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  1. #501
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    In the spirit of offering answers, here is what I think would put a divine destiny on the board as equal to the best of the other spheres.
    * A Core 5 toggle that is a personal 50% damage reduction... across the board for all dmg.
    * A Teir 5 ability that regenerates spell points over time.

    Fill out the rest of the destiny with goodies for melee (melee would need the biggest incentive), DD and DC styles of play. This would give the survival, but in a unique way. It would give the endurance, but again in a unique way. It would stay with the style of divines having staying power and excelling in fights of attrition.

    Not a chance in the world of that going live.

  2. #502
    Community Member bennyson's Avatar
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    Default Arcanes > Divines

    Quote Originally Posted by AtomicMew View Post
    Arcanes are in no way better than divines. They are simply different and have their own unique abilities.
    Arcanes are BETTER than Divines (which is something I HHHAAAAATTTTEEEE!)

    A Drow or Sun Elf Pale Master can max out their Int score by having

    Int base 20 +5 tome +1 exceptional +4 Archlich +4 class score raise +7 ability bonus +11 item +3 insightful +2 racial +2 capstone +3 twist +6 destiny +2 Armath potion equals 70 Int without ship-buffs. Making them freaking powerful Wizards.

    A Drow Sorcerer can max out their Cha at 66 if and only if they find a +11 cha item.

    Even if a character is a Half Elf, a Divine class can ONLY max their Wisdom score at 64 IF and ONLY IF they find a +11 wis item.

    So your statement about Divines being as good as Arcanes is false.

    The ONLY way the Divines can match the Arcanes is by being a race that can max-out their Wisdom score at 20 in character creation at LEVEL 1. (Turbine please, pretty please add a race that starts with 10 wisdom)

    Right now, am done off-topicing with you AtomicMew because your a pain in the neck.
    Last edited by bennyson; 02-24-2014 at 03:13 PM.

  3. #503
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    Cool In case you also misread this thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hiddensight View Post
    Uh Atomicmew do you understand how math works ???? Have you (Atomicmew) ever actually done EE GH with a divine trying to DC ??There is no way any divine can dc on EE because of no DIVINE CASTER ED . SHIRADI IS A RANGER ED OK ( NOT A EE DIVINE CASTER ED ) . Divine crusader as it is being tested is another horrible hybridized melee ED , which melees do not need btw. You keep stating that somehow divines have a " GOOD DC CASTER ED " when they infact do not have ANY real dc ED . Kinda like how DDO has NO DIVINE CASTER RACE. I've been following your threads and can tell you either don't do REAL math or cant do it and probably don't EVER do and real EE questing cause U are to busy trolling this thread. Cause honestly your whole argument is that EA works 4 the favsoul ( as a light based nuking ED but not on EE btw ) and (NOTHING ELSE BUT BLAH , BLAH , BLAH ) u like divine crusader. Hopefully the dev's are looking at the (big picture) in considering the EE Divine Caster. Before the switch over from epic questing to en , eh , and ee . Nobody needed ED's to quest at a epic level just a competent group or a bunch of sp hires. Now with all the (New Content) coming out its time to re-evaluate the role of the divine in general . I really hope the dev's look at the advantages of having another EE caster and come to the same conclusion I have. That it is REALLY worth the modifications , effort , time and energy it will take to change the divine's ED's , core abilities to create the EE Divine Caster. Just like it was worth their (the dev's) time to create the multi-optional spell focus EE Arcane Caster. Honestly I think its high time they provide the divine with more then just a ( lightnuking or hybridized ED option ) 4 end game . The dev's don't treat any other class like this ( forced hybridization ) in the game when it comes to their ED options . So why the divine ? If they create the divine caster btw I hope they consider making the ( planetouched lesser Aasimar humanoid race ) . It would be a 32 point legend build with 10 on cha and wis and 8's on the other 4 stats ( no con penalty ). They would get (like the drow without int) either 2 lvl points on cha or wis and would qualify as a REAL divine dc caster race. LONG LIVE THE EE DIVINE CASTER .
    please consider this option seriously if the dev's are serious in fixing the divine tree.

  4. #504
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    Let's keep the thread on topic. Derailing the discussion and fighting need to end.
    Have fun, and don't forget to gather for buffs!
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  5. #505
    Community Member bennyson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan View Post
    Let's keep the thread on topic. Derailing the discussion and fighting need to end.
    The Cube has spoken
    (I'll be back later with some things about the DC destiny once I find the time to do so, currently everything over here is a mess.)
    Last edited by bennyson; 02-24-2014 at 03:46 PM.

  6. #506
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    Cool This is what i want from the Divine tree

    Quote Originally Posted by Hiddensight View Post
    No I do not want divines to do everything . A they cant melee , range or tank on ee and even with the current ED choices they have without mutli-classing. They cannot dc on ee very we'll even with Shiradi (RANGER ED BTW WHICH I WONDER WHY CASTERS CAN ACTUALLY USE FOR THE RECORD . SINCE RANGERS ARE NOT REAL CASTERS) and tea with the queen's +10 stat booster ( When it actually proc's ).They barely can do any nuking as u call it on EE with EA because of hybridization and doesnt even stack anywhere near the damage draconic does 4 the EE sorcerer.

    As it is the divine tree in general it is so weak I see toon's failing on eh solo's with gear. What I want is the divine to be treated like any other (self-healing) real lvl 9 caster class is treated as . Notice how nobody"s complaining that warforged can self -heal and dc on EE since (self-healing) as it has been put " Is this great and incredibly powerful concept that needs no ED bonuses " let alone DC or caster bonuses , right. Cause divines (having up 2 lvl 9 DC spell list with the same requirements arcane's on EE do btw) have been given the spell mass-heal lvl 9 and this just removes DDO's obligation to create or provide real caster divine ED's in the Divine tree ( NOT HORRIBLE HYBRIDIZED DIVINE MELEE ED'S LIKE THE CURRENT DIVINE CRUSADER CURRENTLY BEING TESTED ) that works for the divine classes and lets them DC on EE

    Even if there NOT tailored to the divines pre's like the arcane's currently are. This is why some people complain when someone wants the divine to do as well as the arcane classes pre's , core abilities and tree . Obviously being able to heal means u should have NO CHOICE as a divine but to be a nuker forced into EA or some hybridizied mutli-classing variant . Why don't we try to apply this to the arcane as well and see where your argument goes ??? LONG LIVE THE EE DIVINE CASTER
    Please change the divine crusader ED and modify the entire divine tree so that its comparable to the options arcanes have. This perspective of mine is really simple as is my motivation for why i'm pushing this idea. My idea 4 changing EA and the favored soul class is this . EA stands for , Exalted Angel , and the divine side of the equation is lacking , if making a REAL divine caster class. Is it should look similar , in damage , in spell list options , and caster bonuses , to that of the sorcerer classes pre's it's arcane counterpart .

    Letting the divines share in its connection with EA , like the sorcerer class , gets to connect with the draconic ED and the 4 arcane elements ( fire , water , air and earth ) will strengthen the class and make it very EE along with the divine ED tree . Why not use the 4 divine elements good (air) , light (fire) , sonic (earth) , and nullification (water) and change the favored soul pre's , EA the current ED and the divines role in general in making an actual divine caster class . Rather then HORRIBLY hybridizing divines cause they get mass-heal which still costs the divine caster sp. By simply mirroring the divine class to what you , the dev's , have already done 4 the arcane's , will fix this little problem.

    I'm suggesting a total revision of the , EA ED , remaking it like draconic , only with the divine elements instead (energy sheath , go out with a bang , energy burst and energy vortex ) . This grants the EE divine caster's real epic caster status and not just (some) nukking power , like the arcane sorcerer . Using exalted angel breath instead of draconic . Divines could DC effectively and nuke on EE like real arcane casters do . Providing another EE DC spell focus class to the game will fix this very weak ED tree and probably create ALOT more divine toons on all server's . Also consider to making a divine lvl 5 sonic dot so that divines have light/sonic like sorcerer's have ice/air balancing the classes (divine/arcane) in power , cause its REALLY worth having another REAL lvl 9 caster class .

    Plus I also recommend amending the spellcraft skill to have wisdom or intel modifier 4 the EE divine caster (whichever is higher) . Fixing divine crusader then , so that it also mirrors , magister , would provide the EE divine caster flexibility and options like the EE arcane .

    See just look at what you already created in the arcane tree and the marvel that it is . Wasn't it worth the time and energy you , the dev's , spent to create it ? . Isn't it so much fun to be able to make a toon , as I've heard the expression "Almost do it all ", in being very self-sufficient and capable of dc'ing on EE . Cause of wonderful spell focus options pre's , core abilities and very AWESOME ED' options without massive hybridization ?? I mean , isn't that what multi-classing is really for btw ? If you really want your toon to end game that way ??

    Why not let the divine's have that ? Since they have ( lvl 9 dc required spells ) give them the same honor and privilege you all ,THE DEV'S , have worked so very hard to provide the arcane's ( the pm's , am's and all the sorcerer elemental pre options , DC capabilities and ED tree choices ) with and including a dc caster race to build them from .

    Honestly , I don't think the creator of this game intended to not have the divines lvl 9 casters not be able to dc on EE ( especially with all the New Content coming Soon ) and force them into hybridization because they get the spell mass heal . Without a doubt in my mind , I know that that's what ALL the other divine ( dc required ) up 2 lvl 9 spell list is 4 and that's why its still there. While you , the dev's , can still make changes to make this possibility available in your wonderful game.

    The ball is now in your court . I have shown you a new path and maybe one you'll implement . I believe my argument speaks 4 itself , as a player , fan of the game and DC casting . In-conclusion hopefully enough of you, the dev's , we'll agree with me in saying , in your future updates to the divine class and game mod's 4 the divine tree , " LONG LIVE THE EE DIVINE CASTER"
    Last edited by Hiddensight; 02-26-2014 at 06:44 PM. Reason: for clarification and transparency

  7. #507
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hiddensight View Post
    Please change the divine crusader ED and modify the entire divine tree so that its comparable to the options arcanes have. This perspective of mine is really simple as is my motivation for why i'm pushing this idea. My idea 4 changing EA and the favored soul class is this . EA stands for , Exalted Angel , and the divine side of the equation is lacking , if making a REAL divine caster class. Is it should look similar , in damage , in spell list options , and caster bonuses , to that of the sorcerer classes pre's it's arcane counterpart . Letting the divines share in its connection with EA , like the sorcerer class , gets to connect with the draconic ED and the 4 arcane elements ( fire , water , air and earth ) will strengthen the class and make it very EE along with the divine ED tree . Why not use the 4 divine elements good (air) , light (fire) , sonic (earth) , and nullification (water) and change the favored soul pre's , EA the current ED and the divines role in general in making an actual divine caster class . Rather then HORRIBLY hybridizing divines cause they get mass-heal which still costs the divine caster sp. By simply mirroring the divine class to what you , the dev's , have already done 4 the arcane's , will fix this little problem. I'm suggesting a total revision of the , EA ED , remaking it like draconic , only with the divine elements instead (energy sheath , go out with a bang , energy burst and energy vortex ) . This grants the EE divine caster's real epic caster status and not just (some) nukking power , like the arcane sorcerer . Using exalted angel breath instead of draconic . Divines could DC effectively and nuke on EE like real arcane casters do . Providing another EE DC spell focus class to the game will fix this very weak ED tree and probably create ALOT more divine toons on all server's . Also consider to making a divine lvl 5 sonic dot so that divines have light/sonic like sorcerer's have ice/air balancing the classes (divine/arcane) in power , cause its REALLY worth having another REAL caster class . Plus I also recommend amending the spellcraft skill to have wisdom or intel modifier 4 the EE divine caster (whichever is higher) . Fixing divine crusader then , so that it also mirrors , magister , would provide the EE divine caster flexibility and options like the EE arcane . See just look at what you already created in the arcane tree and the marvel that it is . Wasn't it worth the time and energy you , the dev's , spent to create it ? . Isn't it so much fun to be able to make a toon , as I've heard the expression "Almost do it all ", in being very self-sufficient and capable of dc'ing on EE . Cause of wonderful spell focus options pre's , core abilities and very AWESOME ED' options without massive hybridization ?? I mean , isn't that what multi-classing is really for btw ? If you really want your toon to end game that way ?? Why not let the divine's have that ? Since they have ( lvl 9 dc required spells ) give them the same honor and privilege you all ,THE DEV'S , have worked so very hard to provide the arcane's ( the pm's , am's and all the sorcerer elemental pre options , DC capabilities and ED tree choices ) with and including a dc caster race to build them from . Honestly , I don't think the creator of this game intended to not have the divines lvl 9 casters not be able to dc on EE ( especially with all the New Content coming Soon ) and force them into hybridization because they get the spell mass heal . Without a doubt in my mind , I know that that's what ALL the other divine ( dc required ) up 2 lvl 9 spell list is 4 and that's why its still there. While you , the dev's , can still make changes to make this possibility available in your wonderful game. The ball is now in your court . I have shown you a new path and maybe one you'll implement . I believe my argument speaks 4 itself , as a player , fan of the game and DC casting . In-conclusion hopefully enough of you, the dev's , we'll agree with me in saying , in your future updates to the divine class and game mod's 4 the divine tree , " LONG LIVE THE EE DIVINE CASTER"
    Wow

    The Great Text Wall of China.

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    Ok, I have two things to add (not to The Great Text Wall of China, I am not capable of reading that and I doubt majority of ppl is).

    1. Divine Crusader is interesting. The Aura DEFINITELY needs to be enlarged. I dont care if it will be enlarged via core abilities (get +x to the size of the aure with each tier..) or if it will be enarged by default. Worst case scenario - one of the abilities will enlarge it. Just... find a way to enlarge it, please.
    Aside from that, the destiny seems pretty solid to me. I mean, yeah, some bad stuff there and there, but its generally decent. Especially when compared to other divine destinies or fatesinger.


    2. To Bennyson - I have no clue why are you typing ONLY and IF in caps regarding the +11 divine gear, when you are counting +11 casting stat gear for every caster, including arcanes. Well, I do, and it sounds kinda pointless. Anyway - While yes, Pale masters, the original DC casters of this game are ahead DC wise (and I really believe that is right), Divines and Sorcs can both reach 66. I havent seen your breakdown, but I am assuming you forgot that tasty alchemical +2 wis from dualinfused water alchemical weapon. which is, btw, something that only Divine casters can get, as int and char are not available on alchemicals.

    We can, ofc, have the discussion on the topic whos spells are better. For instance, Implosion works on constructs and undead, unlike most Instakills from arcane.
    Destruction has the shortest cooldown of all deathspell, including FoD on Sorcerer.
    Slay Living is the cheapest of all deathspells. Also divine, btw.

    That said - I do think that PM are better instakillers (god, they should be!), sorcs better nukers and equal instakillers (but I do like divine instakills much more for reasons above), but Arcanes are definitely better CC. Then again, no arcanes are able to raise and heal and keep alive themselves (Death Pact) or their entire party.
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    Oh and Lol - Fortitude 57, Reflex 64, Will 55 {Godlike Saves!}.
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  8. #508

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    The more I play with blitz, which I just started using a couple weeks ago for the first time and it's on my dps (ha!) pally, the more I'm convinced that my dps (ha!) pally will never make the switch to divine crusader. Getting +250% damage on every swing for the whole quest just blows the doors off divine crusader, even if I abandoned everything else in LD.

    I beg you to consider doing the following:
    • Remove the HP penalty from the DC "blitz"; replace it to cost 2 or 3 sp (not max sp) per stack
    • Increase the individual stacks to +5% melee damage, +5 spell power
    • Cap the stacks at 40, meaning +200%


    I can live running with +200% melee damage compared to +250%. Much lower than +200% (say +150%, for example) and I simply cannot justify leaving LD. And even if it were crazy like +500% but with the HP penalty I won't switch either. No penalty, most of blitz but less than a full blitzer. That's the core concept I beg you to consider.

    This destiny is for dps paladins. I'm one of the few who stubbornly keeps a dps paladin despite it being absolutely dreadful in today's game. Without implementing the above concepts, my perfect target audience for divine crusader won't bother using it.

    It's worth pointing out that I'm reworking my pally into a 15/5 pally/rogue using sireth, and am considering spending ZERO points in the KotC tree. (I'll probably take divine might and nothing else.) That's how bad dps pallies are. All my AP will be spent in the acrobat and human trees, with a few tossed into sacred defender for some saves and prr. KotC may as well not even exist for dps pallies, the tree is really that bad. And divine crusader will be utterly pointless for him if it falls too far behind blitz, both in sustained dps during a quest and how long it takes to get to the max sustained. If there's any survivability penalty involved the whole thing is so pointless for him I won't even bother to farm the destiny for fate points.

    The thing that bothers me most about KotC is that the damage from the cores is useless. Blitz gives you +250% base damage only, so while I'm running around doing a couple/few hundred damage per swing on non-crits, my "dps" tree is adding a whopping 2d6. Whoopie, instead of 250 damage that swing did 257, way to go, KotC! And other than divine might the rest of it is garbage, only being able to be used once or twice a minute (exalted smite), only working on select mobs (censure) or being generally weak (sacrifice). Where's the dps?

    Pallies are in a terrible state in today's game and desperately need help with dps. Their trees do nothing for them. Please make divine crusader the band-aid that gets them through until you redo KotC and give pallies a third tree. (Make KotC a generic evil-killing tree and add a defensive tree, which is where you'd move improved recovery, improved restoration, extra diseases, plus add a bunch of other miscellaneous healing and defensive stuff.)

  9. #509
    Community Member bennyson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by viktorserak View Post
    To Bennyson - I have no clue why are you typing ONLY and IF in caps regarding the +11 divine gear, when you are counting +11 casting stat gear for every caster, including arcanes. Well, I do, and it sounds kinda pointless. Anyway - While yes, Pale masters, the original DC casters of this game are ahead DC wise (and I really believe that is right), Divines and Sorcs can both reach 66. I havent seen your breakdown, but I am assuming you forgot that tasty alchemical +2 wis from dualinfused water alchemical weapon. which is, btw, something that only Divine casters can get, as int and char are not available on alchemicals.

    We can, ofc, have the discussion on the topic whos spells are better. For instance, Implosion works on constructs and undead, unlike most Instakills from arcane.
    Destruction has the shortest cooldown of all deathspell, including FoD on Sorcerer.
    Slay Living is the cheapest of all deathspells. Also divine, btw.

    That said - I do think that PM are better instakillers (god, they should be!), sorcs better nukers and equal instakillers (but I do like divine instakills much more for reasons above), but Arcanes are definitely better CC. Then again, no arcanes are able to raise and heal and keep alive themselves (Death Pact) or their entire party.
    Man I hate doing breakdowns of what I say, but I will do it for the sake of helping people understand my point better. (please no more off-topicing after this)

    +11 Wisdom gear is very rare, even if you do the highest level quest on Epic Elite (Brothers of the Forge anyone?) The only item in the game where I see a +11 bonus to Wisdom is the Shadowsight goggles in their Epic Elite tier. Also, Pale Masters are still and forever shall be the best at DC casting, this is still true even with the changes to enhancements but that made them even better.

    Regarding about the +2 alchemical bonus to Wisdom, I did not know about that, however, the ingredients to upgrade those weapons are difficult to acquire, even if you have tons of raid-bypass timers and do guild runs of LOD. What Divines need is a race that starts with 10 Wisdom (Aasimar!) in order to possibly match Arcanes in the DC spellcasting in the less-time-consuming way like you can do with Drow or Sun Elf.

  10. #510
    Community Member Vellrad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bennyson View Post
    Man I hate doing breakdowns of what I say, but I will do it for the sake of helping people understand my point better. (please no more off-topicing after this)

    +11 Wisdom gear is very rare, even if you do the highest level quest on Epic Elite (Brothers of the Forge anyone?) The only item in the game where I see a +11 bonus to Wisdom is the Shadowsight goggles in their Epic Elite tier. Also, Pale Masters are still and forever shall be the best at DC casting, this is still true even with the changes to enhancements but that made them even better.

    Regarding about the +2 alchemical bonus to Wisdom, I did not know about that, however, the ingredients to upgrade those weapons are difficult to acquire, even if you have tons of raid-bypass timers and do guild runs of LOD. What Divines need is a race that starts with 10 Wisdom (Aasimar!) in order to possibly match Arcanes in the DC spellcasting in the less-time-consuming way like you can do with Drow or Sun Elf.
    +11 wisdom gear is as rare as +11 int gear.
    +11 wisdom named items is lower level than +11 int item.
    +11 charisma item, afaik, does not exist :/
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  11. #511
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    Thumbs down Sorry for the wall it's now fixed

    Quote Originally Posted by viktorserak View Post
    Wow

    The Great Text Wall of China.

    -
    -
    -
    -
    -

    Ok, I have two things to add (not to The Great Text Wall of China, I am not capable of reading that and I doubt majority of ppl is).


    That said - I do think that PM are better instakillers (god, they should be!), sorcs better nukers and equal instakillers (but I do like divine instakills much more for reasons above), but Arcanes are definitely better CC. Then again, no arcanes are able to raise and heal and keep alive themselves (Death Pact) or their entire party.

    Ok , wall is fixed sorry , please read it again . Wow , have you ever heard of UMD ?????? and divine crusader is a horrible hybridizied melee ED , of course divines don't need . Whose aura should be in US , the tanking ED . Which for the record DDO doesn't force any other classes into this type of hybridization btw. Allowing mutli-classing options in case you want to hybridize your toon . It's what mutli-classing is for . The divines deserve way better then this . As a lvl 9 spellcaster type class . They are the only class that's not treated with the same respect ALL other classes are granted in the game because of 1 spell .

    UMD allows arcanes to raise dead lvl 5 scroll , resurrection lvl 7 scroll and arcanes can both raise and umd 1 party member with lvl 6 heal scrolls . Arcanes also are very self-sufficient and need NO DIVINE if your are competent with your build.

    Please again to the dev's reconsider all my thread's in fixing the divine class in general . I do believe the creator of DDO knew what they where doing in making the divine class and granting them mass-heal . They thought out the pro's and con's then , and decided to keep the DC spell list anyways . To show their intention in having the divine class exist as a REAL lvl 9 DC multi-optional spell focus caster class . I doubt they would have it any other way . So why not respect their decision ? Provide the Divine class the same options that you , the dev's , have created 4 the arcane class honoring their intentions . Creating a caster based divine ED tree that is equal to that of the arcane balancing the 2 sides .

    Letting those who want to HYBRIDIZE their toon . The option to multi-class , as they do now . Think about the name Divine Crusader . It's initials are DC (not please horribly hybridize our ed tree cause we get mass-heal) .That would be (nphhoedtcwgm-h) I think , lol . So , since the initials are DC (divine crusader) and the creator of this game did LEAVE the other DC spell list 4 divines (lvl 9 spellcaster type class just like arcanes ) . Knowing full well in advance , what letting divines having the power to heal would be . Why not ???? LONG LIVE THE EE DIVINE CASTER
    Last edited by Hiddensight; 02-28-2014 at 07:20 PM.

  12. #512
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    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    The more I play with blitz, which I just started using a couple weeks ago for the first time and it's on my dps (ha!) pally, the more I'm convinced that my dps (ha!) pally will never make the switch to divine crusader. Getting +250% damage on every swing for the whole quest just blows the doors off divine crusader, even if I abandoned everything else in LD.

    I beg you to consider doing the following:
    • Remove the HP penalty from the DC "blitz"; replace it to cost 2 or 3 sp (not max sp) per stack
    • Increase the individual stacks to +5% melee damage, +5 spell power
    • Cap the stacks at 40, meaning +200%


    I can live running with +200% melee damage compared to +250%. Much lower than +200% (say +150%, for example) and I simply cannot justify leaving LD. And even if it were crazy like +500% but with the HP penalty I won't switch either. No penalty, most of blitz but less than a full blitzer. That's the core concept I beg you to consider.
    Doing this and something that enhaces the evil smite will make me consider change from LD to the Crusader for a melee pally ...

    Quote Originally Posted by EllisDee37 View Post
    This destiny is for dps paladins. I'm one of the few who stubbornly keeps a dps paladin despite it being absolutely dreadful in today's game. Without implementing the above concepts, my perfect target audience for divine crusader won't bother using it.

    It's worth pointing out that I'm reworking my pally into a 15/5 pally/rogue using sireth, and am considering spending ZERO points in the KotC tree. (I'll probably take divine might and nothing else.) That's how bad dps pallies are. All my AP will be spent in the acrobat and human trees, with a few tossed into sacred defender for some saves and prr. KotC may as well not even exist for dps pallies, the tree is really that bad. And divine crusader will be utterly pointless for him if it falls too far behind blitz, both in sustained dps during a quest and how long it takes to get to the max sustained. If there's any survivability penalty involved the whole thing is so pointless for him I won't even bother to farm the destiny for fate points.
    I feel your pain... i did consider exactly same thing. To move to a 15/5 or 14/5/1 and almost no spend in Chalice tree.
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  13. #513
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    Celestial Champion:
    +1 Critical Threat Range with all attacks. When you critically hit with an attack, you gain a stack of Celestial Fervor. A stack of Celestial Fervor grants you +1 Sacred bonus to doublestrike chance. Stacks up to 10 times, with a duration of 6 seconds.

    +1 crit threat range I like

    Sacred bonus to doublestrike is a NO! This will not stack with the Zeal, which is a +10 sacred bonus to doublestrike

    Make it an Insight bonus to doublestrike or something, just don't make it a Sacred bonus. Please.

  14. #514

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    Yep, sacred bonus on that is a non-starter.

    I was also wondering about that critical threat range increase. What's it typed as? Does it stack with Keen Edge? How about the acrobat/henshin tier 5s that add +1 to crit range & multiplier for quarterstaffs?

  15. #515
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    No Regret:
    Whenever an enemy, who was recently affected by your Aura of Purification is slain, other nearby enemies gain 1 to 4 stacks of Purification.

    Okay now this will be helpful in EE quests in killer groups with other abilities from this ED, I think.

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    Cool Please stick to the topic or relevent subject matter

    Quote Originally Posted by Hiddensight View Post
    Ok , wall is fixed sorry , please read it again . Wow , have you ever heard of UMD ?????? and divine crusader is a horrible hybridizied melee ED , of course divines don't need . Whose aura should be in US , the tanking ED . Which for the record DDO doesn't force any other classes into this type of hybridization btw. Allowing mutli-classing options in case you want to hybridize your toon . It's what mutli-classing is for . The divines deserve way better then this . As a lvl 9 spellcaster type class . They are the only class that's not treated with the same respect ALL other classes are granted in the game because of 1 spell .

    UMD allows arcanes to raise dead lvl 5 scroll , resurrection lvl 7 scroll and arcanes can both raise and umd 1 party member with lvl 6 heal scrolls . Arcanes also are very self-sufficient and need NO DIVINE if your are competent with your build.

    Please again to the dev's reconsider all my thread's in fixing the divine class in general . I do believe the creator of DDO knew what they where doing in making the divine class and granting them mass-heal . They thought out the pro's and con's then , and decided to keep the DC spell list anyways . To show their intention in having the divine class exist as a REAL lvl 9 DC multi-optional spell focus caster class . I doubt they would have it any other way . So why not respect their decision ? Provide the Divine class the same options that you , the dev's , have created 4 the arcane class honoring their intentions . Creating a caster based divine ED tree that is equal to that of the arcane balancing the 2 sides .

    Letting those who want to HYBRIDIZE their toon . The option to multi-class , as they do now . Think about the name Divine Crusader . It's initials are DC (not please horribly hybridize our ed tree cause we get mass-heal) .That would be (nphhoedtcwgm-h) I think , lol . So , since the initials are DC (divine crusader) and the creator of this game did LEAVE the other DC spell list 4 divines (lvl 9 spellcaster type class just like arcanes ) . Knowing full well in advance , what letting divines having the power to heal would be . Why not ???? LONG LIVE THE EE DIVINE CASTER
    Thank you to the dev's 4 making a great game so far . The other ed tree's are much better then the divines . Hopefully enough of you are actually fan's of soloable toon build's . That you'll create for the divine the same options that you all the dev's have provided the arcane . LONG LIVE THE EE DIVINE CASTER

  17. #517
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hiddensight View Post
    Hopefully enough of you are actually fan's of soloable toon build's.
    Hhhhmmmmm.....errr.....yyyyaaaa.....right

    Anyway, back to topic (by the way, my posts are abilities FROM Divine Crusader, so my posts ARE right on topic!)

    Here is another thing that am hoping WILL change because it has potential, but it can never reach that unless its changed or replaced by something else.

    Wrath of Righteous:
    Stance: Whenever an enemy who was recently affected by your Aura of Purification is slain, you gain one stack of Wrath. Wrath: +1 Spell power, +1% Damage with all attacks and -3 Maximum hit points. This may be stacked infinitely. Wrath decays by 1 stack every minute, gaining a new stack refreshes this timer. All stacks are removed upon dungeon exit or when the ability is toggled off.

    If this thing is meant to be the Epic Moment of the destiny, its clearly not to me, maybe a buffer of some kind, but it doesn't come close to what other Moments are. Also that -3 HP is a horrible move on the chessboard of Failure & Success, no other ED has a penalty to ANYTHING like that and should be removed or something. Reason be is that anything that reduces HP is a big, fat "NO! Am not using this!" to many players and this ability will be unworthy of DP (destiny points) until it is changed.
    Last edited by bennyson; 02-28-2014 at 10:51 PM.

  18. #518
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    Thumbs down How about a REAL DIVINE ED ? That is not forced hybridization !!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by bennyson View Post
    Hhhhmmmmm.....errr.....yyyyaaaa.....right

    Anyway, back to topic (by the way, my posts are abilities FROM Divine Crusader, so my posts ARE right on topic!)

    Here is another thing that am hoping WILL change because it has potential, but it can never reach that unless its changed or replaced by something else.

    Wrath of Righteous:
    Stance: Whenever an enemy who was recently affected by your Aura of Purification is slain, you gain one stack of Wrath. Wrath: +1 Spell power, +1% Damage with all attacks and -3 Maximum hit points. This may be stacked infinitely. Wrath decays by 1 stack every minute, gaining a new stack refreshes this timer. All stacks are removed upon dungeon exit or when the ability is toggled off.

    If this thing is meant to be the Epic Moment of the destiny, its clearly not to me, maybe a buffer of some kind, but it doesn't come close to what other Moments are. Also that -3 HP is a horrible move on the chessboard of Failure & Success, no other ED has a penalty to ANYTHING like that and should be removed or something. Reason be is that anything that reduces HP is a big, fat "NO! Am not using this!" to many players and this ability will be unworthy of DP (destiny points) until it is changed.
    TOPIC of discussion if you (bennyson) read threads other then your own btw . Was whether or not DDO believes the DIVINE CRUSADER ED that was being tested was a effective EE ED that would fit into the divine tree . Not your analysis of how horribly hybridized it is as a monk / pally ED ( Current divine crusader is a non EE DC spellcaster ED with infinite stacks of non caster lvls and infinite non EE nuking damage ) . As your threads clearly have shown in ALL YOUR ARGUMENTS ( epic moments ) BTW . Please leave HYBRIDIZATION to multi-classing toons not as suggestions 4 divine tree ED options that are good.

    However other people including me , who use REAL DC spellcaster toon's and do real math . Would like it if divines , were treated more like the arcanes . Divines being spellcasters having lvl 9 DC required spells , and multi spell focused spell list . Would like divine spellcaster ED options ( not infinite aura's of non - EE damage ) . With Divine Crusader having the initials DC in it . A real divine spellcaster DC option , would be very EE on end game as well . Like the self-sufficient arcane toon's ( you make and everyone's a fan of ) that can DC on EE and use UMD ( raise dead , resurrection , heal scrolls ) .

    So no , Divine crusader is not a very good DIVINE ED at all . Being able to heal a party with mass-heal or healing aura , doesn't help you solo Epic's very well . Because you can't DC or do very good nuking damage with the current Divine tree or shiradi on EE ( let alone with ALL the NEW content coming ) . I've suggested to the dev's btw ( a fan of DC spell caster build's that can solo EE ). To remake the divine side in general because of this very real fact . Using the sorcerer as the base for a NEW favored soul divine damage caster . Ignoring ( your argument bennyson ) and the healing aspect of the equation . My arguments in prior threads speak for themselves ( please re-read carefully if you haven't ) . LONG LIVE THE EE DIVINE CASTER
    Last edited by Hiddensight; 03-02-2014 at 04:24 PM.

  19. #519
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hiddensight View Post
    So no , Divine crusader is not a very good DIVINE spellcaster ED at all.
    I NEVER said that DC was a good caster destiny, your accusing me of saying something that I never said in any of my posts. Do I read my own posts? Maybe. Do I read posts by other people? YES, but I was unable to actually read your posts in this thread because they are massive walls of text. Also, this is the only thread where I seen you post stuff, which leaves me distrust your information.

    In the old thread "New Divine Epic Destiny" I was hoping that Turbine was making a caster destiny for divines, well now they made this one a melee, which I disliked them for that. Turbine, however, now is taking MORE time to

    1. Make Exalted Angel the true Divine caster ED

    2. Make Unyielding Sentinel the true Divine tank/support ED

    3. Make Divine Crusader the true Divine melee ED

    Me, along with others, before you came with massive walls of text, like the idea (I even forgive Turbine), someone even posted a video about DC's DPS output in a EE Overgrowth, which greatly impressed me about this ED's melee potential.

    If your hoping for a caster destiny, look towards Exalted Angel instead of Divine Crusader.
    Last edited by bennyson; 03-02-2014 at 04:29 PM.

  20. #520
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    Default It's not a good destiny at all !!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by bennyson View Post
    I NEVER said that DC was a good caster destiny, your accusing me of saying something that I never said in any of my posts. Do I read my own posts? Maybe. Do I read posts by other people? YES, but I was unable to actually read your posts in this thread because they are massive walls of text. Also, this is the only thread where I seen you post stuff, which leaves me distrust your information.

    In the old thread "New Divine Epic Destiny" I was hoping that Turbine was making a caster destiny for divines, well now they made this one a melee, which I disliked them for that. Turbine, however, now is taking MORE time to

    1. Make Exalted Angel the true Divine caster ED

    2. Make Unyielding Sentinel the true Divine tank/support ED

    3. Make Divine Crusader the true Divine melee ED

    Me, along with others, before you came with massive walls of text, like the idea (I even forgive Turbine), someone even posted a video about DC's DPS output in a EE Overgrowth, which greatly impressed me about this ED's melee potential.

    If your hoping for a caster destiny, look towards Exalted Angel instead of Divine Crusader.
    Please read everthing before making a thread . I never said you (bennyson) said dc was a good caster destiny . I commented on how you said it was a GOOD destiny . When in fact its not a good destiny for anyone except multi classers . As far as on other threads , I normally have NEVER had a reason to post till now . Was to busy questing and solo'ing epics , on my EE arcane with UMD and REAL ED tree ( no complaints btw) .

    For those who are , the dev's , the divines deserve better then this as a spellcaster class . Please try to provide them the same options you grant the arcanes . Since they have similar requirements to DC on EE


    Divine ED tree breakdown should be :EA - should be divine nuking spellpower tree with turn bonuses you can twist , kinda like draconic . US - should be tanking ED with heal bonuses you can twist and DC should be the divine DC tree with smite bonuses you can twist , like magister . Just like the arcane's . Please leave HYBRIDIZATION 4 all multi-classers if they want to melee , range or tank .


    LONG LIVE THE EE DIVINE CASTER
    Last edited by Hiddensight; 03-02-2014 at 05:10 PM.

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