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  1. #721
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    Quote Originally Posted by RTFM View Post
    Today I had a quick look at the "Occupy Stormreach" turnout.

    Is it me or the "occupy event" mirroring the player base in general right now....i.e.: dwindling number of participants?
    You are quite right that we are fewer than before Glin's double-speak post. It seems some people are satisfied with having to run 80 quests instead of 450, and do not care about BTA, Sagas being mandatory, the devaluation of old epics and house C challenges, and the rest of our concerns.

    But there are still new members joining, and apart from the initial leaving of the people who are very easily satisfied, I haven't seen anything that leads me to believe this is dying out.

    We shall not be moved!

    EDIT; With Mem just announcing another round of Trivia, I expect a good turn out this evening
    It's definitely an N-word.

  2. #722
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    looool....silly protest was unsuccessful. Nothing surprising.

  3. #723
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    The bridge is below us, we shall not be moved

    A thank you to all the awesome crowd there, past present and future - you've really caused me to love this community even more

    We shall not be moved!
    It's definitely an N-word.

  4. #724
    Community Member Ausdoerrt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nestroy View Post
    And therefore the Occupy Bridge Movement is a success.
    Players have always had a voice, the question is whether anyone listens. The fact that it took 300+ people and 60+ hours to even get any sort of response is in no way a good thing. In other games a handful of concerned forum posts would've been sufficient. The fact that the response did little to address player concerns is anything BUT a "success".

    Quote Originally Posted by Dandonk View Post
    You are quite right that we are fewer than before Glin's double-speak post. It seems some people are satisfied
    Or disillusioned and are either already gone or squeezing the last bits of fun from their investments before moving on.
    "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. ... People's heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true." Terry Goodkind

  5. #725
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    We at least have 1 winner already....

    My wife loves the fact I cancelled my VIP and not really play at the moment
    On the other hand my pnp friends guild are mostly all F2P and so left the last couple of months (we are only left with 2 man now)

  6. #726
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    Default maybe we need to move.

    As the intention of the protest was to make them listen think about the concerns we had, I don't think the majority of us had the intention to have our presence have an impact on other players.
    With following up with all that goes on around this topic. I do see also a lot of complaints of why it had to be on this server( because it is so small and almost dead, etc)

    I would propose that if this makes sense someone who knows a bit about what server is best for this and with least impact for other players suggest maybe a new server to move this too.
    (again if this makes sense, I suppose a lot of people with deeper insight will say why or why not we should do this )

    let's show Turbine that we do listen to others and try our best in comparison !

  7. #727
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silken-Akira View Post
    As the intention of the protest was to make them listen think about the concerns we had, I don't think the majority of us had the intention to have our presence have an impact on other players.
    With following up with all that goes on around this topic. I do see also a lot of complaints of why it had to be on this server( because it is so small and almost dead, etc)

    I would propose that if this makes sense someone who knows a bit about what server is best for this and with least impact for other players suggest maybe a new server to move this too.
    (again if this makes sense, I suppose a lot of people with deeper insight will say why or why not we should do this )

    let's show Turbine that we do listen to others and try our best in comparison !
    The reason we picked Wayfinder was part coincidence (the first person to sit on the bridge was a native), part design: as it's the smallest, most quiet server we'd be the least disruptive to other players. That is also why, when instance 1 began to get laggy due to the crowd, we split the party to instance 2 and shortly after to instance 3 when it spawned. We're still keeping all 3 open for precisely that reason: so those that just want to play are not hindered by us. So I think we're already doing what you are suggesting

    But if you can give a good reason why we should move to a different server, please share it.

    Greetz,
    Red Orm
    Last edited by RedOrm; 10-23-2013 at 07:33 AM.

  8. #728
    Hero Silken-Akira's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedOrm View Post
    The reason we picked Wayfinder was part coincidence (the first person to sit on the bridge was a native), part design: as it's the smallest, most quiet server we'd be the least disruptive to other players. That is also why, when instance 1 began to get laggy due to the crowd, we split the party to instance 2 and shortly after to instance 3 when it spawned. We're still keeping all 3 open for precisely that reason: so those that just want to play are not hindered by us. So I think we're already doing what you are suggesting

    But if you can give a good reason why we should move to a different server, please share it.

    Greetz,
    Red Orm
    Greetz,
    Red Orm
    Got no reason myself. Just saw the complaint from time to time. and thought to bring it up. Like I said I have not enough insight on how big some servers are and the impact of such.
    But thanks for the insight because shows for me that it is taken into account and we are trying to keep any impact away from other players.

  9. #729
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dandonk View Post
    You are quite right that we are fewer than before Glin's double-speak post. It seems some people are satisfied with having to run 80 quests instead of 450, and do not care about BTA, Sagas being mandatory, the devaluation of old epics and house C challenges, and the rest of our concerns.
    Exactly. They're still trying to fool everyone, as they did in the past.
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  10. #730
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dandonk View Post
    You are quite right that we are fewer than before Glin's double-speak post. It seems some people are satisfied with having to run 80 quests instead of 450, and do not care about BTA, Sagas being mandatory, the devaluation of old epics and house C challenges, and the rest of our concerns.

    But there are still new members joining, and apart from the initial leaving of the people who are very easily satisfied, I haven't seen anything that leads me to believe this is dying out.

    We shall not be moved!

    EDIT; With Mem just announcing another round of Trivia, I expect a good turn out this evening
    I haven't participated and have no plans to participate, but that doesn't mean I don't care about the issue. I just think we need to give the dev team a chance to work it out. I am not even sure if Turbine's goal of this change is social engineering or revenue generation - or possibly both. Either way it seems to be a major miscalculation on their part and I think they will come around.

    I just think the official topic thread is a better place to make my thoughts heard instead of a bridge on Wayfinder.
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  11. #731
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    Quote Originally Posted by slarden View Post
    I haven't participated and have no plans to participate, but that doesn't mean I don't care about the issue. I just think we need to give the dev team a chance to work it out. I am not even sure if Turbine's goal of this change is social engineering or revenue generation - or possibly both. Either way it seems to be a major miscalculation on their part and I think they will come around.

    I just think the official topic thread is a better place to make my thoughts heard instead of a bridge on Wayfinder.
    I disagree. I think making a statement, even a virtual one, is a powerful tool. That does not mean we shouldn't give constructive feedback and voice our concerns in a civil manner in the proper threads, but the extra leverage that comes from the media coverage and the extra visibility this adds to the issue at hand is not to be discounted.

    As for their motivations and intentions with this change...

    "I know of no way to judge the future but by the past."

    The previous incidents of Offer Wall and other such things lead me to be, shall we say, sceptical. It also leads me to believe that the only way to get change is to make just the kind of statement we have.
    It's definitely an N-word.

  12. #732
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sha123 View Post
    looool....silly protest was unsuccessful. Nothing surprising.
    If the definition of unsuccessful is: coverage in multiple media outlets, attention on facebook, and producer response within 24 hours of return to work on monday, then yeah, I guess you could call it unsuccessful.

    The attempted instigation and trolling of those sitting in on the other hand, fits the real definition of unsuccessful. The same dude commented over 100 times during the time I was there about how he thought "crybabies were only in WOW, but he sees they are now in DDo too." This was the best he could come up with in 5 days?
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  13. #733
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    If the definition of unsuccessful is: coverage in multiple media outlets, attention on facebook, and producer response within 24 hours of return to work on monday, then yeah, I guess you could call it unsuccessful.

    The attempted instigation and trolling of those sitting in on the other hand, fits the real definition of unsuccessful. The same dude commented over 100 times during the time I was there about how he thought "crybabies were only in WOW, but he sees they are now in DDo too." This was the best he could come up with in 5 days?
    don't feed the trolls, though hjeeling them seems to be acceptable
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  14. #734
    Community Member Ausdoerrt's Avatar
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    Another post from DDO Gamer to add to our growing list: http://www.gamergeoff.com/the-last-r...l-write-today/

    Can't say I agree with everything he says, but I do retract (and encourage everyone to do so) any suspicions about his integrity. He may be biased, but it looks like his opinion - Turbine wouldn't have published anything about bannings, or anything strongly grounded in the players' perspective at all, really.
    "People are stupid; given proper motivation, almost anyone will believe almost anything. ... People's heads are full of knowledge, facts, and beliefs, and most of it is false, yet they think it all true." Terry Goodkind

  15. #735
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    If the definition of unsuccessful is: coverage in multiple media outlets, attention on facebook, and producer response within 24 hours of return to work on monday, then yeah, I guess you could call it unsuccessful.

    The attempted instigation and trolling of those sitting in on the other hand, fits the real definition of unsuccessful. The same dude commented over 100 times during the time I was there about how he thought "crybabies were only in WOW, but he sees they are now in DDo too." This was the best he could come up with in 5 days?
    loool, you guys change the motive of the protest so many times, its confusing. First, it was regarding heart of wood change. After many more transformations, you have arrived at media attention. Hilarious! Fact of the matter is that heart of wood system is going to change. Hence, your protest was unsuccessful!

  16. #736
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    If the definition of unsuccessful is: coverage in multiple media outlets, attention on facebook, and producer response within 24 hours of return to work on monday, then yeah, I guess you could call it unsuccessful.
    I have to agree with you there Chai, in many ways, the Sit-In did everything many wanted from it, it showed Turbine that we as players are not as frayed as they thought, that we will respond to things we don't like, and that their antics are becoming less and less acceptable, they need to be on their game better then they have been. Pun intended.

    With that put out, I would like to remind you old friend, responding to Trolls, makes them successful in their own eyes.

  17. #737

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ungood View Post
    I have to agree with you there Chai, in many ways, the Sit-In did everything many wanted from it, it showed Turbine that we as players are not as frayed as they thought, that we will respond to things we don't like, and that their antics are becoming less and less acceptable, they need to be on their game better then they have been. Pun intended.

    With that put out, I would like to remind you old friend, responding to Trolls, makes them successful in their own eyes.
    While the protest has accomplished some things, I am just afraid that any real wins here are fleeting. We certainly get their attention, and got them to come to the table. However, I feel that maybe we have "raised the bar" on the kind of actions it will take to get them to the table again. And now, to get them to listen to us for the next time, it will require a full-scale protest, and perhaps even more.

  18. #738
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sha123 View Post
    loool, you guys change the motive of the protest so many times, its confusing. First, it was regarding heart of wood change. After many more transformations, you have arrived at media attention. Hilarious! Fact of the matter is that heart of wood system is going to change. Hence, your protest was unsuccessful!
    Youre not understanding the difference between the issue that caused the protest, and the result of the protest.

    The issue was the heart of wood change. It has always been about this issue - and has never changed.

    The result of the protest was multiple media coverage and a response from the producer. So far. It isnt over yet.

    Heart of wood system is "going to" change? Just like the madstone boots changed? Oops. yeah strike one. Just like the XP after TR changed. Burrrn, strike 2. Just like keeping tomes after TRing. Yea players got their way on that one as well. Strike 3 - off the plate, next batter.

    Turbine has a case history of coming up with terribad ideas that get rejected by the player base and they have reverted many of them due to overwhelming lack of support for the new machanic.

    You say its confusing - likely because of not being aware of the case history of changes being reverted when not supported, as well as not having a real position on the issue other than attempted instigation. Your error is youre passing off the change as fact, when it hasnt happened yet.

    Oh, and Hilarious® is owned by Chai, and since you used it, I want my two dollars.
    Last edited by Chai; 10-23-2013 at 10:47 AM.
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  19. #739
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    If the definition of unsuccessful is: coverage in multiple media outlets, attention on facebook, and producer response within 24 hours of return to work on monday, then yeah, I guess you could call it unsuccessful.

    The attempted instigation and trolling of those sitting in on the other hand, fits the real definition of unsuccessful. The same dude commented over 100 times during the time I was there about how he thought "crybabies were only in WOW, but he sees they are now in DDo too." This was the best he could come up with in 5 days?
    The forum outrage would have garnered a response regardless of the bridge thing. Honestly I think we would be in exactly the same place with or without people parked on a wayfinder bridge.

    I don't think this form of protest is bad, I just think you and others are giving it more credit for a response than warranted.
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  20. #740
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cauthey_No_CCInfo View Post
    While the protest has accomplished some things, I am just afraid that any real wins here are fleeting. We certainly get their attention, and got them to come to the table. However, I feel that maybe we have "raised the bar" on the kind of actions it will take to get them to the table again. And now, to get them to listen to us for the next time, it will require a full-scale protest, and perhaps even more.
    If that is the case, and they won't come to the table without us having to raise holy hell every time, then they will only cause more players to leave.
    Nobody wins.

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