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  1. #221
    Community Member Minrothad's Avatar
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    It's sad to see such a good thread being ruined by players taking advantage of this exploit.
    I've been in many raids with people carrying neglvl weapons (even casters using shurikens) but we know that in no way, shape or form it is an achievement to complete a quest like that. I think it's very funny that some people (even powergamers) are doing this just to "beat" someone's record.

  2. #222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Minrothad View Post
    It's sad to see such a good thread being ruined by players taking advantage of this exploit.
    I've been in many raids with people carrying neglvl weapons (even casters using shurikens) but we know that in no way, shape or form it is an achievement to complete a quest like that. I think it's very funny that some people (even powergamers) are doing this just to "beat" someone's record.
    It's only 1 person in 1 instance, I can almost guarantee every run made before that was completely legit.
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  3. #223
    Community Member Takllin's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keveniaftw View Post
    Check OP then, Ishr probably didn't notice but if it's less than half, it's not a guild run, my point was that your guildie is claiming you guys are the most holy sacred guild there is that would never do anything wrong, and apparently you've been posting what would count as pug runs, as guild runs. In fact in your post you never even credited the other guilds to thank them for joining, which is so unrespectful.

    I didn't prove you exploited, heck I never even claimed you DID exploit but I suggest it as a possibility. And unless you prove otherwise it will always remain a possibility. Not a single other guild got that hard in the defense when it was said that the posts would be removed

    I even voted in the discussion thread to have all the speedruns removed, that included mine which I (for now) can't remake since I TR'ed from sorc in FvS since then, I too only took a screenie, I did not exploit but I think everyone should fall under the same rules, any exploiter can claim they did not exploit, without proof we'll never know, and I'm sure if you didn't exploit, you can simply do it again without exploiting, but now with a proper vid. Simple as that
    Really? You might, just might, want to read his post again. I think you need to read a lot of posts again honestly. He never even got close to claiming that about our guild.

    That one post yup I did not list the other guilds of my friends who were in that particular run, but I did thank everyone else who joined up with us. It was a quick thing I did this morning or I would have written more about it.

    Have you seen the threads with our server first Deathwrym, and game first Thunder Peak? Where I explicitly put every guild of all members included in that run? Probably not, or your reading comprehension failed you again. Wouldn't be surprised.

    There are so many different exploits available right now. I'm sorry but I don't feel the need to prove myself that I'm a clean player. I actually have trust in people when they post these runs that they were done legitimately, I'm not a cynic. We are upset because SUPPOSEDLY one player, in one instance, SUPPOSEDLY used an exploit. So all the other runs should be wiped away? That's ridiculous.

    I will not be making any videos, it reduces my FPS to sub 20 numbers which makes it near impossible to play. We will beat our time again, and we will post it.

    Stop trying to troll.
    Last edited by Takllin; 03-31-2014 at 02:38 PM.

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  4. #224
    Community Member Grizzt14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Takllin View Post
    We are upset because SUPPOSEDLY one player, in one instance, SUPPOSEDLY used an exploit. So all the other runs should be wiped away? That's ridiculous.
    To further expand on this issue and a very good point:

    Quote Originally Posted by Firewall View Post
    Interesting. But are you sure this is not WAI? Crippling Flames is one of the few weapon enhancements on thunderforged weapons that does NOT explicitly say 'non-bosses only' and actually in epics monsters regain a negative level every 3 or 4 seconds so i think this is not really overpowered. You have to have many people with high attack speeds and crippling flames weapons to drain a high level boss to death. I doubt you could do it with a single person because it is only 2 levels every 20th attack.
    "Crippling Flames: On Crit: 135 to 325 Fire Damage. On Hit: 5% chance to apply 2 Negative Levels." (Source: http://ddowiki.com/page/Thunder_Forge)

    No one I know uses it because common opinion in our playing "circle" is other effects are better, but I see no reason to bar our 59 min Temple from being added in to the OP record (In which no one even used Crippling Flames or exploit to complete).
    Last edited by Grizzt14; 03-31-2014 at 06:04 PM. Reason: Edited post research
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  5. #225
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grizzt14 View Post
    To further expand on this issue and a very good point:



    "Crippling Flames: On Crit: 135 to 325 Fire Damage. On Hit: 5% chance to apply 2 Negative Levels." (Source: http://ddowiki.com/page/Thunder_Forge)

    Crippling Flames is working as described in the Thunder Forge effects. No one I know uses it because common opinion in our playing "circle" is other effects are better, but per its description it is functionally sound. As Crippling Flames is working per description and certainly not an "exploit", I see no reason to bar our 59 min Temple from being added in to the OP record (In which no one even used Crippling Flames or exploit to complete).
    Except for the fact that red/purple named are supposed to be immune to level loss. The assassin tod set said practically the same thing and worked on red/purple named, that got fixed. I think it's safe to say its not working as intended. I dont think your raid completion should be wiped because of it, that is unless all of you were draining levels
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  6. #226
    Community Member nolifer1's Avatar
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    and i also remeber icy prison from sorc savant, worked on bosses lol, right now its totlly borked and does not work even with trash mobs
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  7. #227
    Community Member Minrothad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grizzt14 View Post
    To further expand on this issue and a very good point:



    "Crippling Flames: On Crit: 135 to 325 Fire Damage. On Hit: 5% chance to apply 2 Negative Levels." (Source: http://ddowiki.com/page/Thunder_Forge)

    Crippling Flames is working as described in the Thunder Forge effects. No one I know uses it because common opinion in our playing "circle" is other effects are better, but per its description it is functionally sound. As Crippling Flames is working per description and certainly not an "exploit", I see no reason to bar our 59 min Temple from being added in to the OP record (In which no one even used Crippling Flames or exploit to complete).
    It is an exploit because it works on every monster in the game, and having seen it in action in the highest level raids in the highest difficulty, I can tell you that it is very overpowered, you certainly don't need many people attacking quickly to see the results, one ranger alone could reduce any raid boss to a joke.

    Quote Originally Posted by xTethx View Post
    It's only 1 person in 1 instance, I can almost guarantee every run made before that was completely legit.
    Yes, one person in one instance, as far as we know. I can't really know who exploited or not since I do not know most of the people in this thread but the main problem IMO is not before but the future posts, because other than posting videos (which can be a problem for some of us since we lag way too much while recording) there is no absolute way that I can think of to ensure the legitimacy of the runs.

  8. #228
    2014 DDO Players Council ishr's Avatar
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    as much as i like to pad the reply & view count of this thread :P, please take this debate to the sister thread, thanks.

  9. #229
    2015 DDO Players Council Cetus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keveniaftw View Post
    Your guild just claimed an 11 man run with only 4 of their guild as a guild run, this is against the rules and technically cheating. Now I have proof you are not so 100% legit as you claim to be

    Please tell me more about how you go according to this threads rules
    Relax for a second - no "guild" claimed anything. Yea, it says DM in the post title which I think should have contained due credit for everyone, but other DM posts showing an achievement had explicit credit given to party members, so this isn't a trend of any sort. This particular screenshot contains everyone's name anyway, and an explicit thank you from the poster. So, there isn't anything illegitimate about this. We're not that petty.

    This just seems to me like a quick post that happened to come off wrong. Yes, the contributors should absolutely be credited, and without them the completion wouldn't have happened - hell, the best DM can claim is to just have hosted the run - since the party makeup contains only 3 from the actual guild. In the end its no big deal, who cares, put away your pitchfork its not that serious.
    Last edited by Cetus; 03-31-2014 at 06:52 PM.
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  10. #230
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zoda View Post
    You either 4 manned and decided to invite 8 more to loot, or credit goes to more than just DM. Nicely done regardlesd.
    Troller!


    you know DM considers everyone in channel = guildies.

    and you know Jado posted this quickly cause his Girlfriend was gonna neuter him if he took much longer.
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    and several once viable raiding alts dumped into the packmule stables..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.
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  11. #231
    Community Member TheLegendOfAra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JOTMON View Post
    you know DM considers everyone in channel = guildies.
    Does this make me one of the cool kids?

    Seriously though, almost everyone who is in the FoM channel has been in a guild with one another at some point in this games history, if not years.
    We may be in different guilds with different names, but we're all part of the same group. It doesn't matter if Jado posted the run as Degenerate Matter or not, since it was technically not a PUG, and OP as far as I can see doe not have a "channel run" option. Which is somewhat silly, imo; PUG does not have the same meaning or connotations that Channel does.

    Honestly though, some people are taking this thread way to seriously. I mean, I kind of get why, but one person may have used an exploit and everyone just loses their s h i t. It's ridiculous.
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  12. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cetus View Post
    Relax for a second - no "guild" claimed anything. Yea, it says DM in the post title which I think should have contained due credit for everyone, but other DM posts showing an achievement had explicit credit given to party members, so this isn't a trend of any sort. This particular screenshot contains everyone's name anyway, and an explicit thank you from the poster. So, there isn't anything illegitimate about this. We're not that petty.

    This just seems to me like a quick post that happened to come off wrong. Yes, the contributors should absolutely be credited, and without them the completion wouldn't have happened - hell, the best DM can claim is to just have hosted the run - since the party makeup contains only 3 from the actual guild. In the end its no big deal, who cares, put away your pitchfork its not that serious.
    It wasn't about that, it's just that at least 2 members of DM (I'm not going to talk about others) are getting on their high horses because exploiters (and honestly teth, I do not believe it was only 1 in 1 instance) showed us that more proof was necessary if we want to keep the thread legit. If you all want it to become one big cheaterfest that's fine but that will be without me and a few others, who like to play the game fair. At cap I can go claim some records using unfair methods, which can go from deleveling bosses, to the usage of guildies, to other exploits that shouldn't be mentionned, but that I do not use.

    I'm not trying to break DM down, I'm not trying to claim DM are cheaters. I want to set everyone for the same law, start over fai n' square and 2 members of DM went full rage on that idea, claiming 25 times how disappointed they were, how poor of a choice removing old records was etc. with as reason that they knew they did not cheat. If they know that for theirselves: Great. But any cheater can become angry and say he did not cheat unless proven otherwise, which is why 'I was their and I saw no1 cheated' is a bad argument.

    Again, I'm not trying to break anyone down, I just want a fair thread that does not support cheating
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  13. #233
    Community Member Grizzt14's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keveniaftw View Post
    It wasn't about that, it's just that at least 2 members of DM (I'm not going to talk about others) are getting on their high horses because exploiters (and honestly teth, I do not believe it was only 1 in 1 instance) showed us that more proof was necessary if we want to keep the thread legit. If you all want it to become one big cheaterfest that's fine but that will be without me and a few others, who like to play the game fair. At cap I can go claim some records using unfair methods, which can go from deleveling bosses, to the usage of guildies, to other exploits that shouldn't be mentionned, but that I do not use.

    I'm not trying to break DM down, I'm not trying to claim DM are cheaters. I want to set everyone for the same law, start over fai n' square and 2 members of DM went full rage on that idea, claiming 25 times how disappointed they were, how poor of a choice removing old records was etc. with as reason that they knew they did not cheat. If they know that for theirselves: Great. But any cheater can become angry and say he did not cheat unless proven otherwise, which is why 'I was their and I saw no1 cheated' is a bad argument.

    Again, I'm not trying to break anyone down, I just want a fair thread that does not support cheating
    Quote Originally Posted by keveniaftw View Post
    Your guild just claimed an 11 man run with only 4 of their guild as a guild run, this is against the rules and technically cheating. Now I have proof you are not so 100% legit as you claim to be

    Please tell me more about how you go according to this threads rules
    If you are going to accuse us of cheating go out and do it, but don't pull this stunt and then try and hide from it. You attacked us plain and simple, we responded. We all know what you mean and see plain as day through your passive aggressive approach.

    We have a record we care about, that we've worked at since U21 dropped in a brand new raid on the highest difficulty. Each run we've formed has been through channel and there a good number of players who've been in our runs at various points that will speak to our runs, it is not simply 12 people (See the post from Araphina, one of the channel members in we which run, above yours for more detail). If you did your homework prior to your posts, you'd know we have routinely thanked the members and guilds that join our runs. We've been grateful for every run we've had people along as our guild grows from its recent start. I would even prefer those guilds be given credit in our run statement than denoted as a PUG, which it has never been as OP suggests. Fact is, our run is legitimate and there are many people who've run with us or know of us in channels that will speak to this and the reputations of our current DM members. We will continue to run raids and quests at the highest level and set records, whether it be in this thread or elsewhere. If the lack of video evidence upsets you, so be it, but we know who we are and that truth that our runs are and have always been legitimate.
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  14. #234
    The Hatchery Zoda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JOTMON View Post
    Troller!


    you know DM considers everyone in channel = guildies.

    and you know Jado posted this quickly cause his Girlfriend was gonna neuter him if he took much longer.
    I totally didn't mean to troll, no clue why that guy got all over you lol.

    I haven't even read the posting rules tbh...
    Last edited by Zoda; 04-01-2014 at 09:00 AM.
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  15. #235
    Hero JOTMON's Avatar
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    We all want to see clean achievements using good sound strategy and not using exploits or cheats

    This thread will ultimately fail if the honour system and a simple screen capture cant be used, leaving only those with Moster systems that can record video and play DDO without it becoming a lagfest and even then is subject to scrutiny on every detail not being displayed.
    Last edited by JOTMON; 04-01-2014 at 06:18 PM.
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    and several once viable raiding alts dumped into the packmule stables..

    Update 24: Champions... "whew, it's ok, it's only a red name" .. sad day when trash spawn Champions and their one-shot ignore fort attacks instill more party fear than the Red named bosses.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Too bad I 'purchased' maximum character slots for my account, SSG has now chosen to cater the giveaway perks to benefit multiple freebie accounts instead of the paying customers.

  16. #236
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    Quote Originally Posted by JOTMON View Post
    We all want to see clean achievements using good sound strategy and not using exploits or cheats
    Although, I am surprise that a dev hasn't infracted you and deleted your continued posts of slander and toxic accusations.
    I looked for the rules.. and I see nothing about these challenges being restricted to guild only runs.
    There is nothing here that says you cant channel or pug a run.
    You clearly state here that DM is "technically cheating" when this is not the case.
    Quote Originally Posted by ishr View Post
    As with before, runs with majority guild players should be reported as achieved by that guild, if no single guild has majority representation in the party it should be reported as "PUG". Runs that should be listed as PUG: 3/6, 6/12. Runs that should be listed under a guild: 4/6, 7/12, 3/5, 6/11, 1/1
    Now you clearly didn't do your homework, of course pugs are allowed, but you have to list it under pug, something DM did not do
    Now I personally like the idea to give the credit to a specific channel in their case, but not under their guild if it's only 3/11
    Oh, and even the OP claimed I was right, check this

    Quote Originally Posted by ishr View Post
    i cannot be responsible for correctly determining who is in what guild when not all parties are visible. unless we require all players to be visible in a screenshot (which we can potentially discuss in the sister thread as a new requirement). i was formerly taking your word for it, as i did not anticipate this to be a problem, but obviously i was wrong and maybe that needs to change - again a discussion for the sister thread. at this time it sounds like a run was incorrectly flagged. it will be reflagged according to the rules laid out. if you don't like the rules then please discuss in the sister thread and if there's enough support the rule will be changed. in any event, hopefully the rules are now clarified.
    Now JOTMON, isn't it you, who accused me of something I didn't do? Now I won't act like you, so I don't ask for devs to delete your posts, give you an infraction etc. Just keep in mind, just because DM is reacting all over me, so I'm techincally a minority, doesn't make me wrong

    Quote Originally Posted by Grizzt14 View Post
    If you are going to accuse us of cheating go out and do it, but don't pull this stunt and then try and hide from it. You attacked us plain and simple, we responded. We all know what you mean and see plain as day through your passive aggressive approach.

    We have a record we care about, that we've worked at since U21 dropped in a brand new raid on the highest difficulty. Each run we've formed has been through channel and there a good number of players who've been in our runs at various points that will speak to our runs, it is not simply 12 people (See the post from Araphina, one of the channel members in we which run, above yours for more detail). If you did your homework prior to your posts, you'd know we have routinely thanked the members and guilds that join our runs. We've been grateful for every run we've had people along as our guild grows from its recent start. I would even prefer those guilds be given credit in our run statement than denoted as a PUG, which it has never been as OP suggests. Fact is, our run is legitimate and there are many people who've run with us or know of us in channels that will speak to this and the reputations of our current DM members. We will continue to run raids and quests at the highest level and set records, whether it be in this thread or elsewhere. If the lack of video evidence upsets you, so be it, but we know who we are and that truth that our runs are and have always been legitimate.
    Quote Originally Posted by keveniaftw View Post
    It wasn't about that, it's just that at least 2 members of DM (I'm not going to talk about others) are getting on their high horses because exploiters (and honestly teth, I do not believe it was only 1 in 1 instance) showed us that more proof was necessary if we want to keep the thread legit.
    I believe your runs, and I mean this when I say it, are legit. I believe some peoples runs who aren't being accused of, are not legit. Now I don't want to accuse anyone without knowing they cheated, hence why I think everything should be started over with video proof. You guys seemd to want to be excluded from this starting over, and you got into defense claiming you really wanted to keep your record. I know it sucks, but it's the only fair way to put anyone who didn't post a video's achievements away, and require video proof. That means erasing my record which I could've shortened with 3 minutes as well, even tho I'm sure no1 accuses me of cheating in that one. It's just the fair way to do things

    I shouldn't have brought up the guild thingy because a lot of people began to misunderstand my point after that. I do not dislike DM, I respect their records and that they do stuff efficient. But the multiple attempts of some people to keep this thread open for cheaters just because they didn't want to rerun their record annoyed me a lot, hence why I called their records out as technically wrong. And I don't believe you can erase once post because they could've cheated above anothers, just because one record is better hence less likely to be legit. So this is why I want all records started over fair and square

    Do you now understand my point?
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  17. #237
    2014 DDO Players Council ishr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by keveniaftw View Post
    Now you clearly didn't do your homework, of course pugs are allowed, but you have to list it under pug, something DM did not do
    Now I personally like the idea to give the credit to a specific channel in their case, but not under their guild if it's only 3/11
    Oh, and even the OP claimed I was right, check this



    Now JOTMON, isn't it you, who accused me of something I didn't do? Now I won't act like you, so I don't ask for devs to delete your posts, give you an infraction etc. Just keep in mind, just because DM is reacting all over me, so I'm techincally a minority, doesn't make me wrong




    I believe your runs, and I mean this when I say it, are legit. I believe some peoples runs who aren't being accused of, are not legit. Now I don't want to accuse anyone without knowing they cheated, hence why I think everything should be started over with video proof. You guys seemd to want to be excluded from this starting over, and you got into defense claiming you really wanted to keep your record. I know it sucks, but it's the only fair way to put anyone who didn't post a video's achievements away, and require video proof. That means erasing my record which I could've shortened with 3 minutes as well, even tho I'm sure no1 accuses me of cheating in that one. It's just the fair way to do things

    I shouldn't have brought up the guild thingy because a lot of people began to misunderstand my point after that. I do not dislike DM, I respect their records and that they do stuff efficient. But the multiple attempts of some people to keep this thread open for cheaters just because they didn't want to rerun their record annoyed me a lot, hence why I called their records out as technically wrong. And I don't believe you can erase once post because they could've cheated above anothers, just because one record is better hence less likely to be legit. So this is why I want all records started over fair and square

    Do you now understand my point?
    i have pm'ed you kindly, and asked that you take your debate elsewhere. this thread is for achievements and congratulations. if you want to continue your debate do it in PMs or take the discussion to another thread. your perpetuation of this debate (however meritorious it may be) threatens to get this thread closed and though i suspect is not your goal may be the ultimate outcome, which does nobody a favor. either post your achievement or recognize someone elses, otherwise please excuse yourself and take take the issue elsewhere, thanks.

  18. #238

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  19. #239
    Community Member Nightmanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLegendOfAra View Post
    Does this make me one of the cool kids?

    Seriously though, almost everyone who is in the FoM channel has been in a guild with one another at some point in this games history, if not years.
    We may be in different guilds with different names, but we're all part of the same group. It doesn't matter if Jado posted the run as Degenerate Matter or not, since it was technically not a PUG, and OP as far as I can see doe not have a "channel run" option. Which is somewhat silly, imo; PUG does not have the same meaning or connotations that Channel does.

    Honestly though, some people are taking this thread way to seriously. I mean, I kind of get why, but one person may have used an exploit and everyone just loses their s h i t. It's ridiculous.
    If you are, then so am I. And I really doubt any of the people in channel will admit to that one

  20. #240
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Posts
    401

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by moo_cow View Post
    Lines of Supply - EE - 9 min, 33 sec - Blood Assassin's - Argonnessen - solo

    Not much of an improvement, but it seems like videos are gonna be required for new submissions.






    Video :

    Congratulations, that was sick. I now want to see more of your vids, not to learn about strategy, but cus you're freaking amazing
    On a side note, mind to tell me what your evo and enchant DC's are like? I'm planning on going drow sorc next life, staying at cap a while, and wondering what I should be aiming at
    Ainevek: 9/6/2 FvS/ranger/paladin (life 2/?) Shinweng: 8/5/2 monk/wizard/paladin (life 4/3?Abaranda: 18/2 FvS/monk (life 7/?) Kevenia: 6 sorcerer (life 2/?)
    Two handed chruchers, Ghallanda

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