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Thread: How To Tank

  1. #41
    Community Member HungarianRhapsody's Avatar
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    How to tank, a lesson in 3 parts

    Part the first: Be a Ranger or a Monk (or both).

    Part the second: Get out your bow and engage the multi-shot (note - this is different than multi-pass, even though both are fun to say in Leelo's accent from the 5th Element). Get the enemy's aggro (i.e. his attention will be focused on you because you will have done more damage to it than anyone else since you can shoot it before the melee get in range and because you're shooting several arrows per attack).

    Part the third: Run away from the melee types in large, looping circles in order to keep them from engaging with the target. This will prevent them from taking damage since they will be chasing the enemy and attacking from behind and as long as you stay out of your target's melee range, you will also take minimal damage from the enemy that you are tanking. Plus, this has an extra benefit for all of the melee characters in the party who get to enjoy the extra challenge of hitting that moving target. Since so many quests in DDO are so very easy, players will enjoy and appreciate that extra challenge.
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  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by HungarianRhapsody View Post
    How to tank, a lesson in 3 parts

    Part the first: Be a Ranger or a Monk (or both).

    Part the second: Get out your bow and engage the multi-shot (note - this is different than multi-pass, even though both are fun to say in Leelo's accent from the 5th Element). Get the enemy's aggro (i.e. his attention will be focused on you because you will have done more damage to it than anyone else since you can shoot it before the melee get in range and because you're shooting several arrows per attack).

    Part the third: Run away from the melee types in large, looping circles in order to keep them from engaging with the target. This will prevent them from taking damage since they will be chasing the enemy and attacking from behind and as long as you stay out of your target's melee range, you will also take minimal damage from the enemy that you are tanking. Plus, this has an extra benefit for all of the melee characters in the party who get to enjoy the extra challenge of hitting that moving target. Since so many quests in DDO are so very easy, players will enjoy and appreciate that extra challenge.
    if you do this correctly you can extend a trivial fight to last exactly 2 minutes, thus giving the party more bang for the buck and leaving you ready to manyshot the next group of mobs!
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  3. #43
    Community Member Ralmeth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    No, it is not.

    This is bad advise to new players.
    Actually, the first question when a new player asks for advice is what content do they aspire to play? If they want to get to end game and beat epic elites, then I agree that a Paladin tank is not the right type of character to build. If I had the time / wanted to play epic elites I would TR my Pally tank into a Fighter based character, probably based around Cetus' build, or I'd play my sorc. However, if a new player just wants to play and doesn't care about epic elites, then it's bad advice to tell them not to play a type of character they would enjoy.
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  4. #44
    Community Member avepepix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    it's better to crush their dreams now than after 6-12 months of heading down a dead-end path.

    Heck, even if tanks were in high demand do you really think recommending somebody start as one is a good idea? When I built mine (both of which, one Stalwart and one DoS, are no longer tanks) they were leveled and geared as offensive builds. It's just the smarter way to go about things.

    I'm sorry, it is best to set the record straight when people ask about this stuff.
    Well its about perspective, I have a First life, Dwarf, Stalwart Def, lvl 25 now, and he is all the bad thinks you said about thanks.
    Its true that you can get bored. But no for the class, you get bored of the game if nobody wants to play with you that bored quests where is the stuff you need.
    For ex. 95% of the people want the SOS and im a dwarf, a bad tempered one, hard head, screaming and insulting, like if i was in pnp. So for what i want the sos? For nothing. But for me is fun haven 132 ac, 1302 hp. Press 1 to intimidate all the folks that walks around me.
    Hit the shift to rise my PRR and see and laught of his futiles intents of killing me.

    If you want a tank there`s some things you have to know.
    NOT everyone has to play with a thank besides him, they will run, they will hit and the will die, and you will see all that and cant do nothing about it. Like a tank you cant run (maybe you can) but then a ranger scream MANYSHOOT and then you loose the AGRO and have to run and intimidate again.
    Or with undead, they dont will wait you to get the agro, so you try to intimidate but you cant, and then again you will see how the skeleton kill your party.

    You can chose AC or Hit points or Saves.
    You cant full all. if in your plans you cant get more than 150 AC forget AC. They allways will hit you.
    You can say, ok I leave the AC to other givme life!!! . I have 1300 and i can die easily... so dont think that you can live only for have 1500 hit points.
    The saves can evite you fall in a spell... But they cant cast you enervation and you cant loose 15 lvls soo...
    Dont matter what path you choose. The perfect tank dont exist. Allways can be a quest, a enemy that can kill you. So, get fun!! Its the only thing that really matters.

    For example my simple first life dwarf fighter tank. I really enjoy playing with him, he its not a power character, It was the first character i made when enter the game, he hasent the best equip. But its really fun for me trying to save the life of the rest of the party.

  5. #45
    Community Member elraido's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    it's better to crush their dreams now than after 6-12 months of heading down a dead-end path.

    Heck, even if tanks were in high demand do you really think recommending somebody start as one is a good idea? When I built mine (both of which, one Stalwart and one DoS, are no longer tanks) they were leveled and geared as offensive builds. It's just the smarter way to go about things.

    I'm sorry, it is best to set the record straight when people ask about this stuff.
    6-12 months on a dead end path? That all? My first toon 7 years ago was a S&B Paladin tank. He is basically the only one I play on a regular basis to this day.

    Let people play what they want to play. Obviously I enjoy my tank...even if they are a dead end. It is your opinion. Besides, if it means they can take a horrible build and play the game just fine...does that mean they are a better player than you?
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  6. #46
    Community Member avepepix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elraido View Post
    6-12 months on a dead end path? That all? My first toon 7 years ago was a S&B Paladin tank. He is basically the only one I play on a regular basis to this day.

    Let people play what they want to play. Obviously I enjoy my tank...even if they are a dead end. It is your opinion. Besides, if it means they can take a horrible build and play the game just fine...does that mean they are a better player than you?
    Its true that its a dead end. We have fun with yours tanks, but out there are betters end game choises.
    Basicaly to tank you have to generate threat, Then you need AC or HP.

    I know that today basicaly you can tank with a wizard, but he wants a paladin. so, he must think his better ways to get fun.

    Like i say in my partys, Im the tank, Im poor DPS, Im not a killer... i make the suffer and killing him slowly muahahahaha

  7. #47
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by elraido View Post
    6-12 months on a dead end path? That all? My first toon 7 years ago was a S&B Paladin tank. He is basically the only one I play on a regular basis to this day.
    Some people learn things faster than others.

    Just sayin . . .

  8. #48
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Not really sure even what future the S&B tank has now even as a tank with epic reincarnation giving so many defensive benefits and the way armor class, physical resistance, and dodge works. Since the more physical resistance and armor class that you have the more damage a character avoids or reduces up until a point where adding more basically will not improve the rating the key is really getting to the threshold where adding more PR or AC does not benefit a tank much if at all. Now a lot of builds can reach those thresholds. S&B are limited in how much dodge they can get whereas monks, arcanes, and light armor wearers are not. What this all means is a shiradi wizard or sorc for e.g. can have the same PRR and AC as a S&B tank with more dodge, dps and mobility.
    Last edited by maddmatt70; 11-15-2013 at 11:19 AM.
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  9. #49
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    Not really sure even what future the S&B tank has now even as a tank with epic reincarnation giving so many defensive benefits and the way armor class, physical resistance, and dodge works. Since the more physical resistance and armor class that you have the more damage a character avoids or reduces up until a point where adding more basically will not improve the rating the key is really getting to the threshold where adding more PR or AC does not benefit a tank much if at all. S&B are limited in how much dodge they can get whereas monks, arcanes, and light armor wearers are not. A shiradi wizard or sorc will have the same PRR and AC as a S&B tank with more dodge, dps and mobility.
    With 9 Martial PLs we should see people routinely breaking 220 AC . . . I wonder if that'll work on EE bosses?

  10. #50
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teh_Troll View Post
    With 9 Martial PLs we should see people routinely breaking 220 AC . . . I wonder if that'll work on EE bosses?
    Well my update 19 shortsword unarmored tank build should hit about 200 ac. I am going to try to level him up and then tr a bunch that is if I enjoy epic trring. Not sure I will be able to manage epic trring because I am not sure I can handle doing any lives on epic hard. I have a feeling the whole game is going to be epic hard soon enough and just can not take that.
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  11. #51
    Community Member bsquishwizzy's Avatar
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    Ok, so I’m reading this, and I have a second-life S&B pure pally tank.

    First, I’m going to say that The_Troll is right about pure tanks. Pure pally, almost pure SD (also took some ranks in KotC and Human tree) is substandard as a pure tank, especially in EE. The problem is that I can rack up PRR, Healing Amp, and bump my AC but you run smack-dab into threat generation and intim because you are not dealing enough damage to keep the mob’s attention and aggro. It is extremely frustrating. The second issue is that you need a buttload of dodge / incorp / displacement and all that jazz to avoid damage, because you are getting mauled with inferior AC and PRR, even with a shield. So now you’re going down the farm trail to get equipment to compensate. So you lose on getting aggro, keeping it, and staying alive while the boss is focused on you. Without gear to compensate for the deficiencies, there is NO FRICKIN’ WAY I could tank a boss - any boss – on EE. I have some difficulties on EH as is.

    Note, I am not running with gear that is total ****. I’d say I’m solidly in the middle between random loot equipment, and optimal.

    Is my build useless? No. I routinely stay in the fight longer than other players at my same level – he is very hard to kill. My DPS is not great, but that can be compensated for with specialty weapons. Self-heals, the ability to take quite a bit of damage while I rez other players, and similar things makes him a utility player in a lot of aspects. And yes, I can run him in EE content at level in this manner, and be effective. But as a full-out tank, I’d lose aggro about 3 milliseconds after real DPS starts wailing on the boss, DR running or no.

    It seems a shame that a build meant to be the king of aggro is actually more like the stable boy of aggro.

  12. #52
    Community Member DrNuegebauer's Avatar
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    The main problem with what teh_troll is saying in this thread can be summed up in one word.

    Advice.

    It's spelt with a c, not an s.

    Apart from that, he's spot on. The original poster should not build a "tank". There is simply no need for one in DDO. And, if you DO decide to build one, please do everyone else a favour and don't waste their time by hitting LFMs.

  13. #53
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsquishwizzy View Post
    First, I’m going to say that The_Troll is right . . .
    You could have stopped there

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