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Thread: The Heal Spell

  1. #1
    Community Member Talonaise's Avatar
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    Default The Heal Spell

    While we can likely file this under the "Stuff that will never happen" heading, with the increase in undead with the new content I decided to bring it up anyway.

    One of the worst feelings is when you go to heal yourself, and accidentally hurt the undead that is targeted instead. Those deaths hurt more somehow and we have all been there, we have all done it.

    My question is this, wouldn't it be easier to have the healing spell break off into two versions (similar to fire shield ) where one is healing and one is harming? I know of no one who really uses heal to attack the mobs. There are just too many other more effective ways to do it, but this way they still could use it that way if they wanted to. If you didn't, then you could slide the heal only version onto your bar and never worry again.

    While I realize to go back and change the code for every healing spell to this mechanic would be a pain, and in fact splitting them all would be time consuming when you reset your character. But what if we only changed the one spell -- Heal -- which is used more than the others. It could work this way for spells and for scrolls. It seems a simple and elegant fix.

    There -- I feel better for putting my rant on "paper" - you may go back to waiting for the server to come up now
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  2. #2
    Community Member Grizzt14's Avatar
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    I'd love to see this change or something along these lines. I personally never use Heal to damage undead foes and would prefer an option to remove the ability to target undead with it, whether it be through changing the Heal spell itself or having two separate versions of Heal. With undead frequently over ingame, a change regarding this issue would be very much welcome IMO.
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  3. #3
    Community Member Culver.Civello's Avatar
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    To be fair, it's just a matter of watching where you throw it. I've had this happen to me before, and even have died in result of it... but it's not any different than accidentally having another party member targeted, who may or may not already have full health and accidentally sending it to them instead. Whether something like this gets implemented or not (More likely not), you still have to watch what you are targeting. Heck, at least if it is going toward an Undead, it's doing damage instead of a party member on full health getting absolutely no benefit from it. XD

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    YES!

    The three reasons I stopped playing divines:
    * Insane targeting
    * Lowest survival / Lowest DPS
    * The anti-byoh crowd

    The need to:
    * target yourself to heal yourself
    * turn around and hard target a close mob (because divine wrath lands where the mob was when you start casting and takes an eternity so if you pick a distant mob you will miss everything),
    * target a far mob (because wild shots passes through targets on the way and if you target a close mob, you don't hit the others).
    * target yourself to heal again

    I spent as much time trying to manage targets as I did trying to move and select spells.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Culver.Civello View Post
    To be fair, it's just a matter of watching where you throw it.
    But you combine this issue with the need to target mobs for other spells/abilities and the need to select different targets based on which spell/ability you are using and sometimes you are switching targets for EVERY action. That is fine if I'm healing a raid, I expect to be doing little else other than switching targets and healing. If I'm also trying to target mobs and running for my life... it reaches a point of just being far less fun than playing something with less target switching requirements.

  6. #6
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Sign me up!

    It drives me crazy everytime I try to untrget a mob to casta heal on myself and discouver that auto target has pickd another mob, so instead of healing myself I have cast heal at some undead thing.

    An option to heal only and not use for mobs would be greatly appreciated.

    A simple Right click meta option would be an easy fix.
    Last edited by JOTMON; 03-13-2014 at 02:59 PM.
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  7. #7
    The Hatchery Enoach's Avatar
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    I have been caught by this on many occasions and not just for Heal but for Lay On Hands and other cure type abilities that can also double as an attack on Undead.

    This issue only occurs when Undead mobs are heavy in the content - Which the new content is full of.

    However, I still don't think that creating a version of the Ability (spell or spell like or supernatural) is needed.

    What would be a solution in my mind would be to create a right click option (like meta magic setting) that could be set that would be "Self Target" or Standard. When "Self Target" is set no matter what you have targeted the spell will be cast on "Self". This would fix all features that have a duel purpose and allow the flexibility through the Players UI.

    For now I simply get in the habit of F1 - {healing hotkey}

  8. #8
    Community Member schelsullivan's Avatar
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    Maybe a feature like the ability to always/never meta options, where you right click on said healing spell and enable or disable offensive usage?

    Edit> DOH my post was ninja'd
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  9. #9
    Community Member ssgcmwatson's Avatar
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    Not to derail the thread too much - I also think that you should be able to "kill" undead with a raise dead spell.
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  10. #10
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    No. If you can't target, that's the not the spell's fault. Also, I use it all the time on some undead opponents.

    And no, raise dead shouldn't be able to kill undead.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ancient View Post
    But you combine this issue with the need to target mobs for other spells/abilities and the need to select different targets based on which spell/ability you are using and sometimes you are switching targets for EVERY action. That is fine if I'm healing a raid, I expect to be doing little else other than switching targets and healing. If I'm also trying to target mobs and running for my life... it reaches a point of just being far less fun than playing something with less target switching requirements.
    I even use a gamepad to play and have not had that much issue on my divine, is this really that hard to manage for other people?

  12. #12
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Panacide. View Post
    I even use a gamepad to play and have not had that much issue on my divine, is this really that hard to manage for other people?
    It is more noticable on higher end content, like the new stuff that is riddled with casters and undead where you also have to keep moving while healing.
    Anyone that is standing still is likely only doing so because they are dead.

    pew pewing undead and enemy caster Disintigrates that hit for 600hp, Dragons stomps for 1200damage.. aoe circles of death...
    everyone is spread out so mass cures are ineffective, spot heals are needed.
    In many cases I am using enlarge and heal since most players are scattered to minimize the aoe death attacks.

    Now if I was running casual/normal content I probably wouldnt care I could probably spend 10 minutes topping players up with my eteranal wand of cure minor wounds...
    but on EE you dont have the time to double check if your heals are landing when cycling between party members and you are doing this while doing the bob and weave run around the playing field.
    If your heal has hit a mob then it is likely a party member has just died...
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    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.

  13. #13
    Community Member Raoull's Avatar
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    I agree, this is a annoying problem.

    I even use Heals offensively sometimes. Just this week in the new adventure area my rogue did such pidly DPS to the skellies I was having a hire spam mass heal as well. But.... that is pretty rare. Given the option, I'd rather lose the ability to target enemies with heal if that's what it takes to never accidentally do so.

    I think a good way to implement this would be to have an checkbox available in game options. "Never target undead with heals." or the like. The meta style interface would be fine.... 2 spells would be fine... whatever. But it is a pain.


    Oddly, I find it far less of a pain with actual healers than it is with other toons that can heal. A healer hitting multiple players is already in the zone of "target -> heal" in the way a melee with Heal (or scrolls, or cures, or LOH, etc) is not.

    I find regular soft targetting doesn't create this problem, but I hard target often enough (either to track a baddies HPs, or to be sure I'm hitting the most dangerous one, etc) that I accidentally heal undead quite regularly.
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