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  1. #1
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    Default Should Players Banned for Exploiting Be Considered for the Players Council?

    I am a longtime player, and have until now never bothered with the forums. However I have heard from many guildies that a good number of players banned in the latest wave of exploiting are posting in Cordovan's main thread asking for nominations. I feel that selecting these players to be part of the Players Council sends a bad message: that turbine rewards exploiting. If the Players Council is to function primarily as an exploit detection service, then this makes sense. Otherwise this is totally unfair and unjust to those who have followed the rules all these years.

    I think it would be helpful if a dev weighed in on this.
    Last edited by Hibigibi; 01-14-2014 at 06:20 AM.

  2. #2
    Community Member Vellrad's Avatar
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    Turbine should hire assasins to put end to their miserable lives.
    Then their families should be put into prisons.
    All their offsping should be sterilized, so the expoiters can't pass on their vile genetic codes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Originally Posted by Random Person #2 View Post
    People who exploit bugs in code are cheaters cheaters cheaters. And they are big fat ****yheads too.

  3. #3
    Community Member NaturalHazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vellrad View Post
    Turbine should hire assasins to put end to their miserable lives.
    Then their families should be put into prisons.
    All their offsping should be sterilized, so the expoiters can't pass on their vile genetic codes.
    all their relatives should be sterilized too..............can't be too careful......and everyone in their friend list should get a bann too.

  4. #4
    The Hatchery stoerm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vellrad View Post
    Turbine should hire assasins to put end to their miserable lives.
    Then their families should be put into prisons.
    All their offsping should be sterilized, so the expoiters can't pass on their vile genetic codes.
    Is winter bringing you down? Here, have some happy thoughts of sunshine, flowers and butterflies. <3 <3 <3

    Also regarding your witty signature, it doesn't quite work. Casual players cannot take away the wealth of hard core players, as your socialists allegedly would.
    Praise the Dark Six and pass the heals to pure melees.
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  5. #5
    Community Member Coyopa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibigibi View Post
    I am a longtime player, and have until now never bothered with the forums. However I have heard from many guildies that a good number of players banned in the latest wave of exploiting are posting in Cordovan's main thread asking for nominations. I feel that selecting these players to be part of the Players Council sends a bad message: that turbine rewards exploiting. If the Players Council is to function primarily as an exploit detection service, then this makes sense. Otherwise this is totally unfair and unjust to those who have followed the rules all these years.

    I think it would be helpful if a dev weighed in on this.
    Well, you have four problems. First, you cannot know who did and did not exploit. Second, you cannot know with certainty who did and did not get banned. Third, there are going to be people who exploited and did not get banned. Fourth, even if you can answer points 1 and 2 with certainty, your remaining problem is that some of the people who exploited (banned or not) are also the ones who both have large blocks of time to devote to the game and, due to how much they play, know the game virtually inside-out - and it is these people Turbine wants on this council and, I think, at least some of them should be on the council.

  6. #6
    Community Member Vellrad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stoerm View Post
    Is winter bringing you down? Here, have some happy thoughts of sunshine, flowers and butterflies. <3 <3 <3
    Its still autumn here.
    Something weird is going on with weather, I think we will have winter in july, if any.
    Also regarding your witty signature, it doesn't quite work. Casual players cannot take away the wealth of hard core players, as your socialists allegedly would.
    IDK, they already took my snow.

    And they still come from time to time demaning nerfs because they can't learn how to play, demanding best rewards for low difficulties, and other easy buttons.
    Quote Originally Posted by Originally Posted by Random Person #2 View Post
    People who exploit bugs in code are cheaters cheaters cheaters. And they are big fat ****yheads too.

  7. #7
    Community Member Talon_Moonshadow's Avatar
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    Convicted felons usually cannot vote; however, "convicted" felons usually are given a fair trial before being convicted.

    I would need to know individual details of what someone did before making that decision.

    (however, many posted on the forums comments that made it very clear that they knew exactly what they were doing and tried to pass it off with some very lame and despicable excuses. )
    Quote Originally Posted by Jandric View Post
    ..., but I honestly think the solution is to group with less whiny people.

  8. #8
    The Hatchery stoerm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vellrad View Post
    And they still come from time to time demaning nerfs because they can't learn how to play, demanding best rewards for low difficulties, and other easy buttons.
    Do you have the same opinion of exploiters? Essentially the same thing, getting rewards for no effort.

    P.S. The casuals stole my snow too. B-tards.
    Praise the Dark Six and pass the heals to pure melees.
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  9. #9
    Community Member bartharok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stoerm View Post
    Do you have the same opinion of exploiters? Essentially the same thing, getting rewards for no effort.

    P.S. The casuals stole my snow too. B-tards.
    It was not the casuals, it was I.
    Dystopia = utopia achieved

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hibigibi View Post
    I am a longtime player, and have until now never bothered with the forums. However I have heard from many guildies that a good number of players banned in the latest wave of exploiting are posting in Cordovan's main thread asking for nominations. I feel that selecting these players to be part of the Players Council sends a bad message: that turbine rewards exploiting. If the Players Council is to function primarily as an exploit detection service, then this makes sense. Otherwise this is totally unfair and unjust to those who have followed the rules all these years.

    I think it would be helpful if a dev weighed in on this.
    You should read this:

    https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...Player-Council

    It is a guide to all the posts Cordovan has made on the subject.
    It is much more informative than hearsay by guildies.

    For example:

    •Post 7: To nominate someone you have to use the email address, writing it in the announcement thread does not count

    •Post 14: The council will talk with lots of developers. Also, if you want, please apply even if you have infractions. Some types of infractions will be disqualifying but not all and they are considered on a case-by-case basis

  11. #11
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    I hope they will look at the big picture. There were some people banned for the most recent exploit that I would love to see on the council.

    I am sure it lowers the odds and a bad history will surely eliminate your chances.
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  12. #12
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    No they should still be banned. We don't need or want cheaters involved

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  13. #13
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coyopa View Post
    Well, you have four problems. First, you cannot know who did and did not exploit. Second, you cannot know with certainty who did and did not get banned. Third, there are going to be people who exploited and did not get banned. Fourth, even if you can answer points 1 and 2 with certainty, your remaining problem is that some of the people who exploited (banned or not) are also the ones who both have large blocks of time to devote to the game and, due to how much they play, know the game virtually inside-out - and it is these people Turbine wants on this council and, I think, at least some of them should be on the council.
    Fifth, most of those folks who did get an enforced vacation were leveling toons on a second account the same day, and now post on their sock puppet account. Unless they do some deeper investigation even Turbine wont know who is on that list.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  14. #14
    Community Member Nestroy's Avatar
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    @ OP: Only if these are the initial exploiters. Otherwise: NO.

  15. #15
    Community Member redspecter23's Avatar
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    I think it depends on what goal Turbine is trying to accomplish. One can be an exploiter, but still be a useful resource. Exploiting doesn't make you a bad person. Being a bad person makes you a bad person. If I were Turbine, I wouldn't go out of my way to put exploiters on the team, but if an otherwise awesome candidate has this strike against them, I wouldn't immediately rule them out on principle. Also remember that not every exploiter is caught. Turbine could very well be putting numerous exploiters on the team, but not know it because they were never banned for their actions.

    That being said, there are over 300 applicants so far for 30 positions so if I were trying to strip down that list, I'd probably be looking for any negative off the start. Unless you're an amazing candidate who they are specifically looking for, they would probably just toss aside a known exploiter if only to make the list more managable.
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  16. #16
    Community Member Vint's Avatar
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    I feel that they should allow “cheaters” to the council. Some cheaters may have learned from their mistakes, but they still keep in the loop of what is really going on.

    Just the other day I saw many people posting in a thread that had no clue that there was a very serious exploit going on (players with thousands of posts that clearly know the game). I know that we are not supposed to speak of these issues, but people that are on the council (at least a few) need to be aware of what is really going on and have input on how to address the concerns of the many people that are abusing these things. Burying your head in the sand and just saying ban them is not going to stop these people and you may get some feedback from them possibly to help the issues.

    I will leave it at that and there are ways to curb certain issues that are going on but I will leave it to the yes men to figure out the problems that they do not even know that exist.
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  17. #17
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    Of course! Not just any dirty copycat exploiter...the exploiters that figure out the bugs. Having one or two of those guys on the council will be extremely helpful if they are forthcoming with any "advanced uber pro efficiencies" they find in the new content. Unless you're looking forward to yet another DDO release chock full of cheap exploits. Then you don't want a brilliant exploiter on the council.

  18. #18
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vellrad View Post

    And they still come from time to time demaning nerfs because they can't learn how to play, demanding best rewards for low difficulties, and other easy buttons.
    Its not just the casuals. In the shroud blade thread for example it was many vets using newbies as their excuse, but it was the vets themselves wanting the easy button because it made it easier to take the first 11 people, and not have to lead the group, or even communicate for that matter.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Fifth, most of those folks who did get an enforced vacation were leveling toons on a second account the same day, and now post on their sock puppet account. Unless they do some deeper investigation even Turbine wont know who is on that list.
    Weird.

  20. #20
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    I think that exploiting should not prevent anyone from being part of the council.

    Seriously - While I havent exploited, I will exploit next time (propably), because punishments are simply too low (if any) and the possible gain is many times VERY high.

    This mentality about exploiting is what Turbine community team teached us in the past. All of us, some of us sooner, some of us later.
    Now, some people will bring RL morals into it, and those people should DEFINITELY have voice in the council as well.
    But most ppl today, after Turbine approach... exploited/would exploit/will exploit (if they know how). And for that reason, exploiters should have voice in the council as well.

    Also, if Turbine gets the right kind of exploiters, they will report possible exploits, so it can be prevented. Think of it as a win-win.

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