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  1. #41
    The Mad Multiclasser Failedlegend's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by voodoogroves View Post
    By not using DC spells, and instead overcoming "quality" with "quantity" and 7% chances to proc crazy **** from Shiradi?
    So its not really a spellcaster than what the point in going sorceror wouldn't an Arty be better with a repeater.
    Quote Originally Posted by Cordovan
    There is little value in getting into an edition debate; as with anything, we create what we believe works best for DDO.

  2. #42
    Hero thesnoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Failedlegend View Post
    So uh...I don't mean to be well...mean but you only have 14 Sorc levels your DCs are going to suck...how do you plan to overcome that.

    I mostly ask because I was thinking of doing a Sorc16/Pally2/FvS2
    Most of the spells you use are no-fail spells like MM, CM, and Scorching Ray - Your DC has nothing to do with this build.

    Shiradi Procs are what create the DPS here, not the basic spells you cast. (Except Scorching Ray - it'll do 1K plus damage by itself when it crits, and it crits quite often with this build)



    So its not really a spellcaster than what the point in going sorceror wouldn't an Arty be better with a repeater.
    No - not at all.

    Shiradi Procs damage is multiplied by spell power. The Force Procs are what seem to go off more than anything else, so I'll use them as an example.

    Fey Power (6th Innate Shiradi Ability) - 7% chance to deal 2d100 extra force damage.

    Therefore, an Arti - with little force spell power is going to get close to the base 2-200 damage.

    A Sorcerer - in this case, with 367 Spell power will get 7 - 734 base damage. This doubles on a critical - and this build has a more than 30% Chance to crit with Force (36% IIRC)

    Then you can also add in things like Max/Emp (which apply to the Shiradi Procs), to boost your damage even higher - Same example as above with Max/Emp turned on yields 12 - 1184 damage (again, doubling on a crit.)

    Add in the fact that I can get off 10 - 20 missiles in the time it takes an arti to get off 4-8 bolts and you can see that a Sorcerer is far superior to any Arti in Shiradi.
    Last edited by thesnoman; 12-24-2013 at 06:09 AM.
    "Melkorr (Completionist "Toaster of Vengeance") ~ Angrond (TWF Jugg) ~ Telchacar ~ Celebrimor (Bank) ~ Manados
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  3. #43
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    Default Awesome build, could fire be swapped for other element?

    Your build sounds awesome man. However personally I don't care for fire spells, could this be swapped for air, on a build with 2 past lives Sorcerer?

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by thesnoman;5150712
    I give you the Toaster of Vengeance!

    [B
    Brief Overview:[/B]
    Lawful Good Warforged
    14 Sorc/4 FvS/2 Pally
    Leveling Order: SSSSSSFFSSSSSSSSPPFF

    You also don't want to take your Pally levels last as it will require you to spend extra skill points in Spell Power as it is not a class skill for Paladin.
    You say dont Take paladin levels Last but is 17 and 18 much different than 19 and 20?

    Also from the 2 pala splash things like Lay of Hands that you get wouldnt that be helpful a bit earlier?

  5. #45
    Hero thesnoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azurchaos View Post
    You say dont Take paladin levels Last but is 17 and 18 much different than 19 and 20?

    Also from the 2 pala splash things like Lay of Hands that you get wouldnt that be helpful a bit earlier?
    You really can take Pally whenever you want after Level 8

    You want 6 Sorc for Fireball as quickly as possible
    You then want 2 FvS to get the bonuses to Fire


    You don't want Pally levels LAST because Spellcraft is not a class skill for Pally - as it is skills are at a premium, so spending the extra points on Spellcraft is a waste. Spellcraft IS a FvS Skill, so you want to take either FvS or Sorc as your last level or two to max Spellcraft without wasting skill points.

    Awesome build, could fire be swapped for other element?

    Your build sounds awesome man. However personally I don't care for fire spells, could this be swapped for air, on a build with 2 past lives Sorcerer?
    You can swap it for Air, but I'd suggest going 18/2 (FvS or Pally) or 16/2/2 instead. Your blue bar also won't be as long lasting since you lose out on crit chance by not casting fire spells.

    The biggest reason for going 4 FvS is for the Synergy you get between Angel of Vengeance and Fire Savant. I have played this build with Air primary and Fire secondary, but you lose out so much that it just isn't worth it. (I don't miss wings very often - you get used to not having them)

    Keep in mind that the fire spell you will cast most often is Scorching Ray - FB and DBFB are for masses of baddies that don't have high reflex saves. These are the only fire spells I use.

    You can always level using Air and swap to Fire when you are in Shiradi - it only costs a few platinum to do it.

    If you're specifically interested in Air Savant Builds I suggest the following threads:

    AtomicMew's U19 Shiradi Primer

    My U19 Shiradi Sorc Info

    Wizza's Farwind Build

    EDITOR'S NOTE

    I've TR'd into a Blaeforged for this build - Currently at Level 18 - Will let everyone know how the build progresses
    "Melkorr (Completionist "Toaster of Vengeance") ~ Angrond (TWF Jugg) ~ Telchacar ~ Celebrimor (Bank) ~ Manados
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  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by thesnoman View Post
    You really can take Pally whenever you want after Level 8

    You want 6 Sorc for Fireball as quickly as possible
    You then want 2 FvS to get the bonuses to Fire

    Is the only reason you wanna take FvS the enhancement line? Cause if so wouldnt it be better to wait till later when u have to AP to spend in both Fire Savant and the FvS one?

    I never done a FvS so dunno if u get anything else from the 4 lvls?

    You get this for level 1 and 2 :

    Level 1:
    Enhancement: Toughness
    Spell: Bless
    Spell: Cure Light Wounds
    Spell: Nightshield
    Level 2:
    Bonus Feat: +2 damage with a pecific weapon based on faith
    +1 CHA (Purchasable Enhancement)
    25% Wand Effectiveness Increase

    so i would guess your taking at least 2 for the + CHA but just wondering what you get from taking it all the way to level 4?

  7. #47
    Hero thesnoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azurchaos View Post
    Is the only reason you wanna take FvS the enhancement line? Cause if so wouldnt it be better to wait till later when u have to AP to spend in both Fire Savant and the FvS one?

    I never done a FvS so dunno if u get anything else from the 4 lvls?

    <SNIP>

    so i would guess your taking at least 2 for the + CHA but just wondering what you get from taking it all the way to level 4?
    You're taking 4 FvS Strictly for the AoV Enhancement line.

    Above Level 2 you get the following from enhancements:

    +4% chance for Fire/Force/Light/Physical Damage Spells to Crit
    +2 Charisma
    +3 Caster Levels to Fire/Force/Light/Physical Damage Spells

    +14 Universal Spell Power (from points spent in the AoV tree)

    Keep in mind that the chance to crit. is the key point here.
    From Tier 2 AoV - Just Reward (3/3): When you Critically Hit with Fire/Force/Light/Physical Damage Spells you gain 10 temporary Spell Points

    The higher your Crit Chance, the more temporary spell points you get and the longer your blue bar lasts.
    "Melkorr (Completionist "Toaster of Vengeance") ~ Angrond (TWF Jugg) ~ Telchacar ~ Celebrimor (Bank) ~ Manados
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  8. #48
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    Is there any chance you can post what you took outa the Shiradi Champion epic tree.

  9. #49
    Hero thesnoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Azurchaos View Post
    Is there any chance you can post what you took outa the Shiradi Champion epic tree.
    Sure - here it is:



    Tier 1
    Healing Spring (3/3)
    Illusion of Well Being (1/3) - Grants 1 additional use of Healing Spring per rest.

    Tier 2
    Prism
    Fey Spring (1/3) - Grants 1 additional use of Healing Spring
    Fey Form (3/3) - +15 Spell Power and Required for Elemental Absorption

    Tier 3
    Rainbow

    Tier 4
    Double Rainbow
    In The Weeds (2/3) +2 Dodge
    Elemental Absorption (3/3) - 15% Elemental Absorption

    Tier 5
    Nerve Venom (3/3)

    Tier 6
    Audience with the Queen


    There are alternatives so you can take Stay Frosty and Stay Good, but I don't see a need to take them since you will be in Prism all the time.
    "Melkorr (Completionist "Toaster of Vengeance") ~ Angrond (TWF Jugg) ~ Telchacar ~ Celebrimor (Bank) ~ Manados
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  10. #50
    Founder & Hero Samir_Bennal's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by thesnoman View Post

    EDITOR'S NOTE

    I've TR'd into a Bladeforged for this build - Currently at Level 18 - Will let everyone know how the build progresses
    How is the bladeforged working out? Am getting ready to TR for first time. Was wondering about the 4 lvls favored soul. Is that personal preference? Will less favored soul for more sorc lvls work? Have been a fighter and monk player since the game launched but want to branch out. Do have access to bladeforged if that seems to be working better than warforged. As of this moment, not too concerned about end game survivability as it usually takes me quite a while to level a toon up (as in my toon I started at launch didn't hit 20 till last year). Not lots o play time. Will obviously welcome end game tips to be aware of for the time I do reach that point. Am mainly a solo player if that sways any advice.
    Main - Dinomyte, Leader of the Cult of the Onyx Pikachu
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  11. #51
    Hero thesnoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Samir_Bennal View Post
    How is the bladeforged working out?
    AWESOME!!!

    More Charisma = more SP and more power.

    Also it's +1 to all saves with the Pally levels (although you will be losing out on 1 reflex save since your Dex will be down by 2, so reflex evens out).


    Quote Originally Posted by Samir_Bennal View Post
    Was wondering about the 4 lvls favored soul. Is that personal preference? Will less favored soul for more sorc lvls work?<SNIP> Am mainly a solo player if that sways any advice.
    4 Levels of FvS is what makes this particular build SHINE!!
    For End Game you won't be using many high level spells (in Shiradi) so the extra levels of Sorc are not necessary.
    Keep in mind that this is my personal preference, but it seems to be a popular one as I've seen this split more and more on Thelanis.

    This build is perfect for Soloing - you'll rarely run out of Mana, can self heal, have great saves, and can kill just about everything.
    It does get harder to Solo once you get into the Vale and Shavarath since you're primarily focusing on Fire spells and there are many creatures that are resistant to fire (NOT IMMUNE) but it's still doable.

    Devils and Orthons are immune, but almost everything else is just resistant.
    "Melkorr (Completionist "Toaster of Vengeance") ~ Angrond (TWF Jugg) ~ Telchacar ~ Celebrimor (Bank) ~ Manados
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  12. #52
    Founder & Hero Samir_Bennal's Avatar
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    Alrighty then. Guess we'll give it a go. Will be nice to be bladeforge instead of halfling sorc.

    Edit: Does being bladeforge alter the order you took on the classes?
    Last edited by Samir_Bennal; 01-11-2014 at 07:09 PM.
    Main - Dinomyte, Leader of the Cult of the Onyx Pikachu
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  13. #53
    Hero thesnoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Samir_Bennal View Post
    Edit: Does being bladeforge alter the order you took on the classes?
    Yes - it's a requirement of Bladeforged to take Paladin at Level 1. Since you get enough XP to get to 15, you can put the first 15 in any order, but it's important to have two levels of FvS in the first 15 levels.

    Here's my leveling order for Bladeforged:

    1 & 2: Paladin
    3 - 13: Sorcerer
    14 & 15: Favored Soul

    (You start playing here)

    16 - 18: Sorcerer
    19 & 20: Favored Soul
    "Melkorr (Completionist "Toaster of Vengeance") ~ Angrond (TWF Jugg) ~ Telchacar ~ Celebrimor (Bank) ~ Manados
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  14. #54
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    I normally would not be keyed on taking diplomacy skill. But just read the Shiradi Audience With Queen results chart, based on Diplo success. That alone, having every 2 1/2 minutes that list of crazy buffs go off looks like I will take Diplo. Do the Queens buffs last long enough for you to always be covered between casts, or the buffs match up to only the 11 secs of fast healing? I know this is more an epic destiny thread question, but to me looks like a key part of build.

  15. #55
    Hero thesnoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tracimatrix View Post
    I normally would not be keyed on taking diplomacy skill. But just read the Shiradi Audience With Queen results chart, based on Diplo success. That alone, having every 2 1/2 minutes that list of crazy buffs go off looks like I will take Diplo. Do the Queens buffs last long enough for you to always be covered between casts, or the buffs match up to only the 11 secs of fast healing? I know this is more an epic destiny thread question, but to me looks like a key part of build.
    No Problem - Keep in mind that this ability is only usable once per rest.

    I'll not go over the weaker versions of this ability since you only need a 40 Diplomacy Check, which is easy to hit on a Sorcerer since Diplomacy is a Charisma based skill.

    Here's what you get with Joy of the Queen (This is what you want EVERY TIME)

    11 seconds of fast healing - this heals you for Approx 1000 HP.

    5 minutes of ONE of the following:

    • 75% Royalty bonus resistance to Acid, Cold, Electric, Fire, and Sonic damage.
    • +100 Royalty bonus to Physical Resistance Rating
    • +300 Royalty bonus to Maximum HP
    • +10 Royalty bonus to all saving throws
    • +10 Royalty bonus to all ability scores. In addition, your spells gain a 50% chance to generate a random effect (as Double Rainbow on Prism Stance but at 50% chance instead of 7%).


    The list above is completely random - you never know what you're going to get. The Last one is what you're really shooting for since you get a 50% chance to generate a random effect per spell damage roll, (and happens to be the only one where "Joy of the Queen" pops over your head), but I believe it's only about a 5% chance.

    The 5 Minute bonuses last for exactly that - 5 minutes. There's no downtime in those 5 minutes. Popping Tea is usually saved for boss fights since you only get it once per rest.
    "Melkorr (Completionist "Toaster of Vengeance") ~ Angrond (TWF Jugg) ~ Telchacar ~ Celebrimor (Bank) ~ Manados
    Thelanis

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  16. #56
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    So you are OK with 5% arcane spell failure? It only costs 1 AP to remove the inherent penalty.

  17. #57
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    Question .... Once you made it to 20 and run around in Shiradi, do you keep your metamagics on at all times when casting?

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by jskinner937 View Post
    So you are OK with 5% arcane spell failure? It only costs 1 AP to remove the inherent penalty.

    I do not have 5% Arcane Spell Failure. I'd just rather take it in EK than WF so you get the other beneifts:

    Eldritch Knight Core Ability #2 - Spellsword: Flame
    Toggle:

    • Charge your equipped weapon with magical flame, causing them to deal an addtional 1d6 fire damage on hit. This damage increases to 2d4 at Sorcerer Level 6, 3d4 at Sorcerer Level 12, and 4d4 at Sorcerer Level 18.
    • Up to once every 6 seconds while a spellsword toggle is active, an attack you make that hits an enemy will cost you a spell point.
    • While active, your Eldritch Strike deals an additional 0 to 2 fire damage per character level. This additional damage is affected by your fire spellpower.

    Passive:

    • -5% Arcane Spell Failure from equipped Armor and Shields
    • +10 Force Spell Power
    Last edited by thesnoman; 01-15-2014 at 08:26 AM.
    "Melkorr (Completionist "Toaster of Vengeance") ~ Angrond (TWF Jugg) ~ Telchacar ~ Celebrimor (Bank) ~ Manados
    Thelanis

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  19. #59
    Hero thesnoman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow7375 View Post
    Question .... Once you made it to 20 and run around in Shiradi, do you keep your metamagics on at all times when casting?
    Maximize and Empower are always active, but they are turned to Always Off in my shortcut bars on most spells, including MM, CM, FM, and Scorching Ray. They are on default for FB and DBFB (so metas do effect them).

    Quicken is set to Always On for Reconstruct ONLY and I do not have it active most of the time since casting times are negligible for spells you cast regularly (MM, CM, FM, SR).
    "Melkorr (Completionist "Toaster of Vengeance") ~ Angrond (TWF Jugg) ~ Telchacar ~ Celebrimor (Bank) ~ Manados
    Thelanis

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  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by thesnoman View Post
    The fleshie version works best as a Half Elf w/ Pally Dilli.You then go 16/4 SOrc/Fvs. Here's a Link: Raidon's End Game Builds
    Heya Sno. I'm planning to TR into this build (sort of) and stay at end game to grind out Epic PL's in EE content.

    I have two questions here...

    1) I could go Bladeforged but would prefer to go Human as I have 3 pally PL (also 1 wiz, 2 clr, 2 ftr and 1 mnk PL's) and would think I'd benefit more with the extra Healing Amp and full Chr bonus to saves with your build vs going Raidon's build with no pally splash. The AP's seem a little tight to go H-Elf pally dilly to get decent saves. Am I missing something here that makes the 16/4 split that much better for a fleshie?

    2) If I hold at level 18 to do Vale and Amrath, could I get by staying in Fire Savant while grouping or will I pretty much gimp myself to pikerdom for those two packs? If so, go Air? Acid?

    Bear in mind, I've only played an arcane once and that was a many moons ago...

    Any feedback is much appreciated!

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