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  1. #21
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    Pure barbarian is too squishy just like pure fighter is lacking.
    squishy yes. dps through the roof.

  2. #22
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronClan View Post
    What you're saying here kind of contradicts you though. Fighter can actively use the healing spells the FvS levels gives you in addition to healing strike, and can multiclass with Monk, which means their Crits are basically the same as a Barb (mountain stance and Kensei)... 6 Monk gives Shadow Fade 25% incorp, also has Evasion like yours, and with the right build improved evasion, In addition a few Monk levels gives more movement speed. and even Abundant step.

    4 FvS levels on a Barb just to get ONE ability that self heals for maybe 100 points every 15 seconds (and doesn't go off if you miss, like when the Mob moves away, which happens all the time, I know I have it on my Melee Soul)

    4 Rogue gives nothing worth taking 2 extra rogue levels for (a little sneak attack), a Fighter 12 build could take 6 FvS levels and freely use Maximized Cure critical Wounds, and heal as well or better than a Pali (we've brought this up in many Pali threads already). 2 levels of Monk instead of Rogue = a big chunk of Dodge (Monk levels, Dodge feat and Mobility for free).

    So you found a clunky round about way to self heal a barb, I admit it's useful and probably better than nothing but it comes at a sacrifice, that would work WAY better on a fighter with similar DPS.

    In the end a Barb needing to take a 4 FvS splash for a 100-ish point heal every 15 seconds IF you don't miss, doesn't seem to indicate that Barbarians are doing just fine as your thread title suggests.
    oh but 4 FVS is so much better then just ameliorating strike, it also has divine might, 10 physical resistance, inflame if they every got to work right lol, etc. Huge fan of the warpriest. 4 rogue gives sneak attack, evasion, etc. Rogue and Barbarian get a lot of dodge actually so that is a nice mix. Barbarians have frenzy, barb pa, pain touch. The build has a higher base damage then these fighter ones. I am saying is ameloriating strike means I rarely drink silver flame.
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  3. #23
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronClan View Post
    400 a pop how much healer gear are you using LOL...
    .
    My off hand balizard has devotion 114 slotted in red slot, I have max ranks in heal, I wear an amp 30% bracer of heal skill +13, and have ring with 20% amp on it, as well ship 5%. That is it.
    Edit: I do have the empower healing feat.
    Last edited by maddmatt70; 10-16-2013 at 08:10 PM.
    Norg Fighter12/Paladin6/Monk2, Jacquiej Cleric18/Monk1/Wiz1, Rabiez Bard16/Ranger3/Cleric1, Hangover Bard L20, Boomsticks Fighter12/Monk 6/Druid 2, Grumblegut Ranger8/Paladin6/Monk6, Rabidly Rogue L20, Furiously Rogue10/Monk6/Paladin4, Snowcones Cleric 12/Ranger 6/Monk 2, Norge Barbarian 12/FVS4/Rogue4. Guild:Prophets of The New Republic Khyber.

  4. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronClan View Post
    400 a pop how much healer gear are you using LOL...
    I'd be interested to hear an answer to this as well.

    Reading this post I tried it on the dummy, as an 18 FvS/2 Pal. Dual Wielding a 120 Devo Item and a GS 20%, 30% heal amp stick, with the boat buff 10%, a single past life pally for 5% and tier two human imp recovery for another 20%.

    No strike gave back more then 250ish. And that's a pretty gimp set up as a melee. I would love to hear how you are getting 400 a pop and not gimping your set up.

    OT, it's not that barb splashes are really bad per se, it's just that just about every other melee class can do it better is all.
    Git off mah lawn!

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  5. #25
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Braegan View Post
    I'd be interested to hear an answer to this as well.

    Reading this post I tried it on the dummy, as an 18 FvS/2 Pal. Dual Wielding a 120 Devo Item and a GS 20%, 30% heal amp stick, with the boat buff 10%, a single past life pally for 5% and tier two human imp recovery for another 20%.

    No strike gave back more then 250ish. And that's a pretty gimp set up as a melee. I would love to hear how you are getting 400 a pop and not gimping your set up.

    OT, it's not that barb splashes are really bad per se, it's just that just about every other melee class can do it better is all.
    Are you counting both swings. I get 400 on full attack option when dual wielding 200 each one. Not with the barbarian dps.
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  6. #26
    The Hatchery kierg10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    My off hand balizard has devotion 114 slotted in red slot, I have max ranks in heal, I wear an amp 30% bracer of heal skill +13, and have ring with 20% amp on it, as well ship 5%. That is it.
    Edit: I do have the empower healing feat.
    ship is 10%.

    Do have to say though your barb build does sound pretty nice....not gonna hate.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Memnir View Post
    What I think is OP is anyone who uses implemented game mechanics, standard game features, or their own skill to be more effective in quests then I am - so I then find the time to post complaints about their use of implemented game mechanics, standard game features, or their own skill thus making me OP on the forums.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bridge_Dweller View Post
    Here's a new flash for the people who have not evolved and still play sponge toons: you serve no purpose. it's rude, but it's the truth. Divines are powerful, have been for a long time. They don't need you. If you need them you add no value to the group.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    Are you counting both swings. I get 400 on full attack option when dual wielding 200 each one. Not with the barbarian dps.
    Ah, ok I read it as 400 a shot back. But yes, that was per swing as it were. That sounds about more correct.

    I still have to refute your claim tho. Barbs are as a pure, pureish build are in a sad state. Deeply splashed as you are, you are not experiencing what makes players not wish to play a barb aside from a PL. And, nearly everything you listed as a boon the kensai/monk splashes do it better. I don't say it as an insult to barb lovers, but just a sad truth. Deeply splashing more uber classes as you have does bandaid the broken barbarian.
    Git off mah lawn!

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  8. #28
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    Barbs aren't dead, other classes gained too much in comparison.

    I'm unsure if it will outdps a fighter/monk/paladin hybrid.
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  9. #29
    Community Member maddmatt70's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Braegan View Post
    Ah, ok I read it as 400 a shot back. But yes, that was per swing as it were. That sounds about more correct.

    I still have to refute your claim tho. Barbs are as a pure, pureish build are in a sad state. Deeply splashed as you are, you are not experiencing what makes players not wish to play a barb aside from a PL. And, nearly everything you listed as a boon the kensai/monk splashes do it better. I don't say it as an insult to barb lovers, but just a sad truth. Deeply splashing more uber classes as you have does bandaid the broken barbarian.
    Well pure fighters are no different they also suck. Not sure why pure barb is looked at differently then pure fighter. I do not think that kensai/monk does it better per say because the argument can be made that barb multiclass do more dps. They have virtually everything a fighter/monk has defensively so shrug..
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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    Well pure fighters are no different they also suck. Not sure why pure barb is looked at differently then pure fighter. I do not think that kensai/monk does it better per say because the argument can be made that barb multiclass do more dps. They have virtually everything a fighter/monk has defensively so shrug..
    25% Incorp on demand trumps anything a barb splash has for defense.

    More feats to play with, allowing a fully ranged component while centered, is more.

    Better tactics, for stunning...is more.

    Hey, I am not saying what folks don't know already. But, barbs are way behind the curve. The time barbs shine is when they are full on nasty, raw dps with a healer attachted at the hip. Tho, it is hard to find divines that want to play like a hireling nowadays.
    Git off mah lawn!

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  11. #31
    The Hatchery kierg10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    Well pure fighters are no different they also suck. Not sure why pure barb is looked at differently then pure fighter. I do not think that kensai/monk does it better per say because the argument can be made that barb multiclass do more dps. They have virtually everything a fighter/monk has defensively so shrug..
    tbh fighter/monk/pally 12 6 2 or fighter monk ranger 8 6 6 outclasses the barb, mostly 'cause they simply have more versatility (more feats and such) also being centred and using shadow fade adds a huge defensive component over the barb build.

    Tbh though I prefer my 16 2 2 paladin/fighter/monk :P
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    Quote Originally Posted by Memnir View Post
    What I think is OP is anyone who uses implemented game mechanics, standard game features, or their own skill to be more effective in quests then I am - so I then find the time to post complaints about their use of implemented game mechanics, standard game features, or their own skill thus making me OP on the forums.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bridge_Dweller View Post
    Here's a new flash for the people who have not evolved and still play sponge toons: you serve no purpose. it's rude, but it's the truth. Divines are powerful, have been for a long time. They don't need you. If you need them you add no value to the group.

  12. #32
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kierg10 View Post
    tbh fighter/monk/pally 12 6 2 or fighter monk ranger 8 6 6 outclasses the barb, mostly 'cause they simply have more versatility (more feats and such) also being centred and using shadow fade adds a huge defensive component over the barb build.

    Tbh though I prefer my 16 2 2 paladin/fighter/monk :P
    I have yet to see any mix melee build out DPS a pure barb. This of course depends if they are built "correctly".

  13. #33
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    While it is a nice toon it is no way comparable to the synergy a fighter/pal/monk has.

    Debatable who has better dps. Although fighter hybrid does have manyshot. You can probably fit in manyshot if you switched 4 rogue to 4 ranger but then you would lose evasion and sneak attack.

    What is not debatable is the fighter hybrid is much better defensively.
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  14. #34
    Community Member FlaviusMaximus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LightBear View Post
    Gratz on reaching 10K+ posts... what kind of build is needed for that.
    Wow, everyone was totally on their A game on the first page. I'm still laughing.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qhualor View Post
    I have yet to see any mix melee build out DPS a pure barb. This of course depends if they are built "correctly".
    Well Cetus soloing EE What goes Up really does speak volumes of that class split.

    A pure barb might do more DPS, but it's hard to tell when they are soul stones so often.
    Git off mah lawn!

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  16. #36
    The Hatchery kierg10's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qhualor View Post
    I have yet to see any mix melee build out DPS a pure barb. This of course depends if they are built "correctly".
    since U14 and EEs end game has no longer been a pure DPS race, you need good defense as well or you will die in about 3 seconds.

    And I never said that mix melees were outdoing a pure barb :P
    Ckarlock Alarm (PDK bard 7 fighter 6 rogue 2) life 17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Memnir View Post
    What I think is OP is anyone who uses implemented game mechanics, standard game features, or their own skill to be more effective in quests then I am - so I then find the time to post complaints about their use of implemented game mechanics, standard game features, or their own skill thus making me OP on the forums.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bridge_Dweller View Post
    Here's a new flash for the people who have not evolved and still play sponge toons: you serve no purpose. it's rude, but it's the truth. Divines are powerful, have been for a long time. They don't need you. If you need them you add no value to the group.

  17. #37
    Community Member Teh_Troll's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by maddmatt70 View Post
    I have been having a great time running epic elites on my barbarian. The character is a two weapon fighting 12 barbarian 4 favored soul 4 rogue. It hits like a truck, has highish saves with evasion, high prr and dodge, self healing through ameliorating strike and silver flame pots if needed. These fighter mulitclass builds are most definitely overrated.
    I would like to nominate this post for troll of the year.

    I haven't read anything else yet, but I sense much greatness in this thread.

  18. #38
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Braegan View Post
    Well Cetus soloing EE What goes Up really does speak volumes of that class split.

    A pure barb might do more DPS, but it's hard to tell when they are soul stones so often.
    the ones that are always soul stones are the ones that give barbs a bad rep and that's because self sufficiency has been pushed onto players pretty hard for the past couple years and arguments end up being about lack of teamwork in groups. that is why I try to avoid groups with 5 other soloists in it. when WF casters are always soul stones, the excuse is that they don't know how to play the build very well.

  19. #39
    Community Member Qhualor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kierg10 View Post
    since U14 and EEs end game has no longer been a pure DPS race, you need good defense as well or you will die in about 3 seconds.

    And I never said that mix melees were outdoing a pure barb :P
    that is true, but imagine a barb that can get the same defenses as any other melee. now you are talking defense and offense all rolled into 1 build. the rest is just player skill.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by IronClan View Post
    400 a pop how much healer gear are you using LOL...

    So honest question to the Barb experts (I don't enjoy playing them try as I might) whats the best case scenario for Rage? in terms of stacked up CON and STR? Does the rage spell stack? I forget and in the interest of conversation I wont go wiki it.
    lol for some one who post like they know everything you have no clue.. first of it is not called healer gear it is call healing amp and im sure your fighter builds do awsome with no healing amp right you can solo everything on ee with them. haha 100 a pop for you wow maybe you should get of ron's char planer and look in to the gear the game has to offer.

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