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  1. #1
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    Default trap-capable clonk: feat dilemma

    Hi all,

    Im planning for my next life on my caster, and Im considering 18/2 fvs/monk or 17/2/1 cleric/monk with trapskills. The problem is, how do I incorporate trapskills into a clonk without totally ruining the feat setup?

    feats would be like

    stunning first
    twf
    itwf
    gtwf
    maximize
    (empower)
    quicken
    PL:wiz
    evo focus
    adept of forms
    master of forms
    grandmaster of forms

    looking at this feat list, its impossible to take rogue at lvl 1, since I cant take two (or even one) of these feats with a lvl 1 rogue and 14 starting dex.

    Solution would be either take arti instead of rogue (can take metamagics at 1) or take rogue, but at a later level. Skillpoints are rather short (2 from cleric, 2-3 from int, 1 from human). Rogue has clearly better enhancements that arti for one level splash, arti has spellpoints and a lever-pulling dog.

    What would you do?
    Zeugen der Dreizehn, Thelanis:
    Makkuroi, chain TR: currently drow pure caster warlock
    PLs: Completionist; 3xWiz, Sor; 2x Pal, Brd, Monk EPLs: 3x CotQ,Brc,DS,EW,EC 1xFH,PLD ; IPLs: 2x BF; 3x PDK, SDK

  2. #2
    Community Member Lonnbeimnech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makkuroi View Post
    What would you do?
    Take cleric at level 1 to take meta magic feats, take the rogue level at 2, slightly dump search and use the find traps spell to make up the difference.

    http://ddowiki.com/page/Find_Traps

  3. #3
    Community Member Toro12's Avatar
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    That is a problem I've come across with a trapping divine.
    I'd say go arti @1 for the metas.
    I completely disagree with rogues having better EnH at 1 than arti especially since you seem to still be looking for a caster focus. (All the metas).
    Arcanotech with +USP per point spent , + spell points, some +crit and a weak but nice kicker SLA that at worst give a nice cheap ranged pulling option

    I'd probably consider dropping the evo focus. Tough to justify 1dc for a feat slot IMO.
    Unless your going whole hog PM or insta kill when you need to take any DC boost you can get.

    I think you'd be much better served going heighten than sf:evo

  4. #4
    Community Member giftie's Avatar
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    That's 11 (+1) feats, and a Human with 2 Monk bonus feats would only get 10 heroic feats, so I would assume you're taking Epic feats into account. But doing so leaves you 1-2 epics feat slots unaccounted for, solving your problem. Add Dodge or Toughness to the list, and take that and PL: Wiz at level 1.

    If you don't include epic feats, you'll run into trouble for another reason. ITWF would only be available once your +3 DEX tome kicks in at level 11. That means you'll have to squeeze in 4 feats (Master and GM of Forms as well as ITWF and GTWF) in 3 feat slots (12, 15 and 18).
    Last edited by giftie; 03-22-2014 at 11:25 AM.

  5. #5
    Community Member Toro12's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by giftie View Post
    That's 11 (+1) feats, and a Human with 2 Monk bonus feats would only get 10 heroic feats, so I would assume you're taking Epic feats into account. But doing so leaves you 1-2 epics feat slots unaccounted for, solving your problem. Add Dodge or Toughness to the list, and take that and PL: Wiz at level 1.

    If you don't include epic feats, you'll run into trouble for another reason. ITWF would only be available once your +3 DEX tome kicks in at level 11. That means you'll have to squeeze in 4 feats (Master and GM of Forms as well as ITWF and GTWF) in 3 feat slots (12, 15 and 18).
    Last I checked past life feats can't be taken till level 3. Been a while so it might have changed.

  6. #6
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    yes, I include epic feats, and dodge is high up on the list of possible last feats... unfortunately, wiz PL is lvl 3, and I need the evo focus to unlock the +3 evo twist from magister.

    about enhancement quality: enhancements would be mainly for traps, and rogue enhancements are better there with +3 reflex against traps, combined with rogue innate reflex thats +4 trap saves over arti. As far as firepower is concerned, Im better off with the cleric trees.

    Arti ------------------- vs ----------------- rogue
    more sp ---------------------------+4 trap saves
    dog------------------------------- +1d6 sneak
    repeaters--------------------------more skillpoints if I manage to get it at 1
    can take at lvl 1 for more skillpts

    tending towards arti right now
    Last edited by Makkuroi; 03-22-2014 at 05:40 PM.
    Zeugen der Dreizehn, Thelanis:
    Makkuroi, chain TR: currently drow pure caster warlock
    PLs: Completionist; 3xWiz, Sor; 2x Pal, Brd, Monk EPLs: 3x CotQ,Brc,DS,EW,EC 1xFH,PLD ; IPLs: 2x BF; 3x PDK, SDK

  7. #7
    Community Member Lonnbeimnech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Toro12 View Post
    Last I checked past life feats can't be taken till level 3. Been a while so it might have changed.
    Talk to Fred, he will allow it.

    WAI or not, I don't know.

  8. #8
    Community Member giftie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lonnbeimnech View Post
    Talk to Fred, he will allow it.

    WAI or not, I don't know.
    If I recall correctly, but it's been a while since I bothered with a purchased past life feat, the free past life feats are added at the end of character creation. Since they're prerequisites for the purchased past life feats, those can't be selected during level 1 for purely technical reasons. So I'd wager it's WAI due to lazy coding, because there's no hard level prerequistive I know of.

    Could be wrong.

  9. #9
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makkuroi View Post
    adept of forms
    master of forms
    grandmaster of forms
    Which stance do you plan to use most? If it's Ocean, then I would say the higher tiers aren't worth it: three feats for +2 WIS, +3% Dodge, +3 saves. If it's Earth, then you can stop at Master for the +1 crit multiplier. Only if it's Wind stance would I consider going all the way, and even then it's iffy since you're only gaining +2.5% dbl-strike per feat.
    Major build threads: Axesinger / Dwarven Defender / Drow Ninja / Drow Paladin / Elven Ranger / Monkcher / Sacred Vanguard / Cleric Domains / Kundarak Brigade / Iconic Builds
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  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    Which stance do you plan to use most? If it's Ocean, then I would say the higher tiers aren't worth it: three feats for +2 WIS, +3% Dodge, +3 saves. If it's Earth, then you can stop at Master for the +1 crit multiplier. Only if it's Wind stance would I consider going all the way, and even then it's iffy since you're only gaining +2.5% dbl-strike per feat.
    actually, I use both water and air, water for dc casting and trap saves, air for extra boss dps. Might use earth now and then, but not much.
    Zeugen der Dreizehn, Thelanis:
    Makkuroi, chain TR: currently drow pure caster warlock
    PLs: Completionist; 3xWiz, Sor; 2x Pal, Brd, Monk EPLs: 3x CotQ,Brc,DS,EW,EC 1xFH,PLD ; IPLs: 2x BF; 3x PDK, SDK

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Makkuroi View Post
    actually, I use both water and air, water for dc casting and trap saves, air for extra boss dps. Might use earth now and then, but not much.
    I run a 17/2/1 cleric/monk/fighter clonk. Fun to play, I don't DC cast at all, once in awhile i energy drain, destruction, or cast implosion.. but that's it.

    I did take Grandmaster of forms, and mostly use stunning fist for quick kills.. although it's single target.

    Ocean stance when I need to make saves (running through traps),
    Mountain stance for trash fights. The PPR for damage mitigation is huge. If I'm not worried about incoming damage, I go wind stance.
    Boss fights is a toss up between wind/mountain. I usually forget to switch.

    I opted to not go DC casting as when I need to heal people, I will run out of mana if I'm using mana to do damage. The monk/melee/stunning fist has great synergy with the cleric, and my mana can be reserved almost exclusively for healing.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGardes View Post
    I run a 17/2/1 cleric/monk/fighter clonk. Fun to play, I don't DC cast at all, once in awhile i energy drain, destruction, or cast implosion.. but that's it.

    I did take Grandmaster of forms, and mostly use stunning fist for quick kills.. although it's single target.

    Ocean stance when I need to make saves (running through traps),
    Mountain stance for trash fights. The PPR for damage mitigation is huge. If I'm not worried about incoming damage, I go wind stance.
    Boss fights is a toss up between wind/mountain. I usually forget to switch.

    I opted to not go DC casting as when I need to heal people, I will run out of mana if I'm using mana to do damage. The monk/melee/stunning fist has great synergy with the cleric, and my mana can be reserved almost exclusively for healing.
    with "dc casting" i meant implosion, stunning fist and GMoF abilities. Thats why I dont need heighten.
    Zeugen der Dreizehn, Thelanis:
    Makkuroi, chain TR: currently drow pure caster warlock
    PLs: Completionist; 3xWiz, Sor; 2x Pal, Brd, Monk EPLs: 3x CotQ,Brc,DS,EW,EC 1xFH,PLD ; IPLs: 2x BF; 3x PDK, SDK

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