Results 1 to 18 of 18
  1. #1
    Community Member Set's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    California
    Posts
    53

    Default Bastard Sword/Shield Paladin Build Suggestions

    Hi, I have a level 9 Drow Paladin that I'm trying to fix. This is one of my older toons that I'm trying to get motivated to play again.

    I recently re-speced him as a 2 handed fighter but the survivability was horrible. So now I want to remake this Paladin that mainly uses a Bastard Sword and shield.

    Feat suggestions? I'm thinking: Exotic WP: Bastard Sword, Toughness, 3 THF feats for glancing blows. Cleave/Great Cleave?

    Main stat will be Strength with a decent Constitution and Charisma score. I will mostly fill up the Sacred Defender tree. ( I wanna have good survivability with decent DPS)

    Since Drow Paladin is so feat starved, should I take two levels of fighter for the feats and tower shield proficiency?

    Or should I take 2 levels of Monk for 2 Feats and Evasion? If monk, should I wear robes to stay centered? Does centered matter? Or just I just wear a good light armor so Evasion will work? Thanks
    Last edited by Set; 10-19-2013 at 08:21 PM.

  2. #2
    Community Member Riekan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    441

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Set View Post
    Hi, I have a level 9 Drow Paladin that I'm trying to fix. This is one of my older toons that I'm trying to get motivated to play again.

    I recently re-speced him as a 2 handed fighter but the survivability was horrible. So now I want to remake this Paladin that mainly uses a Bastard Sword and shield.

    Feat suggestions? I'm thinking: Exotic WP: Bastard Sword, Toughness, 3 THF feats for glancing blows. Cleave/Great Cleave?

    Main stat will be Strength with a decent Constitution and Charisma score. I will mostly fill up the Sacred Defender tree. ( I wanna have good survivability with decent DPS)

    Since Drow Paladin is so feat starved, should I take two levels of fighter for the feats and tower shield proficiency?

    Or should I take 2 levels of Monk for 2 Feats and Evasion? If monk, should I wear robes to stay centered? Does centered matter? Or just I just wear a good light armor so Evasion will work? Thanks
    You can't stay centered with the bastard sword unless you take at least 5 levels of fighter and go up the kensai tree to tier 5 and take One With the Blade, so just use Monk for evasion if you decide to go that route. Unless you decide to add in 6 levels of fighter. 5 doesn't do much except unlock the enhancements, might as well go 6 for the extra feat.
    Proud Officer of the Guild of the Black Dragon on Sarlona.

  3. #3
    Community Member Soulfurnace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    The Land of Oz
    Posts
    1,534

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Riekan View Post
    You can't stay centered with the bastard sword unless you take at least 5 levels of fighter and go up the kensai tree to tier 5 and take One With the Blade, so just use Monk for evasion if you decide to go that route. Unless you decide to add in 6 levels of fighter. 5 doesn't do much except unlock the enhancements, might as well go 6 for the extra feat.
    8 levels of fighter, you need greater weapon focus for One with the Blade.

  4. #4
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    12,750

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Riekan View Post
    You can't stay centered with the bastard sword unless you take at least 5 levels of fighter and go up the kensai tree to tier 5 and take One With the Blade
    One w/Blade takes 8 ftr lvls; you need Gtr Weap Focus.

    OP: If you're going S&B, you definitely want Shield Mastery & ISM; add in Legendary SM from Unyielding Sentinel+Zeal and you're up to 25% doublestrike before gear & other buffs. If you also take Imp Shield Bash, consider ftr 2 splash so you can add Shield Striking; that gets your shield bash to 35% (assuming WAI).

  5. #5
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    481

    Default

    If you also take Imp Shield Bash, consider ftr 2 splash so you can add Shield Striking; that gets your shield bash to 35% (assuming WAI).
    It is. This would probably significantly change the intended build but if you were willing to go deep into StD tree you could take, at least, 5 levels of Fighter and grab Block and Cut. That would give you 25% doublestrike that you're able to keep up 50% of the time.

    Between that, Zeal and shield you're looking at 50% doublestrike. As a Bsword user you'll also get access to First Blood which would mean 65% doublestrike.

    That would increase your dps by a sizable amount - but it does cost a LOT of enhancement points.

  6. #6
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    12,750

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Xianio View Post
    This would probably significantly change the intended build but if you were willing to go deep into StD tree you could take, at least, 5 levels of Fighter and grab Block and Cut. That would give you 25% doublestrike that you're able to keep up 50% of the time.
    At that point, I would do pal 14 / ftr 6: 36 APs into Stalwart for Shield Striking + Block&Cut + max Stalwart Stance; a few APs in Sacred D. (mostly extra LoHs & Righteousness); the rest into DPS & survivability boosts from Kensei, KotC, and racial trees. For feats I'd want Power Atk/CL/GC; IC:Slash; SM+ISM+ISB; THF x3; b.sword (or d.axe). There are a few drawbacks, like no Evasion and only getting 1 lvl 4 spell slot; but it's probably as good as S&B DPS on a mostly-pally build gets.

    Once the racial PrEs get added, my hope is to do something similar with dwarf pal 15 / ftr 3 / monk 2, only using Dwarven Defender instead of Stalwart; same # of feats, but this time with Evasion, CSW, and a couple other monk goodies.

  7. #7
    Community Member Sokól's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Location
    Iceland
    Posts
    580

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    Once the racial PrEs get added, my hope is to do something similar with dwarf pal 15 / ftr 3 / monk 2, only using Dwarven Defender instead of Stalwart; same # of feats, but this time with Evasion, CSW, and a couple other monk goodies.
    Rolled up the other day a S&B PDK pal 13 - fighter 2 - monk 2 with a D-AXE and the dps was surprisingly good, with the changes to DM and with buffs his strength got to 42 on a level 15 fist lifer. I do not know if it is the PDK, S&B or something else but the cleave and g-cleave animations were very fast never played a S&B before so I do not know how it was before.
    Last edited by Sokól; 10-21-2013 at 10:16 AM.
    Argonnessen: Hilmir - Purkilius - Jinu - Vignir @ Blood Assassin´s

  8. #8
    Community Member Set's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    California
    Posts
    53

    Default

    Thanks for the great answers!

    Ok, I used a +3 Lesser Stone, so now I am 6 Paladin/2 Monk/2 Fighter so far....I love the 4 extra feats and Evasion. (Using Tower Shield and chain armor)

    Feats so far are: Power Attack, Exotic: Bastard Sword, THF, ITHF, Shield Mastery, Cleave, Great Cleave, Toughness. Not sure what feat or class next....Improved Shield Mastery I think or maybe Improved Crit Slashing...

    The damage and survivablility seem really good at this point. I love the Cleave/GC clickies.

    After reading other forum posts that say Toughness isn't worth it as much now, I may trade it in with Fred..
    Last edited by Set; 10-24-2013 at 08:17 PM.

  9. #9
    Community Member
    Join Date
    May 2013
    Posts
    819

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Set View Post
    Thanks for the great answers!

    Ok, I used a +3 Lesser Stone, so now I am 6 Paladin/2 Monk/2 Fighter so far....I love the 4 extra feats and Evasion. (Using Tower Shield and chain armor)

    Feats so far are: Power Attack, Exotic: Bastard Sword, THF, ITHF, Shield Mastery, Cleave, Toughness.

    The damage and survivablility seem good at this point.
    I just finished a 16 pal / 2 monk / 2 fighter life and loved it. Great healing between LoH, cure spells, unyielding sov; great saves, evasion, nice damage output (was nearly keeping up with my guild mate running pure sorc in EH stuff). For all the abuse paladin takes, it sure seemed like a fun and easy life. Happy hunting!

    *note - build for DPS is my advice. This is a S&B DPS build, not so much a tank build*

  10. #10
    Community Member Ralmeth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    1,697

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    At that point, I would do pal 14 / ftr 6: 36 APs into Stalwart for Shield Striking + Block&Cut + max Stalwart Stance; a few APs in Sacred D. (mostly extra LoHs & Righteousness); the rest into DPS & survivability boosts from Kensei, KotC, and racial trees. For feats I'd want Power Atk/CL/GC; IC:Slash; SM+ISM+ISB; THF x3; b.sword (or d.axe). There are a few drawbacks, like no Evasion and only getting 1 lvl 4 spell slot; but it's probably as good as S&B DPS on a mostly-pally build gets.

    Once the racial PrEs get added, my hope is to do something similar with dwarf pal 15 / ftr 3 / monk 2, only using Dwarven Defender instead of Stalwart; same # of feats, but this time with Evasion, CSW, and a couple other monk goodies.
    Interestingly, since you mentioned working up the Stalwart Tree, instead of the Sacred Defender tree, I've looked at this pretty seriously. The main drawback is that you lose the extra positive spell power. That's a pretty big deal, IMHO.
    Aryk Stoutheart, Paladin - Sarlona
    Rindyl Twirliblade, Elven Swashbuckler - Sarlona
    Vyyndar Stoutheart, Vanguard Paladin - Argo

  11. #11
    Community Member Ralmeth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    1,697

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Set View Post
    Thanks for the great answers!

    Ok, I used a +3 Lesser Stone, so now I am 6 Paladin/2 Monk/2 Fighter so far....I love the 4 extra feats and Evasion. (Using Tower Shield and chain armor)

    Feats so far are: Power Attack, Exotic: Bastard Sword, THF, ITHF, Shield Mastery, Cleave, Toughness.

    The damage and survivablility seem good at this point.
    Awesome! A Monk / Fighter splash has a lot going for it
    Aryk Stoutheart, Paladin - Sarlona
    Rindyl Twirliblade, Elven Swashbuckler - Sarlona
    Vyyndar Stoutheart, Vanguard Paladin - Argo

  12. #12
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    12,750

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Ralmeth View Post
    Interestingly, since you mentioned working up the Stalwart Tree, instead of the Sacred Defender tree, I've looked at this pretty seriously. The main drawback is that you lose the extra positive spell power. That's a pretty big deal, IMHO.
    Well, since pal 14 / ftr 6 only gets 1 lvl 4 spell slot (Zeal), I'm taking it for granted that this would not be a self-healing oriented build; Endless LoHs + Rejuv Cocoon (maybe) would be about it.

    Like I said earlier, I'm hoping Dwarven Defender will let me do pal 15 / ftr 2 / monk 2 (last lvl up for grabs) so I can have Evasion, Block&Cut, Zeal, and CSW all in one tank build.

  13. #13
    Community Member Ralmeth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Posts
    1,697

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    Well, since pal 14 / ftr 6 only gets 1 lvl 4 spell slot (Zeal), I'm taking it for granted that this would not be a self-healing oriented build; Endless LoHs + Rejuv Cocoon (maybe) would be about it.
    It seems a shame that you'd have that many Paladin levels, but you couldn't self heal with cure wound spells The extra DPS from Stalwart Defender would be nice, but that's a big sacrifice. It's too bad that Sacred Defender doesn't have some of the DPS enhancements that Stalwart Defender has.

    Quote Originally Posted by unbongwah View Post
    Like I said earlier, I'm hoping Dwarven Defender will let me do pal 15 / ftr 2 / monk 2 (last lvl up for grabs) so I can have Evasion, Block&Cut, Zeal, and CSW all in one tank build.
    That would be sweet!
    Aryk Stoutheart, Paladin - Sarlona
    Rindyl Twirliblade, Elven Swashbuckler - Sarlona
    Vyyndar Stoutheart, Vanguard Paladin - Argo

  14. #14
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    481

    Default

    I'm curious;

    How much would additional 30% healing amp help make up for it? S&B can get Wall of Wood which adds 30% healing amp so while Pally defensive tree would still be better, would the amp be substantial?

  15. #15
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    12,750

    Default

    They're two separate things. Heal amp boosts any incoming healing, inc. LoHs; every tank wants as much as they can reasonably squeeze in, because when you've got over 1,000 HPs, you wanna make the healer's job easier. Devotion boosts your Cure/Heal spells; since pallies only get CSW, a pally tank which plans to self-heal wants to up its Devotion as much as possible (inc. maxing Heal skill post-U19) to get the most bang-for-its-SPs.

  16. #16
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Posts
    15

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Set View Post
    Thanks for the great answers!

    Ok, I used a +3 Lesser Stone, so now I am 6 Paladin/2 Monk/2 Fighter so far....I love the 4 extra feats and Evasion. (Using Tower Shield and chain armor)

    Feats so far are: Power Attack, Exotic: Bastard Sword, THF, ITHF, Shield Mastery, Cleave, Great Cleave, Toughness. Not sure what feat or class next....Improved Shield Mastery I think or maybe Improved Crit Slashing...

    The damage and survivablility seem really good at this point. I love the Cleave/GC clickies.

    After reading other forum posts that say Toughness isn't worth it as much now, I may trade it in with Fred..
    Well I have tried that, but if you have even 1 monk class and equip a shield or anything above robe armor, you are no longer centered and cannot use stances or any of the monk bonuses. So you gotto wear robes and no shield to make the Ftr/Pal/Monk combo work

  17. #17
    Build Constructionist unbongwah's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Posts
    12,750

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Deathstroke2000 View Post
    Well I have tried that, but if you have even 1 monk class and equip a shield or anything above robe armor, you are no longer centered and cannot use stances or any of the monk bonuses. So you gotto wear robes and no shield to make the Ftr/Pal/Monk combo work
    Not every monk splash needs or wants to be centered. Evasion still works fine w/shield as long as you wear lt armor; and some of the monk PrE bonuses apply even while uncentered (e.g., Ninja Acrobatic, Shintao heal amp).

  18. #18
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Posts
    91

    Default

    Even so, you lose too much by being uncentered. Rogue is probably better at that point (both have the evasion feat). But you also get granted feats that help protect you against traps and can disarm traps/ open locked doors which lets you do more optionals in quests and helps you get more chests. You can also do spots above 20 and a small amount of sneak attack to help out dps. Also helps a lot with getting UMD high so you can use displacement scrolls, e.t.c. Also, there are a great selection of high-level weapons that have anarchic on them so getting umd high can help there too if you want to build around having one (maybe you already have one from a past life?) making Rogue splash very useful. Really, it's the only thing I'd consider besides monk .

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload