8) Chronoscope (+3 Reflex saves, +40% movement speed while in public areas, doesn't stack with Pendant of Time)
    9) Farshifter's Chambers (Teleporter with included Hall of Heroes teleport)
    10) Orien Express (Mailbox, Auction House and Bank)
    11) Concert Hall (+1 saves vs. enchantments, +1 Bard Song and Action Boost per day)
    12) Trapsmith's Workshop (+5% Fortification bypass)
    13) Game Hunter (+3 Fortitude saves and +5% damage to helpless enemies)



    I could be convinced without much effort to try and fit in the following alternates:

    Black Abbot's Shadow (+1 Turn Undead, Lay on Hands and Smite Evil. +4 AC (deflection) and +1 to saves vs Evil (enhancement) that doesn't stack with Protection from Evil)
    Danger Room (+?/?/3 Disable Device, Hide, Open Lock, Search and Spot)
    Guild Vault III (Guild and Officer Chests)

    With three alternates, here's the three I would switch out, in order of switching out first to last:

    Bash the Breakable's Cargo Bay (+1 treasure level from chests)
    Trapsmith's Workshop (+5% Fortification bypass)
    Game Hunter (+3 Fortitude saves and +5% damage to helpless enemies)

    The loot bonus essentially boils down to just giving you more plat, and plat isn't really an issue. Not everything has fortification, so the fort bypass is sometimes useless. The +5% to helpless is very nice but not everyone can induce helpless. (Not everyone has action boosts either, but for those who do, +1 boosts/rest is a massive bonus.)

  6. #6
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    That sounds fine to me. Really, I'm happy with stats/resists/XP/teleporter; everything else is icing.

    Most of the focused stuff (rogue skills, turn undead, etc.) are things I'd have covered in a build/gear anyway. Aside from the DCs and spell pen, I don't know how helpful that would be in epics yet, so I'll leave that up to you all. Personally I would like Fencing Master, if it actually raises cap- I tend to hit dodge cap and max dex a lot, but that might just be me. The Library also looks very good for some casters and at least slightly useful for everyone.

    Cannith crafting station seems pretty useless since I *think* there's only a couple of us and we can probably manage the walk to house K. GS altars we could probably stock up on. I don't much care about the chests. As for the rest of it as long as the buffs stack with everything like they should and work properly, I'm fine with whatever.

    -Matt

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by FrancisP.Fancypants View Post
    Personally I would like Fencing Master, if it actually raises cap- I tend to hit dodge cap and max dex a lot, but that might just be me.
    Good call, I may have misread that one. If it raises the dodge cap, then yeah, it's a must-have.

    Agreed on Cannith Crafting station, especially because it's even a teleporter destination so there isn't even really any walking to do anyway.

  8. #8
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    Haha, seriously? Most of those buffs seem pretty well thought out, but that one..

  9. #9
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    What's the difference between tiers II and III of Fire/Light? Is it just a higher percentage?

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by FrancisP.Fancypants View Post
    What's the difference between tiers II and III of Fire/Light? Is it just a higher percentage?
    Yep.

    • Tier II: +5/10/15 energy resistance, +5/10/15 spell power, +?/?/5% absorption
    • Tier III: +5/10/15 energy resistance, +5/10/15 spell power, +?/?/10% absorption


    My assumption is that the absorption numbers will be 1/3/5 for tier II and 3/6/10 or 3/7/10 for tier III.

  11. #11
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    Cool Exciting ship buffs updates

    Hey Folks -

    I am glad in our cadre of slackers that Ellis is taking point on figuring this notable update out. Nice work bud.

    I will need to review the posts in a lil more detail before I offer an opinion on the situation.

    On first glance I imagine we'll have a balance, like we do now, of how the buffs will be spread out across heroic > epic level toons.

    Perhaps one area of the boat would have certain level-oriented buffs? IDK.

    We can maybe keep guild chest in old room (if im understanding it right so far), if folks still want it and find it useful.

    I personally don't like the two fast-movement shrines right next to each other (as with the boat now) b/c im constantly having to figure which one to ctrl e to use and it never procs the right one i want at the time, so those two spaced out would be nice.

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by division_H View Post
    Perhaps one area of the boat would have certain level-oriented buffs? IDK.
    The placement is only relevant for the bank/mail/auction one. All buffs are acquired by clicking a single location on the top of the ship. No more running around to get all your buffs!

    We can maybe keep guild chest in old room (if im understanding it right so far), if folks still want it and find it useful.
    I wouldn't mind seeing the guild chest go away but I don't begrudge keeping it if people like it.

    I personally don't like the two fast-movement shrines right next to each other (as with the boat now) b/c im constantly having to figure which one to ctrl e to use and it never procs the right one i want at the time, so those two spaced out would be nice.
    You mean the captain and the navigator?

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    Quote Originally Posted by division_H View Post
    I personally don't like the two fast-movement shrines right next to each other (as with the boat now) b/c im constantly having to figure which one to ctrl e to use and it never procs the right one i want at the time, so those two spaced out would be nice.
    Glad I'm not the only one. How many times have you wound up in restless isles now?

  14. #14

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    Would it be preferable to swap the navigator with the healing amp lady? Or maybe the scholar of the twelve?

    I like having all my teleporting from a single location (captain & navigator) but agree that it's pretty cramped up there. I'm happy to move the navigator around if you like.

  15. #15

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    More info, someone set up a new airship on lammania and opted to make one whole floor a "convenience" floor. The buffs they went with on that floor:

    Shroud crafting (which now has the altar to make greensteel blanks!)
    Orien Express: Mail box, auctioneer and bank
    Sellsword's Tavern: Barkeep and all hireling vendors
    Three Finger Thad's: General Vendor and pawn shops
    Crusader's chapel: Divine vendor with spell materials
    Arcane Sanctum: Arcane vendor with spell materials and spell inscription materials
    Archery Range: House D ammunition Vendor

    I'm liking the sound of something along these lines. As long as we have all the stat and resist shrines, I'm currently leaning toward more convenience than power. Some of the power buffs are pretty minimal so could be jettisoned without too much loss.

    I'll put together a "second look" set of recommendations sometime soon.

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