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  1. #81
    Community Member Saravis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JamnJD View Post
    I would say that this should be turned on in quests only, and not in public areas for obvious reasons.

    And so with collisions turned on, there would be no need for penalties at all.

    ...J
    *Barricades doorway and spams /laugh*


    As for friendly fire, why stop at having it in quests? If we want to be realistic, lets have it on all the time. Then some higher level player can head to Korthos and pick off all the new players that come in from the tutorial.

  2. #82
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonqrandom View Post
    so much griefing would come from this. in public and in quest. from a "not requiring too much suspension of disbelief" point of view i agree with it, but from a practical point of view, i don't think the GMs are going to want to disperse groups of griefers kettling other players on a regular basis.
    I dont believe less griefing would come from a -10 penalty (or any other penalty) due to being right on top of someone elses toon. DDO turns "most" of the friendly fire off, and people still get blown up regularly with potion of wonder, or greased off a hill etc...
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  3. #83
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    Youre asking for a penalty due to not having friendly collision turned on. What you really should be asking for is friendly collision to be turned on so that friendlies cant just move through eachother.

    In RL when three people are all (for games sake) "in the same 5 foot square" and they are trained combatants, they are protecting eachothers openings. When someone outside the formation stabs in at person 1, while person 1 parries and turns, the guy to their left cuts the opponent outside the formations arm off. Penalizing would not be the right thing to do. Having friendly collision turned on would be, if we were going for realism.
    Idealistically that would be better. But in practical use for a computer game real time combat MMO that is not turn based I agree with others that it would create more problems than realism. You do not want someone's computer crashing or lagging to stop the party in its tracks cause they can't get through a doorway.

    However, I would not mind giving friendly collision a shot. I can just see someone getting ****ed at a fellow party member and blocking them or trying to **** them off.

    To get the record straight I did not bring up the friendly fire. It was the trolls. I think it would create too many problems. It is magic and has its own excuse because of that.
    Last edited by firemedium_jt; 10-17-2013 at 12:57 PM.
    Your lack of healing amp not my problem. Please buy and use your own remove curse pots in combat, so I don't waste mana. Not my job.

  4. #84
    Community Member jonqrandom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chai View Post
    I dont believe less griefing would come from a -10 penalty (or any other penalty) due to being right on top of someone elses toon. DDO turns "most" of the friendly fire off, and people still get blown up regularly with potion of wonder, or greased off a hill etc...
    whoa, hold on, i in NO way support any penalty for standing in the same place as someone else either, and don't think i ever have done. are you thinking of someone else? 'cos i totally agree with your point above.
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  5. #85
    Community Member Chai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonqrandom View Post
    whoa, hold on, i in NO way support any penalty for standing in the same place as someone else either, and don't think i ever have done. are you thinking of someone else? 'cos i totally agree with your point above.
    Nope, sorry, was just a statement where im lumping just about any action by one player that can penalize another player in any way as something that could be used to grief. Its not an observation of who is supporting what...
    Advocating repeated nerfs in the name of "balancing the game" then complaining about how DDO is moving away from D&D, is a direct contradiction in logic - D&D 3.5 (what DDO is based on) is not a balanced game. We can either have a balanced clone MMO with homogenized classes, or we can have a D&D game. We cant have both.

  6. #86
    Community Member bsquishwizzy's Avatar
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    I soooo support the friendly fire damage, and the stuff that has a potential for griefing. Mainly because:

    1) Zerging would come to a standstill.

    2) No one will want to go questing with uber-gear because there is a possibility that someone will bump them off and take it.

    3) Most parties would not get past the second encounter before they’d all turn on themselves to loot the bodies of the comrades.

    4) If you were in a quest where someone griefed you, you could bump them off with your alt.

    It would be the Michael Corleone version of DDO…

  7. #87
    Community Member Satyriasys's Avatar
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    Ahh I miss Ultima Online
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  8. #88
    Hero LOOON375's Avatar
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    You are playing a fantasy role playing GAME and you want realism?
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  9. #89
    Community Member Oxarhamar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satyriasys View Post
    Ahh I miss Ultima Online
    ^^this

  10. #90
    Community Member Satyriasys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LOOON375 View Post
    You are playing a fantasy role playing GAME and you want realism?
    Yup, realism in rpgs is awesome!
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  11. #91
    Community Member Ashlayna's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by firemedium_jt View Post
    You hit a caster or get hit a spell is ruined. Does not matter what levels you are. Why should a friend be any different if they bump into you.

    5 melees standing in the same spot hacking away and not hitting eachother is stupid. Lets just say you would not hit your buddy, but it should make things harder.
    Yay, no more kiting firewalls or Arit turrets. By all means, allow friendly fire, and watch how fast some of the elite of the elite run away from here. As for realism, I can't remember the last time I actually built my mechanical dog and went sewer crawling for cash, can anyone else?

  12. #92
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satyriasys View Post
    No it isn't. Magic and creatures ARE realistic in the DDO world. Walking through other people is not. (unless by magic)
    Just because it is a fantasy environment doesn't mean the laws of physics go out the window. I don't see how people constantly fail to understand this.
    Okay first let me say I wish MMO's in general and DDO in particular had nice player collision detection what didn't cause lag and client/server prediction headaches, but it's well known in the industry that this is a problem with games where large numbers of players and monsters can all run into each other, and some games choose to tackle it and add to lag, and some (most MMO's) choose to let players occupy the same space but not mobs, for the sake of lower lag.

    But that said your last sentence is ridiculous, physics go out the window in DDO constantly... every 3 seconds my FvS sprouts wings made out of faith (and apparently chicken feathers), and uses them to defy gravity. I can teleport, become non corporeal, I can carry 15,000 pounds, and 4 million platinum coins, SWIM IN METAL ARMOR while carrying, 15,000 pounds, and 4 million metal coins,. Phase into the plane of shadow, shoot balls of fire out of my.... finger tips...

    But that said one more time: yeah I'd love it if DDO could polish up the collision detection and netcode prediction to handle players not being able to occupy the same space...

    Why? Because the visual spam that everyone being in the same spot creates; detracts from the gameplay. Because it eliminates a tactical aspect of combat, and because it just feels unpolished.

    But penalties? no.
    Last edited by IronClan; 10-17-2013 at 02:35 PM.
    You guys filibustering a new mode have already succeeded in scaring the Dev's into not doing it the right way and re-scaling the existing settings, why in the world are you still filibustering? Drunk on your success? Schadenfreude? Spitefulness?

  13. #93
    Community Member Satyriasys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronClan View Post

    But that said your last sentence is ridiculous, physics go out the window in DDO constantly... every 3 seconds my FvS sprouts wings made out of faith (and apparently chicken feathers), and uses them to defy gravity. I can teleport, become non corporeal, I can carry 15,000 pounds, and 4 million platinum coins, SWIM IN METAL ARMOR while carrying, 15,000 pounds, and 4 million metal coins,. Phase into the plane of shadow, shoot balls of fire out of my.... finger tips...

    But that said one more time: yeah I'd love it if DDO could polish up the collision detection and netcode prediction to handle players not being able to occupy the same space...

    Why? Because the visual spam that everyone being in the same spot creates; detracts from the gameplay. Because it eliminates a tactical aspect of combat, and because it just feels unpolished.
    You are talking about magical affects and divine powers, both appropriate to the lore.

    but I agree, we cannot take it too far or the game becomes too tedious. That is why we have systems to mimic reality (e.g encumbrance, stats, skill ect)

    Just because we cannot be 100% realistic like requiring sleep and food does not mean we cannot strive for realism in other areas by having our characters actually move their legs when they run for example.
    Last edited by Satyriasys; 10-17-2013 at 02:40 PM.
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  14. #94
    Community Member Charononus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Satyriasys View Post
    You are talking about magical affects and divine powers, both appropriate to the lore.

    but I agree, we cannot take it too far or the game becomes too tedious. That is why we have systems to mimic reality (e.g encumbrance, stats, skill ect)

    Just because we cannot be 100% realistic like requiring sleep and food does not mean we cannot strive for realism in other areas by having our characters actually move their legs when they run for example.
    Collision dectection would be tedious in ddo, so many fights and quests would be 100% broken by it.

    Citw Broken
    MA Broken
    DQ Broken
    Von6 Broken
    Lob Broken
    Tod Broken
    VoD Broken
    Abbot Broken
    Shroud Broken

    and that doesn't even get into griefing which would be rampant.

  15. #95
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    So, if character collision was incorporated, what happens when 2+ people enter the same dungeon at the same time? Does someone go insta-stone, or do people have to wait for one person to move off of the dungeon tele spot before another can go through?

    Rather surprised that no one on the realism front has made mention of being able to repeat quests, "Bind to" mechanics, or "Minimum Level" mechanics yet.

    Also, an aspect of friendly fire that no one has touched upon - would this extend to mobs for the sake of "realism?" Would mob casters suddenly start frying the rest of the trash because they don't care about AoE spells? Would hordes of melee mobs get the crowding penalty if it were implemented?
    Anything can be explained by drunken wizards.

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  16. #96
    Community Member Satyriasys's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charononus View Post
    Collision dectection would be tedious in ddo, so many fights and quests would be 100% broken by it.

    Citw Broken
    MA Broken
    DQ Broken
    Von6 Broken
    Lob Broken
    Tod Broken
    VoD Broken
    Abbot Broken
    Shroud Broken

    and that doesn't even get into griefing which would be rampant.
    No doubt. In any game I have ever played with player collision there are always people who go afk in doorways.
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  17. #97
    Community Member cnynridr2's Avatar
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    Default they won't do it because.....

    There would be too much griefing.
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