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  1. #21
    Community Member Avenging_Angel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter_Stauffenberg View Post
    I believe it's the guy with the star who should set the rules. If you want to zerg you should at least ask up front if you're not the leader. If you are the leader you should post it in the LFM so people who join know. If no rules are set in the LFM then the default should be a bit slower than zerging.
    I partially agree. The star sets the rules: either write them in the LFM panel, or state them when people join/head to the quest. If no rules are set, I think it pretty much depends on party and quests, but generally the XP/min rule counts (don't lower the XP/min of the quest too much: you probably don't want to spend 5 more minutes in quest for a 800 xp optional and a +2 longsword). You shouldn't zerg in Tempest Spine or Rainbow in the Dark because it gets messy, but I see nothing wrong in going ahead and grabbing the Salve in Eyes of Stone if the party is confused and looking around at the entrance. Maybe we have different definitions of zerging, I'm not in the leet portion of the playerbase.

    I don't see a player "running ahead" as disrespectful or showing off. I'm still convinced that, unless someone in the group is missing out on something (xp for late entry/missed optionals, completion, chests), it's a win-win situation. You get a faster completion and reap full rewards, and you can go back and replay all possible paths in a future, more relaxed playthrough.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bonulino View Post
    No matter what you post, there is always someone who responds with something like "Unless you are gimped, you should be able to do this with your eyes closed and one hand tied behind your back." It gets a little tiresome.

  2. #22
    Community Member Loromir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dredre9987 View Post
    If I am the leader then well hope you keep up or say something so I can come back for you.....I don't see the point in taking 45 minutes to run The Pit when I can run it myself in less than 20...

    Then what is the point in getting up a group?

  3. #23
    Hero nibel's Avatar
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    I always follow a simple rule: The star sets the speed.

    If the star says he is doing the optionals, it is very rude to go ahead and finish the quest while he is miles behind. If the star is out of the quest, it is rude to start the quest before her (unless asked, like in the case of an elite opener). If the star already started the quest with the LFM up, it is your responsability to catch up.

    Any other kind of behavior is unaceptable.
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  4. #24
    Community Member Vellrad's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kinggartk View Post
    Then what is the point in getting up a group?
    To cut time in half, not to double it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Originally Posted by Random Person #2 View Post
    People who exploit bugs in code are cheaters cheaters cheaters. And they are big fat ****yheads too.

  5. #25
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rush007 View Post

    I've notice monks are prime candidates for this behavior.
    That's primarily because this is a video game that pretends to be a role playing game, and the monk class is the video game class.

    Many times you can tell from the character names whether they are a role player with some imagination or a video game player... sometimes even the level of maturity. How many monks have you seen named after Chuck Norris?

    But yes, I agree with you. Running ahead (or lagging waaay behind) are signs of a lack of consideration. But many people don't see it that way because it's become a bad habit and/or they just don't care.

    I don't mind going quickly, but I don't like rushing. Rushing leads to mistakes. I see nothing wrong with taking 30 seconds to get an optional that gives you 900xp. Yesterday in Tomb of the Tormented, after killing the boss, I mentioned that we only needed to kill 2 more wights for the optional. Everyone said "nah" and recalled out. It took me maybe 15 seconds to kill the 2 wights, almost before they recalled, and it was worth almost 4k xp. Now, I'm not going to backtrack for 10 minutes to get 100xp, but I'd much rather get what I can out of quest and move on to another. Farming quests till your nose bleeds only makes the grind worse.

    And while it is sometimes fun to race through a quest as fast as possible, it's sometimes also fun to slow down and quest with some newbs. Variety being spicy and all that. Speed ??* fun.

  6. #26
    Community Member Loromir's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vellrad View Post
    To cut time in half, not to double it.


    If he can do pit in 20 mins solo, I don't think joining a group is going to cut the time in half.

  7. #27
    Community Member voodoogroves's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kinggartk View Post
    If he can do pit in 20 mins solo, I don't think joining a group is going to cut the time in half.
    Not half, but will reduce it.

    I do like doing the pit where one person/team works the furnaces and another does the alternates.

    But no, it's no Shadowcrypt where a good group can duo-path super fast.
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  8. #28
    Community Member Talon_Moonshadow's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHazard View Post
    Some people think they are helping the group to get a quicker completion, some people want to show off, some people just don't care, others are just so in rush/rush mode they can't turn it off even when they join a group? Hopefully some will bother to read, put up No zerging, flower sniffers only or some such.
    The thing is, there is a big difference between zerging or flower sniffing....... and soloing a quest.


    IMO, zerging... as a group is fine.
    Charging into every fight and slaughtering hordes of monsters is fun.

    But ruining someone else's fun is wrong.


    .. and I said "slaughtering"... not running past everything in a mad red alert dash to get to the end fight.


    I play thing game... to "play" the game. Not watch someone else do it. Or not hurry to get out of the dungeon so I can stand around looking at the LFM panel again.
    I want to be inside a quest.

    We can move fast... that is fine. But I plan to either kill most of the monsters or sneak past them with some skill and leave them unagroed.


    And I join a group to do the dungeon with other people.

    Again, not to watch someone else do it for me. Or do it by myself.




    Anyway, I would expect that the regular normal pace.. of moving more or less together and killing as we go.... should be expected unless there is some LFM comment to imply otherwise.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jandric View Post
    ..., but I honestly think the solution is to group with less whiny people.

  9. #29
    Community Member dredre9987's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kinggartk View Post
    Then what is the point in getting up a group?
    Whats wrong with helping pikers? Whats wrong with meeting new people that may play like me?
    Quote Originally Posted by Nitesco View Post
    Oh and honestly, you are all carrying portal beaters on your casters? What on earth are you using it on often enough to clog up your bag with it?
    Quote Originally Posted by HungarianRhapsody View Post
    Portals.

  10. #30
    Community Member dredre9987's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kinggartk View Post
    If he can do pit in 20 mins solo, I don't think joining a group is going to cut the time in half.
    No not half it but I have been in groups that have pulled it off in 15 minutes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nitesco View Post
    Oh and honestly, you are all carrying portal beaters on your casters? What on earth are you using it on often enough to clog up your bag with it?
    Quote Originally Posted by HungarianRhapsody View Post
    Portals.

  11. #31
    Community Member Saravis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dredre9987 View Post
    Whats wrong with helping pikers? Whats wrong with meeting new people that may play like me?
    Who said that they were pikers?

  12. #32
    Community Member AzB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talon_Moonshadow View Post
    The thing is, there is a big difference between zerging or flower sniffing....... and soloing a quest.


    IMO, zerging... as a group is fine.
    Charging into every fight and slaughtering hordes of monsters is fun.

    But ruining someone else's fun is wrong.


    .. and I said "slaughtering"... not running past everything in a mad red alert dash to get to the end fight.


    I play thing game... to "play" the game. Not watch someone else do it. Or not hurry to get out of the dungeon so I can stand around looking at the LFM panel again.
    I want to be inside a quest.

    We can move fast... that is fine. But I plan to either kill most of the monsters or sneak past them with some skill and leave them unagroed.


    And I join a group to do the dungeon with other people.

    Again, not to watch someone else do it for me. Or do it by myself.




    Anyway, I would expect that the regular normal pace.. of moving more or less together and killing as we go.... should be expected unless there is some LFM comment to imply otherwise.
    Quoted just because it's so very well said.

  13. #33
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    i've seen this a few times, but it was a favor train, no xp, favor only quest, jump in and pike or do whatever you want ...partiicipation was "optional"

    the LFM comment was appropriate however, specifificaly said favor train, no xp, zerging, etc ...
    Last edited by sk3l3t0r; 11-25-2013 at 09:31 AM.
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  14. #34
    Community Member Vint's Avatar
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    This happens for the very same reason a flower sniffer joins a zerg LFM. This game in infested with idiots.

    I joined a pug (IP) yesterday for “In the belly of the beast” and the LFM clearly said to know the way to the quest. Between me joining and completing the quest 4 people joined and dropped because they did not have a clue how to get there. IDIOTS everywhere.
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  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by somethingtosay View Post
    I solo a lot. If not, I rather put my lfm up than join one. Mainly because I rush a lot and prefer BYOH.

    Recently I have joined few groups full of experienced players and it was truly joy for me. Even if it could look like we were soloing, everyone on his own, we weren't. We were rushing a lot, buffing while running (but together so everyone actually received mass buffs), everything went smooth so far, if you got in the trouble you knew that there was someone behind you who will help you right away...etc.

    So yeah...this is the playstyle I like. But I try my best when I join non zerging party. I really do.
    This is how I feel about it as well as the groups I love to end up joining.

    I join groups for 3 reasons: to socialize, to finish things faster, and for a change. I can solo most of the quests in the game on the difficulty appropriate for each toon (some are limited to EHards while others are easily EE-capable). The things I can't solo I don't feel that I need to run in a group. So if I join a group it's not because I need the group - it's because I'm looking for one of those 3 things.

    I'll always modify my approach based on the group. Now, one thing pointed out in here that IS rude is going in the quest before everyone else without asking. If you're going to be the first one in and everyone else isn't at the quest yet you should really ask if anyone minds if you get started. Honestly the response to that will tell you a lot about what type of group you've joined. If the person running the group responds with 'sure, go for it' then you can be pretty sure you're joining a group like you outlined there. If however they tell you, 'no, I want us all to stay together and take our time' then you know you're in a different type of group. I'm not a crazy xp-pot guy so I'll normally hang around for those. They can be fun, a wonderful teaching opportunity, and a chance to give newer players a good experience with the game.

    Honestly though, people just need to treat each other with respect and use some common sense and courtesy. There doesn't have to be any hard and fast rules - just be nice to each other.
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  16. #36
    Community Member HungarianRhapsody's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saravis View Post
    Who said that they were pikers?
    The fact that they didn't step into the quest until it was already half completed.
    No one in the world ever gets what they want
    And that is beautiful
    Everybody dies frustrated and sad
    And that is beautiful

  17. #37
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kinggartk View Post
    If he can do pit in 20 mins solo, I don't think joining a group is going to cut the time in half.
    Youd be surprised how much time you can save on that quest when everyone knows what they are doing and can split off.

    Also, naming one of the few exceptions of the rule doesnt negate that the other 98% of quests where time can be reduced by half or more simply by having more group members.

  18. #38
    Community Member Hendrik's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nibel View Post
    I always follow a simple rule: The star sets the speed.

    If the star says he is doing the optionals, it is very rude to go ahead and finish the quest while he is miles behind. If the star is out of the quest, it is rude to start the quest before her (unless asked, like in the case of an elite opener). If the star already started the quest with the LFM up, it is your responsability to catch up.

    Any other kind of behavior is unaceptable.
    Truth.

    Oddly, those that zerg do not put up the groups, they join them. The person with the star is in charge. If one does not like how they lead people have the option to leave and join another, and another, and another until they find one that plays like they do.

    Teamwork is a lost art.

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  19. #39
    Community Member dredre9987's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hendrik View Post
    Truth.

    Oddly, those that zerg do not put up the groups, they join them. The person with the star is in charge. If one does not like how they lead people have the option to leave and join another, and another, and another until they find one that plays like they do.

    Teamwork is a lost art.

    Exactly and that is why I pug when I do.. ( though that is fairly rare for me anyways ) Like I said if I join a group and someone says something about me going too fast I slow down. I won't be there on the next quest but hey that is how I play. ( got to keep up with a friend that always tries to beat me to 20 )
    Last edited by dredre9987; 12-06-2013 at 01:57 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nitesco View Post
    Oh and honestly, you are all carrying portal beaters on your casters? What on earth are you using it on often enough to clog up your bag with it?
    Quote Originally Posted by HungarianRhapsody View Post
    Portals.

  20. #40
    Community Member Draxis's Avatar
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    I know that in epic content, a lot of people are just grinding out CoVs right now - Which means racing to completion as fast as humanly possible and then on to the next quest.

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