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  1. #181
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    lolwut?


    i was just bringing up an example of one guy i know who got hit hard.


    yet i know there had to be many more untouched.

    meh

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  2. #182
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    up - up, down - down, left - right, left - right, A-B (Start)...

    Trapping a turtle on a staircase...

    The Game Shark...

    Exploits have always existed in video games, and company's have always sought out ways to profit off 'em.
    I would still like to see... Something that tests character versatility and player adaptability rather than character focus strength and quest knowledge.
    I play the quests for the content of the quests not just as an XP/min merry-go-round.
    Actual play experience is worth infinitely more than theorycrafting...

  3. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    Shame on everybody who's participated in the last couple of pages!

    You've taken this completely popcorn worthy thread and turned it into yet another rehash of the extremely tired "Turbine Goooooood... Dupers Baaaaaaad...." vs "Dupers Gooooood... Turbine Baaaaaaad...."

    I'm highly disappointed in all of you!
    It's the same people every time. I stay out of it until some moronic Turbine sycophant pokes his or her head in, and then I can't resist the bait.

    Also, for what it's worth, I never argued the Dupers were good. They broke the rules, and they deserve whatever Turbine decides to do to them. What bothers me is how some people blindly defend Turbine, as though they are completely innocent and unworthy of skepticism, while simultaneously painting the exploiters as repulsive, vile lepers who should be exterminated. Neither side is that good or that bad.

  4. #184
    Community Member Vint's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by merridyan View Post
    This was to fix a worse exploit than the duping one, apparently with this one you could:

    Reuse stones of XP from daily dice, raid bypass timers, etc as often as you wanted.
    Reuse ottos's stones of XP
    Create as many AS as you want.
    That just proves the point. We are not allowed to discuss exploits here, but how long had this gone on without the powers that be fixing it? Even if Turbine fixed it as soon as they found it, it does not discount that people have been doing this for a long time. If people were that “scared” or reprisal (especially after the “extreme prejudice”) why are people still cheating?

    I would wager that a very small percentage of dupers were caught and most of those received most of their ill-gotten stuff back. This sends a strong message. “Cheat and we will slap you on the wrist and then we will let you keep your stolen loot”. PM me with the next sploit if that is how we are playing the game.
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  5. #185
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    Quote Originally Posted by Vint View Post
    That just proves the point. We are not allowed to discuss exploits here, but how long had this gone on without the powers that be fixing it? Even if Turbine fixed it as soon as they found it, it does not discount that people have been doing this for a long time. If people were that “scared” or reprisal (especially after the “extreme prejudice”) why are people still cheating?

    I would wager that a very small percentage of dupers were caught and most of those received most of their ill-gotten stuff back. This sends a strong message. “Cheat and we will slap you on the wrist and then we will let you keep your stolen loot”. PM me with the next sploit if that is how we are playing the game.
    Yeah I don't think people are scared at all. A 2-week temporary ban is hardly a deterrent., and that's only if you get caught. Draconic augments were super rare and valuable and seldom show on the ASAH; and if they do it would be for 1000s of AS. In the weeks following the exploit ban and extreme prejudice announcement, I saw like 5-10 augments everyday listed for a fraction of the price. I think the inventory is slowly bought out now cause the number of augments I see have been declining. People who thinks the duped goods have been eliminated probably also believe in the tooth fairy.

    In most games I play, dupers are viewed almost universally as scums of the earth. Perma-bans are almost a given. I've never seen so much support/defense of duping as I've seen here in this community. Nor have I seen such light slapping of the wrist for the perpetrators.

  6. #186
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    If we are justifying not penalizing exploitation because it makes money to keep people on the servers, that's a short term cop out at best, because its only a matter of time before everyone is doing it due to the clear demonstration that nothing is being done about it.

    To you and me its a game, to them its their business. Its the entity that puts food on their table. They shouldn't be having the same "who cares" attitude like players do, and the fact that they did not do anything for a long period of time is more astonishing than any player saying "who cares" - but that being said, they are doing now what they should have done a long time ago. What remains to be seen is if they continue to do so, or if they fall back on their "fight club don't talk about it" attitude of old - which is what encourages this stuff to happen in the first place.

    At the end of the day, if the fate of the game hinges on not penalizing exploiters in hopes that they will pay into the system, that's a pretty poor game.

    The part I highlighted in red isn't what my stance is. I most emphatically think they should fix the exploit so that it may no longer be used. That's not doing nothing, rather (to remove the double negative) its doing something, that something is just not killing off a segment of an already atrophying population.

    I mean, lets assume that every exploiter is banned from the game.

    We can ask the following question then:

    Is the game better off now, with the portion of the player base that exploited gone (along with their associated financial contributions), versus the alternate situation where they are not banned, the exploit no longer exists because turbine rectified the problem, but these folks may exploit again in the future, perhaps?

    Since turbine is completely in control of how the economy will evolve, based on the power and binding nature of future items, I think its reasonable to think that the latter situation would still make for a healthier game.
    Last edited by Cetus; 11-03-2013 at 04:09 PM.
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  7. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by Whispurr View Post
    In most games I play, dupers are viewed almost universally as scums of the earth. Perma-bans are almost a given. I've never seen so much support/defense of duping as I've seen here in this community. Nor have I seen such light slapping of the wrist for the perpetrators.
    In most games you play, are the exploits so often profitable for the game company? From store bought Shears, to store bought Augment bags, to all the "just do (X) with item from your (store bought) shared bank," to all the shards being purchased to obtain dupes from the A$AH... It seems that a great many of the exploits in this game are either the result of spending money, or result in spending money.

    I know people hate RL analogies, but here's one anyway:

    If speeding tickets are a source of revenue, does a municipality really want to discourage speeding, or would it prefer people just continue speeding and paying the associated fines?

    Remember, this is relation to a video game, so fatalities and injuries resulting from speeding are irrelevant unless analogous to the video game situation at hand!
    Last edited by PermaBanned; 11-03-2013 at 04:23 PM.
    I would still like to see... Something that tests character versatility and player adaptability rather than character focus strength and quest knowledge.
    I play the quests for the content of the quests not just as an XP/min merry-go-round.
    Actual play experience is worth infinitely more than theorycrafting...

  8. #188
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    Default it's not a Exploit if all you have to do is..

    hit a check box. . .. . .

  9. #189
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    My God. Is this thread still alive? How much spleen can a person vent? I can tolerate all kinds of things, but not boring people.


    We need a greasemonkey script to hide threads, and users.

  10. #190
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    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    Shame on everybody who's participated in the last couple of pages!

    You've taken this completely popcorn worthy thread and turned it into yet another rehash of the extremely tired "Turbine Goooooood... Dupers Baaaaaaad...." vs "Dupers Gooooood... Turbine Baaaaaaad...."

    I'm highly disappointed in all of you!


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  11. #191
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeslieWest_GuitarGod View Post
    Turbine nailed a lot of people. There is not a single MMO in existence that wouldn't welcome their player base to alert them of exploits as soon as they happen. .
    Every MMO except for turbine.......iv'e lost count with the number of exploits people reported on lama that then made it to live then had no action taken till it reached epic proportions, then it was all slap on the wrist....sometimes I think some of it is deliberate oh lets leave it up for a bit to get people to buy this new pack before we shut it down hmmmm? They where even made aware of the buy back then where glacial on making any changes to nip that in the bud. I'm sorry if they are your personal friends but if anyone is going to get blamed for the exploit early exploit often culture that has festered in DDO they are almost as good candidates as the group of exploiters .
    Last edited by NaturalHazard; 11-03-2013 at 08:10 PM.

  12. #192
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mystera View Post
    Why?
    Why ask why? Try Bud Dry.
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  13. #193
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAL View Post
    Again, either you're accepting the word of total strangers who might just as well be lying that they pulled one over on Turbine or you know cheaters well enough to take their word.
    Because somehow despite not knowing Turbine they shouldn't be treated as total strangers? Turbine's representatives are paid to state what Turbine wishes said. Whether or not it is the truth is another matter altogether.

    Quote Originally Posted by HAL View Post
    I also find it interesting that you will trust / know cheaters but malign the OP.
    How is the OP any different from an exploiter? He likes to come across as someone who doesn't partake, but he is more than willing to continue purchasing from them after he comes to the conclusion the goods are laundered. Further he is unwilling to dispose of them claiming that Turbine should refund him. Which is a good stance to take if you wish to have an excuse to keep them with no worries about having to give them up.

    As for trusting/knowing cheaters, I never stated that. Maybe you should stop trying to read between the lines. Because it is very apparently you aren't any good at it.
    Last edited by Ryiah; 11-03-2013 at 07:58 PM. Reason: Yay typos
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  14. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by HAL View Post
    The OP makes perfect sense to me. If I saw an item on the AH that was a good deal I might snap it up. If I checked the AH again later like I usually do and there was another one I might think I'm lucky and snap it up again. Then when you see another one for the same low price, you start to wonder. If you have plenty of shards you might buy it just to see what happens. Sure enough there is another one. Now you've confirmed in your mind that something fishy is going on. You might continue to buy just to see how many there will be. Then you inform Turbine but obviously if they want to remove the items you purchased from the game you would want your currency back. Nothing wrong with that - players should not be required to sacrifice their own currency to catch exploiters. And if Turbine isn't concerned with removing the items from the game, then it is apparently fine for you to keep them.
    OP here. This pretty much sums up the thoughts that went through my head. From reading over the thread, everyone obviously has different opinions about what they would have done. I guess it's easy to be an armchair quarterback and say you would have done differently. If I could go back again I would probably just report it to Turbine instead of opening a thread. I thought there might be more power in getting Turbine to act by going to the forums, but instead I just opened myself up to everyone's opinion on what they thought I should have done.
    Last edited by Mystera; 11-03-2013 at 09:23 PM.

  15. #195

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    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHazard View Post
    Every MMO except for turbine.......iv'e lost count with the number of exploits people reported on lama that then made it to live then had no action taken till it reached epic proportions, then it was all slap on the wrist....
    No question about it. I've been saying that for years. It takes time code fixes, but I agree, it never seems like enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHazard View Post
    sometimes I think some of it is deliberate oh lets leave it up for a bit to get people to buy this new pack before we shut it down hmmmm?
    I do not agree with this. I understand the business side of it. Not a chance they would do this, as it would cost far more in PR and in actual dev time to code the fix and hunt down morons. I agree fully about the reaction time, too slow.


    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHazard View Post
    They where even made aware of the buy back then where glacial on making any changes to nip that in the bud. I'm sorry if they are your personal friends but if anyone is going to get blamed for the exploit early exploit often culture that has festered in DDO they are almost as good candidates as the group of exploiters .
    DDO = exploiter = scum arguments are not helpful. Turbine DID come out strong here. They are not done yet. Hell Im for banning all dupers period, that should be obvious. There IS a good argument however for doing what they did, especially inventory adjustments. They should be commended for getting their hands dirty and wiping the inventories. They sent plenty to the hills. If you listen closely, many ran for the hills. Sure some are back, but most without the goods, minus other items that require serious farming to replace. Some brag they dident get caught. THESE are the dumbest ones in the lot. "Hey me OVER HERE YOU MISSED ME nananana!!!" <--- They are either full of ****, full of stupid, or a complex concoction of both.

    Plenty in this thread, and other websites are not being genuine when they comment. Notice someone always knows someone else, but few give their own account. Why? Because they either got NAILED, or are scared of getting nailed. I believe this time was different, they really did crack down.

    Next time though, I hope they can respond quicker, and extend those vacations out quite a bit. Personally, I believe they should still be banned from using any AH/mail/trading/bank/communication features for at least three months after the in-game suspension is lifted.
    Last edited by LeslieWest_GuitarGod; 11-03-2013 at 09:35 PM.


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  16. #196
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeslieWest_GuitarGod View Post


    I do not agree with this. I understand the business side of it. Not a chance they would do this, as it would cost far more in PR and in actual dev time to code the fix and hunt down morons. I agree fully about the reaction time, too slow.
    You mean like putting an item on sale in the DDO store just before it was removed because it was used in exploits? Yeah sure, this company would never dirty themselves in order to make a quick buck.
    Git off mah lawn!

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  17. #197

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    Quote Originally Posted by Braegan View Post
    You mean like putting an item on sale in the DDO store just before it was removed because it was used in exploits? Yeah sure, this company would never dirty themselves in order to make a quick buck.
    Of course they want to make a quick buck. But to twist everything around to somehow defend the rights of exploiters to cheat is a bunch of shenanigans and you know it. That's all this is about.

    Turbine has been terrible about keeping its word about ensuring exploiters punished appropriately. Nobody in here is blindly supporting Turbine. But many of us ARE happy enough what they've done. Was it everyone, of course not. Will some go to the well and try it again? Without question. But no doubt, Turbine needs to keep it up, because regardless what a dozen or so of you are saying in this thread... they at the very least successfully put a bunch of cheaters on notice. Whether they choose to READ the notice and abide by it, is another story altogether.


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  18. #198

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    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHazard View Post
    yeah this photo is really apt
    It is indeed. It is what I think of "adults" that have to run to another website to discuss more ways to cheat at an mmo, then run back to this one and put down the manufacturer in a never-ending cycle. And to think they aren't all 14 year olds..... AMAZING.
    Last edited by LeslieWest_GuitarGod; 11-03-2013 at 11:41 PM.


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  19. #199
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeslieWest_GuitarGod View Post
    Of course they want to make a quick buck. But to twist everything around to somehow defend the rights of exploiters to cheat is a bunch of shenanigans and you know it. That's all this is about.

    Turbine has been terrible about keeping its word about ensuring exploiters punished appropriately. Nobody in here is blindly supporting Turbine. But many of us ARE happy enough what they've done. Was it everyone, of course not. Will some go to the well and try it again? Without question. But no doubt, Turbine needs to keep it up, because regardless what a dozen or so of you are saying in this thread... they at the very least successfully put a bunch of cheaters on notice. Whether they choose to READ the notice and abide by it, is another story altogether.
    Nice red herring, but it's unsuccessful. Turbine very clearly knew about the bug regarding Shears, and they knowingly made the decision to have a sale on them anyway, very shortly before they removed them because of the bug. They profited off a bug. There is no denying it. It has nothing to do with "defending the rights of exploiters."

  20. #200
    Community Member NaturalHazard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LeslieWest_GuitarGod View Post
    Of course they want to make a quick buck. But to twist everything around to somehow defend the rights of exploiters to cheat is a bunch of shenanigans and you know it. That's all this is about.

    Turbine has been terrible about keeping its word about ensuring exploiters punished appropriately. Nobody in here is blindly supporting Turbine. But many of us ARE happy enough what they've done. Was it everyone, of course not. Will some go to the well and try it again? Without question. But no doubt, Turbine needs to keep it up, because regardless what a dozen or so of you are saying in this thread... they at the very least successfully put a bunch of cheaters on notice. Whether they choose to READ the notice and abide by it, is another story altogether.
    Where did I defend the rights of the exploiters to cheat? Be nice if turbine didn't pick and choose when its appropriate for them to enforce the rules and when to turn a blind eye. Im sorry but if we want this nipping in the bud of exploits to be successful we need the people doing the policing not to have double standards. Hopefully this will be what they are aiming to do but im not holding my breath on that. You yourself mentioned of course they wanted to make a quick buck, how can you trust people who would contradict their own standards like that?

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